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InvisibleAsante
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Re: African History Tribute: Frances Cress Welsing (and more) [Re: jainveganbuddha]
    #14002353 - 02/21/11 04:01 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)

I hope you'll grace me with a reply also :smile:


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Re: African History Tribute: Frances Cress Welsing (and more) [Re: jainveganbuddha]
    #14002366 - 02/21/11 04:04 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)

Quote:

jainveganbuddha said:
the Africans are good and loving people, so that is what we expect.





every last one embodies love and caring


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Offlinejainveganbuddha
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Re: African History Tribute: Frances Cress Welsing (and more) *DELETED* [Re: Asante]
    #14002373 - 02/21/11 04:05 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)

Post deleted by jainveganbuddha

Reason for deletion: repetitive



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InvisibleLe_Canard
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Re: African History Tribute: Frances Cress Welsing (and more) [Re: jainveganbuddha]
    #14002379 - 02/21/11 04:06 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)

Lighter skin is an adaptation, not a form of genetic damage as you claim. And seriously, all those "attributes" you claim come with less melanin are hardly scientifically documented.

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Re: African History Tribute: Frances Cress Welsing (and more) [Re: jainveganbuddha]
    #14002406 - 02/21/11 04:10 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)

Genetics would say otherwise of this "sciece".

http://galsatia.files.wordpress.com/2007/04/blanche_paleur.pdf


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Re: African History Tribute: Frances Cress Welsing (and more) [Re: Le_Canard]
    #14002425 - 02/21/11 04:15 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)

Quote:

Humans and other organisms that live in the day on the surface of the earth are not suited to white/colorless skin without melanin. Melanin is needed and highly desirable for the well-being and survival of the human species. It aids development and protects the cells, organs, systems etc of the body. This dominance tends to play out in nature, relationships, etc, which seems to be, at least part of why the albino male would seem so threatened and hostile.




White people do have melanin, just not as much.  It is better to have dark skin in africa, but white skin evolved in the northern hemisphere for a reason.  You should also be aware that albinism is completely different from just having light skin.  Calling her statements "scientifically based" is completely wrong, it is pseudoscience.


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Offlinejainveganbuddha
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Re: African History Tribute: Frances Cress Welsing (and more) [Re: Le_Canard]
    #14002449 - 02/21/11 04:18 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)

white skin is not an adaptation, it is a mutation and an undesirable genetic trait, unfortunately. this is not an insult, but melanin deficiency affects all stages of development , and slows development.

and in case you didnt know, those with thoroughly non-racist, and intermixed families such as myself know that among babies of mixed race, the ones that are fairer have slower maturation and development. their melanin and functional skills come in consistently later than those who are darker and get the dominant genes. they eventually get some color, and their eyes darken from pale blue to hazel or brown by age three.

white skin is not an adaptation, it is a mutation and an undesirable genetic trait, unfortunately. this is not an insult, but melanin deficiency affects all stages of development , and slows development.

and in case you didnt know, those with thoroughly non-racist, and intermixed families such as myself know that among babies of mixed race, the ones that are fairer have slower maturation and development. their melanin and functional skills come in consistently later than those who are darker and get the dominant genes. they eventually get some color, and their eyes darken from pale blue to hazel or brown by age three.

fully african babies show advanced skills of movement, function, interaction, and recognition very early relative to all other groups. they are hardier, in general, and are born with brown to dark brown eyes and full or nearly-full color.

by isolating themselves genetically through racism, the most albino lineages have shrunk their own gene pool to dangerous proportions, and kept themselves from the protective function of the majority genetic population. this is especially true among the aryan elite that controls the worlds banking systems etc. that is, by intermixing, they would stabilize and mask the recessive traits, strengthening their line. their own self-isolation is what has doomed them to degradation and extinction, it seems, scientifically speaking.

fully african babies show advanced skills of movement, function, interaction, and recognition very early relative to all other groups. they are hardier, in general, and are born with brown to dark brown eyes and full or nearly-full color.

