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Offlinefeelthy
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Best of BULK
    #14086922 - 03/08/11 02:15 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I've been hesitant to join a forum for a couple of stupid reasons, but Shroomery is awesome and asking my own questions is much more efficient than reading other peoples Q&A. So I'm a straight noob. I had some Koh Samui cakes abrewin', but I lost them all! First half I lost in the jar, because I half assed my sterility during inoculation. I lost the rest after birthing by only a few days. The first had trich, the ones I was beginning to fruit I lost to a pretty blue/green mold. They weren't really spotted or anything. Just lightly covered with it one morning. I'm sure that was due to air exchange. I kept them in a large wooden box for security reasons. I plan on ventilating it for my next grow. Anyways instead of repeating the brf tek and learning from my mistakes I've already decided to take on bulk. I know the yield and health of the fruits are better and I'm too invested to not try it despite my lack of experience. I have definitely learned a lot from my pitfalls and know I will do better either way, but I have a lot of questions still, because I want this to run smoothly. My biggest question is if in my large container (64 qt.) I fill the bottom with wet perlite,can I add my substrate and casing layers directly on top to obtain humidity? Or do I need them in trays that fit inside the tub so they have the terrarium effect with the walls surrounding them? I've seen a lot of pics of huge tubs where it would appear the shrooms grew right off the top with now terrarium. Do you need a humidifier for this type of grow? I'm looking for maximum yield that will fit in this one container. I would like to discuss further best optimum bulk substrate and casing layers, but let's get the ball rolling, before I bore my readers to death please. Oh, and an odd request as well. I haven't found any diagrams of good bulk tek's or even casing for that matter. Any of you brilliant dudes feeling crafty?

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Offlinei GrOw StUFF
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Re: Best of BULK [Re: feelthy]
    #14086967 - 03/08/11 02:26 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

The health of fruits are better?....No, BRF cakes are awesome.  There are tons of posts for bulk teks use the search engine.  If you failed miserably with PF tek BRF cakes then why move to something involving a harder sterilizing process.....Do you have a still air box?  pressure cooker?


--------------------
The mushrooms, which grow only during the season of torrential rains, awaken the forces of creation and produce an experience of spiritual abundance, of an astonishing, inexhaustible constitution of forms that identifies them with fertility and makes them a mediation, a means of communion, of communication between man and the natural world of which they are the metaphysical flesh.

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Offlinei GrOw StUFF
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Re: Best of BULK [Re: i GrOw StUFF]
    #14086972 - 03/08/11 02:26 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

How did you fail to sterilize BRF cakes?


--------------------
The mushrooms, which grow only during the season of torrential rains, awaken the forces of creation and produce an experience of spiritual abundance, of an astonishing, inexhaustible constitution of forms that identifies them with fertility and makes them a mediation, a means of communion, of communication between man and the natural world of which they are the metaphysical flesh.

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Offlinebbt0009
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Re: Best of BULK [Re: feelthy]
    #14086975 - 03/08/11 02:27 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

You need to rethink your entire plan buddy. A new 'box' as you call it would be a good start and check out this tek...
http://www.shroomery.org/9030/Docs-Wild-Bird-Seed-Tek

And if once you get that started you can give this simple bulk tek a shot and use a 'monotub' <- look it up man
http://www.shroomery.org/10858/How-to-do-Coir


--------------------
It was all a dream...

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InvisibleTranscendingLife
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Re: Best of BULK [Re: feelthy] * 1
    #14086982 - 03/08/11 02:29 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

feelthy said:
I've been hesitant to join a forum for a couple of stupid reasons, but Shroomery is awesome and asking my own questions is much more efficient than reading other peoples Q&A.




No it's actually not. You need to Use the Search Function First. Then, once you have Specific questions, make your own thread. We're not here to hold hands or do any work for you that you won't do yourself. Personally, I spent 6 months on this forum before I even posted. I read & read & read & read..& read some more. Now I know things & fruits have appeared, because I've done my research.

Check the AMU Q&A in my signature for some good bulk recipes. You'll learn a lot by reading the whole Journal thread. yea, it's over 60 pages but the knowledge is invaluable. 

PS Use the "enter" button too. People like to read in paragraphs/blocks. Not one huge paragraph that jumps from North to East to Up to Down.

GL


--------------------
AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here
"One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife
“A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
:sporedrop::sporedrop::mushroomgrow::sporedrop::sporedrop::wow:How I Do EVERYTHING:wow::sporedrop::sporedrop::mushroomgrow::sporedrop::sporedrop:
"Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung
"Anything that can be done chemically can be done by other means."- William S. Burroughs
"You are as dead now as you will ever be" - Seth

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Offlinebbt0009
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Re: Best of BULK [Re: i GrOw StUFF]
    #14086985 - 03/08/11 02:29 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

i GrOw StUFF said:
How did you fail to sterilize BRF cakes?



