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OfflineSeeka
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Registered: 02/02/03
Posts: 98
Loc: Western Hemisphere
Last seen: 13 years, 10 months
Tripping with a questionable friend: advice requested.
    #1289534 - 02/07/03 07:21 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

I'm not sure if this is in the right forum, but I figured it was related to set and setting so I posted it here. Feel free to move, mods.

I have a friend who I was going to trip shrooms with for the first time... I've had .. one acid trip, and no shrooms trips as of yet. He has done acid one time as far as I can tell, but he refuses to divulge his history too much to me. We somehow launched into a discussion about acid and shrooms and he mentioned that he thought that acid was overrated and that it wasn't really that special. He said when he tripped acid it wasn't really that special, and that he thought that it wasn't something to "just do" -- in fact, he even went so far as to compare acid to pop tarts with regard to favorableness.

So, my first thought is, "OK, this guy didn't dose high enough, or he got a watered-down dose of acid" -- And I still think that, but he claims he's been around enough people (80 was the number he gave me) that tripped acid that he knows what it does to you and all this. Well, I question the validity of his friends' accounts, and of course that never makes him happy, because he thinks I'm calling him a liar.

I pretty much stopped the subject right there, thinking "OK, I'm gonna post to the Shroomery later, and ask for advice on this, but right now I'm thinking that I can't trip with this guy" - And so here I am, looking for advice on how to proceed. I can't possibly imagine tripping with this guy if he has such a negative view of what shrooms/acid really do.

But this guy is one of my best friends. Granted, he's a little more unstable than I'd like, but he's a good friend for what I have to pick from around here. He smokes cigarettes, drinks like a madman (occasionally) and has been convicted of three felony charges, which are all of the same act [which was a bomb threat, breaking and entering, and destruction of public property].. That is, they all happened in the same night and at the same place and with the same motive. Right now he's got his driver's license taken away for driving too fast and wrecking his car, but I don't hold that against him since I almost got mine taken away for doing the same thing (creepily, I crashed my car the day after he crashed his. and the cop that was on the scene at the time was the same cop who gave me a speeding ticket a month earlier).

I should mention that all these things happened from a general rebellion of authority, a bad childhood, and a rough upbringing. I'm sure most of you are framiliar with the rebellion part, since shrooms are illegal in lots of places, and so is acid, marijuana, etc... I myself have a strong rebellious instinct; and that's partly nature/nurture, and partly that I'm a young adult (18) who refuses to accept blind truth. He is 17 y.o.a.

What's somewhat ironic is that he doesn't (even) smoke pot, and he thinks "drugs" are bad although he agreed to trip with me in the near future a while ago. You can imagine my confused state of mind.

OK, so, I'm looking for advice on what to do here. Obviously a lot of people are going to say not to trip with him, and I'm probably going to agree with that statement. But at the same time, people aren't without flaws. It's just that I don't think I should have to deal with him bringing me down _at all_ during the trip, even if it's that uncomfortable atmosphere not knowing if he's gonna flip out or not.

Thanks.. :smile: 


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Invisiblebert
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Re: Tripping with a questionable friend: advice requested. [Re: Seeka]
    #1289551 - 02/07/03 07:32 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

This guy sounds pretty unstable to me, and I think you probably wouldn't feel comfortable tripping with him if you had to come to a forum to ask in the first place.
Comparing acid to pop tarts? That's ludicrous, he obviously hasnt done acid before or he's eating some new flavor of pop tarts that I have to check out. Even if he doesn't end up bringing you down, you'll probably end up babysitting him when he freaks out on the acid and starts running around getting in trouble.


--------------------
Persons denying the existence of robots may be robots themselves.


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Invisibletryptamine_skies
For MentalExtensions

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Re: Tripping with a questionable friend: advice requested. [Re: Seeka]
    #1289557 - 02/07/03 07:36 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

The choice is up to you.

Basically the fact that you are questioning how you would respond to him being there tells me you shouldn't. Personally I enjoy tripping alone, without the hinderance of other people there to ground me, but you may be different.

