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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Pain Formula
    #1319906 - 02/19/03 04:47 PM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Swami: Pain is in direct proportion to the difference between desired reality and actual reality.

Sclorch: Hmmm.... I like that. Suffering is then what happens when you can't or don't cope with actual reality, then?


Methinks this needs to be refined, not as pure mathematical formula, but more in the line of the Drake Equation.

S = Suffering
I = Intensity of desire
L = Length of time the desire has been held
N = Nearness to the goal
P = Probability of it actually occurring

S = (I * L * N) / P

Let's take the Laci Petersen case as one example.

The length of time this desire has been held was not the day that Laci disappeared, but the day she was born as her parents desired to see her live a full life. Length of time held is important as the longer the neural pathways are conditioned the more difficult it is to let go.

Intensity for any family member that loved her is also extremely high.

Nearness to the goal is irrelevant in this case as there is no way to measure it.

The desire for her family is to find her alive. The probability on day one was pretty good, so the suffering was not that intense at that time. With each passing day the probability approached zero, so suffering approached infinity or near the maximum amount of psychic or emotional pain a human being can endure.


Now let's try a more mundane example.

17 year old Joey desires a new $250,000 Ferrari. He has been drooling for one year, but with $3000 in the bank, does not believe it as a possibility in the near future so the the suffering level is quite low.

25 year old Joey desires a new $330,000 Ferrari (inflation!). He has been drooling for nine years and has $80,000 in the bank. He has put a down payment on the car of his dreams as his stock options mature next month and he will make $500,000. Days before the options mature, an investigative committee finds accounting fraud and the stock's value plunges 80% overnight.

Do the math and figure out his pain level.

Add / correct any additional major variables until we have a working formula that applies to most situations. One variable I delkiberately left out is the subjects level of enlightenment or ability to let go of strongly held dreams.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


Edited by Swami (02/19/03 07:47 PM)


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OfflineGRTUD
INFP
Male

Registered: 01/31/01
Posts: 270
Loc: The Days Between
Last seen: 8 years, 10 months
Re: Pain Formula [Re: Swami]
    #1320008 - 02/19/03 05:23 PM (14 years, 10 days ago)

I like this kind of thinking because as a close friend once told me,
Quote:

mathematics is the language of God


. Mathematics seems to be the model of everything, even what we consider psychological, to some extent.
What Jesus and Buddha had in common was that they could think through all desire and determined that nothing was physically obtainable in the sense that we "get" something and that desire ceases to exist. Instead what they both taught was that desire could only be temporarily extinguished then it returned again and again. Ancient mythology also depicted this condition in several senerios. Jesus' parable of the Lion and the Lamb summarized this conflict in a timeless way similar to several mythological stories.
What seems to be the issue with the mortal not attempting to achieve supergalatic oneness, is how do we have fun without expending either our body and/or soul and/or our mental health. The answer is almost certainly as multitude as there are people on this planet. Certainly pain is an element of joy in as much as any number in an equation is an element of it's result. The magnitude of self centeredness surrounding the person in question, from which the precieved pain effects, on any level, is similar to a volume control on a high powered stereo. The volume, and the comfort level which correspond to the desired effect of happiness, is not always the same considering the company.
And of course, (in case any reader wonders) time, probablity, and amount of energy expended toward a goal, are indeed quantifible elements which could calculate suffering. This, like the formula for growing mushrooms or building an atomic bomb, could be used for both good and evil purposes.


--------------------
"New shit has come to light..."


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InvisibleZero7a1
Leaving YourWasteland

Registered: 10/23/02
Posts: 3,594
Loc: Passing Cloud
Re: Pain Formula [Re: Swami]
    #1320222 - 02/19/03 06:30 PM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Have you read Albert Camu's , The Stranger?


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What?


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InvisibleRebelSteve33
Amateur Mycologist
Male

Registered: 05/28/02
Posts: 3,774
Loc: Arizona
Re: Pain Formula [Re: Swami]
    #1320302 - 02/19/03 06:57 PM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Neat, I like the equation! :laugh:

-RebelSteve


--------------------
Namaste.


