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ProfessorPinHead
Trapped in the Archives....




Registered: 07/09/10
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Re: High Tech Solution To The Pains Of Pasturization [Re: DZ]
#14062905 - 03/03/11 08:48 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Ozzy said: and those that paved the way for us as well.

Quote:
DZ said: no need for name calling and degradation, we'll let my planned research decide 
We've already been where you are going bro, No offense .... Thats all were sayin'
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Ozzy
TimeLord




Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 1,067
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Re: High Tech Solution To The Pains Of Pasturization [Re: DZ]
#14062922 - 03/03/11 08:49 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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It wasn't the worst name I could think of for pulling some experience card on your part. Have fun with your experiments. If you wanna save some time use the search function. maybe someone there will meet your requirements of "experienced"
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DZ
ranger



Registered: 01/25/09
Posts: 381
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Re: High Tech Solution To The Pains Of Pasturization [Re: ProfessorPinHead]
#14062971 - 03/03/11 08:56 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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thank you for your concern, i've seen no documentation of your claims profph. so you guys are telling me that substrate in a bucket that maintains a temperature of 140-185 for at least 1 hour, by whatever means, hasn't achieved pasteurization? i strongly doubt this, and plan on disproving this theory, but no hard feelings if i'm wrong, and none if i'm right
no experience 'cards' needed, i was just pointing out that it does WORK from my experience. im sure people do things differently which could result in different outcomes.
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ProfessorPinHead
Trapped in the Archives....




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Re: High Tech Solution To The Pains Of Pasturization [Re: Ozzy]
#14063007 - 03/03/11 09:00 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Yea, I didn't think "hot shot" was too harsh..... I usually like to go with fucko. It has a better ring to it. 
You should have heard some of the shit I was saying yesterday,,,, I was not having a healthy morning 
Anyway, I thik the bucket is ok if you use a thermometer and make sure the water your dumping in the bucket is not over 180. Sixty seconds is not long enough for water to drop from 212 which is boiling to 180 which is the high end of pasteurization and before sterilization.
If you just dump boiling water or near boiling water into a bucket with coir you are risking sterilizing it which in turn can cause your bulk sub to contaminate.
I used the bucket method many years ago. I do things correctly now and pasteurize in a steam bath for 2 hours.
I have a zero percent contamination rate.
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Ozzy
TimeLord




Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 1,067
Loc:
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Re: High Tech Solution To The Pains Of Pasturization [Re: ProfessorPinHead]
#14063021 - 03/03/11 09:02 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
ProfessorPinHead said: Yea, I didn't think "hot shot" was too harsh..... I usually like to go with fucko. It has a better ring to it. 
You should have heard some of the shit I was saying yesterday,,,, I was not having a healthy morning 
Anyway, I thik the bucket is ok if you use a thermometer and make sure the water your dumping in the bucket is not over 180. Sixty seconds is not long enough for water to drop from 212 which is boiling to 180 which is the high end of pasteurization and before sterilization.
If you just dump boiling water or near boiling water into a bucket with coir you are risking sterilizing it which in turn can cause your bulk sub to contaminate.
I used the bucket method many years ago. I do things correctly now and pasteurize in a steam bath for 2 hours.
I have a zero percent contamination rate.
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DZ
ranger



Registered: 01/25/09
Posts: 381
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Re: High Tech Solution To The Pains Of Pasturization [Re: Ozzy]
#14063067 - 03/03/11 09:09 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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that's fine if that's your experience. i've used this method of pasteurizing for at least 50, 56 quart monotubs, within the last 5 or 6 months. not a single tub has contaminated before at least 2-3 flushes, and if they're picked carefully usually more if the yields are worth it. these have all been 500-600 gr of coir and 2 qts of verm mixed with 4.5-5 qts of nearly boiling water, spawned with 4-5 qts of WBS. i can't speak about hpoo, but i will be able to soon, and i see no logic to disprove it from working.
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Ozzy
TimeLord




Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 1,067
Loc:
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Re: High Tech Solution To The Pains Of Pasturization [Re: DZ]
#14063133 - 03/03/11 09:22 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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well there you go, add some nitrogen and see how that works.
me and the prof can run through what takes you 6 months to do in a month.
seriously, you are talking outta well....you know. a simple serch of RR+pasteurization will yield you all the answers of why you are wrong, but go ahead and beat that dead horse with your two part mix.
you obvioulsy don't have the expereince to speak on the subject, so why are you arguing the facts?
there are benificial bacteria that you kill off at those temps, which leaves your subs suceptable to contams.
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DZ
ranger