by isolating themselves genetically through racism, the most albino lineages have shrunk their own gene pool to dangerous proportions, and kept themselves from the protective function of the majority genetic population. this is especially true among the aryan elite that controls the worlds banking systems etc. that is, by intermixing, they would stabilize and mask the recessive traits, strengthening their line. their own self-isolation is what has doomed them to degradation and extinction, it seems, scientifically speaking.
Quote:

ToiletDuk said:
Lighter skin is an adaptation, not a form of genetic damage as you claim. And seriously, all those "attributes" you claim come with less melanin are hardly scientifically documented.




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OfflineDrMambo
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Re: African History Tribute: Frances Cress Welsing (and more) [Re: jainveganbuddha]
    #14002465 - 02/21/11 04:20 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)

read over that article that I linked, it explains things quite reasonable


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OfflineShroomerette
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Re: African History Tribute: Frances Cress Welsing (and more) [Re: Shroomerette]
    #14002466 - 02/21/11 04:20 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)



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OfflineShroomerette
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Re: African History Tribute: Frances Cress Welsing (and more) [Re: jainveganbuddha]
    #14002486 - 02/21/11 04:23 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)

It IS an adaptation.  Why did you post everything twice?

And PLEASE stop calling white people albino.


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InvisibleLe_Canard
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Re: African History Tribute: Frances Cress Welsing (and more) [Re: jainveganbuddha]
    #14002491 - 02/21/11 04:24 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)

Oh please. :facepalm: Link me to a legitimate scientific study demonstrating this.

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Offlinejainveganbuddha
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Re: African History Tribute: Frances Cress Welsing (and more) [Re: Shroomerette]
    #14002502 - 02/21/11 04:26 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)

Quote:

Shroomerette said:
Quote:

Humans and other organisms that live in the day on the surface of the earth are not suited to white/colorless skin without melanin. Melanin is needed and highly desirable for the well-being and survival of the human species. It aids development and protects the cells, organs, systems etc of the body. This dominance tends to play out in nature, relationships, etc, which seems to be, at least part of why the albino male would seem so threatened and hostile.




White people do have melanin, just not as much.  It is better to have dark skin in africa, but white skin evolved in the northern hemisphere for a reason.  You should also be aware that albinism is completely different from just having light skin.  Calling her statements "scientifically based" is completely wrong, it is pseudoscience.




No, there is no environment on the face of the earth that would make that state of pigmentation desirable, and that is why it is recessive, and plagued by all the abnormalities of any recessive phenotypes. People living where the UV index is lowest may benefit from being lighter but not white/aryan/pigmentless.

Most people who think of themselves as WHITE are falling into a trap set by the elites to divide categorize conquer and dominate the majority human population. People with recognizable amounts of melanin in the hair eyes skin etc are mixtures, because these traits can be diluted by codominance. I think if you realized how very white and colorless the true 'white' people of the ruling elite, and see them, you would know whats up. but we do not see them often. they have become isolated, evil, and twisted in their separation from their roots.


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Offlinejainveganbuddha
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Re: African History Tribute: Frances Cress Welsing (and more) [Re: jainveganbuddha]
    #14002534 - 02/21/11 04:30 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)

for a legit scientific study, you need unbiased un-racist interpretation. what cress does is correctly interpret irrefutable scientific fact. you just dont want to accept it for your own inner reasons, it seems.

I have made the distinction between the truly white people as true albinos and the others who are conveniently classified by the elites as whites. this is a ploy to divide humanity (like all race and national divisions) up so that their albino minority can deal with them in smaller groups, and pit them against each other, as well.

cress says there is virtue to repetition, sometimes.


