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Offlinenycomyco
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Registered: 11/13/03
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Blue-Staining Polypore
    #13416002 - 10/31/10 09:01 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

near philadelphia stumbled across these flashy white polypores growing from a fallen tree, probably oak, but barkless so not positive.  The flesh was moderately soft for a polypore and the pores were relatively large, visible like bolete tubes from a cross-section.  There was some bluing visible when the mushroom was undisturbed, but the flesh especially the pores bruised blue when handled, becoming deep navy like a potent psilocybe. 

The blue seemed closer to psilocybin blue rather than blue-staining bolete blue, but it's hard to say because the flesh is pure white unlike other blue-staining species. 

I'm not aware of any blue-staining polypores.  Any ideas?





It was a great day for shroom hunting in philadelphia- found a basketball sized oyster, lots of too-old chickens, flamullina velutipes, big honeys, 3-lb lion's mane, plenty of psathyrella and coprinus, some other unknowns- I'll post pics when I have time to upload more.

Thanks!


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OfflineJoie
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Re: Blue-Staining Polypore [Re: nycomyco]
    #13416036 - 10/31/10 09:09 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Postia subcaesia


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Edited by Joie (10/31/10 09:17 PM)


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Offlinenycomyco
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Re: Blue-Staining Polypore [Re: Joie]
    #13416074 - 10/31/10 09:22 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Great thanks


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OfflineJoie
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Re: Blue-Staining Polypore [Re: nycomyco]
    #13416099 - 10/31/10 09:35 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

You're welcome.


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InvisibleinskiM
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Re: Blue-Staining Polypore [Re: Joie]
    #13431132 - 11/03/10 08:41 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

The accepted name for this is now Oligoporus caesius.

Here's a recent collection posted at MushroomObserver.
http://mushroomobserver.org/57923?q=2cnU


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InvisibleThe Thinker

Registered: 09/01/10
Posts: 4,000
Re: Blue-Staining Polypore [Re: inski]
    #13431146 - 11/03/10 08:44 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

inski said:
The accepted name for this is now Oligoporus caesius.



What source do you use to search for accepted names?

*curious because IF says Postia caesia


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InvisibleMr. Mushrooms
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Re: Blue-Staining Polypore [Re: inski]
    #13431156 - 11/03/10 08:46 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

inski said:
The accepted name for this is now Oligoporus caesius.





I'm not sure that any name is universally accepted, but I know what you mean.  For example, how many mycologists stay current with every single name change that is published?  Two professional journals in the States use "outdated" names.

Until mycology becomes much more global than it now is there are no official names, only names that certain authorities use.  A fine point, perhaps, but I think it needs to be said.  :smile:


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InvisibleMr. Mushrooms
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Re: Blue-Staining Polypore [Re: The Thinker]
    #13431159 - 11/03/10 08:46 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

The Thinker said:
Quote:

inski said:
The accepted name for this is now Oligoporus caesius.



What source do you use to search for accepted names?

*curious because IF says Postia caesia




An excellent question in light of my above post.


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InvisibleinskiM
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Re: Blue-Staining Polypore [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
    #13431218 - 11/03/10 09:09 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Index Fungorum is not always up to date.
Postia caesia is synonymous with Oligoporus caesius so both names describe the same fungus but O. caesius is the most recent published name so it should be the accepted combination.

Another example at Index Fungorum is the naming of Weraroa novae-zelandiae, the new accepted name is Psilocybe weraroa, this recent taxonomic change was made in Jan Borovička's paper, Molecular phylogeny of Psilocybe cyanescens complex in Europe, with reference to the position of the secotioid Weraroa novae-zelandiae, the naming at IF has not been updated yet so it's just a matter of who updates their listings regularly.


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InvisibleThe Thinker

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Re: Blue-Staining Polypore [Re: inski]
    #13431250 - 11/03/10 09:20 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

inski said:
is the most recent published name so it should be the accepted combination.



