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OfflineLord Amok
Glorious Visage of Punchability
Male


Registered: 03/01/11
Posts: 51
Last seen: 13 years, 2 months
Re: Can someone explain Socialism to me in a non biased way? [Re: johnm214]
    #14050650 - 03/01/11 07:34 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

johnm214 said:
That's an interesting reply and perspective- you've described a situation where people are "put in" particular jobs.  By whom, exactly?



By themselves. People who need money either try to get jobs or resort to crime. I may be wrong, but I think most people would prefer to get a job, if only out of cowardice. If most people are uneducated and thus don't have any qualifications, they'll go for entry-level jobs-and only so many of those are available. Unemployment and crime go up.

Quote:

You're not in a communist state, you don't have to work if you don't want to- no one's going to take your bread or jail/kill you if you quit your job or get a new one.



No, but I am in a socialist state, and it isn't doing too bad. And if I quit my job, I do have to look for a new one if I want my life to be at all pleasant.

Quote:

It seems you've presupposed that employment is an excercise of some central power- presumably the government.  How is this justified?  The government does not assign workers to jobs, at least non-communist ones, and disatisfaction with your job is anything but the burden of the society and government.



You are way off the mark in terms of what you think I believe. You really have no idea.

Quote:

Your's is an attitude of entitlement and externalizing your problems.



No, but nice try.

Quote:

I doubt you'd maintain this perspective for long if you got a government that actually decided your lot in life- traditionally they have come along with repression and genocide.



Who said I wanted that? I want to think for myself, schmuck.


--------------------
Viva las Vegas.

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OfflineMushyHobo
Stranger

Registered: 02/28/11
Posts: 45
Last seen: 13 years, 2 months
Re: Can someone explain Socialism to me in a non biased way? [Re: johnm214]
    #14050715 - 03/01/11 07:44 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

johnm214 said:
Quote:

MushyHobo said:
Quote:

johnm214 said:
Its my understanding that socialist policies inevitably retard freedom and prosperity and any signifigant amount of these policies in proportion to other countries tends to create an unenviable disparity.  Pretty much why socialist countries tend to have guards and walls keeping people locked in the employ of the state, or financial barriers of the same effect.




Right on!  Originally from Kentucky and up in Canada now just because with the Obama recession and all I can make bigger buck here, plus there are some nice relaxed possession policies _for now_ which makes me breathe a little easier, if you know what I mean :mushroom2:  :bigjoint:

But I'm hardly able to take a walk outside without feeling the subdued misery and the tax+spend oppression is as tangible as a knife in the wallet.  On the plus side, I was able to register for free healthcare after six months on a work visa, well - I'm am not an idiot, right?  In and out.  That's my plan.

You know how they say Canadians are more polite?  It's just shell-shock.  Remember the G20 in Toronto last year?  That's the real face of soviet canuckistan.





What does your reply have to do with my post- which you've ostensibly responded to?

About the only way I can make sense of it is to presume you're assuming all sorts of unstated arguments and then ridiculing them, without bothering to show how they're a consequence of my position or post.  :thumbdown:





Duuuude, I am in totally agreement with you.  I'm living in the Socialist state of Canuckistan right now, and I'd totally move back home to the US if the economy wasn't all to shit.  They're trapping me in this country with my fat government contract - as you say I'm "locked in the employ of the state," with "financial barriers of the same effect."

It's total impacting my freedom :grrr:

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OfflineFaye Runaway
Occupant
Female

Registered: 03/01/11
Posts: 9
Last seen: 13 years, 2 months
Re: Can someone explain Socialism to me in a non biased way? [Re: MushyHobo]
    #14050890 - 03/01/11 08:20 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Hold on, hold on. Socialism is wrong because any money I make belongs to me, and it should be my decision what to do with it.

Right?  Nobody made my money for me, and no one deserves my money BUT me.


--------------------
      “It's possible to love a human being if you don't know them too well.”

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OfflineMushyHobo
Stranger

Registered: 02/28/11
Posts: 45
Last seen: 13 years, 2 months
Re: Can someone explain Socialism to me in a non biased way? [Re: Faye Runaway]
    #14050927 - 03/01/11 08:28 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Couldn't agree more broseph.  And if I want to ride my BMW at 200kpmh+ then that should be my business too.  If I scrape your car in the process, sue me, otherwise why bother having courts in the first place?  We don't need to pay taxes to have some silver spoon gboy deciding upon all that nanny regulation.

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OfflineLord Amok
Glorious Visage of Punchability
Male


Registered: 03/01/11
Posts: 51
Last seen: 13 years, 2 months
Re: Can someone explain Socialism to me in a non biased way? [Re: Faye Runaway]
    #14050973 - 03/01/11 08:36 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Faye Runaway said:
Hold on, hold on. Socialism is wrong because any money I make belongs to me, and it should be my decision what to do with it.

