Home | Community | Message Board

Magic-Mushrooms-Shop.com
This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   Myyco.com Isolated Cubensis Liquid Culture For Sale   North Spore Bulk Substrate   MagicBag.co All-In-One Bags That Don't Suck   PhytoExtractum Maeng Da Thai Kratom Leaf Powder   Mushroom-Hut Grow Bags   Original Sensible Seeds Bulk Cannabis Seeds   Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Extract

Jump to first unread post Pages: 1
Some of these posts are very old and might contain outdated information. You may wish to search for newer posts instead.
Invisiblelipa

Registered: 07/24/07
Posts: 2,684
Trusted Cultivator
Arizona Oyster with some unusual features
    #14007956 - 02/22/11 02:42 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)

I traveled to the Arizona white mountains last year during the monsoon rains and collected some oyster prints from a huge rotting fallen aspen. I did not take pictures unfortunately of the original specimens but they were very creamy white and had the classic shape of the common Pleurotus ostreatus. After a few month I fired up some of the spores and isloated a few cultures. During the first attempt I initially forgot about the grow in a shotgun box and before I had gotton to it it was out of control and sticking the block outside was not going to help. To my amazement the fruitbodies did not seem to care a whole lot about which way was up. They somewhat turned up but as you can see in the pictures they are very hesitant of it. Some exhibited a slight upturn during maturity. Also the presence of spores is scarce to none. I cold not collect any spores whatsoever and upon placing some gill tissue under the microscope I saw one basidia in an hour sitting. As you can see they also have a tiny acute umbo on top that I have never seen in oyster. The smell is more tarragony and the umbo seems to have a darker appearance. Somewhat confused I would like your alls thought on this. I have a grow moving along as we speak.  The first three pics are of the new grow taken today.







My Southern California Oyster on spent shiitake substrate.

Edited by lipa (02/22/11 04:13 PM)

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinecaricapapaya
Stranger
Male User Gallery


Registered: 04/10/06
Posts: 258
Last seen: 1 year, 9 months
Re: Arizona Oyster with some unusual features [Re: lipa]
    #14010408 - 02/22/11 10:11 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)

I am thinking there is a possibility that whatever is causing the lack of their ability to sense gravity is somehow linked to the lack of spores.

I wonder if there are any studies on what allows mushrooms to sense gravitiy?

In plants, statoliths (which are more dense than their surroundings) "fall" and can accumulate (at least in the root tips) and allow the roots to "know" which way to grow.

I wonder if mushrooms have a similar mechanism, and that it is controlled by the same pathways that control spore production. It seems to make sense that they would be linked, as the only real advantage that I can see to growing "up" and turning your cap the right way, is for spore dispersal, which you wouldnt need to do if you have no spores.

I think this is an awesome find, with good breeding potential. It would be easier to breed if you could find some spores, but thats probably not necessary (according to the claims of many).

definately save it.

I know of a very nice plant that only came about because the breeder searched and searched "pollen-less" flowers until he found some pollen to use in a cross.

Keep us updated,

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinecaricapapaya
Stranger
Male User Gallery


Registered: 04/10/06
Posts: 258
Last seen: 1 year, 9 months
Re: Arizona Oyster with some unusual features [Re: caricapapaya]
    #14010525 - 02/22/11 10:29 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)