His views on LSD are certainly false, as anyone who has experienced what LSD can do knows it's something that is very powerful, beautiful and should be respected.

Although this person could certainly be tolerable on low dose mushroom excursions, I think anything more intense should be spent with maybe a close friend you can relate to, talk with.. Not just an 'aquaintance', but a real friend.

Anyway, I hope I've helped in some way.  :wink:
- trypt


--------------------
The most beautiful experience we can have is the mysterious ; it is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science.



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OfflineSeeka
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Registered: 02/02/03
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Last seen: 13 years, 10 months
Re: Tripping with a questionable friend: advice requested. [Re: tryptamine_skies]
    #1289591 - 02/07/03 07:56 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

The choice is up to you.

Basically the fact that you are questioning how you would respond to him being there tells me you shouldn't. Personally I enjoy tripping alone, without the hinderance of other people there to ground me, but you may be different.

His views on LSD are certainly false, as anyone who has experienced what LSD can do knows it's something that is very powerful, beautiful and should be respected.

Although this person could certainly be tolerable on low dose mushroom excursions, I think anything more intense should be spent with maybe a close friend you can relate to, talk with.. Not just an 'aquaintance', but a real friend.

Anyway, I hope I've helped in some way.  :wink:
- trypt 



All responses are helpful. That's my first rule: I never criticize someone for responding when I ask a question. Yes, you have helped me.

I don't think it's wise for me to trip alone just yet. I don't feel I am an experienced enough as a tripper, and while I have tripped alone on experimental tryptamines that put me on the edge of sanity (low-dose fortunately, but tell that to the guy in IRC who insisted I had taken too much despite me knowing that the dose was a reasonably safe undertaking.)

That said, I have other friends I can trip with who are more friendly to acid and shrooms. But these friends too have quirks about them that make them unstable. Let me assure you as you probably already know, that it sucks being the only reasonably stable person in a group of people trying to find themselves in all the wrong ways (or rather, what I perceieve to be tactics of self-destruction; I think hallucinogens have made me realize that nothing is ever completely certain).

His description of how LSD was overrated set off an alarm bell in my head 150 dB loud. I don't know that this person really knows how to control his life yet. He tells me he "likes" smoking and won't tell me he wants to quit, mostly I think because he can't. Not that I'm saying not being able to quit smoking means you're mentally unstable, but I'd like to think that given the chance I _could_ successfully ween myself off of such a dangerous drug. But again, not downplaying how hard smoking is to quit.

At the same time that all this is happening, I know I have to keep him as a friend because I probably never would've survived the horrible whirlpool that is highschool today would it not have been for a uniform front in my rebellious ideas.

I realize how personality flaws can become intensified on shrooms, and so in the end I'll almost definitely chose to do low-dose or not dose at all with him. Do you guys ever get that feeling like you want to introduce someone into the world of hallucinogens, though, so that they would know what it is really like? Some part of me wants to free him from this negative thinking.

I have another policy, though.. I don't give things to people that they can't control. This idea actually came from my shrink, and I'm grateful to him for the contribution. To me, giving someone something (even if it is only a harsh opinion, or something as serious as a psychoactive drug) that they can't control is at best negligent and most likely abuse.

Quote:

Comparing acid to pop tarts? That's ludicrous, he obviously hasnt done acid before or he's eating some new flavor of pop tarts that I have to check out. Even if he doesn't end up bringing you down, you'll probably end up babysitting him when he freaks out on the acid and starts running around getting in trouble.



Yes, it is ludicrous, but if it helps any, I think it was a "second-generation" comparison, that is, he compared the idea of acid to another idea that is "really not that exciting to just do for no reason" or similar, and then he related that idea to acid.

I'm not still suffering from some of the conditions that I originally had detected in him and so we had common ground then, but less and less now. I think I have to be the one to move on, because, well, if you hang around a certain crowd of people, of course you're going to behavior a certain way.

I guess nobody said that these decisions were easy.