Is this always the case?

IF has Oligoporus caesius (1985) listed but still resorts to calling it Postia caesia (1881)

does IF use different guidelines?


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InvisibleMr. Mushrooms
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Re: Blue-Staining Polypore [Re: inski]
    #13431264 - 11/03/10 09:24 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

inski said:
Index Fungorum is not always up to date.
Postia caesia is synonymous with Oligoporus caesius so both names describe the same fungus but O. caesius is the most recent published name so it should be the accepted combination.




Should is different than is.  As I said recently, I sincerely doubt Dr. Gaston Guzman -- mycologist, taxonomist, explorer, author and anthropologist -- is the world's foremost authority on the genus Psilocybe is calling non-active species Deconica.

Quote:

inski said:
Another example at Index Fungorum is the naming of Weraroa novae-zelandiae, the new accepted name is Psilocybe weraroa, this recent taxonomic change was made in Jan Borovička's paper, Molecular phylogeny of Psilocybe cyanescens complex in Europe, with reference to the position of the secotioid Weraroa novae-zelandiae, the naming at IF has not been updated yet so it's just a matter of who updates their listings regularly.




That is good news.  Some were pushing, for reputation sake, naming Psilocybe cubensis, Weraroa cubensis.  :lol:  I was like, "Yeah, that'll be the day."

Personally, I don't see how adopting a new name helps us here.  :shrug:  Lately I've been using common names.  For the most part, they don't change.


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InvisibleinskiM
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Re: Blue-Staining Polypore [Re: The Thinker]
    #13431278 - 11/03/10 09:30 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

As Mr. Mushrooms said, different journals favor different articles and you will see different authorities using different synonyms, if a more recent paper is published with taxonomic changes it is because new studies have been done and new information is found that proves that a fungus belongs in a different genus or a species is found to be synonymous with an earlier published name, both names can be used but the more recently published name should be the accepted combination!


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Offlineelprawn
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Re: Blue-Staining Polypore [Re: inski]
    #13431404 - 11/03/10 09:53 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

There's more than one way to skin a cat.

But enough of my incoherent ramblings. Back to the nomenclaturial discussion...


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OfflineTwiztidsage
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Re: Blue-Staining Polypore [Re: elprawn]
    #13431422 - 11/03/10 09:58 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

elprawn said:
But enough of my incoherent ramblings.




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InvisibleinskiM
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Re: Blue-Staining Polypore [Re: Mr. Mushrooms]
    #13431459 - 11/03/10 10:06 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

If the rules of nomenclature were adhered to all blue staining Psilocybe species would have had to be placed in the genus Weraroa but some mycologists didn't like that so they proposed to retain the name Psilocybe by changing the type species from P. montana which is a non blue staining species now placed into the genus Deconica to P. semilanceata, I'm just glad that the name weraroa was retained by Jan Borovička as the species name for the previously named Weraroa novae-zelandiae, the species name novae-zelandiae could not be used because there is already a non blueing species here in New Zealand P. novae-zelandiae which should but hasn't yet been transfered into Deconica.

I don't know if Dr. Guzman agrees with the placing of the non blue staining Psilocybe species into the genus Deconica or not but recent DNA studies have proven that those species are only distantly related to the blue staining species and belong in the Strophariaceae family, the blue staining Psilocybe species belong in the Hymenogasteraceae family which is a sister clade to the Strophariaceae.
Here is a link to an accepted paper by Dr Machiel Noordeloos with some taxonomic changes from the genus Psilocybe to the genus Deconica.
http://www.entoloma.nl/pdf/Noordeloos_Deconica.pdf


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InvisibleMr. Mushrooms
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Re: Blue-Staining Polypore [Re: inski]
    #13433107 - 11/04/10 09:38 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

:congrats:

Finally, someone knows what they are talking about in reference to this issue.  I cannot thank you enough for those posts.  If you don't mind, I may quote you in the future if it is necessary.

Thank you, inski!


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