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learningtofly
Ancient Aliens



Registered: 05/21/07
Posts: 15,105
Loc: Out of this world
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Quote:
bigmike7104 said:
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OrgoneConclusion said:
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Makes me wonder if the world is really the way as we see it.
What does that mean? Seriously?
Because the brain gets information from the light that goes into our eyes, then we see what our brain processed. It just got me wondering if maybe the brain wasn't 100 percent accurate at processing this information, which would mean reality or the world around us would look at least somewhat different from the way we see it. This is the way optical illusions happen, our brain can't make sense of the whole thing, so if like reality was just one big illusion. I don't know it was just a thought, nothing important.
it is widely, widely, widely accepted that the brain filters out a lot of information.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
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which would mean reality or the world around us would look at least somewhat different from the way we see it
You still are not making sense.
An unperceived universe doesn't look like anything at all.
So you want to compare a human's perception to what, exactly? To a tsetse fly, a machine, to nothing?
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
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So what? My question has still not been answered.
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bigmike7104
Stranger

Registered: 07/12/10
Posts: 1,395
Loc: USA
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said:
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which would mean reality or the world around us would look at least somewhat different from the way we see it
You still are not making sense.
An unperceived universe doesn't look like anything at all.
So you want to compare a human's perception to what, exactly? To a tsetse fly, a machine, to nothing?
I don't mean an unperceived universe or compared to another organism, I mean we see it but the brain alters our view of the universe. It's not like I'm saying that's true but with how we see what our brain interprets(not the object directly) I was just posing that question. I don't know it's hard to exactly say what I'm thinking.
-------------------- Over thinking, over analyzing separates the body from the mind Withering my intuition, missing opportunities and I must Feed my will to feel my moment drawing way outside the lines
Edited by bigmike7104 (09/28/10 10:54 PM)
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terence
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Re: Does reality exist? [Re: shadowplay]
#28219738 - 03/07/23 09:17 PM (10 months, 16 days ago) |
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“Reality” and “existence” become a matter of personal opinion instead of insight into truth. What are they really?
The lens through which we see is always anthropomorphic.
An amoeba perceives certain electrical and chemical gradients, the equivalent of eyes and ears. A sophisticated network of organelles and gels provides a universe of wonder and possibility, of mortality and joyful reproduction. The most sophisticated intelligence in the universe is probably mycelium.
Same same all the way up and down the line. Its turtles all the way down. “Great fleas have little fleas, upon their backs to bite’m; little fleas have lesser fleas, and so ad infinitum.” There are probably intelligent - or at least aware - networks of galaxies.
Liberated from anthropomorphism we can see that each droplet in life’s ocean has a consciousness of its own, an existence of its own, is a node of the cosmic internet, a facet of indra’s jewel, and is itself a reflection of the one pearl. “The moon in a dewdrop.”
So, “existence” is what each dewdrop - that’s you and me and all our relatives, the granularity of life - experience. What we are aware of, conscious of; what makes impressions, memories, and evolving response patterns. “Reality” is the endless chaos of potential stuff that experience tastes, like a fish tastes salt water.
What makes “reality” seem obvious and unquestionable to the naive observer is that we unconsciously accord 95% of our responses to each other in totally conventional and mutually understood ways or we are deemed crazy and ostracized or killed.
The mystic experiences reality directly, accepting chaos and not allowing the net of words to attempt to contain it. The amoeba will always be naive, and think it lives by itself in a vast universe. Not so sure about mycelia. What do the whales sing of, what do dolphins perceive holographically? (Well, sex of course, but this is all just sublimating eros.)
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A quote from dogen’s shobogenzo:
Upon attaining the Way, he would instruct people with the words, “All the universe is one bright pearl.”
A monk once asked him, “I’ve heard you have said that all the universe is one bright pearl. How can I gain an understanding of that?” The master said, “All the universe is one bright pearl. What need is there to understand?” The next day the master asked the monk, “All the universe is one bright pearl. What is your understanding of it?” The monk answered. “All the universe is one bright pearl. What need is there to understand?” “Now I know,” replied Hsüan-sha, “that you are living in the Cave of Demons on Black Mountain.”
Edited by terence (03/07/23 09:24 PM)
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,530
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Re: Does reality exist? [Re: terence]
#28220022 - 03/08/23 03:09 AM (10 months, 16 days ago) |
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do words have meaning?
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Buster_Brown
L'une


Registered: 09/17/11
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Reality is the pursuit of happiness which depends on other people's sacrifices so we could assume that the ultimate reality is revelling in the misfortune of others.
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Kickle
Wanderer



Registered: 12/16/06
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Assuming others' sacrifices leads to misfortune?
-------------------- Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain
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Buster_Brown
L'une


Registered: 09/17/11
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Re: Does reality exist? [Re: Kickle]
#28220163 - 03/08/23 06:30 AM (10 months, 16 days ago) |
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Assuming the pursuit of happiness embraces deceit and murder one may unknowingly revel in another's misfortune in sacrificing their life.
Or we could consciously accept that the continuance of the species ensures constant opportunity to revel in someone else's misfortune.
Edited by Buster_Brown (03/08/23 06:33 AM)
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Buster_Brown
L'une


Registered: 09/17/11
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Men could revel in the fact that women have to go thru the pains of labor.
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RJ Tubs 202



Registered: 09/20/08
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Re: Does reality exist? [Re: terence] 1
#28220205 - 03/08/23 07:05 AM (10 months, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
terence said:
The amoeba will always be naive, and think it lives by itself in a vast universe.
That is quite poetic!
It's rare I see someone's first post on The Shroomery
Welcome
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sudly
Darwin's stagger