Edited by Seeka (02/07/03 08:01 PM)


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Invisibleperuvian spark
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Re: Tripping with a questionable friend: advice requested. [Re: tryptamine_skies]
    #1289599 - 02/07/03 08:02 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

"Not just an "aquaintance", but a real friend"- (pretty good) That's probably the best advice you could get about tripping with other people. I wouldn't trip with that guy, too many bad things can happen, and you have to be very strong both physically and mentally to deal with someone having a bad trip, or just being really unreasonable. If you KNOW you can handle any situation with this guy, you should be all right- might even be able to help him out.


--------------------
"The only unchangeable certainty is that nothing is certain and everything is changeable."


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Invisibletryptamine_skies
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Re: Tripping with a questionable friend: advice requested. [Re: Seeka]
    #1289631 - 02/07/03 08:20 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

I don't think it's wise for me to trip alone just yet. I don't feel I am an experienced enough as a tripper, and while I have tripped alone on experimental tryptamines that put me on the edge of sanity (low-dose fortunately, but tell that to the guy in IRC who insisted I had taken too much despite me knowing that the dose was a reasonably safe undertaking.)




Oh yes, I forgot that you mentioned that.. I'm sorry, I am just a little tired. I've had quite an acid experience today myself.  :tongue:

I definately agree with you though. Maybe take 'baby steps' for the first few times, and trip low doses with the friends you ultimately come to decide on tripping with.. Sort of test the waters out a little bit until you are suited well enough to dose alone in the future if you'd like. Personally I like dosing alone alot better, as I've stated before, it just seems to bring upon the most enlightening, and spiritual journeys within myself.

Quote:

His description of how LSD was overrated set off an alarm bell in my head 150 dB loud. I don't know that this person really knows how to control his life yet. He tells me he "likes" smoking and won't tell me he wants to quit, mostly I think because he can't. Not that I'm saying not being able to quit smoking means you're mentally unstable, but I'd like to think that given the chance I _could_ successfully ween myself off of such a dangerous drug. But again, not downplaying how hard smoking is to quit.





There is definately a chance he would be no help if you needed it, as from watching other non-experienced people try and talk people down from bad trips, they always seem to say the wrong things, and even sometimes escalate the whole ordeal.

The way he says 'LSD is overrated' makes me think he just looks at it like a party favor.. I don't like those types of people. They're usually, simple-minded, ignorant fools who always seem as though their brain is so dulled from the bullshit they feed themselves that they can't even experience the LSD experience in it's full intensity on any dose.

Quote:

I realize how personality flaws can become intensified on shrooms, and so in the end I'll almost definitely chose to do low-dose or not dose at all with him. 




Sounds like a reasonable decision. Just make sure you're truly comfortable with this person, as it's just such a better experience if you are.

Quote:

Do you guys ever get that feeling like you want to introduce someone into the world of hallucinogens, though, so that they would know what it is really like? Some part of me wants to free him from this negative thinking.





I get it all the time.. It basically comes with my urge to 'free everyone's mind'.. =P

Quote:

I have another policy, though.. I don't give things to people that they can't control. This idea actually came from my shrink, and I'm grateful to him for the contribution. To me, giving someone something (even if it is only a harsh opinion, or something as serious as a psychoactive drug) that they can't control is at best negligent and most likely abuse. 




That's good advice. Although somewhere down the line with hallucinogenics, one must experience overwhelming fear, and overcome it, to proceed further down the 'path of knowledge'.. But that's not for everyone I suppose.  :laugh:


--------------------
The most beautiful experience we can have is the mysterious ; it is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science.



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OfflineSeeka
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Registered: 02/02/03
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Re: Tripping with a questionable friend: advice requested. [Re: peruvian spark]
    #1289635 - 02/07/03 08:22 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

I guess I should mention that I'm a strong believer in taking risks. That means that while at this point I'm definitely not tripping regular dose with him, I might go lower and see how he reacts to it.