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OfflineDrMambo
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Re: African History Tribute: Frances Cress Welsing (and more) [Re: jainveganbuddha]
    #14002548 - 02/21/11 04:32 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)

jainveganbuddha, please address this

Researchers have disagreed for decades about
an issue that is only skin-deep: How quickly
did the first modern humans who swept into
Europe acquire pale skin? Now a new report
on the evolution of a gene for skin color suggests
that Europeans lightened up quite
recently, perhaps only 6000 to 12,000 years
ago. This contradicts a long-standing hypothesis
that modern humans in Europe grew
paler about 40,000 years ago, as soon as they
migrated into northern latitudes. Under
darker skies, pale skin absorbs more sunlight
than dark skin, allowing ultraviolet rays to
produce more vitamin D for bone growth and
calcium absorption. “The [evolution of] light
skin occurred long after the arrival of modern
humans in Europe,” molecular anthropologist
Heather Norton of the University of Arizona,
Tucson, said in her talk.
The genetic origin of the spectrum of
human skin colors has been one of the big
puzzles of biology. Researchers made a
major breakthrough in 2005 by discovering a
gene, SLC24A5, that apparently causes pale
skin in many Europeans, but not in Asians.
A team led by geneticist Keith Cheng of
Pennsylvania State University (PSU) College
of Medicine in Hershey found two variants
of the gene that differed by just one
amino acid. Nearly all Africans and East
Asians had one allele, whereas 98% of the
120 Europeans they studied had the other
(Science, 28 October 2005, p. 601).
Norton, who worked on the Cheng study
as a graduate student, decided to find out
when that mutation swept through Europeans.
Working as a postdoc with geneticist Michael
Hammer at the University of Arizona, she
sequenced 9300 base pairs of DNA in the
SLC24A5 gene in 41 Europeans, Africans,
Asians, and American Indians.
Using variations in the gene that did not
cause paling, she calculated the background
mutation rate of SLC24A5 and thereby determined
that 18,000 years had passed since the
light-skin allele was fixed in Europeans. But
the error margins were large, so she also analyzed
variation in the DNA flanking the
gene. She found that Europeans with the
allele had a “striking lack of diversity” in
this flanking DNA—a sign of very recent
genetic change, because not enough time has
passed for new mutations to arise. The data
suggest that the selective sweep occurred
5300 to 6000 years ago, but given the imprecision
of method, the real date could be as far
back as 12,000 years ago, Norton said. She
added that other, unknown, genes probably
also cause paling in Europeans.
Either way, the implication is that our
European ancestors were brown-skinned
for tens of thousands of years—a suggestion
made 30 years ago by Stanford University
geneticist L. Luca Cavalli-Sforza. He
argued that the early immigrants to Europe,
who were hunter-gatherers, herders, and
fishers, survived on ready-made sources of
vitamin D in their diet. But when farming
spread in the past 6000 years, he argued,
Europeans had fewer sources of vitamin D
in their food and needed to absorb more
sunlight to produce the vitamin in their
skin. Cultural factors such as heavier clothing
might also have favored increased
absorption of sunlight on the few exposed
areas of skin, such as hands and faces, says
paleoanthropologist Nina Jablonski of PSU
in State College.
Such recent changes in skin color show
that humans are still evolving, says molecular
anthropologist Henry Harpending of the University
of Utah, Salt Lake City: “We have all
tacitly assumed for years that modern humans
showed up 45,000 years ago and have not
changed much since, while this and other
work shows that we continue to change, often
at a very fast rate.”


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Offlinejainveganbuddha
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Re: African History Tribute: Frances Cress Welsing (and more) [Re: jainveganbuddha]
    #14002552 - 02/21/11 04:32 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)

More informative interviews with Dr. Welsing... enjoy.



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OfflineShroomerette
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Re: African History Tribute: Frances Cress Welsing (and more) [Re: jainveganbuddha]
    #14002584 - 02/21/11 04:39 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)

Quote:

jainveganbuddha said:
white skin is not an adaptation, it is a mutation and an undesirable genetic trait, unfortunately. this is not an insult, but melanin deficiency affects all stages of development , and slows development.




BS. Prove it.