just searched a little bit and found something interesting:
link:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11541309
text:
Considering that research on gravitropism in higher fungi has a history of over 100 years, the harvest of established fact is disappointingly meagre. We can be reasonably certain of the following. Hymenomycete 'mushroom' fruit bodies (polypore and agaric) exhibit a number of tropisms of which anemotropism, gravitropism, phototropism and thigmotropism have been clearly demonstrated. At any one time one tropism usually predominates but the inferior tropisms can be demonstrated if the predominating ones can be removed by manipulation of the growth conditions. In ascending order, the hierarchy appears to be: thigmotropism, gravitropism, anemotropism, phototropism. During the course of development of a fruit body different tropisms predominate at different times. The youngest fruit body initials grow perpendicularly away from their substratum. The nature of this tropism is completely unknown but perpendicular growth of fruit body initials has been remarked upon in experiments at a variety of light intensities and in gravitational fields from +/- 0 to 4.5 g. The fruit-body primordium then becomes first positively phototropic but later negative gravitropism predominates. The switch between predominance of the two tropisms has been associated with the onset of sporulation in a number of different studies. The major adjustment of the direction of growth in response to a tropic stimulus is made by the mushroom stem. It is the apex of the stem which makes the most immediate gravitropic response. Gravitropic growth curvatures are limited to the normal growth zones of the stem and seem to depend on re-allocation of available growth resources. If the fruit body is reoriented late in the growth of the stem, it may not be able to respond fully. In these cases gravitropic movements of the cap may still be able to bring the hymenophore back to the vertical. Mechanical forces may influence and contribute to the 'gravitropic' response but this has not been experimentally examined. The hymenophore (gill, tube or tooth) is positively gravitropic and responds independently of the stem. Bracket polypores do not show tropisms but exhibit gravimorphogenetic responses such that gross disturbance leads to renewal of growth to produce and entirely new fruiting structure suitably reoriented to the new spatial position. One experiment performed on an orbiting space station suggests that, in the absence of a light stimulus, gravity may be required for initiation of fruiting in Polyporus brumalis. Otherwise, the indications from both clinostat and space-borne experiments are that the basic form of the mushroom (overall tissue arrangement of stem, cap, gills, hymenium, veil) in agaric and polypore alike is established independently of the gravity vector. Abnormal stem growth has been observed in clinostat cultures of Panus (= Lentinus) tigrinus and Polyporus brumalis, but the morphogenetic event which seems most dependent on gravity is sporulation (in the broadest sense). Cultures of P. brumalis on orbiting space craft fail to produce the poroid hymenophore and in clinostat experiments on the ground even karyogamy was rare in similar cultures. Coprinus cinereus grown on the clinostat was able to produce apparently normal fruit body primordia which failed to produce spores and then aborted, forming a new flush of primordia on the old. Taken together with the clear association between observation of gravitropism and the onset of sporulation, the implication is that commitment to the meiosis-sporulation pathway both requires the gravity vector and couples it in some way to fruit-body growth. There is no convincing evidence for a graviperception mechanism in fungi. There is no evidence for any organised means of communicating the gravitropic stimulus once it has been perceived. Reports of three different experimental studies reveal the authors' conviction that the apparently coordinated expression of gravitropic response is in truth a common, but independent, response by the individual component hyphae of the structure concerned. There is some evidence that in the negatively gravitropic Phycomyces sporangiophore the vacuole floats in the protoplasm. If this is generally true it could affect protoplasmic volumes above and below the vacuole such that a greater proportion of the cell's potential for wall growth was adjacent to the lower wall. This is not only an attractive way of accounting for asymmetric wall growth, but since the relative density of the vacuole can presumably be controlled by regulation of water influx and efflux, it is also an attractive means of accounting for the control of gravitropic responses. Phycomyces also exhibits a response to the mechanical consequences of reorientation which is additional to (and different from) the longer term gravitropic response. [TRUNCATED]

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMycelio
Stranger
Male

Registered: 06/24/08
Posts: 1,636
Loc: Berlin Flag
Last seen: 4 months, 24 days
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Arizona Oyster with some unusual features [Re: lipa]
    #14012127 - 02/23/11 06:32 AM (13 years, 10 days ago)

Thats an interesting type of oyster, especially those nipples look funny. Thanks for showing, Lipa!

As you are asking for thoughts... When seeing cultures from wild oysters, I always wonder if it is P. ostreatus or P. pulmonarius. Here my first thought was that it may be P. cornucopiae as well, though I guess you found large fruitbodies, indicating P. ostreatus. There may be more similar species in Arizona, which I don't know of.
The lack of spores should be caused by the current fruiting conditions, as you took a sporeprint from the wild mushrooms.

Carsten

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblelipa

Registered: 07/24/07
Posts: 2,684
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Arizona Oyster with some unusual features [Re: Mycelio]
    #14012901 - 02/23/11 10:52 AM (13 years, 10 days ago)

Thanks guys for your input. The paper on gravitropism is really interesting. I will be taking more photos this afternoon. They are fruiting outside and they are still just pointing the same direction. I ate a small cluster last night.

It trips me out eating mushrooms that just don't behave like themselves. I had the initial anxiety felings but they went away. :lol::smirk:

Lipa

Edited by lipa (02/23/11 10:54 AM)

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMycelio
Stranger
Male

Registered: 06/24/08
Posts: 1,636
Loc: Berlin Flag
Last seen: 4 months, 24 days
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Arizona Oyster with some unusual features [Re: lipa]
    #14013054 - 02/23/11 11:37 AM (13 years, 10 days ago)

On another thought... did you consider P. euosmus?

Carsten

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineRogerRabbitM
Bans for Pleasure
Male User Gallery


Registered: 03/26/03
Posts: 42,214
Loc: Seattle
Last seen: 1 year, 12 days
Trusted Cultivator
OG Cultivator
Re: Arizona Oyster with some unusual features [Re: Mycelio]
    #14013094 - 02/23/11 11:49 AM (13 years, 10 days ago)

That paper got me to thinking of perhaps putting oyster substrates on a BBQ spit and rotating them during fruiting.  It would be interesting to see if interrupting the gravity that way might help produce sporeless fruits.
RR


--------------------
Download Let's Grow Mushrooms



semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat

"I've never had a failed experiment.  I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleAlkaloids
3,4,5-trimethoxyphenethylamine
Male


Registered: 11/15/98
Posts: 743
Loc: pubis mons
Re: Arizona Oyster with some unusual features [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #14013426 - 02/23/11 01:02 PM (13 years, 10 days ago)

lipa  those do look interesting.  Right now i'd say just wait and see.  How many strains did you isolate from spores? 

caricapapaya  great paper. Thanks for the read.