With regard to "Not just an 'aquaintance', but a real friend," I think it's great if you can find friends that you can be cool with all the time, but I've not had such luck. I look for more people to trip with, but you guys know how the paranoia can kick in when you feel that your new friend might turn you into the cops... Of course that's a moot point since I should be screening the friends before allowing them to know anything bad about me.. :smile:

Am I able to handle any situation with this guy? No. I'm sure he could outpower me if he tried, and he's stubborn at times. So, I should probably just leave it alone. Tough decisions suck.


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Invisibleperuvian spark
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Re: Tripping with a questionable friend: advice requested. [Re: Seeka]
    #1289664 - 02/07/03 08:36 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Check it out, I was at a festival with a friend and my cousin ( who was bigger than me and my other friend ), and we all took about 7 hits a piece. I trust these kids with my life, honestly, but my cousin kind of wigged out. Since we couldn't control him in any way, he ended up running around this place naked, yelling " Im going there, so that we can die!!" for all to see for about an hour. He wasn't being mean, he was just making some mischief and having a mind blowing experience. In a way it was a positive experience because he had a serious spiritual breakthrough that night, but it was crazy because we couldn't get him to put his pants back on!  :wink:  Thats just one example of what could happen with LSD. 


--------------------
"The only unchangeable certainty is that nothing is certain and everything is changeable."


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OfflineStrumpling
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Re: Tripping with a questionable friend: advice requested. [Re: Seeka]
    #1289711 - 02/07/03 08:52 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

lol after thinking about how evil and terrible this guy is for this long, its probably best you not trip with him, at least not any time soon, because you've recorded so much thinking about it now, and we're recording more of it as we speak :smile: until you don't feel the need to even ask the question "should I trip with this guy" then I don't know if you should :wink:

Good luck man - Peace


--------------------
Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
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Invisibletryptamine_skies
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Re: Tripping with a questionable friend: advice requested. [Re: Strumpling]
    #1289723 - 02/07/03 08:55 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

lol after thinking about how evil and terrible this guy is for this long, its probably best you not trip with him, at least not any time soon, because you've recorded so much thinking about it now, and we're recording more of it as we speak :smile: until you don't feel the need to even ask the question "should I trip with this guy" then I don't know if you should :wink:

Good luck man - Peace 




He's got a point there.  :tongue:


--------------------
The most beautiful experience we can have is the mysterious ; it is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science.



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OfflineSeeka
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Re: Tripping with a questionable friend: advice requested. [Re: tryptamine_skies]
    #1289786 - 02/07/03 09:17 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Point well recieved. I think I'll have to trip with one of my friends who knows what acid actually does to you.


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Offlineliftedoff420
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Re: Tripping with a questionable friend: advice requested. [Re: Seeka]
    #1291334 - 02/08/03 04:33 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

who cares man

ive tripped shrooms with my friends who have all had incidents with the cops, it dont matter man maybe cus im like them too lol...if the person doesnt make you stressed in your sober state i say go for it


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OfflineStrumpling
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Re: Tripping with a questionable friend: advice requested. [Re: liftedoff420]
    #1291395 - 02/08/03 05:07 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

"who cares man"

HE cares, so it matters.


--------------------
Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
In addition: SHPONGLE


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OfflineSeeka
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Re: Tripping with a questionable friend: advice requested. [Re: liftedoff420]
    #1292420 - 02/09/03 05:35 AM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

who cares man

ive tripped shrooms with my friends who have all had incidents with the cops, it dont matter man maybe cus im like them too lol...if the person doesnt make you stressed in your sober state i say go for it



I'm not disqualifying the guy because of his incidents with the law. That I couldn't give two shits about, but the fact is that it leads to a pattern and that's why I mentioned it. And he doesn't make me stressed in sober state but that's only because I'm constantly not giving a shit about what he says. While tripping it's totally different because everything's amplified.


