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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: Evolutionary changes [Re: gnrm23]
    #3862153 - 03/03/05 01:40 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Lamarckism:

"A discredited theory of evolution developed by French biologist Jean-Baptiste Pierre Antoine de Monet, Chevalier de Lamarck in the 19th century."


--------------------
Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.


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Invisibleniteowl
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Re: Evolutionary changes [Re: redgreenvines]
    #3862193 - 03/03/05 01:51 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

redgreenvines said:
but that has nothing to do with your testicles
that part was really really ridiculous unless you have an unique relationship with the higher consciousness and or randomness itself





Let say that this "higher conscience" is nothing more than the "collective conscience" of the planet (Mother Nature if you will).

When WE as a species have randomly mutated to a point of stagnation and need an evolutionary nudge to continue our evolution.

The EASIEST way to make minor genetic adjustments (on a large scale), to our genetic make-up, is to "tweak" the sperm as its being made.

"God/Mother Nature" could show up for a minute, assess the situation, see where we needed to go and "alter" the chemical soup of the whole human race, in a very drastic way, in a very short time frame, with very little energy.


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Invisibleniteowl
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Re: Evolutionary changes [Re: trendal]
    #3862223 - 03/03/05 02:00 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

trendal said:
If you cannot prove/disprove your idea, it is not a theory. It is dogma.

Hasn't this already been pointed out, several times?





For those of you who do not know how to use a dictionary........


dogma: a doctrine or body of doctrines formally proclaimed by a religion

theory: 1 abstract thought: 2 the general principles of a subject: hypothesis, conjecture


untill someone can prove my theory of "divine intervention thru manipulation of sperm" wrong it isnt dogma it is still just a theory.


--------------------
Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Evolutionary changes [Re: niteowl]
    #3862296 - 03/03/05 02:16 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

niteowl said:
When WE as a species have randomly mutated to a point of stagnation and need an evolutionary nudge to continue our evolution.

The EASIEST way to make minor genetic adjustments (on a large scale), to our genetic make-up, is to "tweak" the sperm as its being made.

"God/Mother Nature" could show up for a minute, assess the situation, see where we needed to go and "alter" the chemical soup of the whole human race, in a very drastic way, in a very short time frame, with very little energy.




assessing stagnation in evolution is a nonissue - not done never done among evolution scientists, not a factor in the whole thing altogether - it isn't part of the understanding of evolution.

evolution is the process conceived while looking back at history of survivors of mutation. It helps understanding emerge (sometimes).

(makes me think what a dumb guy am I being involved in this thread again)


the sperm at creation (meiosis) tweak you are surmizing is not easier than any other method of introducing mutation -

course an omnipotent creator could do anything, so why would you have dreamed up this supposedly easy way (NOT EASY AT ALL) for HIM/HER to fool around with genetics - wouldn't a direct and spontaneous approach be delicious.


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Invisibleniteowl
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Re: Evolutionary changes [Re: redgreenvines]
    #3862345 - 03/03/05 02:33 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

redgreenvines said:
course an omnipotent creator could do anything....




Not if he is bound by a set of natural laws.


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Offlinefreddurgan
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Re: Evolutionary changes [Re: niteowl]
    #3863003 - 03/03/05 04:47 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

You know there IS evidence of missing links. Bones from older humans. There -is- evidence of this stuff.

http://www.gate.net/~rwms/EvoEvidence.html

Read the link "Evidence for Human and Ape Common Ancestry", and his rebuttal on the bottom. You act like we have no evidence when really we have tons. We ARE proving our theory and disproving yours.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: Evolutionary changes [Re: niteowl]
    #3863424 - 03/03/05 05:46 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

niteowl said:
Quote:

redgreenvines said:
course an omnipotent creator could do anything....




Not if he is bound by a set of natural laws.



then what does omnipotent mean?
I assure you it is nothing to do with testicles


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Invisibleniteowl
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Re: Evolutionary changes [Re: redgreenvines]
    #3863715 - 03/03/05 06:44 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

freddurgan said:
Read the link "Evidence for Human and Ape Common Ancestry", and his rebuttal on the bottom. You act like we have no evidence when really we have tons. We ARE proving our theory and disproving yours.





I never said that we didn't evolve from an ape like creature.


NEVER.