Quote:

and in case you didnt know, those with thoroughly non-racist, and intermixed families such as myself know that among babies of mixed race, the ones that are fairer have slower maturation and development. their melanin and functional skills come in consistently later than those who are darker and get the dominant genes. they eventually get some color, and their eyes darken from pale blue to hazel or brown by age three.




Slower maturation? BS. Prove it.

Quote:

fully african babies show advanced skills of movement, function, interaction, and recognition very early relative to all other groups. they are hardier, in general, and are born with brown to dark brown eyes and full or nearly-full color.




Prove it?

Quote:

jainveganbuddha said:
Quote:

Shroomerette said:
Quote:

Humans and other organisms that live in the day on the surface of the earth are not suited to white/colorless skin without melanin. Melanin is needed and highly desirable for the well-being and survival of the human species. It aids development and protects the cells, organs, systems etc of the body. This dominance tends to play out in nature, relationships, etc, which seems to be, at least part of why the albino male would seem so threatened and hostile.




White people do have melanin, just not as much.  It is better to have dark skin in africa, but white skin evolved in the northern hemisphere for a reason.  You should also be aware that albinism is completely different from just having light skin.  Calling her statements "scientifically based" is completely wrong, it is pseudoscience.




No, there is no environment on the face of the earth that would make that state of pigmentation desirable, and that is why it is recessive, and plagued by all the abnormalities of any recessive phenotypes. People living where the UV index is lowest may benefit from being lighter but not white/aryan/pigmentless.

Most people who think of themselves as WHITE are falling into a trap set by the elites to divide categorize conquer and dominate the majority human population. People with recognizable amounts of melanin in the hair eyes skin etc are mixtures, because these traits can be diluted by codominance. I think if you realized how very white and colorless the true 'white' people of the ruling elite, and see them, you would know whats up. but we do not see them often. they have become isolated, evil, and twisted in their separation from their roots.




Why then is pretty much the entire indigenous population of the northern hemisphere white?  Are they all inbred and pointless mutants?  Also, I don't understand why you call "whiteness" recessive when children mixed between african and caucasian heritage are basically medium colored.  If whiteness is recessive, children with one white parent and one black would come out as black as the black parent.  I believe skin color genes should properly be considered codominant.


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Offlinejainveganbuddha
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Re: African History Tribute: Frances Cress Welsing (and more) [Re: jainveganbuddha]
    #14002611 - 02/21/11 04:45 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)

Dark skin and melanin are known to absorb and protect the body from all kinds of radiation, not just light in the visible spectrum.

I understand what the article is saying, but you have to understand that africans are the parental roots of humanity. it is no mystery where whiteness and those in between come from. It happens when albinos mix with others. endless variations are possible, and africans with every varion of features--from hair texture to facial shape etc are present in africa... and her sister civilization in India. these european scientists are just guessing and postulating from data and their own mind-state as well.

genes do not adapt to environment. this may happen by genetic mixing and survival due to desirable traits for the environment, but according to their info there should still be mostly dark people in europe!

genetic mutation is exclusively degrading. nothing good comes of it. intermixing in sexual reproduction seems to allow for this damage to be corrected from the other parents genes.

Im not sure what your scientific background is, but I completed my pre-meds requisites, and I feel Cress has her conclusions pretty much correct. if she did not, I would say so.


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: African History Tribute: Frances Cress Welsing (and more) [Re: jainveganbuddha]
    #14002628 - 02/21/11 04:49 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)

Quote:

yeah, i didnt read the entire body of the text





You insinuate I nick other peoples work, yet you didnt even bother to read the copypasta that is the original post of this thread? :owned:


Quote:

these are interpretations of her work from others, which I find to be incorrect interpretations.




No, what I quoted were her actual words, and the interpretation thereof was mine.