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Offlinemrr0gers
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Re: Tripping with a questionable friend: advice requested. [Re: Seeka]
    #1292496 - 02/09/03 06:23 AM (14 years, 4 months ago)

This guy sounds like he might be bi-polar. I know a lot of manic-depressives, one of them I've talked to about LSD and shrooms. She was all for shrooms but says that acid will make you go insane and that I shouldn't even bother cultivating ergot cultures(she had ONE bad trip and never did it again). A month later she asked if I had any acid. So what I'm saying is, that guy sounds like he can't really stick to an opinion which I find when talking with some of my bi-polar family and friends.


--------------------
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OfflineSeeka
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Re: Tripping with a questionable friend: advice requested. [Re: mrr0gers]
    #1293432 - 02/09/03 12:49 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

This guy sounds like he might be bi-polar. I know a lot of manic-depressives, one of them I've talked to about LSD and shrooms. She was all for shrooms but says that acid will make you go insane and that I shouldn't even bother cultivating ergot cultures(she had ONE bad trip and never did it again). A month later she asked if I had any acid. So what I'm saying is, that guy sounds like he can't really stick to an opinion which I find when talking with some of my bi-polar family and friends.



He's got some sort of chemical imblance, not sure if it's bipolar though. Probably social anxiety, but I've got that too, only I've effectively defeated it. He was on Paxil and stopped.. same as me, lol.


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Invisiblepoke smot!
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Re: Tripping with a questionable friend: advice requested. *DELETED* [Re: Seeka]
    #1293775 - 02/09/03 04:06 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Post deleted by poke smot!

Reason for deletion: x



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Invisibletryptamine_skies
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Re: Tripping with a questionable friend: advice requested. [Re: poke smot!]
    #1293842 - 02/09/03 04:27 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Damn! grats. I have an aunt that is suffering trying to get off paxil. I hear withdrawl is quite undesirable.




A few years ago I was prescribed to Paxil, and it was absolutely horrible.. When I took it, I felt nothing but restlessness, anxiety, and depression. There were times when I'd take that drug and feel as though I needed to kill myself to end the feelings induced by it.

I never got to taking it enough to experience withdrawl symptoms, as I seriously despised it from the very beginning.

That's just another reason why I vowed to stay away from prescription medications and things. God knows what they are really doing to your brain.

Quote:

I have some clinically-undiagnosable concoction of odds-and-ends disorders, but I deal with mushies very well. I believe they truly help me overcome the negativity and the way I look at myself.




I am very much the same way, and I also find that psychedelics help me very much in finding closure within myself. They just help me overcome those "disorders", enable me to surpass them.

Quote:

So maybe your friend's got some disorder. Just as long as he's not treating shrooms as another way of getting fucked up, I think it's ok. It might make him a better person, tighten your friendship, make him improve. Or it could be a result you don't want. At least it's not like he's committed to taking shrooms after one trip.





From how Seeka is talking about his friend, it seems as though he does have that kind of "getting fucked up" mentality, but maybe I'm wrong. If he is so experienced with psychedelics like he claims, then he should have no problem being alone, and truly using these substances to improve himself as a person. Right now I don't think Seeka should risk it just yet. I've had experiences where I've been tripping, and people I thought were good friends were around, and still I felt such a distance, and disconnection from them. Things like that happen, and you just have to be careful who, if anyone, is around. Psychedelics can isolate you in such an astounding way.



--------------------
The most beautiful experience we can have is the mysterious ; it is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science.



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OfflineSombie
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Re: Tripping with a questionable friend: advice requested. [Re: Seeka]
    #1293855 - 02/09/03 04:30 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

I'm not sure if this is in the right forum, but I figured it was related to set and setting so I posted it here. Feel free to move, mods.

I have a friend who I was going to trip shrooms with for the first time... I've had .. one acid trip, and no shrooms trips as of yet. He has done acid one time as far as I can tell, but he refuses to divulge his history too much to me. We somehow launched into a discussion about acid and shrooms and he mentioned that he thought that acid was overrated and that it wasn't really that special. He said when he tripped acid it wasn't really that special, and that he thought that it wasn't something to "just do" -- in fact, he even went so far as to compare acid to pop tarts with regard to favorableness.

