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OfflineJammer
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CNN: Bin Laden's Audio Tape - al Qaeda & Iraq Unite -
    #1299963 - 02/11/03 01:26 PM (14 years, 16 days ago)



Today's BIG Story:

Bin Laden's call to arms, battle instructions


Tuesday, February 11, 2003 Posted: 6:54 PM EST (2354 GMT)
(CNN.COM)

DOHA, Qatar (CNN) -- A voice purported to be that of Osama bin Laden Tuesday issued a call to arms for Muslims to fight against any U.S.-led invasion of Iraq and offered battle strategies aimed at causing the highest number of American casualties.

The message believed to be from the al Qaeda leader was broadcast on the Qatar-based, Arabic-language network Al-Jazeera.

"We want to let you know and confirm to you that this war of the infidels that the U.S. is leading with its allies ... we are with you and we will fight in the name of God," the voice said.

"Our brothers the mujahedeen in Iraq, don't worry about America's lies and their powers and their military might," he said. "We also advise you to drag the forces into fighting you in street fights. Take them into farms, into cities, and fight them in there... they will be losing a lot of lives." (Iraqi military movements)

U.S. officials said the tape does seem to be from bin Laden, and that a technical analysis will be done. Officials also said this tape was of much better quality than the previous one presumed to be from bin Laden, which Al-Jazeera broadcast in November. A U.S. analysis of that tape concluded it extremely likely the tape was authentic.

Word of the tape first emerged earlier in the day when U.S. Secretary of State Colin Powell told a Senate panel a new message had surfaced believed to be bin Laden claiming he is "in partnership with Iraq."

But while the broadcast message declared solidarity with Iraqis, it made no mention of Iraqi President Saddam Hussein and even denounced his socialist Baath party as "infidels."

The voice added that whomever helps America in any war on Iraq -- even by words -- "they have to know that they are outside this Islamic nation. Jordan and Morocco and Nigeria and Saudi Arabia should be careful that this war, this crusade, is attacking the people of Islam first."

He urged "good Muslims" to join together in overthrowing "leaderships that work as a slave to America" and encouraged suicide attacks against the so-called enemies of Islam.

A senior Bush administration official who listened to the tape said that, if authentic, "At best it is a terrorist making common cause with a brutal dictator and at worst it demonstrates a burgeoning alliance of terror."

Other developments
? An emergency session of NATO abruptly ended Tuesday after 30 minutes without resolution on whether to defend Turkey in the event of war with Iraq. NATO spokesman Eyves Brodeur said member states would continue to meet informally "through the night to try and find common ground." NATO was plunged into the crisis Monday after France, Germany and Belgium blocked U.S.-led efforts to send defensive military hardware to Turkey, NATO's only Muslim nation and the only NATO member that borders Iraq.

? The United States and France are drafting competing documents for the U.N. Security Council about the next step in the Iraqi crisis, diplomats said Tuesday. The U.S. document could call Iraq in "material breach" of Resolution 1441 and authorize military action, a U.S. official said. The French document reportedly would authorize more aggressive inspections enforced by many more inspectors.

? U.S. intelligence has noticed that Iraq has moved Scud missile launching equipment next to mosques and historic sites in an apparent effort to preserve launchers from a possible U.S. attack. It also has detected shipments of explosives into southern Iraq that may be intended for oil fields.

? At a hearing Tuesday before the Senate Intelligence Committee, CIA Director George Tenet said two dozen members of Egyptian Islamic Jihad, which he called "indistinguishable" from al Qaeda, and two senior planners have been "operating freely" in Baghdad.

? A Vatican envoy arrived Tuesday in Baghdad on a mission for peace and said he would deliver a "personal message" from Pope John Paul II to Iraqi President Saddam Hussein. "I have come to encourage all efforts for peace," Cardinal Roger Etchegaray said. "War cannot be the last solution. It would be the worse solution, and no one must be resigned to it."

This cnn.com report is here.


I find this story to be EXTREMELY interesting.

Opinions?


--------------------
>>Jammer>>


Edited by Jammer (02/11/03 01:28 PM)


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Offlinezandorf
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Re: CNN: Bin Laden's Audio Tape - al Qaeda & Iraq Unite - [Re: Jammer]
    #1299970 - 02/11/03 01:30 PM (14 years, 16 days ago)

every tape before this bin laden has made was video. SUDDENLY he changes to audio and CONVENIENTLY teams up with Iraq in it.
how convenient.


--------------------
We live in a world where lemonade is made with artificial flavours and furniture polish is made with all natural lemon.