Dude there's alot he's not telling us. I bet that 'pretty mold' that came over night was trich and he had been growing that the entire time and mistook it for myc. But just my opinion.


--------------------
It was all a dream...

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InvisibleTranscendingLife
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Re: Best of BULK [Re: bbt0009]
    #14086995 - 03/08/11 02:31 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

bbt0009 said:
Quote:

i GrOw StUFF said:
How did you fail to sterilize BRF cakes?



Dude there's alot he's not telling us. I bet that 'pretty mold' that came over night was trich and he had been growing that the entire time and mistook it for myc. But just my opinion.




:bigyesnod:

I totally agree. I'm sure he's going to need to completely Sterilize his entire house. Especially since he now has mold spores all over it...


--------------------
AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here
"One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife
“A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
:sporedrop::sporedrop::mushroomgrow::sporedrop::sporedrop::wow:How I Do EVERYTHING:wow::sporedrop::sporedrop::mushroomgrow::sporedrop::sporedrop:
"Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung
"Anything that can be done chemically can be done by other means."- William S. Burroughs
"You are as dead now as you will ever be" - Seth

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Invisiblebiologys
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Re: Best of BULK [Re: bbt0009]
    #14087008 - 03/08/11 02:33 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

usually once fully colonized and in fruiting yyou dont see trich, im wondering if you threw away good cakes just bruising from either not watering, or over watering...


a wood box is not going to work..you need osmething that will hold high humidity and not rot because of it...


as well the same as todlow said i was on this site for around a year, before i even attempted my first grow, and registering here..this hobby takes alot of reading, and studying, and reading some more...

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Offlinefeelthy
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Re: Best of BULK [Re: biologys]
    #14087265 - 03/08/11 03:16 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Oh, whoa, whoa, hey.. Alright motherfuckers, slow down and allow me to clear up a few things right here. I began my testimony stating that I'm a noob, because I know that to be fact and want your help very much. That doesn't make me an idiot and it doesn't mean that I'm a pussy expecting his hand to be held either. I've done hours of reading and mostly on this website. That's why I decided to join here. I asked a question I hadn't found a direct answer to. And nobody answered it either. I've read both of those teks on wbs and coir and that's another topic I wanted to get to. "Which teks are best?" I know that's gotta be a matter of opinion at a certain point when you're performing a well attentive job, but I want a lot of opinions that's why I came here. When I say I value your opinions, I certainly do, but it don't mean I wanna' hear you rip on me for no reason. I thought the point of these things was to help each other, not use a monitor and keyboard like a lens to magnify your ego to a stranger. That wooden box I was speaking of is huge. You could easily fit two bodies in it. And it's in a very special location that I'm paranoid of releasing on the web (one of the reasons I put off joining.)But let's say it's a non negotiable aspect of my grow efforts. The reason I didn't swamp you with information is, because I was afraid I was getting carried away with writing. I thought it might be easier to handle this one thing at a time. I'm not looking for a quick answer. I want to talk with you guys and find optimum grow specs. I'm a fast typer and I enjoy the shit out of writing so I'll write a rampage for y'all if it pleases the crowd, but do you mind please asking me some constructive questions instead of discussing how stupid I am with each other?

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InvisibleTranscendingLife
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Re: Best of BULK [Re: feelthy]
    #14087284 - 03/08/11 03:21 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Ok, slow down buddy. We're not trying to be arrogant assholes here. We're trying to help you help yourself.

Again, please use the "Enter" button to start a new paragraph every now & then. It helps us all.

There's no such thing as "best" in mycology. You're going to get 20 different replies from 20 different users all disagreeing & saying "my way is the best." It's what works the Best for YOU.

I did answer your bulk questions. Like I said, click on the AMU Q&A link in my sig. There's tons of bulk information plus general good information in there.


--------------------
AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here
"One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife
“A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
:sporedrop::sporedrop::mushroomgrow::sporedrop::sporedrop::wow:How I Do EVERYTHING:wow::sporedrop::sporedrop::mushroomgrow::sporedrop::sporedrop:
"Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung
"Anything that can be done chemically can be done by other means."- William S. Burroughs
"You are as dead now as you will ever be" - Seth

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Invisiblevirus1824
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Re: Best of BULK [Re: TranscendingLife]
    #14087541 - 03/08/11 04:09 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Reading other people's questions then finding answers for them is the best way i learn myself. You might say Im feeding of other people's apathy.