So, my first thought is, "OK, this guy didn't dose high enough, or he got a watered-down dose of acid" -- And I still think that, but he claims he's been around enough people (80 was the number he gave me) that tripped acid that he knows what it does to you and all this. Well, I question the validity of his friends' accounts, and of course that never makes him happy, because he thinks I'm calling him a liar.

I pretty much stopped the subject right there, thinking "OK, I'm gonna post to the Shroomery later, and ask for advice on this, but right now I'm thinking that I can't trip with this guy" - And so here I am, looking for advice on how to proceed. I can't possibly imagine tripping with this guy if he has such a negative view of what shrooms/acid really do.

But this guy is one of my best friends. Granted, he's a little more unstable than I'd like, but he's a good friend for what I have to pick from around here. He smokes cigarettes, drinks like a madman (occasionally) and has been convicted of three felony charges, which are all of the same act [which was a bomb threat, breaking and entering, and destruction of public property].. That is, they all happened in the same night and at the same place and with the same motive. Right now he's got his driver's license taken away for driving too fast and wrecking his car, but I don't hold that against him since I almost got mine taken away for doing the same thing (creepily, I crashed my car the day after he crashed his. and the cop that was on the scene at the time was the same cop who gave me a speeding ticket a month earlier).

I should mention that all these things happened from a general rebellion of authority, a bad childhood, and a rough upbringing. I'm sure most of you are framiliar with the rebellion part, since shrooms are illegal in lots of places, and so is acid, marijuana, etc... I myself have a strong rebellious instinct; and that's partly nature/nurture, and partly that I'm a young adult (18) who refuses to accept blind truth. He is 17 y.o.a.

What's somewhat ironic is that he doesn't (even) smoke pot, and he thinks "drugs" are bad although he agreed to trip with me in the near future a while ago. You can imagine my confused state of mind.

OK, so, I'm looking for advice on what to do here. Obviously a lot of people are going to say not to trip with him, and I'm probably going to agree with that statement. But at the same time, people aren't without flaws. It's just that I don't think I should have to deal with him bringing me down _at all_ during the trip, even if it's that uncomfortable atmosphere not knowing if he's gonna flip out or not.

Thanks.. :smile: 





I think your being WAY to judgmental man, just cause he thinks acid ain?t all that great, doesn?t mean he isn?t good to trip with, just show them how great they are.


Its my personal belief that drugs are put here by God, and as such they are meant for EVERYONE, to say that this guy is good enough and this guy isn?t is really self centered... think of yourself as a teacher, not a partner of him in the trip, and I think it will work out fine.

EDIT: oh and if your really worried about it, give him some shrooms to trip on his own (if you have enough that is) that way, he'll see the power they pocess, and you will be far away.


--------------------
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Edited by Sombie (02/09/03 04:35 PM)


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Invisibletryptamine_skies
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Registered: 01/27/03
Posts: 167
Loc: Hicksville
Re: Tripping with a questionable friend: advice requested. [Re: Sombie]
    #1293877 - 02/09/03 04:39 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

I think your being WAY to judgmental man, just cause he thinks acid ain?t all that great, doesn?t mean he isn?t good to trip with, just show them how great they are.


Its my personal belief that drugs are put here by God, and as such they are meant for EVERYONE, to say that this guy is good enough and this guy isn?t is really self centered... think of yourself as a teacher, not a partner of him in the trip, and I think it will work out fine.
 




I'm not trying to belittle your opinion or anything, but I don't think he's trying to say his friend isn't good enough to trip at all. I think Seeka is just concerned about the impact this person will have on his experience, and there's nothing wrong with that.

Seeka is not exactly in the position to be a 'teacher' as stated before he has very little experience with psychedelics, but it seems to me like he has a healthy ambition to learn. If things got rough, who would be there?

Oh, and that person's view on LSD is certainly twisted and false. How can you NOT think LSD is an amazingly powerful godsent?  :grin: 


--------------------
The most beautiful experience we can have is the mysterious ; it is the fundamental emotion which stands at the cradle of true art and true science.



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