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Rocker232
Stranger


Registered: 10/17/08
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Re: enlightening experiences with psychdelics? [Re: Almond Flour]
#10429148 - 05/31/09 11:14 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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I will tell you what psychedelics (Marijuana included but not as extreme) give you. Perspective. The ability to see yourself from an outside source. You underestimate how powerful the ego is in hiding the world from you. I think enlightenment can only be reached through meditation (which I do), but that mushrooms and the sort can give you a momentary glimpse of it. I don't think I will ever see the world in the same way I used too, and I am okay with that. I am okay with watching the news and seeing the people as nothing more than plastic figurines. I am okay with looking down upon people who do not know anything about themselves and think they are some kind of King. I am okay with knowing that I as a human am very flawed, but that through insight and action I can change that. Mushrooms to me are what it feels like after you have meditated for years, only you reach it within an hour and stay there for quite some time. It shows you things that I don't think you can just "stumble" upon.
Take time for instance, you know its all about perception, but did you really KNOW it before you took mushrooms? I have went on walks that lasted 45 minutes that felt like days, maybe years. I have stared at objects for seconds and it felt as though I had devoted a lifetime to them. I have realized just how thin reality is and that there is so much more out there to explore. It got me interested in Psychology and LSD made me see music in a new light.
Whether its "real" or not is arbitrary, what matters is that it can lead you to true enlightenment. You either take the drug to get fucked up, or you take the drug to open your eyes. That choice is upon you and that decision makes all the difference.
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With Allure I Look to the Sky With Awakened Eyes
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PyroBurns
душа кофе


Registered: 10/14/07
Posts: 4,343
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Re: enlightening experiences with psychdelics? [Re: Rocker232]
#10429184 - 05/31/09 11:25 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Tea, just because you don't know what you're doing please don't rain on everyone else's parade.
You can't reach enlightenment on psychedelics but they are great for helping you see things in a new perspective and make your inner mind loud enough to understand what you're thinking and what you need to do. Of course it's not always perfect and I wouldn't say it has anything to do with god's but it's very important and useful to reveal things to yourself and help you reflect. And take in the general idea of things.
-------------------- Remember to cut your nails regularly.
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antiPock
fighting entropy



Registered: 07/09/07
Posts: 2,509
Loc: Sol 3
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Re: enlightening experiences with psychdelics? [Re: champinhom]
#10429190 - 05/31/09 11:26 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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I absolutely think psychedelic experiences can be truly enlightening, though certainly any given experience is not necessarily so. I mean, what is enlightenment in the first place? There are many levels to the experience, any of which may prove enlightening to the individual. This is not to say that psychedelics are in of themselves enlightening so much as a (potential) means to new ways of thinking and understanding.
"Enlightenment" is not a singularity, not a plateau that is reached never to be transcended. It is a journey, a gradual series of steps that has no end point. (Timeless "white hole" states of mind non-withstanding, lolz.) To dismiss the potential role of psychedelics in attaining higher states of enlightenment is as much folly as to suggest that they will bring enlightenment in of themselves.
This line of questioning also makes me think of "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance". This book was not about psychedelics per say, but IMO gets to the heart of the matter. One can "go to the top of the mountain", seeking higher and higher abstract states of mind, but in the end we do live in a meat-box and are chained to the requirements of living as animals, with all of he requisite minutia of day to day living.
We monkeys may for a time attain transcendent states of mind, and these states can carry forward into our world view and understanding. However we are at this point in our evolution still constrained by limited intellect, finite life spans and biology that thwarts our best intentions. This however is not to say that we cannot improve ourselves and expand our understanding, and psychedelics are among the gifts that give us the means to do so.
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champinhom
Lord Justhappensness


Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 987
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Re: enlightening experiences with psychdelics? [Re: Muppet]
#10429204 - 05/31/09 11:28 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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I think people, whether they be church goers and/or users of psychedelic substances are doing the best they can--if only because they are doing the only thing they can.I haven't believed in free choice for 32 years now.There is no burden like the burden of that belief.
-------------------- My father used to say: I don't care what else you do in life, just don't be an asshole. People, forgive me when I forget what my daddy said. Cut back the proliferating list of people whose opinions can hurt you. Unless they have done or want to do you some good, their views are just not worth tracking. Saul Bellow “People are just cannibals unless they leave each other alone.” Doris Lessing Those whom the gods would save, they dower with compassion. Mr. P. Silocybin
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Deekay



Registered: 09/07/08
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Re: enlightening experiences with psychdelics? [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
#10429205 - 05/31/09 11:28 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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i believe that Socrates said something along the lines of that, "he who thinks he enlightened surely is a fool for thinking so". i tend to agree with this, you might have a true moment of clarity, but no human, even the most revered or acclaimed, is truly enlightened. that's my take on it anyway, and i tend to use that word an ideal or a very temporary state (which may not be even be true enlightenment ).
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Cognitive_Shift
CS actual




Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 29,591
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Re: enlightening experiences with psychdelics? [Re: Deekay]
#10429208 - 05/31/09 11:29 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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If your a materialist you could say with too much challenge that google.com is closest thing to enlightenment in the world.
-------------------- L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs
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takeacti0n
Stranger


Registered: 05/25/09
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Re: enlightening experiences with psychdelics? [Re: Deekay]
#10429224 - 05/31/09 11:32 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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If everyone tripped once in their life, would the world be a better place? I tend to think so.
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shine on forever benevolent son!
Edited by takeacti0n (05/31/09 11:33 AM)
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Cognitive_Shift
CS actual




Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 29,591
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Re: enlightening experiences with psychdelics? [Re: takeacti0n]
#10429229 - 05/31/09 11:33 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
takeacti0n said: If everyone tripped once in their life, would the world be a better place? 
Better is perspective. But it sure would be different
-------------------- L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs
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PyroBurns
душа кофе


Registered: 10/14/07
Posts: 4,343
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Re: enlightening experiences with psychdelics? [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
#10429241 - 05/31/09 11:35 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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I think enlightenment is a very vague term too.
With lots of psychedelics and even books by Douglas Adams, I feel there is a Earth-o-centric Human-o-centric point of view we can't really escape. We can be better and more open all the time, but to truly ascend ourselves is futile and pointless. You know what I'm saying?
-------------------- Remember to cut your nails regularly.
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champinhom
Lord Justhappensness


Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 987
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Re: enlightening experiences with psychdelics? [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
#10429261 - 05/31/09 11:40 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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I have not taken heavy enough doses to experience the famous "ego death". Afraid I might black out or do something nutty--like tell my boss to go f*&k himself.Afraid of a bad trip. Fear, fear, fear.
-------------------- My father used to say: I don't care what else you do in life, just don't be an asshole. People, forgive me when I forget what my daddy said. Cut back the proliferating list of people whose opinions can hurt you. Unless they have done or want to do you some good, their views are just not worth tracking. Saul Bellow “People are just cannibals unless they leave each other alone.” Doris Lessing Those whom the gods would save, they dower with compassion. Mr. P. Silocybin
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Cognitive_Shift
CS actual




Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 29,591
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Re: enlightening experiences with psychdelics? [Re: champinhom]
#10429269 - 05/31/09 11:41 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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If your afraid, psychedelics are probably not your frontier.
-------------------- L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs
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gENERIX
/usr/bin/drinking?



Registered: 10/18/05
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Re: enlightening experiences with psychdelics? [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
#10429284 - 05/31/09 11:45 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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There is a difference between being afraid and being anxious. I always find myself a little anxious before tripping because you never know what lies ahead.
The last time I swallowed acid, I woke up the next morning feeling brilliant. My goals in life seemed so much clearer.
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takeacti0n
Stranger


Registered: 05/25/09
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Re: enlightening experiences with psychdelics? [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
#10429287 - 05/31/09 11:46 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Even bad trips are a learning experience.
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shine on forever benevolent son!
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Cognitive_Shift
CS actual




Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 29,591
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Re: enlightening experiences with psychdelics? [Re: gENERIX]
#10429299 - 05/31/09 11:48 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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I get anxiety and anxious before every trip. Because i know im about to get my mind blown. But once i have gotten passed the onset its smooth sailing. And on some of the higher doses i am just so fucked up, that i don't even know what being afraid is.
-------------------- L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs
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Muppet
Nomadic Jester



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Re: enlightening experiences with psychdelics? [Re: takeacti0n]
#10433861 - 06/01/09 04:57 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
takeacti0n said: Even bad trips are a learning experience.
if you ask me - you tend to learn more from the 'bad' trips then you do the good
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Ravings of a Madman
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blewmeanie




Registered: 10/01/06
Posts: 28,984
Loc:
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Re: enlightening experiences with psychdelics? [Re: Muppet]
#10433885 - 06/01/09 05:10 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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"Because I took LSD, I now know that butter is way better than margarine.
I saw through the bullshit."
-Mitch Hedberg
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Dropcidnotbombz
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Re: enlightening experiences with psychdelics? [Re: champinhom]
#12996225 - 08/03/10 01:57 PM (13 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
champinhom said: Here is a question that has been exercising me lately: Can the experiences that are provided by LSD, psilocybin, mescaline really be called liberating, enlightening? Do they really change lives? Or do these substances play with us, make us feel, while we are under their influence, that we are really onto something important, some key truth--something great that seems simply weird the day after when we are sober.There are a lot of spiritual teachers who say anything you get through psycedelic experience is just foam--it melts away and leaves yhou where you were when you before you ingested.
The psychedelic thought is a paradox.
The whole message of doing them, is to self improve, and that includes not using drugs.
So you may be enlightened, but it didn't actually teach you anything.
Your mind was the tool of knowledge, not the psychedelic, it just put things in perspective.
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