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henk600
Medical cannabis user



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Re: Face it ... the drugs don't work [Re: hesus321]
#14040401 - 02/28/11 05:11 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Let me tell you another fact i saw in real life.
i knew a man with the age of 56 who used heroin since he was 18 years old. that is 38 years of using heroin. Wat he did was always taking care of good food and the needed vitamins,minerals etc.
I guess he also used clean heroin,not like the black tan stuff.
He is still alive,he looks like a junkie but he took care of himself over the years. I think he can get 85 years old if he continu what he is doing.
Ever saw an alcoholic drinking daily alcohol for 38 years? You must be very lucky if you survive it.
A friend of mine who works with mental and psychical peoples and have learned for it told me once that from every drugs he know that alcohol is the worstets of all. He talked with persons on cocaine and heroin and amphetemines, but he said that an person on alcohol is the worst to talk with . he prefer someone on cocaine to have conservations with than an alcoholic.
That says to me alcohol is worster then heroin. Th peoples who call that no harddrugs really have no experience enough with alcohol or seeing people on alcohol.
It is legal,but does that mean that is no hard drugs? It is legal hard dope.
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Re: Face it ... the drugs don't work [Re: henk600]
#14040703 - 02/28/11 08:26 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Alcohol is definitely a hard drug though. It's addictive and toxic. Hard. That's the rules. I don't know why you'd argue with this.
-------------------- Enlil said: You really are the worst kind of person.
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hesus321
Guru


Registered: 05/12/09
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I just dont agree with you that Alcohol is addictive to most people. Sure, its addictive to some people, but so is tv, chocolate and exercise.
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Re: Face it ... the drugs don't work [Re: hesus321]
#14041258 - 02/28/11 11:12 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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You yourself said that you were fine after trying crack and heroin, so by your logic those are not hard drugs either.
Face it man, if you're going to say something is "not a hard drug" that means there are substances which ARE "hard drugs," and if you are going to insist upon such a distinction then you must at least be consistent.
TV and chocolate can make you fat and you can overwork yourself with exercise but these are not toxic substances, like alcohol will kill your brain cells and damage your liver, kidneys, stomach, heart, and throat even when used in moderation.
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blazenn
rawdog the whale.


Registered: 05/13/09
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Re: Face it ... the drugs don't work [Re: hesus321]
#14041270 - 02/28/11 11:15 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
hesus321 said: I just dont agree with you that Alcohol is addictive to most people. Sure, its addictive to some people, but so is tv, chocolate and exercise.
alcohol is most certainly addictive to most people. but unlike heroin, meth, crack, etc you have to beat yourself up through a foul tasting drink to feel the high until you get used to the taste. whereas with all other drugs you simply inhale or put a shot in your veins and feel a greater high than alcohol (how good the high is is subjective of course) plus waking up in the morning feeling like hell is enough to keep most people from drinking day after day after day.
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usefulidiot13
Dark Passenger



Registered: 05/22/07
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Quote:
Tchan909 said: These things make me really sad.
Is this where our tax dollars go? To provide for the public exhibition, ridicule and belittlement of people who have had such horribly difficult lives you can read it on their faces? It makes me sick. 
EDIT: Is it just me, or does the guy second from the bottom on the left look just like Muammar Gaddafi in his after pic?
i agree on your first point bro....these people have horrible lives and now everyone is on the internet laughing at them and thinking WOWZ METH IZ BAD...fucking stupid...ive tried meth a few times and i didnt get addicted at all....ive been addicted to opiates for almost 6 years and i look as healthy as ever...use a needle too...
and i def agree about that guy looking like qaddafi!
-------------------- What Would Dexter Do?
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LadyLittleZeppelin
Stoner



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Re: Face it ... the drugs don't work [Re: usefulidiot13]
#14043742 - 02/28/11 05:34 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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You have to moderate any substance or activity Too much of a good thing is bad. Some things require so much moderation that they aren't good for you at all I think. That's why I avoid meth, cocaine, and heroine.
-------------------- SHROOMS MAKE YOU GAY ~ Crystal G said: its cuzzzzzz i giiiiiive a meeeeean blooooowjjjobbbb.
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Smitington
Unidentified Flying Object


Registered: 08/10/09
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To continue the alcohol discussion...
I am curious what the percentage of users who come into problems is for each drug. Alcohol seems like it is the most widely used drug. Just about everybody I know drinks to some degree or another. I know very few people who are alcoholics. I would be willing to wager that the percentage of alcohol users who come into problems is significantly lower than that of meth, crack, cocaine, and heroin. I would define a drug problem as a level of addiction where the user has a hard time getting through the day without, spends an unhealthy amount of money on the drug and is very ignorant of other responsibilities, and one which results in a serious toll on health. Although alcohol is never safe, I would say that the average drinker is not significantly hurting themselves.
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deCypher



Registered: 02/10/08
Posts: 56,232
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Re: Face it ... the drugs don't work [Re: Smitington]
#14044300 - 02/28/11 06:45 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Here are some interesting statistics I found:
Greater than 50% of grownups in the US have had knowledge of someone in their immediate family with an alcohol problem.
and
Alcohol dependence and abuse cost the US approximately $220 billion in 2005. For the sake of comparison, this was greater than the amount of money spent to combat cancer ($196 billion) and obesity ($133 billion).
http://www.treatment-centers.net/alcoholism-statistics.html
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Re: Face it ... the drugs don't work [Re: Smitington]
#14044319 - 02/28/11 06:47 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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It's a hard thing to track statistically, given how illegal drugs are illegal and alcohol is not. But in my experience, most users of meth and cocaine use it like they would alcohol - occasionally. The percentage of users who use daily is low, because it's difficult to sustain that type of habit, regardless to which drug you're using. There are a lot of very pressing reasons not to do it, including financial and just general psychological well-being. The drugs take an immediate and obvious toll that most users can notice and respond to.
As for opiates on the other hand, it seems like most people I hear becoming seriously addicted to them at some point were "blessed" with a very large supply of opiates which they were free to pick from like a giant bag of skittles.
-------------------- Enlil said: You really are the worst kind of person.
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Smitington
Unidentified Flying Object