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Anonymous

Re: CNN: Bin Laden's Audio Tape - al Qaeda & Iraq Unite - [Re: Jammer]
    #1299984 - 02/11/03 01:34 PM (14 years, 16 days ago)

if al-qaeda says it's in allegiance with iraq, that means nothing. if iraq says it's in allegiance with al-qaeda... well then there'd be news. that shit about NATO not backing Turkey in the event of war is fucked up. i'm sure if germany bordered iraq, things would be different.


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OfflineJammer
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Re: CNN: Bin Laden's Audio Tape - al Qaeda & Iraq Unite - [Re: zandorf]
    #1300024 - 02/11/03 01:53 PM (14 years, 16 days ago)

Quote:

every tape before this bin laden has made was video. SUDDENLY he changes to audio and CONVENIENTLY teams up with Iraq in it.
how convenient.





I too found this interesting. I also found it interesting how fast the American goverment implied that it's indeed Bin Laden's voice on the tape.


--------------------
>>Jammer>>


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OfflineMushyMay
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Re: CNN: Bin Laden's Audio Tape - al Qaeda & Iraq Unite - [Re: Jammer]
    #1300040 - 02/11/03 02:08 PM (14 years, 16 days ago)

You might find this interesting as well.

-------
Bin Laden Denounces Saddam
February 11, 2003
MSNBC television report this afternoon that their translation of the latest Osama bin Laden tape being read on Al-Jazeera television contains an appeal to the Iraqi people to overthrow Saddam Hussein.

The online story now claims that this was a mistake, that Osama only denounced Saddam as an "infidel." The original story contained this sentence in the second paragraph:


At the same time, the message also called on Iraqis to rise up and oust Iraqi President Saddam Hussein, who is a secular leader.


The AP story mentions that "he denounced Saddam's secular, socialist al-Baath party as 'infidels.'"

This Routers story says that bin Laden tells Muslims not to support "the ignorant governments that rule all Arab states, including Iraq," and that he urges support for the Iraqi people rather than the Iraqi goverment.

It appears that, for some reason, the media has made a decision to bury this part of the message.

No English news outlet has yet made a translation available.

---------
ripped from www.antiwar.com



--------------------
MushyMay is a fictional character, as a result any information provided by MushyMay is also fictitious.


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OfflineJammer
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Re: CNN: Bin Laden's Audio Tape - al Qaeda & Iraq Unite - [Re: MushyMay]
    #1300049 - 02/11/03 02:14 PM (14 years, 16 days ago)

Very good point. As a matter of fact, I have been clicking thru the cable tv news channels here tonight as i have been surfing. I just heard about this side of the story (either on msnbc or foxnews) a moment before you replied.

Good point indeed MushyMay.

Im thinking that maybe the networks aired this story well before they had time for any real experts to review it.


--------------------
>>Jammer>>


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Invisibleangryshroom
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Re: CNN: Bin Laden's Audio Tape - al Qaeda & Iraq Unite - [Re: MushyMay]
    #1300053 - 02/11/03 02:17 PM (14 years, 16 days ago)

Hah, thats pretty funny mushymay..

Anyways in response to Jammer's article...

It says: A senior Bush administration official who listened to the tape said that, if authentic, "At best it is a terrorist making common cause with a brutal dictator and at worst it demonstrates a burgeoning alliance of terror."

Thats hillarous... The "voice" is basically just saying that you should stand up for your rights. How can America be "mad" about this?! Its a war, I hope they dont just expect the Iraqi people to just rollover. The US is creating the terror, they aren't! They are just trying to protect themselves!!!!


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OfflineAngry Mycologist
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Re: CNN: Bin Laden's Audio Tape - al Qaeda & Iraq Unite - [Re: angryshroom]
    #1300143 - 02/11/03 02:56 PM (14 years, 16 days ago)

I'm always amazed when I read an actual Bin Laden transcript after "hearing" about it from the media. He actually makes quite a bit of sense....


--------------------
The proper penalty of ignorance, which is of course that those who don't know should learn from those who do... - Plato


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OfflineJammer
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Re: CNN: Bin Laden's Audio Tape - al Qaeda & Iraq Unite - [Re: Angry Mycologist]
    #1300167 - 02/11/03 03:06 PM (14 years, 16 days ago)

Shesh, as I sit here fox news has just reported that the American goverment is pointing out how this tape "shows a common bond between al Qaeda and Saddam Hussein.."

What gives? :confused: 


--------------------
>>Jammer>>


Edited by Jammer (02/12/03 08:59 AM)


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OfflineMushyMay
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Re: CNN: Bin Laden's Audio Tape - al Qaeda & Iraq Unite - [Re: Jammer]
    #1300215 - 02/11/03 03:27 PM (14 years, 16 days ago)

Ah, the propaganda machine in motion. :wink: 


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OfflineAngry Mycologist
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Re: CNN: Bin Laden's Audio Tape - al Qaeda & Iraq Unite - [Re: MushyMay]
    #1300431 - 02/11/03 05:31 PM (14 years, 16 days ago)

Quote:

Ah, the propaganda machine in motion.