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A weekend wasted is never a wasted weekend

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Offlinei GrOw StUFF
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Re: Best of BULK [Re: virus1824]
    #14087571 - 03/08/11 04:15 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

and I wasn't trying to be a dick....but a 0% colonization rate of BRF jars raises a red flag to me....I was implying that you should get the sterilizing process of BRF jars down first before attacking grains.....


--------------------
The mushrooms, which grow only during the season of torrential rains, awaken the forces of creation and produce an experience of spiritual abundance, of an astonishing, inexhaustible constitution of forms that identifies them with fertility and makes them a mediation, a means of communion, of communication between man and the natural world of which they are the metaphysical flesh.

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Offlinebbt0009
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Re: Best of BULK [Re: feelthy]
    #14087836 - 03/08/11 05:08 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

feelthy said:
Oh, whoa, whoa, hey.. Alright motherfuckers, slow down and allow me to clear up a few things right here. I began my testimony stating that I'm a noob, because I know that to be fact and want your help very much. That doesn't make me an idiot and it doesn't mean that I'm a pussy expecting his hand to be held either. I've done hours of reading and mostly on this website. That's why I decided to join here. I asked a question I hadn't found a direct answer to. And nobody answered it either. I've read both of those teks on wbs and coir and that's another topic I wanted to get to. "Which teks are best?" I know that's gotta be a matter of opinion at a certain point when you're performing a well attentive job, but I want a lot of opinions that's why I came here. When I say I value your opinions, I certainly do, but it don't mean I wanna' hear you rip on me for no reason. I thought the point of these things was to help each other, not use a monitor and keyboard like a lens to magnify your ego to a stranger. That wooden box I was speaking of is huge. You could easily fit two bodies in it. And it's in a very special location that I'm paranoid of releasing on the web (one of the reasons I put off joining.)But let's say it's a non negotiable aspect of my grow efforts. The reason I didn't swamp you with information is, because I was afraid I was getting carried away with writing. I thought it might be easier to handle this one thing at a time. I'm not looking for a quick answer. I want to talk with you guys and find optimum grow specs. I'm a fast typer and I enjoy the shit out of writing so I'll write a rampage for y'all if it pleases the crowd, but do you mind please asking me some constructive questions instead of discussing how stupid I am with each other?



Dude nobody called you an idiot and we both sent you what we thought would help. If you're gonna take something helpful and productive and turn it around the way you did nobody's going to help you.


--------------------
It was all a dream...

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Offlineshroomtastic89
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Re: Best of BULK [Re: bbt0009]
    #14087965 - 03/08/11 05:33 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Ok well i agree with everyone here so far...

First of all get pics man. Like they say a picture is worth 1000 words... There is no reason to worry about getting in trouble. We all only grow edibles.

By the sounds of it you prolly just had some nice trich cakes growing. The reason people are telling you to stick to cakes is because they are much easier to sterilize than grains, which would be needed to go bulk.

That wooden box is just a bad idea. Wood molds easily and with the humidity needed to grow shrooms you would have trich everywhere. At this location cant you just leave it out of the box?

What tek did you use for your brf cake grow?

How did you remove the trich cakes?

What have you done to sterilize your grow area since the trich?

Did you have the smaller tub that was inside the box elevated so air could flow up from the bottom? That is if you used a SGFC which you could convert to a hybrid MSG for bulk.

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Offlinefeelthy
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Re: Best of BULK [Re: shroomtastic89]
    #14091528 - 03/09/11 09:33 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Okay, I suppose I overreacted a little. I know it's not a good idea
to step on toes right after introducing oneself. What can I say?
I'm a little competitive.

Sorry, I felt pretty insulted when it was
suggested that I can't tell the difference between mold and bruising
on fruiting body.

It's fucking mold, come on guy. There's no way I'd throw out a perfectly good cake, especially after the time invested
in it all.

I may be new at this, but I've already shared the experience, the love and tragedy, in raising my own babies.

One important aspect I kinda' sorta' left out is I didn't use a PC. I followed the BRF tek from mushroomvideos.com and steamed my jars for 90 mins. Is that very irresponsible?

They didn't have filters either, just the four holes. That's one thing I'm changing. I'm using polyfil filters and medical tape for inoculation points coming soon.

I used a lot of lysol like air disinfectant everywhere all the time,
but I think I just needed to be cleaner.

I've read of bleach bombing the room, but it's supposed to stain carpet and clothing even in the ten percent solution. So I should think that "ammonia bombing" would be just as effective, no?

Of coarse I heated the needle and wiped everything down with a good cleaner. I also used a glove box, though I feel it was not super air tight.

I incubated the Koh Samui in a double tub set up with an aqua heater. Temp was usually between 84 and 87 degrees F. but the first day they were under a sweltering 92. I was worried for a bit until I saw some beautiful mycelium popping up.

And fine, you broke me. I feel paranoid for not disclosing my
underground experiments. I guess if I ever feel threatened I could always remove my posts.

