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Offlinelearningtofly
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If your father is jewish and your mom is french
    #13570217 - 12/01/10 08:32 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

What are you? You can't be nothing can you? Lots of people identify with ethnic backgrounds, and for someone in this situation or anyone who has a father matrilineal society and a mother from a patrilineal, how do they form their identity?


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Invisibleblewmeanie
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: learningtofly]
    #13570229 - 12/01/10 08:36 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Does it really matter at this point? As far as tribal identity goes, your a member of any group that accepts you as a member.


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Invisiblebigmike7104
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: learningtofly]
    #13570233 - 12/01/10 08:36 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

wouldn't they be half jewish half french?


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InvisibleSpiritualSnorkel

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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: blewmeanie]
    #13570239 - 12/01/10 08:37 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

But I wouldn't want to join any group that would have me as a member.


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Offlinelearningtofly
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: bigmike7104]
    #13570248 - 12/01/10 08:38 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

blewmeanie said:
Does it really matter at this point? As far as tribal identity goes, your a member of any group that accepts you as a member.



Neither of them would accept you...
Quote:

bigmike7104 said:
wouldn't they be half jewish half french?



No.

Matrilineality is a system in which lineage is traced through the mother and maternal ancestors
Patrlineality is a system in which lineage is traced through the father and paternal ancestors.

If you have a jewish father, you're not a jew (jews = matrilineal)
if you have a french mother, you're not french (french = patrilineal)

So what are you?


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Offlinestuntmanmike
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: bigmike7104]
    #13570256 - 12/01/10 08:40 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Jewish is a religion and france is a country so you would probably be neither

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Offlinedestructo_low
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: learningtofly]
    #13570258 - 12/01/10 08:41 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

You'd be a human with dna that assigns meaningless words to everything.

edit - Or a bastard child that no one wants. You're half Jewish and French aren't you? And in the situation you described I bet. It's time to remove your fucked up organism of a body from this planet. Not even the Shroomery wants you.


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There is a molecule for every purpose. There are only actions and reactions. Cut out the middle men. Everything I say is a lie.

Edited by destructo_low (12/01/10 08:43 PM)

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InvisibleCaine
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: SpiritualSnorkel]
    #13570263 - 12/01/10 08:41 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

I'm actually this... Except it's french canadian and my mom's the jewish one :smirk:

Hah. That probably made little to no sense.
Whateevvvver :vaped:

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Invisibleblewmeanie
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: learningtofly]
    #13570273 - 12/01/10 08:43 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Nah, this is 2010, none of that shit matters anymore to most people. Some jewish communities would accept you and others wouldn't without going through a bunch of bullshit.

Part of my family is catholic an d part is jewish, but when it comes to the hardcore believers of each group, neither of them accept me because I wasn't raised in either community properly.  :shrug:


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Offlinelearningtofly
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: destructo_low]
    #13570284 - 12/01/10 08:44 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

stuntmanmike said:
Jewish is a religion and france is a country so you would probably be neither



I am referring to judaism as an ethnicity.
Quote:

destructo_low said:
You'd be a human with dna that assigns meaningless words to everything.

edit - Or a bastard child that no one wants. You're half Jewish and French aren't you? And in the situation you described I bet. It's time to remove your fucked up organism of a body from this planet.



This is not what I'm asking. No I am not half jewish/french. I am asking what a matrilineal and/or patrilineal society would view this type of person as.


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InvisibleSpiritualSnorkel

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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: destructo_low]
    #13570286 - 12/01/10 08:44 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

destructo_low said:
You'd be a human with dna that assigns meaningless words to everything.




There's a genus of fishes named after Frank Zappa.

So much for science. :evil:

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Invisiblefrith
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: destructo_low]
    #13570293 - 12/01/10 08:45 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

destructo_low said:
You'd be a human with dna that assigns meaningless words to everything.



this.

who cares. just be you.


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Offlinedestructo_low
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: learningtofly]
    #13570294 - 12/01/10 08:45 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

learningtofly said:
Quote:

stuntmanmike said:
Jewish is a religion and france is a country so you would probably be neither



I am referring to judaism as an ethnicity.
Quote:

destructo_low said:
You'd be a human with dna that assigns meaningless words to everything.

edit - Or a bastard child that no one wants. You're half Jewish and French aren't you? And in the situation you described I bet. It's time to remove your fucked up organism of a body from this planet.



This is not what I'm asking. No I am not half jewish/french. I am asking what a matrilineal and/or patrilineal society would view this type of person as.




I was just fucking with you.

Quote:

SpiritualSnorkel said:
Quote:

destructo_low said:
You'd be a human with dna that assigns meaningless words to everything.




There's a genus of fishes named after Frank Zappa.

So much for science. :evil:




I want a Zappa! Mom! Can I have one, please?!


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InvisibleCaine
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: blewmeanie]
    #13570306 - 12/01/10 08:47 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Ok, I see what you mean now.

