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InvisibleFreakQlibrium
Son of Uncle Meat
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Registered: 06/06/02
Posts: 19,058
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What IF eternity is a jest.......
    #1397238 - 03/21/03 06:14 AM (13 years, 8 months ago)

Will life all have been worthwhile? Will it continue to be? What if it COULD be empirically demonstrated that eternity/the afterlife was merely a construct devised by man to hide the truth of his existence......can anyone here(anyone that sincerely believes there is SOMETHING on the other side of the door) honestly say their day to day experience of life including their thoughts and actions would be unaltered? How difficult would it be for YOU to adjust to this newly discovered and undeniable truth? Your thoughts....please


--------------------
"Being crazier than a shithouse rat is not sufficient grounds for banishment"



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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: What IF eternity is a jest....... [Re: FreakQlibrium]
    #1397465 - 03/21/03 07:42 AM (13 years, 8 months ago)

I don't believe in an 'afterlife' so it really wouldn't make a difference in how I conduct my affairs, it would have only affirmed my suspicions.


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.


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InvisibleRebelSteve33
Amateur Mycologist
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Registered: 05/28/02
Posts: 3,774
Loc: Arizona
Re: What IF eternity is a jest....... [Re: Evolving]
    #1397533 - 03/21/03 07:59 AM (13 years, 8 months ago)

Same here, Evolving.

-RebelSteve

P.S. I hate your avatar. It exudes negativity.


--------------------
Namaste.


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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: What IF eternity is a jest....... [Re: RebelSteve33]
    #1397544 - 03/21/03 08:01 AM (13 years, 8 months ago)

Sorry, I'll look for a new one.


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.


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Anonymous

Re: What IF eternity is a jest....... [Re: FreakQlibrium]
    #1398082 - 03/21/03 11:30 AM (13 years, 8 months ago)

My life would suddenly lose it's entire purpose and direction. I imagine I'd feel like just another typical depressed human being. I'd probably end up thinking there was something wrong with ME rather than the crazy world we live in, and I'd be prescribed a couple antidepressants. I would work my ass off at a job I could care less about to buy a fast powerful car, have the latest in satellite television entertainment, and of course a big house and a beautiful wife devoid of anything resembling a personality. Oh gee this is beginning to sound a bit like typical middle America! What a funny coincidence.

If eternity is a jest, then this life is the biggest joke of all. We'd be here living this painful, shitty existence for nothing at all. If I was certain there was nothing more to this life than the immediately observable, I'd have shot myself many years ago.


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Anonymous

Re: What IF eternity is a jest....... [Re: ]
    #1398159 - 03/21/03 12:11 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

or it can give us motivation to make this hell on earth... heaven.


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InvisibleXibalba
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Registered: 05/14/00
Posts: 2,114
Re: What IF eternity is a jest....... [Re: FreakQlibrium]
    #1398176 - 03/21/03 12:18 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

There's never been any reason for me to believe otherwise. I can't even conceive of what it would be like to really truly have faith I'm going to go somewhere after I die. I think the evidence for life after death as being a false myth is already pretty solid, although -proof- like you are supposing will never be possible.

But for me it's another one of those infinite number of improbable things that always could be true- but the other explanation is so much more logical and straightforward you don't even need to disprove it. Everything we can experience or test or model suggests that the mind is the product of the brain and the soul dies with the body; we rot, life goes on without us and that's that. That already explains the world just fine.

To add an immortal intangible soul and a mechanism by which it interacts with a mortal human body and another mechanism by which it separates from that body at the moment of death and an entire universe for it to go to, governed by a different physics- complicates things greatly. Yet it doesn't explain the world any better than the null hypothesis. To add to this, it -sounds- like wishful thinking.
Life after death would be nice, wouldn't it? No one wants to die and be gone forever. In fact, if there was no afterlife and no soul, doesn't it seem likely people would create this belief anyway to make ourselves feel better?
Because whether there is or not that's we did anyway- religion is far older than science. For evidence, the belief is all we've got, because no one's been dead and back. (No, 'near death' doesn't count- by definition, if you survived to tell about it then you didn't really die. )
So if it is true, it is an amazing coincidence that the universe is really set up in the same way we would have liked to imagine it.

