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Offlinegilesypopper
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Do you have rest days between working out?
    #13095116 - 08/24/10 11:49 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

I've been reading up on some workouts for my upper body. All the guides I've read say make sure that your body/muscle group gets a good rest in-between workouts, some even suggest a week! I sort of understand why the body needs rest, but the you see all the massive guys like firemen and miners who must put their body through alot every day.

Do you really need to rest between workouts to build stronger/bigger muscles? Or are websites just legally covering themselves or something?

Any experience?

Cheeeers


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Law breakers, law makers, let us fight them all, why not.


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OfflineMushroomninja
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Re: Do you have rest days between working out? [Re: gilesypopper]
    #13095158 - 08/24/10 12:00 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

You should always let a muscle group recover before you tear it up again. How long has a lot to do with genetics, diet, supplements, training goals, and methods of training. Sometimes after a really heavy chest day I'll wait 2-3 days(while I'm still pretty sore) then hit chest again with low weight-high rep and get super pumped and super sore...but I've been training for years, my body is used to it and I know my limits well. If you are just starting out I would say to give each muscle group at least five days before you hit it again. At least until you know what works for you. Water water water, you can't get enough if you're working out.


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I am said to be a revolutionist in my sympathies, by birth, by breeding, and by principle. I am always on the side of the revolutionist, because there never was a revolution unless there were some oppressive and intolerable conditions against which to revolt.- Mark Twain


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Offlinegilesypopper
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Re: Do you have rest days between working out? [Re: Mushroomninja]
    #13095229 - 08/24/10 12:20 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Hey,

I normally get a good night's sleep after I've been working out and only have a desk job during the day, so was kind of thinking that that would be a suitable recovery time??

Plus I'm only working out at home with a set of dumbbells. So, it might just be that I'm not working myself SUPER hard but my arms chest, shoulders still feel tired/temporarily weakened afterwards. I don't feel nasty sore the next day though - would def. take a rest if I did.

I guess I can't rationalise the benefit of taking 5 days off between workouts compared to working a group several times a week (not EVERY day tho!)

Sorry if this is a bit gibberishy.  :sheesha:


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Law breakers, law makers, let us fight them all, why not.


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OfflineMushroomninja
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Re: Do you have rest days between working out? [Re: gilesypopper]
    #13095309 - 08/24/10 12:36 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Once you have been at if for awhile you can train more often. But to do otherwise in the beginning is only setting yourself up for injury. Especially your rotator cuff. Also, as much as working legs sucks, doing so will help make your chest develop. The larger the muscle group you work, the more testosterone your body will produce in response. If all you have is dumbbells you can hold some heavy ones overhead and do some squats/thrusters till it hurts. Not every workout should make you sore and stiff. Like when you do high weight-low rep stuff you shouldn't really even get a pump. You're just trying to stimulate the muscle to grow...not destroy it. If you can't take in a gram of protein per pound of body weight per day, at least get some protein every three hours. Other wise you start eating the muscle you just grew. Water, lots of it. It will help you recover faster, drop fat, and look ripped faster. Working an office job just means you have to warm up and stretch more. If anything, you're worse off. Just sitting there getting more stiff and sore than you would if you were up and moving during the day like me. On the plus side of an office job, it's easier to get the food you need when you need it.


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I am said to be a revolutionist in my sympathies, by birth, by breeding, and by principle. I am always on the side of the revolutionist, because there never was a revolution unless there were some oppressive and intolerable conditions against which to revolt.- Mark Twain


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OfflineMushroomninja
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Re: Do you have rest days between working out? [Re: gilesypopper]
    #13095313 - 08/24/10 12:37 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

What is your height/weight? How much weight are you using for what move and how many reps?


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I am said to be a revolutionist in my sympathies, by birth, by breeding, and by principle. I am always on the side of the revolutionist, because there never was a revolution unless there were some oppressive and intolerable conditions against which to revolt.- Mark Twain


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Offlinegilesypopper
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Re: Do you have rest days between working out? [Re: Mushroomninja]
    #13095441 - 08/24/10 12:58 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

I'm about 6 foot 1. Roughly, my typical sets comprise of

3x8 bicep curls
3x6 hammer curls
3x6-8 one arm, standing tricep extensions (the over head one)
3x10 dumbbell presses
3x8 dumbell flyes
Normall chuck in about 40 push ups as well.

Totally take your point about the squats, I'll look to include a set of these too. I read good things about these. To be honest I've just been focussing on the top half as been feeling really shitty lately, am looking for a vanity boost - hit the most flattering parts. Once I've tightened up the top half I'm gonna hit the bottom half. I also do get a good 2-3 miles a day walking in (not great but not bad).