It'd be some lonely outcast. The social equivalent of a homeless person :smirk:

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OfflineF0SS1L
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: SpiritualSnorkel]
    #13570318 - 12/01/10 08:50 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

French isn't a religion so what does it matter? You can't identify both with your mother's religion and your father's nationality? Is it a french custom to take your father's religion? It all seems inconsequential since you'd end up taking your mother's religion anyways; I don't think her being french would supersede jewish custom.
In the end, I doubt the child will give a shit.


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Offlinelearningtofly
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: F0SS1L]
    #13570329 - 12/01/10 08:52 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

F0SS1L said:
French isn't a religion so what does it matter? You can't identify both with your mother's religion and your father's nationality? Is it a french custom to take your father's religion? It all seems inconsequential since you'd end up taking your mother's religion anyways; I don't think her being french would supersede jewish custom.
In the end, I doubt the child will give a shit.



What the hell are you talking about?


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InvisibleR10tGuNn3r

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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: Caine]
    #13570339 - 12/01/10 08:54 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

i wouldnt want to be either jewish nor french anyway.. so it doesnt look like a big loss to me

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Offlinelearningtofly
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: R10tGuNn3r]
    #13570353 - 12/01/10 08:57 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Thank you for your eye-opening contribution.

Okay maybe I should clarify... i am not asking specifically about french/jew, i am asking if you have a mother from a patrilineal society and a father from a matrilineal society.


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Invisiblefrith
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: learningtofly]
    #13570384 - 12/01/10 09:01 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

learningtofly said:
i am not asking specifically about french/jew, i am asking if you have a mother from a patrilineal society and a father from a matrilineal society.



what type of society do you live in?


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InvisibleR10tGuNn3r

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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: learningtofly]
    #13570403 - 12/01/10 09:04 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

learningtofly said:
Thank you for your eye-opening contribution.

Okay maybe I should clarify... i am not asking specifically about french/jew, i am asking if you have a mother from a patrilineal society and a father from a matrilineal society.



you would be screwed. by definition you are neither, so you'll never be able to go to the any of the good jewish or french bars.

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Offlineonnagata
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: learningtofly]
    #13570406 - 12/01/10 09:05 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

with the jewish community you are a full jewish , in the eyes of the temple, if your mother is jewish.....ideally both of your parents would be jewish but temples are very strict and some will not even let you be consserded apart of the temple.
But some temples are less strict....because they are now three brances of judiasm.
orthodox, reformed, and conservative.

i consider myself an old school reformed.....my father is jewish.


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Offlineonnagata
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: onnagata]
    #13570417 - 12/01/10 09:07 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

some temples in isreal wont let you be sen has jewish in the eyes of the temple if you father is the only jewish in your blood line....

I know someone from isreal who married a women who was christian and from america and when they tried to get her converted to judiasm in isreal, it was going to take 5 years but they did not want to wait, so they married without her being confirmed and now his family ahs disowned him and they havnt spoken in 5 years.:sad:


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One of the greatest gifts in life is that you can change your world simply by changing your state of mind

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OfflineF0SS1L
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: learningtofly]
    #13570418 - 12/01/10 09:07 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

learningtofly said:
Quote:

F0SS1L said:
French isn't a religion so what does it matter? You can't identify both with your mother's religion and your father's nationality? Is it a french custom to take your father's religion? It all seems inconsequential since you'd end up taking your mother's religion anyways; I don't think her being french would supersede jewish custom.
In the end, I doubt the child will give a shit.



What the hell are you talking about?





Jews customarily take the religion of their mother. I don't see how your mother being French matters. Or how your father being jewish affects the french identity from your mothers side.

Ok, so lineage is tracked differently. But as someone else pointed out, it's 2010 and nobody cares anymore. Saying you're not french, but you're not jewish doesn't make sense. Nor does it matter since they're not mutually inclusive. If this were "old times" you'd probably just be a mutt and shunned regardless.

Also you could be raised jewish anyways. Maybe not considered a part of jewish lineage, but would anyone really care?


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Invisiblefrith
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: onnagata]
    #13570439 - 12/01/10 09:11 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

onnagata said:
some temples in isreal wont let you be sen has jewish in the eyes of the temple if you father is the only jewish in your blood line....

I know someone from isreal who married a women who was christian and from america and when they tried to get her converted to judiasm in isreal, it was going to take 5 years but they did not want to wait, so they married without her being confirmed and now his family ahs disowned him and they havnt spoken in 5 years.:sad:



ahh religion.. continuously tearing families apart for 5000 years..


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Invisiblejewunit
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: learningtofly]
    #13570525 - 12/01/10 09:29 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

learningtofly said:
Quote:

stuntmanmike said:
Jewish is a religion and france is a country so you would probably be neither



I am referring to judaism as an ethnicity.



If you're referring to it as an ethnicity it doesn't matter if it was your mother or father who was Jewish. At least not in my mind. Also I kinda hate it when people say I'm half Jewish. I'm not half anything. My mother was Jewish, my father is Lutheran. Am I half Jewish half Lutheran? Obviously not. If you're dad is Catholic and your mom is African are you half black half Catholic? Nope.

