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teknix
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Re: We are angry with our leaders. [Re: Icelander]
#14048263 - 03/01/11 12:30 PM (13 years, 4 days ago) |
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What is your purpose in posting here anyway?
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Icelander
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Re: We are angry with our leaders. [Re: teknix]
#14048466 - 03/01/11 01:12 PM (13 years, 4 days ago) |
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I've stated it dozens of times.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Icelander
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Re: We are angry with our leaders. *DELETED* [Re: teknix]
#14048497 - 03/01/11 01:19 PM (13 years, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
teknix said: A lot of this thread is me elaborating on your questions and presenting proof, however when the burden is shifted to you, all I see is you shifting the focus.
Are you referring to the post that you made a snide remark and tried to edit it away after I had already responed? Then once busted put it back?
Quote:
teknix said:
Quote:
teknix said: Well I direct you to debate forums, if you want to debate something.
Nice edit!
Here is what this comment was in response to btw.
Quote:
Icelander said: The inevitability of moral progress is testiment to unity that will be achieved.
Can you please evaluate these statements. How is moral progress "inevitable" and how is something that hasn't happened yet a testament to anything? Along with your other statements of proof, this does not prove anything.
The imperative natural forces have always lead to larger and larger human aggregates leads to an inevitable human unification.
This is so not true imo. When I was a kid everyone in my neighborhood knew and talked to everyone else and that was normal. Now it's almost unheard of. Humans are more divided than ever. Again I will direct you to the political forum and remind you this is the Shroomery.
She tempts humanity, her thinking instrument, and tests how far it is ready for the harmony she has imagined;
There is not now and has never been real evidence that nature is aware and has an intent for harmony. This is pure wishful thinking on your and the authors part. In fact by calling nature a she it's pretty obvious that the intent is to make nature a reflection of the human subjective thought process. It doesn't work that way at all imo.
This is from an article, and I think it is a very good anology in relation to the nature of things as shown through history.
There is an equillibrium that has been heavily offset in recent times.
I presented evidence. Like I always say "most humans believe that history begins and ends with their lifetime" http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=are+there+more+revolts+now+than+at+other+times+in+history&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8#q=are+there+more+revolts+now+than+at+other+times+in+history&hl=en&client=safari&rls=en&prmd=ivnsb&tbs=tl:1&tbo=u&ei=z6ZnTcP1JpK6sQPcwsmmBA&sa=X&oi=timeline_result&ct=title&resnum=11&ved=0CFQQ5wIwCg&bav=on.1,or.&fp=d18fa4a7e898769c
and showed the weakness in your evidence and where it actually backed my assertions.
Dec 2002 - The two concepts, βgovernmentβ and βregimeβ also need to be distinguished. On 0th December 2002, there was indeed a change of government in Kenya from KANU to NARC, with substantial changes in the people who run the country politically. A new president was elected and he proceeded to form a new government. But the regime continued.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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teknix
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Re: We are angry with our leaders. *DELETED* [Re: Icelander]
#14048684 - 03/01/11 02:00 PM (13 years, 4 days ago) |
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Icelander
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Re: We are angry with our leaders. *DELETED* [Re: teknix]
#14049018 - 03/01/11 03:03 PM (13 years, 4 days ago) |
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Point is that revolutions are common throughout history. And guess what? They happen over and over again often in the same countries. Can you guess why? Yup the revolutionaries become corrupt when they gain power and become the new tyrants and need to be over thrown again and again. Gee is that some evidence of what I've been saying? No not for you I'm sure because as you mentioned you don't care about history and don't see how it's relevant to what's happening now.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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teknix
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Re: We are angry with our leaders. *DELETED* [Re: Icelander]
#14049024 - 03/01/11 03:05 PM (13 years, 4 days ago) |
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You mean common through the last 271 years?
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Icelander
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Re: We are angry with our leaders. *DELETED* [Re: teknix]
#14049710 - 03/01/11 04:57 PM (13 years, 4 days ago) |
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The last couple hundred years will do. Populations being much lower before that and the ability of tyrants to really have an iron fisted control large areas especially rural. That's just a guess however. Over population and scarcity of natural resources might have an influence also.