Right?  Nobody made my money for me, and no one deserves my money BUT me.




Of course. Who needs paved roads anyway?


--------------------
Viva las Vegas.

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OfflineFaye Runaway
Occupant
Female

Registered: 03/01/11
Posts: 9
Last seen: 13 years, 2 months
Re: Can someone explain Socialism to me in a non biased way? [Re: Lord Amok]
    #14051094 - 03/01/11 08:54 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

What does paved roads have to do with it?  I just don't want to pay taxes.


--------------------
      “It's possible to love a human being if you don't know them too well.”

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Invisiblephoxyilluminata
Stranger
Female
Registered: 02/27/11
Posts: 102
Re: Can someone explain Socialism to me in a non biased way? [Re: Lord Amok]
    #14051105 - 03/01/11 08:56 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Lord Amok said:
Quote:

Faye Runaway said:
Hold on, hold on. Socialism is wrong because any money I make belongs to me, and it should be my decision what to do with it.

Right?  Nobody made my money for me, and no one deserves my money BUT me.




Of course. Who needs paved roads anyway?




Fuck roads. And traffic lights. And street lights. And mail. And fire departments. Fuck that noise.

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OfflineMushyHobo
Stranger

Registered: 02/28/11
Posts: 45
Last seen: 13 years, 2 months
Re: Can someone explain Socialism to me in a non biased way? [Re: Faye Runaway]
    #14051119 - 03/01/11 08:58 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Faye Runaway said:
What does paved roads have to do with it?  I just don't want to pay taxes.




Pay him no heed.  I think, and don't correct me if I'm right, that he's talking about the old "roads don't grow on trees" argument which is always made by poor people who couldn't afford to use privately funded roads.

Dude you have no money, you don't get to live in a suburban paradise, if you're lucky enough to have a job then maybe your boss will be nice enough to supply housing close enough so that you don't need to worry about roads.

Don't let the invisible hand smack you on the way out  :dancer:

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OfflineFaye Runaway
Occupant
Female

Registered: 03/01/11
Posts: 9
Last seen: 13 years, 2 months
Re: Can someone explain Socialism to me in a non biased way? [Re: phoxyilluminata]
    #14051128 - 03/01/11 09:00 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Ok, NOW you're just being silly. They can get paid with fees and bills, like everyone else.


--------------------
      “It's possible to love a human being if you don't know them too well.”

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Invisiblephoxyilluminata
Stranger
Female
Registered: 02/27/11
Posts: 102
Re: Can someone explain Socialism to me in a non biased way? [Re: MushyHobo]
    #14051131 - 03/01/11 09:00 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

MushyHobo said:
Quote:

Faye Runaway said:
What does paved roads have to do with it?  I just don't want to pay taxes.




Pay him no heed.  I think, and don't correct me if I'm right, that he's talking about the old "roads don't grow on trees" argument which is always made by poor people who couldn't afford to use privately funded roads.

Dude you have no money, you don't get to live in a suburban paradise, if you're lucky enough to have a job then maybe your boss will be nice enough to supply housing close enough so that you don't need to worry about roads.

Don't let the invisible hand smack you on the way out  :dancer:



Fuck yeah. I'm starting myself a private traffic light service. You pay $50, the light turns green for 4 and a half seconds. It's the 'Murrican way.

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OfflineFaye Runaway
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Female

Registered: 03/01/11
Posts: 9
Last seen: 13 years, 2 months
Re: Can someone explain Socialism to me in a non biased way? [Re: phoxyilluminata]
    #14051171 - 03/01/11 09:07 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Tollbooths. It's that easy. Pay for only what you use.


--------------------
      “It's possible to love a human being if you don't know them too well.”

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OfflineNet
Official Mr Shoebat Lackey
Male


Registered: 02/28/11
Posts: 32
Last seen: 13 years, 2 months
Re: Can someone explain Socialism to me in a non biased way? [Re: phoxyilluminata]
    #14051181 - 03/01/11 09:08 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Lord Amok said:
Quote:

Faye Runaway said:
Hold on, hold on. Socialism is wrong because any money I make belongs to me, and it should be my decision what to do with it.

Right?  Nobody made my money for me, and no one deserves my money BUT me.




Of course. Who needs paved roads anyway?




Have you ever noticed how private toll roads are really, really nice?

Quote:

phoxyilluminata said:
Quote:

Lord Amok said:
Quote:

Faye Runaway said:
Hold on, hold on. Socialism is wrong because any money I make belongs to me, and it should be my decision what to do with it.

Right?  Nobody made my money for me, and no one deserves my money BUT me.




Of course. Who needs paved roads anyway?




Fuck roads. And traffic lights. And street lights. And mail. And fire departments. Fuck that noise.




