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OfflineComradez
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Registered: 03/21/10
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Did I ruin mimosahuasca for myself henceforth?
    #12881087 - 07/11/10 04:03 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

So my plan for today was to take about 15 grams-equivalent MHRB liquid extract and ~5 grams-equivalent of Syrian Rue seed liquid extract.  This was to be my first oral DMT trip, and first DMT trip in general.  I followed the MAOI diet for about 20 hours beforehand, so what ensued cannot be blamed on any mishap on that account.

Well, I never got around to doing the MHRB part.  Within 15 minutes the Syrian Rue was coming on REALLY strong, stronger than I've ever felt it before from the two previous times that I tried it beforehand.  It eventually got to the point, mentally, of a 3 gram mushroom trip, I'd say.  I had open-eye warping of objects and streaks and ripples of light, and closed-eye visuals so engrossing that I would forget after a while that I had my eyes closed at all.  And some of them were BEAUTIFUL (such as being inside a brilliant transparent tie-dye purple and red submarine and looking out over a deep orange and red jungle), at rare times even overpowering the nausea with feelings of wonder and joy.  It was all VERY dreamlike.  And my thought patterns were going all over the place, stepping me emotionally into all sorts of perspectives and whatnot.  For example, I felt like, by looking at my dog, I could see exactly what he was thinking and feeling moment to moment.  I had one closed eye visual where I was racing down a highway with crystal glass mile markers all along the right-hand side, and every mile marker was a monument to a being in my ancestry, going from mother, to grandmother, to great-grandmother, through many generations of humans (and I could picture of scene of many generations of my ancestors from long ago in Africa probably having gone through what I was going through right now), slowly transitioning to my farther-back ape ancestors, back to my mammal ancestors, back, back, back, all the way to the beginning of life.  Thought patterns raced, doubled back on themselves, and performed all sorts of furious gymnastics.  I got the same uncanny feeling that I was being led to think of certain things because I was sensing some vibe from the future.  (Edit:  I also want to add another realization I had:  What a miracle it is that there is still love in the world!  Because love has to be carried from generation to generation, and there have been so many opportunities for things to go wrong during our existence as a thinking, feeling species.  I felt that every person who conveyed love from their heart in this modern world was a precious jewel.  I also had an interesting take on Cat Steven's song "Sad Lisa."  It struck me as if at first Cat Stevens is playing the part of someone who is taking advantage of the distraught girl's feelings, and then he zooms out to a different, third-person perspective to lament about that, the real tragedy, the fact that this girl is so distraught that she will fall into anyone's hands who puts on a helpful air and says the right convincing, empathetic, wise-sounding words.  This made me chuckle, seeing the song in this new light).  These were the interesting aspects of the trip. 

Mixed in with all of that, though, was me feeling miserably nauseous, throwing up for about three hours, and promising to myself that I would never do this ever again.  I also felt like my heart was pumping hard and beating furiously.  I felt heavy and yet restless.  I couldn't keep my hands, legs, toes, or whole body still for long at all.  I started to get that high-mushroom-dose-trip feeling of estrangement from my body, which normally is merely interesting, but in this case, combined with the nausea, it felt like my body was slipping out of my conscious control.  I lost awareness of strange parts of my body, such as the back of my tongue, and I had the odd sensation that my mouth was filled with some invisible substance.  My skin felt alive with electricity, or perhaps a trillion minuscule flies or molecules buzzing around on the surface, while the bulk of my limbs felt hollow and dead, as if they did not really belong to me, even though I could still make them move.  This kinda unnerved me, and I tried some deep breathing exercises (as it was the one aspect of my body that I still felt I had thorough control over), and it helped some, but not much. 

I felt no nausea the two previous times I tried Syrian Rue (once in liquid extract form, once as dry crystal/gunk extract from the vinegar/salt method).  I assume that this time I just misjudged the dose and ended up doing too much--probably much more than 5 grams after all, because I augmented my almost-5 gram liquid amount with just a bit of dry extraction that I just sorta eyeballed from previous experience with that batch.  Perhaps I hit upon a lopsided lump of harmine/harmaline extract in that tiny piece of crystal/gunk extract that I also took.  I just wanted to make sure that I had enough for the MHRB to work, but it turned out that I didn't get to do the MHRB at all.  There was no way I would have been able to keep it down for even a minute.  I would have started vomiting from the awful taste alone.  It would have been pointless. 

Now my problem is, if that was any indication of what the "mimosahuasca" experience is going to be like, I don't think it could ever be my cup of tea.  "La Purga" would have been alright if it had happened once, followed by the nausea departing, but I kept on feeling nauseous and throwing up for 3 hours.  I felt like anything more intense, either mentally or physically, would have sent me and/or my body over the edge.  Furthermore, now that I am down from the Syrian Rue, even thinking about the taste of that stuff again makes me want to gag.  I don't know if I'll ever be able to get that stuff down now that I've had such a hard experience of tasting it as it was coming up back the other way for 3 hard hours. 

So, have I ruined mimosahuasca for myself?  Does it sound like I'll ever be able to try it (at a much lower dose on the Syrian Rue side to be sure) ever again?

Edited by Comradez (07/11/10 04:23 AM)

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Invisiblemonkeyheaven
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Registered: 07/09/07
Posts: 964
Loc: yonder
Re: Did I ruin mimosahuasca for myself henceforth? [Re: Comradez]
    #12881134 - 07/11/10 04:51 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Maybe too much rue?