And to try to answer the inverse of your question, if it were proven to me to be real of course things would be different- because at that time I would be dead and no longer confined to the material plane... I'll wait to worry about what to do until after I get there.


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OfflineMurex
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Re: What IF eternity is a jest....... [Re: FreakQlibrium]
    #1398198 - 03/21/03 12:32 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

What IF eternity is a jest.......

Then I would accept it. I'd have to because it is the truth.


--------------------
What if everything around you
Isn't quite as it seems?
What if all the world you think you know,
Is an elaborate dream?
And if you look at your reflection,
Is it all you want it to be?



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OfflineEvilGir
Im the on coming storm

Registered: 11/26/01
Posts: 1,301
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Re: What IF eternity is a jest....... [Re: Murex]
    #1398446 - 03/21/03 02:16 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

The only true proof of what is beyond life is DMT, but we have not evolved enough to take advantage of this compound. So we are reborn time and time again just waiting for the final moment of the human race. This could be some sort of technological advancement that would allow us to make a stable bridge into DMT hyperspace. The whole of socity is evolving now at a super fast rate, not a lot of time to go before we all may enter its eternity.


--------------------
Fighting the man the best way I can.


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InvisibleIn(di)go
People of the sun.
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Re: What IF eternity is a jest....... [Re: FreakQlibrium]
    #1398472 - 03/21/03 02:29 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

well... it really wouldnt change much, i think... for i believe that after my body dies i will be doing exactly the same im doing now: living, creating and experiencing... and thats the reason i try to be here now as much as i can... forget about the past, dont worry about the future... it is NOW that counts... what comes afterwards is irrelevant...

Quote:

or it can give us motivation to make this hell on earth... heaven.



amen


--------------------


Edited by In(di)go (03/21/03 02:30 PM)


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InvisibleXibalba
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Posts: 2,114
Re: What IF eternity is a jest....... [Re: In(di)go]
    #1398617 - 03/21/03 03:24 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

Jezu- Didn't want to complicate things in my first post, but yes, I know about the DMT exception to linear material reality- It's not a matter of reading a bunch of Terrence McKenna's books and taking his word for it, I've been there... I know there is something to that beyond a simple drug intoxication. But I don't think it's changed how I live my life in any way. I've no choice but to take the blue pill, as Zion has not been built yet. How else should I act- grow a beard, wear a funny hat, find some cute little Mormon girl to be my wife...? Our current society is not too fond of its messiahs. So, I finish my education, get a job, a girlfriend, a house, a dog, make some art, read some books, travel, do the same stuff everyone else does.

So yeah, I think there's a "something more-" a pretty big something, too- but it exists only in our future. Maybe someday we will not be limited by mortality... but everyone alive now is still going to die. It's kind of a tragic stage to be in- aware of our own consciousness, aware of the possibility of higher consciouness, still doomed to grow old and rot like any other animal.

Reincarnation seems like a moot point to me. "you" being reborn without your memories is no different from someone else being born- there's no continuation there. We don't remember our past lives. Those memories can be fabricated- like any other memory- through hypnotic suggestion... but the fact that the vast majority of people have no memory of having lived before means there are a lot of dead people who are not being remembered, so whether or not they now inhabit a new body and don't know it- they're for all practical purposes just plain dead.


Edited by Xibalba (03/21/03 03:24 PM)


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InvisibleSwami
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Registered: 01/19/00
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Re: What IF eternity is a jest....... [Re: EvilGir]
    #1398726 - 03/21/03 04:17 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

The only true proof of what is beyond life is DMT

WARNING! LOGIC BREAKDOWN!

The effect of a drug on a living entity can in NO way reveal what happens to said entity after decomposition.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineMurex
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Re: What IF eternity is a jest....... [Re: Swami]
    #1398830 - 03/21/03 05:23 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

Where's your proof?


--------------------
What if everything around you
Isn't quite as it seems?
What if all the world you think you know,
Is an elaborate dream?
And if you look at your reflection,
Is it all you want it to be?