Registered: 01/05/15
Posts: 10,797
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Re: Does reality exist? [Re: shadowplay]
#28221171 - 03/08/23 05:26 PM (10 months, 15 days ago) |
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shadowplay said: Everyone seems to have a different idea of what reality is. But then some people say that reality is what you make it. I don't believe this. But at the same time, I have a pretty negative view of my reality, and what do ya know? My reality sucks. Is this because I think it sucks? Or is this why I think it sucks, becuase it really does suck? Discuss!!
Nah mate you're all a figment of my imagination and rocks and trees are all a part of the cosmic oneness of the cosmos energy that intertwined and results from an as of yet undiscovered force that I will say is the prerequisite to this belief.
So yeah nah it is what it is, you can't argue the truth of the bubble foam universe!
-------------------- I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
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Kickle
Wanderer



Registered: 12/16/06
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Re: Does reality exist? [Re: sudly]
#28221191 - 03/08/23 05:41 PM (10 months, 15 days ago) |
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Does reality exist? #13256573 - 09/27/10 10:11 PM (12 years, 5 months)

Good to see you sudly
-------------------- Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain
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sudly
Darwin's stagger

Registered: 01/05/15
Posts: 10,797
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Re: Does reality exist? [Re: terence]
#28223206 - 03/10/23 02:44 AM (10 months, 14 days ago) |
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The most sophisticated intelligence in the universe is probably mycelium.
Could this not be an anthropomorphic view? I mean some slime molds at least seek the most efficient pathways for nutrient transmission, they find the shortest routes to sustenance, and while they may seem intelligent, I think it could also be called simple efficiency.
I would call mycelium elegant and efficient, but I don't think ascribing them with sophisticated intelligence really makes sense.
-------------------- I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,530
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Re: Does reality exist? [Re: sudly]
#28223258 - 03/10/23 04:55 AM (10 months, 14 days ago) |
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yah, slime mold is amazing but not multi-talented. (mycellium on the other hand is fascinating as it is one cell(with multiple nuclei) fibrously branching across a vast space with an interconnection property that we do not yet understand. It also may not be multi-talented, but it truly is amazing - especially the fruiting bodies)
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terence
Stranger
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yes
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sudly
Darwin's stagger

Registered: 01/05/15
Posts: 10,797
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I might call a nervous system a most sophisticated intelligence, and we are more closely related to mycelia than we are to plants. But I wouldn't say we don't understand it to a good degree.
-------------------- I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
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terence
Stranger
Registered: 03/07/23
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Last seen: 6 months, 21 hours
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Quote:
redgreenvines said: do words have meaning?
I'm tempted to just say yes and leave it at that, but the question is pertinent.
Without words there is no existence. Through words, as rumi says, we know a Friend. All things emerge from the darkness of chaos by being named.
In the sufi tradition, the hadith "God said, 'I was a hidden treasure and I desired to be known,'" is the beginning of the Creation of existence. God taught adam - the quintessential, primordial human - all of the Names. That is to say, all nameable things were brought into existence. Thus we have our world of objects.
In reality, all objects are empty. "Form is emptiness; emptiness is form." Speaking of a bridge over a river, zen tells us that it is the bridge which is flowing, the river which is still. This is because the idea of an object as a fixed entity is false. As heraclitus says, "everything flows." There is no stable object, all are melting and changing, some just melt faster than others. Use time lapse or slo-mo photography and all objects can be seen to change, to come into and go out of existence as objects while all the while everything remains the same, like waves passing through water. Dogen says, "Inch time foot gem."
The real existence of objects is not in the mundane world of constant transformation but in the imaginal world of the muhammedan reality (as ibn arabi calls it. The world of platonic forms, of neo-platonic emanations. There is a place where space and time do not apply wherein the angels and jinns dwell, and we can visit. Like Swedenborg's heaven and hell. Here is where words have their origin and meaning. The true Word is the object itself. Words as we know them are the names of the Names.
from rumi, fihi ma fihi:
If you want to get to know people, engage them in speech. By their words you will know them. If they are imposters, even if someone told them that people can be recognized by their words and they watch their words carefully to avoid being caught, still, in the end you will come to understand who they are.
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terence
Stranger
Registered: 03/07/23
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Quote:
RJ Tubs 202 said:
Quote:
terence said:
The amoeba will always be naive, and think it lives by itself in a vast universe.
That is quite poetic!
It's rare I see someone's first post on The Shroomery
Welcome 
thanks
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terence
Stranger
Registered: 03/07/23
Posts: 85
Last seen: 6 months, 21 hours
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Re: Does reality exist? [Re: sudly] 1
#28224578 - 03/11/23 12:03 AM (10 months, 13 days ago) |
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Quote:
sudly said:
Quote:
shadowplay said: Everyone seems to have a different idea of what reality is. But then some people say that reality is what you make it. I don't believe this. But at the same time, I have a pretty negative view of my reality, and what do ya know? My reality sucks. Is this because I think it sucks? Or is this why I think it sucks, becuase it really does suck? Discuss!!
Nah mate you're all a figment of my imagination and rocks and trees are all a part of the cosmic oneness of the cosmos energy that intertwined and results from an as of yet undiscovered force that I will say is the prerequisite to this belief.
So yeah nah it is what it is, you can't argue the truth of the bubble foam universe!

A monk was walking with the master one day and they came upon a worm which a farmer had cut in half with his plow. Both halves were wriggling. The monk said to the master, what I want to know is, which half contains the buddha nature?
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