My wooden box as I call it is basically a small grow room. It's wickedly hidden under carpet with a trap door lid. It took me a couple man hours to build, but it's totally awesome.

I even surrounded it with insulation to ensure my babies stay warm. Trap door in my trailer! Is that not cool? So once again "NO" I cannot not use it. It's essential.

And Todlow to you sir, you are correct in there is a shit load of really good information in that AMU link (I really liked the clean LC tek in there) and I'm sorry I didn't catch that earlier, so thank you for it. I have more reading to do. But also..

Quote:

The Tod wrote:

There's no such thing as "best" in mycology. You're going to get 20 different replies from 20 different users all disagreeing & saying "my way is the best."





That's what I was hoping for, or was that not clear? And was my spacing a little easier for every one?

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InvisibleTranscendingLife
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Re: Best of BULK [Re: feelthy]
    #14091585 - 03/09/11 09:53 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

feelthy said:

Quote:

The Tod wrote:

There's no such thing as "best" in mycology. You're going to get 20 different replies from 20 different users all disagreeing & saying "my way is the best."





That's what I was hoping for, or was that not clear? And was my spacing a little easier for every one?




:ilold: @ "The Tod" haha. love it! it makes me feel like I'm :winning:, jeeze...

Spacing was awesome this time :awethumb:...There's just so much that goes into doing bulk that you can't really just toss the broad generalization out there. I'm starting my journal thread of "How I do Everything" This weekend w/ my lids. I've got 3 different styles for 3 different myco related projects. Then I'll do grain prep, tub prep, etc...

Yea, dude GLC, is what you were referring to, I'm assuming. It's awesome. I did it 3 weeks ago &, I know I'm going to catch some flack for this & no I don't have pics, my myc actually grew in sterile water. I know it's not supposed to, but there is def. more myc in my jar now than there was 2 weeks ago...
^ that's the only pic I have of it.

I like your idea of the "hidden" room. I'd recommend lining the whole thing w/ 4 mil plastic & your temps are a bit high, especially for bulk. I run my room between 74-76.

I'm actually making a fruiting room in my basement ATM. Just some 2x4's w/ 4 mil plastic wrapped around it. Going to have 2 4' double bulbed shop lights w/ 6500K lights in them for lighting & I have a bulk humidifier for RH...

You're going to need a PC, 12 quart jars w/ some kind of filter medium (& no poly fill is NOT a contam barrier/filter) + 1 syringe, one large sterilite tub & some poly fill...probably some RTV, duct tape & trash bags. For sterility, Oust, Iso 70% & bleach water @ 1:10 bleach to water.


--------------------
AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here
"One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife
“A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
:sporedrop::sporedrop::mushroomgrow::sporedrop::sporedrop::wow:How I Do EVERYTHING:wow::sporedrop::sporedrop::mushroomgrow::sporedrop::sporedrop:
"Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung
"Anything that can be done chemically can be done by other means."- William S. Burroughs
"You are as dead now as you will ever be" - Seth

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Invisiblepenhed
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Re: Best of BULK [Re: TranscendingLife]
    #14091629 - 03/09/11 10:07 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

i use h/poo ,straw,worm castings for my bulk and late case with 50/50  ...in a mono tub hybrid

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OfflineFunkjunkie
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Re: Best of BULK [Re: TranscendingLife]
    #14091724 - 03/09/11 10:28 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

The Tod wrote:



Yea, dude GLC, is what you were referring to, I'm assuming. It's awesome. I did it 3 weeks ago &, I know I'm going to catch some flack for this & no I don't have pics, my myc actually grew in sterile water. I know it's not supposed to, but there is def. more myc in my jar now than there was 2 weeks ago...
^ that's the only pic I have of it.





DAMN really? gota be tap water right?


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OfflineLightShedder
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Re: Best of BULK [Re: feelthy]
    #14091770 - 03/09/11 10:36 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

You've got the right idea buddy. Ignore any pessimistic loser who tells you otherwise. Just spend a little time reading up on the following,

Liquid culture
Grain jars (I like rye berry, and honestly, grain is easier then BRF)
Still air glove box (this is key, and has given me a 1% contamination rate on 3000+ jars)
Monotubs (uncased and untouched completely)

There ya go. Successfully inoculate 4 qt jars and I bet you'll come out with 4 oz dried after harvest.

Good luck


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OfflineLightShedder
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Re: Best of BULK [Re: LightShedder]
    #14091792 - 03/09/11 10:40 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

And to whoever said polyfil isn't a contam barrier, I've used it on the above-mentioned 3000+ jars and yes it is indeed a great filter. BTW I re use the same polyfil batch after batch.

Works like a charm.


--------------------

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