And of course the main point being is once the revolution ends often the corruption and oppression begin. Many of todays tyrants were yesterdays freedom fighters. This seems to be the nature of the beast.
But I think we've been all over this before.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
Edited by Icelander (03/01/11 07:44 PM)
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teknix
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Re: We are angry with our leaders. *DELETED* [Re: Icelander]
#14052866 - 03/02/11 04:45 AM (13 years, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: The last couple hundred years will do. Populations being much lower before that and the ability of tyrants to really have an iron fisted control large areas especially rural. That's just a guess however. Over population and scarcity of natural resources might have an influence also.
And of course the main point being is once the revolution ends often the corruption and oppression begin. Many of todays tyrants were yesterdays freedom fighters. This seems to be the nature of the beast.
But I think we've been all over this before.
Yes, you proved that humanity hasn't had a voice until recently, and people were oppressed, and had no ability to speak out or even to think for themselves.
The graph is showing the voice of humanity beginning to speak out as a whole, and it is becomming more articulate everyday.
You proved these differences.
Now how about explain why you are really here without accusations or deceit. I find it odd that someone who wants to help would resort to these tools.
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Icelander
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Re: We are angry with our leaders. *DELETED* [Re: teknix]
#14053011 - 03/02/11 06:39 AM (13 years, 4 days ago) |
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Yes, you proved that humanity hasn't had a voice until recently, and people were oppressed, and had no ability to speak out or even to think for themselves.
I never proved any such thing nor tried to as I'm fairly sure you are aware of.
Now how about explain why you are really here without accusations or deceit. I find it odd that someone who wants to help would resort to these tools.
How come , so often, when someone feels threatened in their ability to discuss an issue successfully they resort to attacking the other person discussing the issue. This is very poor form.
I've stated dozens of times here that I post for my own entertainment which is likely why we are all here. It would be better if you left me personally out of the discussion. I assume it's a here the same as it is in the philosophy forum.
If you believe I am breaking the forum rules then the proper channel is to flag the offending post and inform a moderator. They will then take the appropriate action. Switching the discussion to the personality of the other person has no benefit to the discussion but instead serves only to distract from the ideas being discussed. Please keep this in mind and take any future discussion of Icelander to the Moderators or to me in PM.
Edited by Icelander (03/02/11 06:48 AM)
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teknix
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Re: We are angry with our leaders. *DELETED* [Re: Icelander]
#14053040 - 03/02/11 06:52 AM (13 years, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: Yes, you proved that humanity hasn't had a voice until recently, and people were oppressed, and had no ability to speak out or even to think for themselves.
I never proved any such thing nor tried to as I'm fairly sure you are aware of.
Now how about explain why you are really here without accusations or deceit. I find it odd that someone who wants to help would resort to these tools.
How come , so often, when someone feels threatened in their ability to discuss an issue successfully they resort to attacking the other person discussing the issue. This is very poor form.
I've stated dozens of times here that I post for my own entertainment which is likely why we are all here. It would be better if you left me personally out of the discussion. I assume it's a here the same as it is in the philosophy forum.
If you believe I am breaking the forum rules then the proper channel is to flag the offending post and inform a moderator. They will then take the appropriate action. Switching the discussion to the personality of the other person has no benefit to the discussion but instead serves only to distract from the ideas being discussed. Please keep this in mind and take any future discussion of Icelander to the Moderators or to me in PM.
I am simply questioning your motives.
Thanks for inadvertantly proving what I have said.
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teknix
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Re: We are angry with our leaders. [Re: Icelander]
#14053043 - 03/02/11 06:54 AM (13 years, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said:
Quote:
Joolz said: We will always have trouble uniting humanity as long as the southern Baptists exist. I've been raised through that church, my family all goes to a Baptist church. They spread hate on all other religions and refuse to listen to reason.
While we may fight our leaders, the people who refuse to end their hate against people different than them will always hold us down it seems.