Or rather in stagnation. After all, we are going nowhere.


--------------------
The proper penalty of ignorance, which is of course that those who don't know should learn from those who do... - Plato


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OfflineMushyMay
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Re: CNN: Bin Laden's Audio Tape - al Qaeda & Iraq Unite - [Re: Angry Mycologist]
    #1300537 - 02/11/03 06:13 PM (14 years, 16 days ago)



--------------------
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InvisibleCracka_X
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Re: CNN: Bin Laden's Audio Tape - al Qaeda & Iraq Unite - [Re: Jammer]
    #1300543 - 02/11/03 06:16 PM (14 years, 16 days ago)

why not video tape??? Is there something to hide? Maybe its fake


--------------------
The best way to live
is to be like water
For water benefits all things
and goes against none of them
It provides for all people
and even cleanses those places
a man is loath to go
In this way it is just like Tao        ~Daodejing


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OfflineJammer
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Re: CNN: Bin Laden's Audio Tape - al Qaeda & Iraq Unite - [Re: MushyMay]
    #1300680 - 02/11/03 07:11 PM (14 years, 16 days ago)

Thanks for the link!

That site lead me to the BBC New's "full text translation" of the recent Bin Laden tape.


For those interested that might of missed it.... Check out the BBC's interpretation of the Bin Laden Audio Tape here.


--------------------
>>Jammer>>


Edited by Jammer (02/12/03 06:38 AM)


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Invisibledee_N_ae
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Re: CNN: Bin Laden's Audio Tape - al Qaeda & Iraq Unite - [Re: Jammer]
    #1301452 - 02/12/03 05:07 AM (14 years, 15 days ago)

Come on, anyone who's heard the guy on the tape can tell he is obviously an American agen*cough* AHEM.[/sarcasm]

Seriously though, I too find it interesting how Bin Laden suddenly comes out of nowhere in full support of Iraq.
He told them how he hopes they will succeed.
At what exactly?
America is the one planning the attack. If Bin Laden means "succeed in defending your country" why didn't he say it? Not as if it matters of course ...
Either way, the tape is fishy at best.


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OfflinePhred
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Re: CNN: Bin Laden's Audio Tape - al Qaeda & Iraq Unite - [Re: zandorf]
    #1301501 - 02/12/03 05:27 AM (14 years, 15 days ago)

Zandorf writes:

every tape before this bin laden has made was video.

Incorrect. There was at least one other that was audio only... the one where he threatened by name several other countries (including Australia and Canada). Come on, man, this was just a few months ago, for crying out loud! The media was full of speculation as to whether or not it was really his voice. Some were saying that the rumors he was dead were true, and that it was a plot by Al-Qaeda leaders to convince the faithful that he was still alive.

Let me refresh your memory:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/2455143.stm
http://www.cdi.org/terrorism/binladen-pr.cfm
http://cbc.ca/stories/2002/11/12/binladen021112
http://afr.com/world/2002/11/13/FFXD9T93G8D.html

pinky


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InvisibleInnvertigo
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Re: CNN: Bin Laden's Audio Tape - al Qaeda & Iraq Unite - [Re: zandorf]
    #1301502 - 02/12/03 05:27 AM (14 years, 15 days ago)

***how convenient. ***

I'm afraid to admit it but i was thinking the same thing....so was my wife.


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

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OfflineJammer
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Re: CNN: Bin Laden's Audio Tape - al Qaeda & Iraq Unite - [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1301695 - 02/12/03 07:00 AM (14 years, 15 days ago)

I have mixed feelings over the issue of it being an audio (rather than video) tape. The American goverment can fake a video almost as easy as an audio one I'm thinking.

What gets my attention here is the almost universal acceptance from the "world" (goverments) that the voice on the tape is that of Bin Laden...

Shucks, it seems to me that there was much more debate as to the validity of the previous Bin Laden VIDEO tapes than America and others are giving this audio tape. It's like America is saying: "Yep, thats the dude... thats him alright.." and others quickly follow us. Does this not strike others as a rush to judgment ?

WTF?


--------------------
>>Jammer>>


Edited by Jammer (02/12/03 08:54 AM)


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OfflineRonoS
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Re: CNN: Bin Laden's Audio Tape - al Qaeda & Iraq Unite - [Re: Jammer]
    #1301771 - 02/12/03 08:13 AM (14 years, 15 days ago)

Pass the Duct Tape
By MAUREEN DOWD


WASHINGTON

Osama bin Laden came to the rescue of George W. Bush yesterday.