Let me reference one in particular:


Quote:

On both St. Valentine’s Day and Mother’s Day, the white male gives gifts of chocolate candy with nuts…. If his sweetheart ingests "chocolate with nuts," the white male can fantasize that he is genetically equal to the Black male…. Is it not also curious that when white males are young and vigorous, they attempt to master the large brown balls, but as they become older and wiser, they psychologically resign themselves to their inability to master the large brown balls? Their focus then shifts masochistically to hitting the tiny white golf balls in disgust and resignation — in full final realization of white genetic recessiveness.

Frances, Cress Welsing (1990). The Isis Papers: The Keys to the Colors. Third World Press. ISBN 0-88378-104-2.




That humongous load of sexual racial speculation based on her obeservations of white men playing sports are from her own book, the Isis Papers.


Quote:

Welsing also claims that the prevalence of high blood pressure among African Americans is due to the fact that melanin picks up "energy vibrations" from people who are experiencing stress. Thus people with dark skin will absorb the effects of stress in others resulting in higher blood pressure.

Welsing, F. C. 1975. Blacks, hypertension, and the active skin melanocyte. Urban Health, 4(3):64-72.





Quote:

Melanin theory is a pseudoscientific theory, founded in the distortion of known physical properties of melanin, a natural polymer and organic semiconductor.[1] In humans, melanin is the primary determinant of skin color. People whose ancestors lived for long periods in the regions of the globe near the equator generally have larger quantities of eumelanin in their skins. Melanin theorists assert that the possession of greater quantities of melanin causes an inherent superiority of black people. Conversely, its lack demonstrates the essential inhumanity and inferiority of white people. The theory is linked to black supremacism.

Some black supremacists justify supremacist assertions by assigning dubious properties to melanin based on pseudoscience and distortions of scientific fact or speculation. Scientists consider melanin theory pseudoscience; it has no credibility in mainstream medicine or science.

Ortiz de Montellano, Bernard R. (17 Dec 2006). "Afrocentric Pseudoscience: The Miseducation of African Americans". Annals of the New York Academy of Sciences (New York Academy of Sciences) 775: 561–572.




Quote:

what do the Europeans have that has not been stolen?




Do you want an answer to that? It's going to be a very long list.

Quote:

look at the world banking system and practices, and tell me who is stealing??




Oy! White people did the Rotschilds international banking cartel too?

Quote:

I dont think she is racist, she is taking a logical and scientific approach to problems caused by the people she is referring to




Melanin Theory is as quacky as pseudoscience can get, if you think that's scientific you either dont understand melanin theory or you dont understand science.

Quote:

People like you seem unable to handle intelligent discussion, because of one of many complexes, or possibly innate reasons. you have to consider that you may have a deficiency state that affects your behavior and functioning, and therefore submit to the guidance and help of those more able.




wut? Are you implying I'm being this way because I'm white? That's awesome :smile2:

You and I agree on more things than you can hope to find in just about any thread, but you're ruining it because instead of admitting that the good lady made some atrociously incorrect statements in the course of her life, you choose to defend these statements that disqualify your point of view.

Its obvious you idolize her. I invite you to take a more critical look at the direct quotes of her I made from the post you started this thread with.

I could even teach you a thing or two about melanin :smile:


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Re: African History Tribute: Frances Cress Welsing (and more) [Re: jainveganbuddha]
    #14002634 - 02/21/11 04:51 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)

Quote:

jainveganbuddha said:
genes do not adapt to environment. this may happen by genetic mixing and survival due to desirable traits for the environment, but according to their info there should still be mostly dark people in europe!




How should there still be mostly dark people in europe if this random mutation was 10,000 years ago, as well as beneficial?

Quote:

genetic mutation is exclusively degrading. nothing good comes of it.




Explain. That sounds contrary to everything I know of evolution.


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Re: African History Tribute: Frances Cress Welsing (and more) [Re: jainveganbuddha]
    #14002637 - 02/21/11 04:52 PM (13 years, 11 days ago)

:facepalm: at "genetic mutation is exclusively degrading. nothing good comes of it."


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