And fucking them is what the government does best:

Roads, except for private toll roads, are pothole riddled shit-cakes across the country.

Have you seen these new traffic lights? They're utter crap. You can't see them unless you're at the correct angle. Only government could fuck up something as simple as goddamn lights.

Street lights? Pure socialistic waste. What are headlights on your car for? Who doesn't own a flashlight?

Private mail services beat the snot out of USPS.

Firefighters? Greedy, unionized lazy fucks don't even work a regular schedule.


--------------------
“In all institutions from which the cold wind of open criticism is excluded, an innocent corruption begins to grow like a mushroom - for example, in senates and learned societies”

—Friedrich Nietzsche

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OfflineLord Amok
Glorious Visage of Punchability
Male


Registered: 03/01/11
Posts: 51
Last seen: 13 years, 2 months
Re: Can someone explain Socialism to me in a non biased way? [Re: Faye Runaway]
    #14051192 - 03/01/11 09:09 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Faye Runaway said:
Ok, NOW you're just being silly. They can get paid with fees and bills, like everyone else.




No, no, you're right. Your money is yours and yours alone. You said it yourself. Not any toll road's money. Not any grocery store's money. Not any fire department's money. Not any car company's money.

Your money.

I'd recommend learning to farm.


--------------------
Viva las Vegas.

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OfflineCanis latrans
Stranger
Registered: 03/01/11
Posts: 35
Last seen: 13 years, 1 month
Re: Can someone explain Socialism to me in a non biased way? [Re: Lord Amok]
    #14052011 - 03/01/11 11:15 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

I have a question for all you gentlemen.

If an organization that guarantees all employees the same salary and benefits regardless of the amount of work different employees may do a socialist one? And what if pay increases were simply granted based on the amount of time an employee had been with the company instead of merit?
Further more, what if this hypothetical company subsisted wholly on tax monies gathered from public?

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Invisiblephoxyilluminata
Stranger
Female
Registered: 02/27/11
Posts: 102
Re: Can someone explain Socialism to me in a non biased way? [Re: Canis latrans]
    #14052021 - 03/01/11 11:18 PM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Canis latrans said:
I have a question for all you gentlemen.

If an organization that guarantees all employees the same salary and benefits regardless of the amount of work different employees may do a socialist one? And what if pay increases were simply granted based on the amount of time an employee had been with the company instead of merit?
Further more, what if this hypothetical company subsisted wholly on tax monies gathered from public?



LOL. America's Red Army.

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OfflineViveka
refutation bias
 User Gallery

Registered: 10/21/02
Posts: 4,061
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
Re: Can someone explain Socialism to me in a non biased way? [Re: phoxyilluminata]
    #14053008 - 03/02/11 06:39 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

What schizophrenic is having a conversation with themselves here?

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OfflineAtomsk
King of the Space Pirates


Registered: 02/28/11
Posts: 34
Last seen: 13 years, 7 days
Re: Can someone explain Socialism to me in a non biased way? [Re: Viveka]
    #14053031 - 03/02/11 06:50 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Viveka said:
What schizophrenic is having a conversation with themselves here?




Thats silly dont be paranoid

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OfflineAtomsk
King of the Space Pirates


Registered: 02/28/11
Posts: 34
Last seen: 13 years, 7 days
Re: Can someone explain Socialism to me in a non biased way? [Re: Atomsk]
    #14053033 - 03/02/11 06:51 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Atomsk said:
Quote:

Viveka said:
What schizophrenic is having a conversation with themselves here?




Thats silly dont be paranoid




I agree!

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OfflineYgor
Cyberite Sybarite
Male


Registered: 03/01/11
Posts: 57
Last seen: 13 years, 19 days
Re: Can someone explain Socialism to me in a non biased way? [Re: Canis latrans]
    #14053059 - 03/02/11 06:59 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Canis latrans said:
I have a question for all you gentlemen.

If an organization that guarantees all employees the same salary and benefits regardless of the amount of work different employees may do a socialist one? And what if pay increases were simply granted based on the amount of time an employee had been with the company instead of merit?
Further more, what if this hypothetical company subsisted wholly on tax monies gathered from public?




Such an organisation could never exist in America!!


--------------------
Flowers gathered in the morning,
Afternoon they blossom on.
Still are withered by the evening,
You can be me when I'm gone.

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OfflineFaye Runaway
Occupant
Female

Registered: 03/01/11
Posts: 9
Last seen: 13 years, 2 months
Re: Can someone explain Socialism to me in a non biased way? [Re: Ygor]
    #14053079 - 03/02/11 07:11 AM (13 years, 2 months ago)

Who cares? It would never work right, if that's the way it was set up.


--------------------
      “It's possible to love a human being if you don't know them too well.”

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