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InvisibleReoSpeedwagon153
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Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 2,098
Loc: Chetumal, Mexico
Re: Did I ruin mimosahuasca for myself henceforth? [Re: monkeyheaven]
    #12881899 - 07/11/10 10:52 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Well, rue has some toxicity issues anyway if one does not perform a salt precipitation to remove the unwanted compounds.

A lot of people prefer harmine/thh to harmaline/harmine. Harmaline can be sedating and very nauseating. THH and harmine are much clearer and somewhat stimulating.



Great trip report! Almost makes me want to OD on rue! From what I have read and observed with my friends, rue does not seem to unleash its true psychedelia unless taken in doses high enough to cause extreme nausea.


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“I thought naming myself ‘ReoSpeedwagon153’ on a forum was a funny idea in 2006.”

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OfflineKinichAhau
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Registered: 12/07/09
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Re: Did I ruin mimosahuasca for myself henceforth? [Re: ReoSpeedwagon153]
    #12881939 - 07/11/10 11:05 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

I'll stick with B. Caapi.

OP-if you're worried about MHRB, try a different DMT source.
Otherwise, search for info using gelatin to remove tannins in MHRB-this reduces the amount of nausea you'd feel consuming the brew, and help keep it down more easily.

That said it sounds like you took too much Rue. Try less next time and you should be good to go.


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(Thanks to Sui for letting me use this!)

"....buy small portions of say 1/2 gram...buy from a reliable internet source (they're out there) and store in a cool, dark, secret place"

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Offlinefloatingwater
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Registered: 01/06/09
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Re: Did I ruin mimosahuasca for myself henceforth? [Re: ReoSpeedwagon153]
    #12881948 - 07/11/10 11:08 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Ive read you only really need 2 or 3 grams worth of syrian rue to benefit from its MAOI properties. At that level you shouldn't get much from the rue, but you will be preparing your body for the mimosa.

I've heard good things and bad things about the rue/mimosa combination.

I've heard mostly amazing things about caapi/chacruna(or viridis) which is the more traditional combination.

Also, if you're looking for another angle. I've read that a caapi only experience can be a great way to prepare yourself for ayahuasca.


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OfflineNature Boy
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Re: Did I ruin mimosahuasca for myself henceforth? [Re: Comradez]
    #12881993 - 07/11/10 11:23 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Nice trip report, but the answer to your question is :  TOO MUCH RUE.

There are many alkaloids in rue, and several produce nausea...bad nausea!  Next time, stick with Manske extracted harmaline and forego the rue.

N.B.


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Offlinefloatingwater
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Re: Did I ruin mimosahuasca for myself henceforth? [Re: Nature Boy]
    #12882080 - 07/11/10 11:49 AM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Nature Boy said:
Nice trip report, but the answer to your question is :  TOO MUCH RUE.

There are many alkaloids in rue, and several produce nausea...bad nausea!  Next time, stick with Manske extracted harmaline and forego the rue.

N.B.





Manske extracted?? Is that the vinegar and sodium chloride tek?


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OfflineComradez
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Registered: 03/21/10
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Re: Did I ruin mimosahuasca for myself henceforth? [Re: floatingwater]
    #12882325 - 07/11/10 12:46 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Well, for some reason, now that it has been about 24 hours after doing the rue, my stomach must be even more back to baseline because I can at least contemplate the taste of the rue without wanting to upchuck.  I think I will try it again, this time with half the amount of rue. 

I'm guessing that the perfect amount of rue to do if one is doing rue + mimosa is to get to the point where one feels one's eyes start to perk up and where things start to feel just a bit heavy and dreamy, but before one gets to the point of full-on psychedelic effects from the rue itself.  I've been to that lower level of rue without getting nausea on two occasions, once with liquid, and once with salt precipitation.  I guess I just assumed that, since the effects weren't really that noticeable those two times, that I wasn't doing enough to activate the oral DMT, and that I'd have to do more when I tried it for real. 

I also see that I can buy pure tetrahydroharmine on the web.  Would that be worth it? 

Also, I performed a gelatine extraction of the tannins on the MHRB, so I hope that that should not be a source of nausea when I get around to doing the full monty next time.  Thanks for all of the advice!

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InvisibleReoSpeedwagon153
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Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 2,098
Loc: Chetumal, Mexico
Re: Did I ruin mimosahuasca for myself henceforth? [Re: Comradez]
    #12882632 - 07/11/10 01:47 PM (13 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Comradez said:
Well, for some reason, now that it has been about 24 hours after doing the rue, my stomach must be even more back to baseline because I can at least contemplate the taste of the rue without wanting to upchuck.  I think I will try it again, this time with half the amount of rue. 

I'm guessing that the perfect amount of rue to do if one is doing rue + mimosa is to get to the point where one feels one's eyes start to perk up and where things start to feel just a bit heavy and dreamy, but before one gets to the point of full-on psychedelic effects from the rue itself.  I've been to that lower level of rue without getting nausea on two occasions, once with liquid, and once with salt precipitation.  I guess I just assumed that, since the effects weren't really that noticeable those two times, that I wasn't doing enough to activate the oral DMT, and that I'd have to do more when I tried it for real. 

I also see that I can buy pure tetrahydroharmine on the web.  Would that be worth it? 

Also, I performed a gelatine extraction of the tannins on the MHRB, so I hope that that should not be a source of nausea when I get around to doing the full monty next time.  Thanks for all of the advice!




Perfect amount of un-manske'd syrian rue seeds: 0g.

Do the salt-water extraction, or stick with caapi.

Yes, buying tetrahydroharmine on the web is a :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup: idea!


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“I thought naming myself ‘ReoSpeedwagon153’ on a forum was a funny idea in 2006.”

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