Admit my diet needs a bit of work though. Again though, I have to think that amount of exercise trumps quality of diet, as long as diet is fairly balanced. I'm my maybe carrying a few pounds extra fat but I'm no KFC-whore.

Thanks for your input. :thumbup:


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Law breakers, law makers, let us fight them all, why not.


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OfflineMushroomninja
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Re: Do you have rest days between working out? [Re: gilesypopper]
    #13095573 - 08/24/10 01:26 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

That's not a bad start really. Shoot for getting 4 sets of ten on everything...barley getting 8-10reps on you last set is what you're shooting for. Then bump up weight/intensity. I started out training just like you...upper body only. It was already a strong point of mine, plus what guy doesn't want awesome chest/arms? Use legs for in between chest/back/arm workouts. You'll be amazed how much of a difference doing legs will help chest. I fought this advise until I got into an old iron head gym and my body wouldn't let me get anymore out of balance. Once you're in shape and have some decent muscle tone start changing up the order of your workouts. If you normally do flat bench first, switch to pec deck first after 5-6 weeks. Even at the same weight/#of reps it will surprise your body. The name of the game is to keep your body guessing.


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I am said to be a revolutionist in my sympathies, by birth, by breeding, and by principle. I am always on the side of the revolutionist, because there never was a revolution unless there were some oppressive and intolerable conditions against which to revolt.- Mark Twain


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InvisibleHobbs
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Re: Do you have rest days between working out? [Re: gilesypopper]
    #13096535 - 08/24/10 04:49 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

When determining my rest periods I really just listen to my body. I've learned what it feels like when my body is good to go, or putting on the brakes. Rest is monumental, so until you figure out what your body likes it's always good to err towards excess rest rather than not enough.

It's good that you get enough sleep, maintain that.

You can massage each muscle individually to prevent binding and keep the muscles supple and relaxed. It also increases blood circulation and helps remove excess lactic acid and the byproducts of metabolism (free radicals), leading to a better recovery.

Muscle Control is something that's been suggested by other shroomerites, and should be of interest to you.

:rockon:


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External control, are you gonna let them get you?
Do you wanna be a prisoner in the boundaries they set you?
You say you want to be yourself, do you think they'll let you?
They're out to get you.




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InvisibleChampion des Champignons
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Re: Do you have rest days between working out? [Re: Hobbs]
    #13096982 - 08/24/10 06:43 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

It depends what your aims are.
what are your aims? fitness? getting "toned"? big muscles? big strength?
mediocrity in all 4?


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hmmm........


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OfflineCMACD
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Re: Do you have rest days between working out? [Re: Champion des Champignons]
    #13097160 - 08/24/10 07:26 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Yeah I'd try to not to the exact same thing two days in a row, but I'm also not a fan of only working out one group or doing one exercise a week. Progression in strength seems nearly impossible that way. If you look at the starting strength or bill starr's 5x5 training program, it suggests doing squats 3 days a week, and I found it to be an extremely effective program.

I find chin/pull ups to be very volume-effective or whatever... meaning I get the strongest when I just do them lots with no regard for rest. Certain things like grip strength and shit where strength has more to do with more nervous control of muscles than the amount of actual muscle working/built needs less rest IMO. I just totally pulled that out of my ass though :p


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Offlinemarmarlun
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Re: Do you have rest days between working out? [Re: gilesypopper]
    #13098384 - 08/25/10 01:09 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

gilesypopper said:
I'm about 6 foot 1. Roughly, my typical sets comprise of

3x8 bicep curls
3x6 hammer curls
3x6-8 one arm, standing tricep extensions (the over head one)
3x10 dumbbell presses
3x8 dumbell flyes
Normall chuck in about 40 push ups as well.

Thanks for your input. :thumbup:




What are you training for here? You are training in the least efficient way (isolation exercises) and leaving out the most effecient exercises (compound lifts - squats, deadlifts etc) which you need to stress your nervous system enough to tell your muscles to GROW.

When I say efficiency, I mean in terms of increase in strength and size. You can do a million curl variations, but it won't do anything for you unless you lift heavy compound lifts.

Your biceps get more than enough work from chins and rows - exercises that actually build muscle.


This is so common in gyms in the west - people pounding out silly isolation exercises, going after those glamour muscles, not making progress in years, while beginners that start with a simple 5X5 program (that includes simple, heavy compound movements with squats, benchpress, deadlifts, chins and rows) gain pounds of lean mass by the week.

Your nervous system has more to do with how your muscles develop than the actual muscle tissue itself. If you don't load your body consistently with heavy weight, less growth hormone/testosterone will be produced, and you simply won't adapt (grow).