I was raised same. But that mind set is all over the country and I see it among the non religious too. Humanity will remain basically in this state for the next few hundred thousand years at least.
I believe you left off explaining this.
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Icelander
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Re: We are angry with our leaders. *DELETED* [Re: teknix]
#14053289 - 03/02/11 08:33 AM (13 years, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
teknix said:
Quote:
Icelander said: Yes, you proved that humanity hasn't had a voice until recently, and people were oppressed, and had no ability to speak out or even to think for themselves.
I never proved any such thing nor tried to as I'm fairly sure you are aware of.
Now how about explain why you are really here without accusations or deceit. I find it odd that someone who wants to help would resort to these tools.
How come , so often, when someone feels threatened in their ability to discuss an issue successfully they resort to attacking the other person discussing the issue. This is very poor form.
I've stated dozens of times here that I post for my own entertainment which is likely why we are all here. It would be better if you left me personally out of the discussion. I assume it's a here the same as it is in the philosophy forum.
If you believe I am breaking the forum rules then the proper channel is to flag the offending post and inform a moderator. They will then take the appropriate action. Switching the discussion to the personality of the other person has no benefit to the discussion but instead serves only to distract from the ideas being discussed. Please keep this in mind and take any future discussion of Icelander to the Moderators or to me in PM.
I am simply questioning your motives.
Thanks for inadvertantly proving what I have said.
Once again you are going off topic to make this a discussion about me the poster instead of the topic at hand. Most likely in an attempt to distract from the questions at hand or in an attempt to get back at me for some imagined slight. I'm here to discuss the topic. I'll discuss you in PM if that's what I want.
Would any Moderator here like to weigh in on this?
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Icelander
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Re: We are angry with our leaders. [Re: teknix]
#14053302 - 03/02/11 08:38 AM (13 years, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
teknix said:
Quote:
Icelander said:
Quote:
Joolz said: We will always have trouble uniting humanity as long as the southern Baptists exist. I've been raised through that church, my family all goes to a Baptist church. They spread hate on all other religions and refuse to listen to reason.
While we may fight our leaders, the people who refuse to end their hate against people different than them will always hold us down it seems.
I was raised same. But that mind set is all over the country and I see it among the non religious too. Humanity will remain basically in this state for the next few hundred thousand years at least.
I believe you left off explaining this.
No I finished explaining my position.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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teknix
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Re: We are angry with our leaders. [Re: Icelander]
#14053310 - 03/02/11 08:41 AM (13 years, 4 days ago) |
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And your position is based on fallacy?
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Icelander
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Re: We are angry with our leaders. [Re: teknix]
#14053327 - 03/02/11 08:46 AM (13 years, 4 days ago) |
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Likely not.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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teknix
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Re: We are angry with our leaders. [Re: Icelander]
#14053358 - 03/02/11 08:54 AM (13 years, 4 days ago) |
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I don't see anything to the contrary.
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Icelander
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Re: We are angry with our leaders. [Re: teknix]
#14053367 - 03/02/11 08:56 AM (13 years, 4 days ago) |
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I don't know what that means? Contrary to what?
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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teknix
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Re: We are angry with our leaders. [Re: Icelander]
#14053382 - 03/02/11 08:59 AM (13 years, 4 days ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: I don't know what that means? Contrary to what?
That your position is based on fallacy?
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Icelander
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Re: We are angry with our leaders. [Re: teknix]
#14053399 - 03/02/11 09:03 AM (13 years, 4 days ago) |
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Show me.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Diploid
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Re: We are angry with our leaders. *DELETED* [Re: teknix]
#14053421 - 03/02/11 09:08 AM (13 years, 4 days ago) |
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I am simply questioning your motives.
teknix,
His motives, his mother's honor, and the color of his tie have NOTHING to do with the validity of his argument. You've been here long enough to know this.
Debate the topic and leave the people you're debating with out of the discussion. They are COMPLETELY irrelevant.
Consider this your warning.
Read the rest of the rules here before you post again:
Edit: wrong link:
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/4780411
-------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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