RR  that does sound like an interesting idea.  If there is a simply mechanical way to get those Pl. ostreatus to fruit without all those spores that would be excellent.  This has got the thinking cap going though. :smile:


--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinecaricapapaya
Stranger
Male User Gallery


Registered: 04/10/06
Posts: 258
Last seen: 1 year, 9 months
Re: Arizona Oyster with some unusual features [Re: Alkaloids]
    #14013922 - 02/23/11 02:17 PM (13 years, 10 days ago)

I think RRs idea has merit. If it worked, it would show that spore development requires a perception of gravity to get going.

There are some orchids that when grown in tissue culture, in liquid under constant shaking, they just grow undifferentiated protocorm-like structures, then when they are plated out and left alone, they differentiate into plantlets (roots and shoot)

It would be interesting to see if it was similar with oysters, and RRs idea could be carried out very easily.

Another thing I noticed about those fruit bodies is that the stems appear mostly central, not lateral like you would expect to see in most oysters.

I wonder if the lateral stem is also controlled by its ability to perceive gravity?

I am very interested in this mutant......

Lipa, in the pics you posted the older mushrooms look like they were starved for FAE, is that because they were in the shotgun for too long, or do they always mature like that?

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Invisiblelipa

Registered: 07/24/07
Posts: 2,684
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Arizona Oyster with some unusual features [Re: caricapapaya]
    #14014440 - 02/23/11 03:22 PM (13 years, 10 days ago)

Yes, the first grow was in a shotgun. The current grow is outside in the cave with good lighting.  By the way the reason why these are not as prolific as the first grow is because i used the first grow to inoculate the second. I have new spawn and will be doing a standard grow soon.  Here at home I always start them in a shotgun and then during cap development i throw them in the cave.

I isolated about 5 strains. This one started fruiting on the agar very quickly so I decided to start with it first. The other 4 will have to wait a few weeks before I get to them. This strain pins up 2 days after colonization. Its very fast.

They still seem to be growing the same direction. I am thinking of sending these in for a DNA analysis.









The mycelium is odd in that it doesn't get really fluffy like. It's spotty. On agar it is cottony at first but by the time it is about the size of a quarter it becomes appressed.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleAlkaloids
3,4,5-trimethoxyphenethylamine
Male


Registered: 11/15/98
Posts: 743
Loc: pubis mons
Re: Arizona Oyster with some unusual features [Re: lipa]
    #14019417 - 02/24/11 11:22 AM (13 years, 9 days ago)

Lipa  Are you thinking of growing this out on some aspen sawdust/shavings to see if this might have an effect on sporulation?  I suppose part of this will have to wait until you fruit the other strains out, since they might provide some useful information as well.

  They look tasty enough. :smile:


--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlineleschampignons
Biochemistry + Mycology
Male User Gallery

Registered: 08/30/13
Posts: 1,583
Loc: NY/NJ/ME Flag
Last seen: 1 month, 5 days
Re: Arizona Oyster with some unusual features [Re: lipa]
    #18822323 - 09/10/13 07:50 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Lipa, do you still have this strain running? I have a fair collection of cultures and would like a sporeless strain of oysters.


--------------------
leschampignons Trade List

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: 1

Shop: Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   Myyco.com Isolated Cubensis Liquid Culture For Sale   North Spore Bulk Substrate   MagicBag.co All-In-One Bags That Don't Suck   PhytoExtractum Maeng Da Thai Kratom Leaf Powder   Mushroom-Hut Grow Bags   Original Sensible Seeds Bulk Cannabis Seeds   Left Coast Kratom Buy Kratom Extract


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Why won't my king oyster caps get any bigger? mr_meeseeks 1,168 10 05/09/21 05:25 AM
by sendmehummus
* pink oyster pics grown on craft straw dysphoria 2,732 5 09/01/07 09:15 AM
by greys
* Someone look at this Oyster plate for me? mushpunx 417 13 05/09/21 03:54 PM
by TravelAgency
* Adding motor oil to oyster mushroom spawn bags.
( 1 2 all )
Kevin 8,194 28 12/02/12 03:55 AM
by cloudpersona
* Looking for tips from King Oyster growers
( 1 2 3 all )
Hindsight 2,999 45 08/15/21 12:15 PM
by Bytor2112
* oyster will save the world shachar 837 3 11/02/04 12:18 PM
by DrGidget
* Bulk Oyster Mushrooms
( 1 2 all )
Flop Johnson 10,767 27 10/01/07 07:01 PM
by Jeremy_Davis
* King oyster - too much pins? Owl 3,875 15 01/20/06 09:28 AM
by micololo2

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: RogerRabbit, Pastywhyte, Forrester, Stromrider, SHROOMSISAY01
1,301 topic views. 2 members, 3 guests and 2 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2024 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.028 seconds spending 0.007 seconds on 14 queries.