(that being said, on a 5X5 program, users have the option of adding ONE supplimentary isolation exercise per muscle group - but remember, without heavy lifts, these exercises on their own are useless.

http://stronglifts.com/stronglifts-5x5-beginner-strength-training-program/


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Offlinewellage
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Re: Do you have rest days between working out? [Re: Hobbs]
    #13098983 - 08/25/10 08:17 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

if you are not training to failure and you are listening to your body, you will most likely train every day.

But not if you are training to failure.

and isolation exercises as a main point of a fitness plan=lame


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Offlinegilesypopper
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Re: Do you have rest days between working out? [Re: wellage]
    #13099381 - 08/25/10 10:28 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

marmarlun said:
Quote:

gilesypopper said:
I'm about 6 foot 1. Roughly, my typical sets comprise of

3x8 bicep curls
3x6 hammer curls
3x6-8 one arm, standing tricep extensions (the over head one)
3x10 dumbbell presses
3x8 dumbell flyes
Normall chuck in about 40 push ups as well.

Thanks for your input. :thumbup:




What are you training for here? You are training in the least efficient way (isolation exercises) and leaving out the most effecient exercises (compound lifts - squats, deadlifts etc) which you need to stress your nervous system enough to tell your muscles to GROW.

When I say efficiency, I mean in terms of increase in strength and size. You can do a million curl variations, but it won't do anything for you unless you lift heavy compound lifts.

Your biceps get more than enough work from chins and rows - exercises that actually build muscle.


This is so common in gyms in the west - people pounding out silly isolation exercises, going after those glamour muscles, not making progress in years, while beginners that start with a simple 5X5 program (that includes simple, heavy compound movements with squats, benchpress, deadlifts, chins and rows) gain pounds of lean mass by the week.

Your nervous system has more to do with how your muscles develop than the actual muscle tissue itself. If you don't load your body consistently with heavy weight, less growth hormone/testosterone will be produced, and you simply won't adapt (grow).

(that being said, on a 5X5 program, users have the option of adding ONE supplimentary isolation exercise per muscle group - but remember, without heavy lifts, these exercises on their own are useless.

http://stronglifts.com/stronglifts-5x5-beginner-strength-training-program/




Training for the usual reason - look better and feel more confident. Not looking to be a pro-body builder though or anything.

5x5 sounds interesting, though I'm just working out at home (for now) and dont have a barbell for deadlifts. Also, no way could I do chin ups (at least not yet). Can you do modified 5x5 with dumbbells?


Quote:

wellage said:
if you are not training to failure and you are listening to your body, you will most likely train every day.

But not if you are training to failure.

and isolation exercises as a main point of a fitness plan=lame




I am pushing myself fairly hard. In last set of reps I'm struggling to lift any more.

If isolation exercises are so bad, what are good exercises? Like Marmarlun suggests? Good resources?

Cheers guys :thumbup:


--------------------
Law breakers, law makers, let us fight them all, why not.


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OfflineKingofdiamonds
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Re: Do you have rest days between working out? [Re: gilesypopper]
    #13100090 - 08/25/10 12:45 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

gilesypopper said:


5x5 sounds interesting, though I'm just working out at home (for now) and dont have a barbell for deadlifts. Also, no way could I do chin ups (at least not yet). Can you do modified 5x5 with dumbbells?







you can do dumbbell deadlifts and you could do door pullups :laugh:


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Edited by Kingofdiamonds (08/25/10 12:46 PM)


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Offlinegilesypopper
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Re: Do you have rest days between working out? [Re: Kingofdiamonds]
    #13100313 - 08/25/10 01:25 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Think I'm a few weeks off pull ups as well! Curses....


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Law breakers, law makers, let us fight them all, why not.


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Offlinemarmarlun
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Re: Do you have rest days between working out? [Re: gilesypopper]
    #13100353 - 08/25/10 01:32 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

gilesypopper said:
If isolation exercises are so bad, what are good exercises? Like Marmarlun suggests? Good resources?

Cheers guys :thumbup:




It's only 'bad' in the sense that you are wasting time focusing more on those lifts. Doorway chins are great too.


to answer your original question, YES you need rest. Rest and sleep are just as important as the training itself. The timing suggested in that 5X5 page should give you an idea of what the body needs.

If you get enough rest, and over time lift more weight (progressive overload) your body will adapt.


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OfflinePunkSamurai
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Re: Do you have rest days between working out? [Re: gilesypopper]
    #13102912 - 08/25/10 10:05 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

I do the p90x workout and I can say that after a hardcore training day youll prolly need a days rest. But when I say rest I dont mean dont do anything I jus mean focus on a different group but maybe add in some curls or pulls ups. Youll know when your pushing yourself to far. But id say focus on abs or chest and back one day then the other shoulder and arms.


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