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OfflineEarth_Droid
Stranger
Registered: 04/19/02
Posts: 5,240
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Re: Pain Formula [Re: Swami]
    #1320636 - 02/19/03 10:34 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

All science is kind of like gods language because it defines the reality that are perception formulates.


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Offlinejohnnyfive
Burning withCircles!
Registered: 07/02/02
Posts: 886
Loc: Hell
Last seen: 12 years, 9 months
Re: Pain Formula [Re: GRTUD]
    #1321754 - 02/20/03 10:40 AM (14 years, 9 days ago)

"mathematics is the language of God"

Since ive started messin with psyhedelics, ive noticed math seams easyer! I guess cus math requires more visualization?


--------------------
And the gameshow host rings the buzzer (brrnnntt) oh and now you get a face full of face!


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Offlinejohnnyfive
Burning withCircles!
Registered: 07/02/02
Posts: 886
Loc: Hell
Last seen: 12 years, 9 months
Re: Pain Formula [Re: GRTUD]
    #1321755 - 02/20/03 10:40 AM (14 years, 9 days ago)

"mathematics is the language of God"

Since ive started messin with psyhedelics, ive noticed math seams easyer! I guess cus math requires more visualization?!


--------------------
And the gameshow host rings the buzzer (brrnnntt) oh and now you get a face full of face!


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OfflineDavid_Scape
Anti Genius
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Registered: 08/05/02
Posts: 878
Loc: U.S. of muthafuckin A.
Last seen: 7 years, 8 months
Re: Pain Formula [Re: Swami]
    #1322025 - 02/20/03 12:11 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

The Formula for Happiness(And no, it's a not fifth of jack daniels and a marijuana cigarette.)

Happiness = P + (5xE) + (3xH)

P = Personal Characteristics (outlook on life, adaptability and resilience.)

E = Existence (health, financial stability and friendships)

H = Higher Order Needs (Self-esteem, expectations, ambitions and sense of
                        humor)
           
Click on the link if you want to know why the 5 and the 3 are there.

[EDIT: Also, for something interesting... click on the link and look at the upper right hand corner in the "see also" column. Click on the link provided for 26 June 02. :wink: :wink:]

   


--------------------
focusing
Flow
The Enneagram


Edited by David_Scape (02/20/03 12:17 PM)


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 07/13/99
Posts: 4,805
Loc: On the Brink of Madness
Re: Pain Formula [Re: David_Scape]
    #1324005 - 02/21/03 07:08 AM (14 years, 8 days ago)

DavidScape: [EDIT: Also, for something interesting... click on the link and look at the upper right hand corner in the "see also" column. Click on the link provided for 26 June 02. ]

That's fucking ridiculous.


--------------------
Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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OfflineRemy
Bitches Brew
 User Gallery

Registered: 06/04/02
Posts: 1,343
Loc: Atlanta, GA
Last seen: 5 years, 3 months
Re: Pain Formula [Re: Swami]
    #1325165 - 02/21/03 05:58 PM (14 years, 8 days ago)

In order for this equation to work, you would also need to work in another immeasurable, hope, which is relative to P(I+L+N*+R); R being religious beliefs. As probability declines, hope also declines. As hope declines suffering declines as well.

S = P(I+L+N+R)/H

Of course all of this is usless because suffering is not quantifiable. Furthermore, the amount of suffering one individual can endure varies on a case by case basis. One man may be devastated by the loss of a close family member, while another may be unphased by the loss of an equally close family member.


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OfflineDavid_Scape
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Registered: 08/05/02
Posts: 878
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Re: Pain Formula [Re: Sclorch]
    #1326458 - 02/22/03 12:48 PM (14 years, 7 days ago)

LOL! You summed that up quite nicely.


--------------------
focusing
Flow
The Enneagram


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