Registered: 08/10/09
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Re: Face it ... the drugs don't work [Re: deCypher]
#14044387 - 02/28/11 06:57 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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My perception of "hard drugs" may be distorted as I have never really been in contact with them or known people who have problems with them. However, I find it hard to believe that alcohol, a drug which the majority of adults consume, is as dangerous as people are making it out to be in this thread.
Quote:
deCypher said: Greater than 50% of grownups in the US have had knowledge of someone in their immediate family with an alcohol problem.
This is the quote I found from your link:
"An estimated 43% of US adults have had someone related to them who is presently, or was, an alcoholic."
There is a big difference between immediate family, and a relative. Families are huge. How many people do you think the average person is related to? And by related I mean first cousins, aunts, uncles, grandparents, great-aunts, great-uncles, great-grand parents, and immediate family. I would estimate the number is easily 100 or more. The fact that 43% of people know one person out of 100 who had alcohol problems equates to .43% of all people having problems.
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Re: Face it ... the drugs don't work [Re: Smitington]
#14044403 - 02/28/11 07:00 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Many people who live with addiction are not down-and-out homeless people. Oftentimes you can't even tell without getting to know them that they have any kind of problem at all.
Addiction is a far more complicated problem than fuckers like this are willing to address.
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Smitington
Unidentified Flying Object


Registered: 08/10/09
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How are you calling a fucker?
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Re: Face it ... the drugs don't work [Re: Smitington]
#14044431 - 02/28/11 07:04 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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The guy they talk to in the OP's article, the cop involved with this "Faces of Meth" thing.
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deCypher



Registered: 02/10/08
Posts: 56,232
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Re: Face it ... the drugs don't work [Re: Smitington]
#14044439 - 02/28/11 07:05 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Smitington said: My perception of "hard drugs" may be distorted as I have never really been in contact with them or known people who have problems with them. However, I find it hard to believe that alcohol, a drug which the majority of adults consume, is as dangerous as people are making it out to be in this thread.
Quote:
deCypher said: Greater than 50% of grownups in the US have had knowledge of someone in their immediate family with an alcohol problem.
This is the quote I found from your link:
"An estimated 43% of US adults have had someone related to them who is presently, or was, an alcoholic."
There is a big difference between immediate family, and a relative. Families are huge. How many people do you think the average person is related to? And by related I mean first cousins, aunts, uncles, grandparents, great-aunts, great-uncles, great-grand parents, and immediate family. I would estimate the number is easily 100 or more. The fact that 43% of people know one person out of 100 who had alcohol problems equates to .43% of all people having problems.
Yeah, according to that page 14 million people in America currently have problems with alcohol which translates to about 4.7% of Americans. Not THAT significant but still a decent amount. I think part of the reason why we seem to be able to handle alcohol at least tolerably well is because it's socially accepted and growing up in a family who drinks moderately can teach the children how to use it properly. Binge drinking in college somewhat negates this factor, but I feel like other hard drugs like meth and heroin would be much more handleable if they were socially accepted and used in a similar manner of moderation while growing up. I remember reading that there are certain villages in Afghanistan where opium is socially accepted (but NOT junkiedom, just like the distinction between using alcohol moderately here and becoming an alcoholic)... they have far fewer problems than countries where opiates are stigmatized and illegalized.
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Smitington
Unidentified Flying Object


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Re: Face it ... the drugs don't work [Re: deCypher]
#14044509 - 02/28/11 07:13 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
deCypher said: Yeah, according to that page 14 million people in America currently have problems with alcohol which translates to about 4.7% of Americans. Not THAT significant but still a decent amount. I think part of the reason why we seem to be able to handle alcohol at least tolerably well is because it's socially accepted and growing up in a family who drinks moderately can teach the children how to use it properly. Binge drinking in college somewhat negates this factor, but I feel like other hard drugs like meth and heroin would be much more handleable if they were socially accepted and used in a similar manner of moderation while growing up. I remember reading that there are certain villages in Afghanistan where opium is socially accepted (but NOT junkiedom, just like the distinction between using alcohol moderately here and becoming an alcoholic)... they have far fewer problems than countries where opiates are stigmatized and illegalized. 
Actually, you make an excellent point.
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Re: Face it ... the drugs don't work [Re: Smitington]
#14044527 - 02/28/11 07:15 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Yeah, plus I don't think it's too common for people in the Native American Church to jump through windows on peyote.
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LadyLittleZeppelin
Stoner



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I'm trying to find peyote I've smoked salvia, weed, and tried shrooms. I can't wait to see what kind of trip I have on peyote.
-------------------- SHROOMS MAKE YOU GAY ~ Crystal G said: its cuzzzzzz i giiiiiive a meeeeean blooooowjjjobbbb.
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Sophistic Radiance
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I'd love to try peyote too, it seems to be a tough one to find.
I need to try san pedro though, been putting that one off for way too long.
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Smitington
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San Pedro cactus or similar cacti which are not currently controlled are nearly equivelant from what I have read, and much more common. Peyote is pretty rare as it takes a long ass time for the buttons to grow and is an endangered plant.
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