Edited by Murex (03/21/03 05:23 PM)


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Invisibledee_N_ae
\/\/¡†¢h |-|øµ§³ ¢å†
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Re: What IF eternity is a jest....... [Re: Swami]
    #1398842 - 03/21/03 05:30 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

That "drug" has been shown to be produced by our pineal gland at death.


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Invisibledjfrog
omgws!!!1!

Registered: 10/23/00
Posts: 3,710
Re: What IF eternity is a jest....... [Re: dee_N_ae]
    #1398924 - 03/21/03 06:14 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

"
That "drug" has been shown to be produced by our pineal gland at death.
"


Which proves.... nothing? I don't mean to belittle the DMT experience. I've never done it. If it can be learnt from, I doubt it is the only path.

Life after death. To my rational mind it doesn't even make sense, its like asking what ice cream tastes like after you've finished the bowl. To my other mind I think the concept has meaning, but only in the sense of what is perceived when mind no longer associates with the individual experience. But in either case, ideas of personal retribution in an afterlife doesn't make much sense.


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Invisibledee_N_ae
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Re: What IF eternity is a jest....... [Re: djfrog]
    #1398933 - 03/21/03 06:19 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

I didn't say it proved anything.. I was just sayin' is all...    :wink: 


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Offlineshaggy101
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Re: What IF eternity is a jest....... [Re: FreakQlibrium]
    #1399133 - 03/21/03 07:47 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=Forum11&Number=1275568&page=34&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=&fpart=1

heh not that relative but this is good story if you kinda switch topics in the story I think you will see my point though.
I think anyone who takes the little time to read it will enjoy it..

A quick ego based response I would be sad and alittle scared at first.

But luckily I have thought MANY hours on this topic and it wouldnt change much.
unfortunately more details from me I cant give because it is (to state the obvious :smirk: ) impossible to prove that,... as you said " COULD " though..
Before I choose to look within and dare to defy everything I had been taught and the things that I said I knew,

I had been ..content with living and dying.. nothing more or less( although I am glad to say I wasnt "content" enough :crazy: )

damn that was a good question!




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InvisibleZero7a1
Leaving YourWasteland

Registered: 10/23/02
Posts: 3,594
Loc: Passing Cloud
Re: What IF eternity is a jest....... [Re: FreakQlibrium]
    #1399276 - 03/21/03 08:53 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

What if time is a test?


--------------------
What?


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OfflineEvilGir
Im the on coming storm

Registered: 11/26/01
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Re: What IF eternity is a jest....... [Re: Zero7a1]
    #1399458 - 03/22/03 12:28 AM (13 years, 8 months ago)

Ok how about the buddists interpretation of it as they beleive it takes 42 days to be reborn and this happens to be the exact time the pinal gland is fully developed as well as sex. There has also been proof of mostly children remembering past lives with a large amount of acuracy but this information is usualy lost as they grow older. I think that all the information from all your lives is there somewhere in your mind but has to be repressed. Because death must screw most people up and so would birth.

Just imagine being born into a body unable to communicate, move almost in a cabbage state compared to a health adult. So the mind could just supress all the memories.

But there is also new developments where people are now starting to develope child psychology stragaties to communicate with new born babies and toddlers using a simpl form of sign language. Just imagine what state the human race could reach if this became world wide.

As for the terrance Mckenna thing, I did have some ideas about this before reading some of his stuff, but this was because I read an article in new scientist that they are developing a device to create a unnatral form of neutreno ie with high energy, which they will pass it through the earth from diffrent points. They beleive a neturino is a 11 dimentional object.


--------------------
Fighting the man the best way I can.


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InvisibleSwami
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Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
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Re: What IF eternity is a jest....... [Re: dee_N_ae]
    #1399639 - 03/22/03 04:55 AM (13 years, 8 months ago)

That "drug" has been shown to be produced by our pineal gland at death.

It IS a drug, not a "drug". Would also like to see your reference on this and how this is relevant to an after-life.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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Amazon Shop for: Terrence McKenna

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