Edit: Alright, I don't hate it, but I prefer people don't refer to me as half Jewish.


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Offlinelearningtofly
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: R10tGuNn3r]
    #13570638 - 12/01/10 09:53 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

frith said:
Quote:

learningtofly said:
i am not asking specifically about french/jew, i am asking if you have a mother from a patrilineal society and a father from a matrilineal society.



what type of society do you live in?



Why is that relevant, i gave you the specific relevant information already
Quote:

R10tGuNn3r said:
Quote:

learningtofly said:
Thank you for your eye-opening contribution.

Okay maybe I should clarify... i am not asking specifically about french/jew, i am asking if you have a mother from a patrilineal society and a father from a matrilineal society.



you would be screwed. by definition you are neither, so you'll never be able to go to the any of the good jewish or french bars.



but how can you be nothing?


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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: learningtofly]
    #13570671 - 12/01/10 10:00 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

learningtofly said:

If you have a jewish father, you're not a jew (jews = matrilineal)
if you have a french mother, you're not french (french = patrilineal)

So what are you?




mostly you'd be human but otherwise you'd be french, being 'jewish' isnt a nationality

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Offlinelearningtofly
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #13570678 - 12/01/10 10:01 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

I never said being jewish was a nationality. It's an ethnicity.


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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: learningtofly]
    #13570685 - 12/01/10 10:03 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

incorrect, Judaism is a religion, not an ethnicity

so they could still be french and jewish

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Invisiblejewunit
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: learningtofly]
    #13570710 - 12/01/10 10:07 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Ethnicity has a lot to do with self-identity, at least in my mind it does. The religious laws don't necessarily dictate your ethnicity (though religion is a common factor in ethnic identity) so I really don't see why it matters if it's your mother or father who is Jewish or French.


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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: jewunit]
    #13570749 - 12/01/10 10:13 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

traditionally a kid takes the religion of it's mother

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InvisibleR10tGuNn3r

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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: learningtofly]
    #13570772 - 12/01/10 10:18 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

learningtofly said:
Quote:

frith said:
Quote:

learningtofly said:
i am not asking specifically about french/jew, i am asking if you have a mother from a patrilineal society and a father from a matrilineal society.



what type of society do you live in?



Why is that relevant, i gave you the specific relevant information already
Quote:

R10tGuNn3r said:
Quote:

learningtofly said:
Thank you for your eye-opening contribution.

Okay maybe I should clarify... i am not asking specifically about french/jew, i am asking if you have a mother from a patrilineal society and a father from a matrilineal society.




you would be screwed. by definition you are neither, so you'll never be able to go to the any of the good jewish or french bars.



but how can you be nothing?



its not that you are nothing.. its that your NOT jewish or french.. why cant you just consider yourself lucky to be born in the country that you were born in and worship (or not) whatever god you do and be happy with that? why label yourself.. it makes it that much easier for people to judge you.. and why argue the point that your not jewish or french then argue how you can be nothing when you're clearly by orthodox definition not either of those things? its circular logic and its like a monkey trying to fuck a football..

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Offlinefapjack
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: learningtofly]
    #13570778 - 12/01/10 10:20 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Jewish isn't really an accurate ethnicity, its more of a cultural identity.  Look at Jews from around the world, they look nothing alike.  Not to say they don't share a similar ancestry, but they were obviously fucking the locals.


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Invisible2newtz
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: learningtofly]
    #13570992 - 12/01/10 11:05 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

learningtofly said:
What are you? You can't be nothing can you? Lots of people identify with ethnic backgrounds, and for someone in this situation or anyone who has a father matrilineal society and a mother from a patrilineal, how do they form their identity?




HALF FRENCH toast


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Offlinelearningtofly
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #13571395 - 12/02/10 12:57 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
incorrect, Judaism is a religion, not an ethnicity

so they could still be french and jewish



Incorrect, jews can be considered an ethnoreligious group. their faith and culture are very interconnected


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InvisibleGreen_T
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: 2newtz]
    #13571567 - 12/02/10 02:16 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

2newtz said:
Quote:

learningtofly said:
What are you? You can't be nothing can you? Lots of people identify with ethnic backgrounds, and for someone in this situation or anyone who has a father matrilineal society and a mother from a patrilineal, how do they form their identity?




HALF FRENCH toast




That's fucked up but :ilold:


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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: If your father is jewish and your mom is french [Re: learningtofly]
    #13571822 - 12/02/10 06:07 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

learningtofly said:
Quote:

Prisoner#1 said:
incorrect, Judaism is a religion, not an ethnicity

so they could still be french and jewish



Incorrect, jews can be considered an ethnoreligious group. their faith and culture are very interconnected





absolutely not, I believe the term you're looking for may be 'hebrew',
while it's a language group it's also used to define the cultural
ethnicity if one group of semitic people. semites cover north africa and
the middle east an includes ethiopians and arabs

so if an arab is claimed to be anti-semitic he must be a self loathing bastard

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* anybody speak french?
( 1 2 all )
Vvellum 1,528 27 08/18/05 02:25 PM
by Shroomism

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