The president and his secretary of state had been huffing and puffing to prove a link between Saddam Hussein and Al Qaeda. George Tenet, who presides over a C.I.A. full of skepticism about the tie, did his best for the boss, playing up the link to the Senate.

Ignoring all the blatant Qaeda hooks to Saudi Arabia, Syria, Yemen and Pakistan; ignoring the fact that Osama has never had any use for the drinking, smoking, womanizing, secular Saddam; ignoring the fact that Saddam has no proven record of sharing weapons with Al Qaeda, the Bushies have been hellbent on making the 9/11 connection.

The world wasn't entirely buying that rationale for war.

And then who but Osama himself should pop up on an audio tape, calling on Muslims to fight the U.S. if the "infidels" attack "our brothers in Iraq."

Osama's disdain for Saddam still gleamed through. He barely mentioned the Iraqi leader and seemed to be holding his nose when he gave permission to his Qaeda brethren to fight "the Crusaders" alongside Saddam's Baath Party, "even if we believe and declare that the socialists are apostates," and whether Saddam remains in power or not.

Still, the administration pounced on the tape, hoping it would prove to those epicene Old Europeans, with their poufy blue-helmeted U.N. force, that Al Qaeda and Iraq were "bound by a common hatred," as the State Department's Richard Boucher said.

Mr. Powell was so eager to publicize Osama's statements that he broke the news himself at a Senate Budget Committee hearing, hours before Al Jazeera even acknowledged it had the tape.

He said the tape showed that Osama was "in partnership with Iraq," and proved that the U.S. could not count simply on a beefed-up inspection force in Iraq.

In the past, Condi Rice has implored the networks not to broadcast the tapes outright, fearing he might be activating sleeper cells in code.

But this time the administration flacked the tape. And Fox, the official Bush news agency, rushed the entire tape onto the air.

So the Bushies no longer care if Osama sends a coded message to his thugs as long as he stays on message for the White House?

To get Saddam, the Bush administration is even willing to remind the American public that it failed to get bin Laden. Its fixation on Saddam seems to have blinded it to the possibility that Osama might be perversely encouraging America in this war.

The administration and Al Qaeda both have a purpose for invading Iraq, and both want a regime change.

Both talk about "liberating" the Arab people, but Osama's vision is apocalyptic. He wants the Middle East ? Israel and the Arab monarchies ? to go up in flames. By Zionizing our battle with Iraq and promising an anti-American theocracy, he hopes to radicalize recruits for a jihad against an American occupation of Arab land.

Osama's own fanaticism was forged by foreign occupations ? the Soviet Union's invasion of Afghanistan and American forces stationed in Saudi Arabia.

The Bush hawks want to go to war in a non-apocalyptic way, to stabilize the Middle East, not to inflame it. They have a grandiose ? if risky ? plan to transform Iraq into a model kitchen of democracy, a buffer for Israel that the Palestinians and other Arab autocracies would be pressured to emulate.

Senators quizzed Bush officials yesterday, asking whether Gen. Tommy Franks, the future mukhtar of Baghdad, would be choosing new Iraqi leaders. They pressed about the time and cost of an American occupation.

Chris Dodd suggested that there could be unforeseen explosions in the model kitchen, citing an alliance between the Iraqi exiles who might run a post-Saddam government and conservative Iranian clerics who think we're the Great Satan.

"You have to level with the American public," he lectured the Bush officials. "It could be very costly and take a long, long time."

But it is the Bushies' dream of a model kitchen in Iraq, rather than a Saddam-Qaeda link, that makes this war seem noble to them. That's why they were so busy hawking the Osama tape, rather than coming up with ways we can protect ourselves from the coming Osama attacks ? other than with plastic and duct tape.

...and this is from the New York times...probably one of the most right wing papers out there...looks like someone is getting a conscience...or fired...


--------------------
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OfflineTheCaptain
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Re: CNN: Bin Laden's Audio Tape - al Qaeda & Iraq Unite - [Re: Rono]
    #1301832 - 02/12/03 08:40 AM (14 years, 15 days ago)

Thats a good article...

I would have to argue with some of the points tho, like

"They have a grandiose — if risky — plan to transform Iraq into a model kitchen of democracy."

This quote is portrayed in a way to say that its a good thing... well, yah, democracy is good, but as history has shown- nearly every time since WWII when we go in there and set up a "democracy" it ends up being some half crazy dictator... Thats how this mess got started in the first place.


--------------------
"I mean, it's real hard to be free when you are bought and sold in the marketplace. 'Course, don't ever tell anybody that they're not free 'cause then they're gonna get real busy killin' and maimin' to prove to you that they are."


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