I believe that our evolutionary theory is correct.


All I'm saying is the "random" mutations may not be random but "divinely inspired".




Quote:

redgreenvines said:
then what does omnipotent mean?




I never made reference to an "omnipotent being".

I said "God/Mother Nature".(another "term" is "Great Spirit")

You assumed I was talking about an "omnipotent/all powerful being", and I wasn't. The thought of anything being "omnipotent" is some what barbaric.

I believe their are spiritual beings that are more "spiritually evolved" than we are. That only exist in spirit form.

The collective power of these "spirits", forms a "Great Spirit". These things (spirits) are not separate from the system but part of it. They are bound by the same "natural laws" that we are.

When the "Great Spirit" sees that we need to make have an evolutionary change. He "wills/nudges" it to happen in a certain way. The "Great Spirit" isn't worried about the male/female issue.(unlike some people here). His concern is to try and help us along the way.

Knowing how we humans "reproduce". The quickest, easiest, most energy efficient way to make a quick change in the genetic code of these humans is to "WILL" a change which ever gender would be easier to manipulate. In humans is the men.

It is just a theory about how "god" may influence our evolution.


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Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
Don't be afraid of what lies in your future


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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hold on to them gonads [Re: niteowl]
    #3864018 - 03/03/05 07:52 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

you have a very specific theory then of slightly superbeings that got their degrees in molecular biology and who are compelled to evolve humans

sounds like a plot for the x-files


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Invisibleninjapixie
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Re: Evolutionary changes [Re: niteowl]
    #3864158 - 03/03/05 08:16 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

When the "Great Spirit" sees that we need to make have an evolutionary change. He "wills/nudges" it to happen in a certain way. The "Great Spirit" isn't worried about the male/female issue.(unlike some people here). His concern is to try and help us along the way.

Help us along the way to what?

Your view of evolution implies direction towards something, some final god-like organism, but all evolution evolves are organisms capable of surviving in their future environments.


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Offlinefreddurgan
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Re: Evolutionary changes [Re: ninjapixie]
    #3864249 - 03/03/05 08:34 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Ooh, ok. So you think that everything is correct except for the way mutation works. You think instead of mutation working the way our highly refined data says it does, that God just helps us mutate.

I'm out of this thread =( This is stupid. I thought you didn't believe in human evolution at all.


--------------------
Ishmael
http://www.ishmael.org

Ron Paul 2008!
http://www.ronpaul2008.com/


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Invisibleniteowl
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Re: Evolutionary changes [Re: niteowl]
    #13684621 - 12/25/10 11:34 PM (11 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

niteowl said:
So what your saying is that evolutionary adaptation is just "dumb luck". That their isnt any thing we do to "adapt" to our changing environment.




Quote:

Phluck said:
Exactly.




Ummmmm......

Scientists at the University of Massachusetts Medical School and the University of Texas at Austin have uncovered evidence that environmental influences experienced by a father can be passed down to the next generation, "reprogramming" how genes function in offspring.


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Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
Don't be afraid of what lies in your future


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Invisibleniteowl
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Re: Evolutionary changes [Re: niteowl]
    #13696364 - 12/28/10 04:30 PM (11 years, 1 month ago)

Come on now, some one needs to accept the fact that I was right about how a mans sperm CAN STRONGLY influence his offspring.

Trendal.....

Quote:

To test their hypothesis that environmental influences experienced by the father can be passed down to the next generation in the form of changed epigenetic information, Rando and colleagues fed different diets to two groups of male mice. The first group received a standard diet, while the second received a low-protein diet. To control for maternal influences, all females were fed the same, standard diet. Rando and colleagues observed that offspring of the mice fed the low-protein diet exhibited a marked increase in the genes responsible for lipid and cholesterol synthesis in comparison to offspring of the control group fed the standard diet.




Genetic change DOES happen in men faster than women......due to the fact that men make new sperm daily. Sperm is a mini copy of who that man is at that moment.

If that man makes significant changes to himself....those changes get passed down to his kids.


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Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
Don't be afraid of what lies in your future


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Offlinefalcon
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Re: Evolutionary changes [Re: niteowl]
    #13696704 - 12/28/10 05:53 PM (11 years, 1 month ago)

epigenetic influences don't change what DNA is there, it changes what DNA gets expressed


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