Registered: 01/25/09
Posts: 381
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Re: High Tech Solution To The Pains Of Pasturization [Re: Ozzy]
#14063714 - 03/03/11 11:00 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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grow up, this is not a pissing contest. 0% contamination is 0% contamination, who cares how much you can do? the fact is, i believe it will work and you dont. neither of us have evidence to prove either way!
Edited by DZ (03/03/11 11:29 PM)
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DZ
ranger



Registered: 01/25/09
Posts: 381
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Re: High Tech Solution To The Pains Of Pasturization [Re: DZ]
#14063820 - 03/03/11 11:21 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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"Manure should be maintained at the center of the substrate at 140F to 160F for at least one hour, but 90 minutes is better. Any method you use that achieves the above will work. RR"
evidence
Edited by DZ (03/03/11 11:36 PM)
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RogerRabbit
Bans for Pleasure



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Re: High Tech Solution To The Pains Of Pasturization [Re: dharmabum182]
#14063855 - 03/03/11 11:26 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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For the price of that thing, you can get a 55 gallon drum, plus propane burner and tank. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat "I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work." Thomas Edison
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ProfessorPinHead
Trapped in the Archives....




Registered: 07/09/10
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Re: High Tech Solution To The Pains Of Pasturization [Re: RogerRabbit]
#14064647 - 03/04/11 04:12 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
RogerRabbit said: For the price of that thing, you can get a 55 gallon drum, plus propane burner and tank. RR
That is exactly what I plan on doing as soon as this wretched winter breaks and I can get outside.....
The snow is as deep as your waist here ..... I haven't been in my back yard in 2 months.....
The bird feeders at the wood line are still half full; so no need to break out the snow shoes yet! 
Its been negative ten outside, and like you said I still have to crack the windows to keep the grow rooms at ambient temps. Other wise when you walk up there it is 90 degree,,,
Sure cheap in terms of fuel efficiency
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dharmabum182
Beluga
Registered: 01/16/11
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Re: High Tech Solution To The Pains Of Pasturization [Re: ProfessorPinHead]
#14064817 - 03/04/11 06:18 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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There are cheaper ways that take more time and require more supervision. But that's the tradeoff. A one time purchase of a waterbath will continue to reward me with more time for other work. Plus it's resellable, in case I find a better method down the road. Just made smart sense to me.
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Ozzy
TimeLord




Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 1,067
Loc:
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Re: High Tech Solution To The Pains Of Pasturization [Re: DZ]
#14064928 - 03/04/11 07:16 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
DZ said: grow up, this is not a pissing contest. 0% contamination is 0% contamination, who cares I cared how much you can do? the fact is, i believe it will work and you dont. neither of us I don't have evidence to prove either way!
Fixed your statement.
....................lol elem entry subs... i assume you speak from experience using the aforementioned technique. from years of experience, and all sorts of different pasteurization methods, and varying strains;...................
First off, you cared about experience as stated in your post upthread.
Second, coir and verm is the most basic sub you can do, great that you haven't had a contam. That will change as you start adding ingredients. period. As much as you want to argue that FACT it is not gonna change the outcome.
Stating that it works 100% was wrong on your part and ther are countles threads to prove your remark on it wrong aside from MY EXPERIENCE.
It works well on the two part mix, which is why it's popular, but it's not 100%. And to reiterate, you will find out this FACT when you get a little deeper into mycology.
Quote:
DZ said: "Manure should be maintained at the center of the substrate at 140F to 160F for at least one hour, but 90 minutes is better. Any method you use that achieves the above will work. RR"
evidence
Good luck not going over 160 and keeping it at 140 to 160 for 90 minutes when you start 20 to 30 degrees over that mark. Your logic and quote dosen't hold water from the get go. You are missing the point entirely. I look forward to your response 6 months from now after your trials, been there done that and and so have many others, I have tried to pass that EXPERIENCE to you, I am done now. good luck I already know the outcome. ........................................................................ .....RR quotes that you should pay attention to.
You're supposed to hydrate all bulk substrates with gently warm or even cold water, and then slowly bring the field capacity mixture up to 140F and maintain that temperature in the center of the substrate mix for an hour, without letting it exceed 160F during that hour....... RR
I recommend 140F to 160F based on experience. Higher temps kill more of the beneficial bacteria we're trying to save, and 140F for one hour kills all mold spores, which is what we're after. RR
........You're partially sterilizing, which is making the substrate more susceptible to contamination......... RR
Those are 3 I found in 5 min utsf. Is that expereince enough for you, there are many other old hands with this advice, but I'll let you do the rest of your homework on your own.
If there were no need to "go above and beyond" as you say then we would all be doing it. But we don't .... wander why that is. Maybe cause it is the proper way to do it, nothing "above and beyond" about it. In actuality, you cut corners and your sub-par subsrate and lucky contam rate are what they are. sub par and lucky. good day... I said good day......lol
Edited by Ozzy (03/04/11 09:16 AM)
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ProfessorPinHead
Trapped in the Archives....




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Re: High Tech Solution To The Pains Of Pasturization [Re: Ozzy]
#14065016 - 03/04/11 08:00 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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!!!!!!!
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k00laid
NEMO


Registered: 05/03/10
Posts: 19,636
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Re: High Tech Solution To The Pains Of Pasturization [Re: ProfessorPinHead]
#14065454 - 03/04/11 10:04 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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i been skimming this but i figured another person saying
"hpoo wont work in the bucket tek"
couldnt hurt <3
-------------------- AMU - AMU Q & A - MyVideo Teks!
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DZ
ranger



Registered: 01/25/09
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Re: High Tech Solution To The Pains Of Pasturization [Re: k00laid]
#14065533 - 03/04/11 10:27 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Hitsuzen
Space Cowboy



Registered: 10/17/08
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Re: High Tech Solution To The Pains Of Pasturization [Re: DZ]
#14065536 - 03/04/11 10:28 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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I like the scientific one. It looks uber-pro. I'd take that over a roaster any day.
-------------------- Hate never yet dispelled hate, Only love dispels hate. This is the law, Ancient and inexhaustible. -Buddha
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Hitsuzen
Space Cowboy



Registered: 10/17/08
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Re: High Tech Solution To The Pains Of Pasturization [Re: Hitsuzen]
#14065548 - 03/04/11 10:32 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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@Ozzy: Dr. Who is da shit.
-------------------- Hate never yet dispelled hate, Only love dispels hate. This is the law, Ancient and inexhaustible. -Buddha
Edited by Hitsuzen (03/04/11 10:32 AM)
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Ozzy
TimeLord




Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 1,067
Loc:
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Re: High Tech Solution To The Pains Of Pasturization [Re: Ozzy]
#14065574 - 03/04/11 10:38 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
DZ said: http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/9315587
Quote:
Ozzy said: While that works for ELEM ENTRY subs like Damion5050 tec, when you move beyond the simplicity of cubes, that kind of stuff doesn't work. And even with coir/verm only it is not 100%. Proper temps for allotted times are essential in this hobby. If you can't get to that then you are just playing at mycology(which isn't bad), but certainly will lead to constant high failure rates early on in your subs.
That dosen't mean it fails all the time. I read your "evidence" the first time. still dosen't make it the right way to do something.
If I build ya a house and leave you with no drainage, it sure would be comfortable for a while but sooner or later things will go bad fast.
And Dr. Who is indeed "the shit"...
And on a final note. that pateurizer is cool, just pricy for my taste. If I would have seen it at a lower price and didn't have the tools I have currently, I would buy it, it would be great for a small setup.
OP ,sorry for having to dispel poor info in your thread.
Edited by Ozzy (03/04/11 10:47 AM)
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ProfessorPinHead
Trapped in the Archives....




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Re: High Tech Solution To The Pains Of Pasturization [Re: Ozzy]
#14065612 - 03/04/11 10:45 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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I used to use the bucket method to work with poo.
The idea was that if you broke up the coir on the surface of the poo. When you poured the water in it would insulate the poo underneath,.
The method worked for me for about 6 months straight..... Then I got the Thrich something fierce. This was due to the Poo getting sterilized from over temping.
Bottom line is pouring boiling water into a bucket is not only a lazy ass fuckin way of doing things.
It is not the correct way of doing things either.
Sorry guys but we got a whole feild (mycology) on our backs on this one. It is not a matter of opinion it is a matter of fact.
Buckets are the wrong way to do it
I'm starting to sound like a broken

Lazy is not how people get real shit accomplished.
Its how you get diminished returns though.... That is for certain,.
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