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What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer
    #12867897 -

Evolution theory shows that it is through mutations that organisms change. Their had to have been one final mutation that made the modern chicken what it was today, the first of its species born from a pre-chicken-like species in an egg. Thus we can conclude by logical reduction that the egg came first.

The question always seemed arbitrary to me..


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Orissa India Bulk Grow (Tub Tek)
Bulk Steamer Pasteurizer Tek

"Our intention is our eternal fingerprint in the universe."

We know that God is good, and so are hamburgers and hot dogs. We know that hamburgers and hot dogs definitely do exist, so then by deduction of logic God too must also exist. Hamburgers + Hot dogs = God.... Duh

Edited by Akira (07/08/10 03:08 PM)

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Akira]
    #12867922 -

You are correct. I already knew this, but some people never understand.


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That's me on the street with a violin under my chin. Playing with a grin, singing gibberish.

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Akira]
    #12867962 -

Quote:
Their had to have been one final mutation


Intelligent Designers and other dogmatic fundies would love to hear of such a thing in nature. We haven't found it yet.

Both 'chicken' and 'egg' are arbitrarily distinguished according to characteristics that fit our criteria; meaning, the difference between an egg and a chicken is no more actual than the difference between zygote, fetus, and a baby, as life continually develops along a continuum, with most species--including the microscopic--following a pattern that flows through stages. Where we say one stage ends and another begins is ambiguous. True, we can say for instance that 'day' and 'night' are different categories, but we must also admit our small, biased perspective from one hemisphere on one planet is what generates that perceived difference.

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Arden]
    #12867997 -

I egged the chicken and then I ate his leg

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Solemente]
    #12868052 -

I like Popeye's chicken


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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Akira]
    #12868072 -

The question is better stated as this, "What came first, the chicken or the chicken egg?"

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: ModusPwnd]
    #12868087 -


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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: ModusPwnd]
    #12868099 -

Quote:
ModusPwnd said:
The question is better stated as this, "What came first, the chicken or the chicken egg?"



It still has the same answer, the same logic still applies. The egg that held what we know as a chicken today, before it hatched, had to have been a chicken egg. :-P

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Watchtower]
    #12868117 -

Only if you name an egg for the animal that comes out of it rather then the animal it came out of.

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: ModusPwnd]
    #12868121 -

here's my final answer: WHO GIVES A FUCK! :cool:

good call though :thumbup:


--------------------
i love you ♥

you are beautiful! :rockon:



COME TOGETHER, JOIN THE PARTY!!

"what beith a man if he doth not enjoy cannabis?" :mushroom2:

Edited by owls (07/08/10 03:40 PM)

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: owls]
    #12868139 -

On second thought, Church's Chicken is better.


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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: TrancedShroom]
    #12868150 -

it's way too greasy for me.

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: owls]
    #12868156 -

owls said:
here's my final answer: WHO GIVES A FUCK! :cool:

good call though :thumbup:


typical response of someone who opted out


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My cultivation guide.  How anyone can grow mushrooms. 

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: PreparationH]
    #12868170 -

Quote:
typical response of someone who opted out


:rofl:

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Le_Canard]
    #12868190 -

ToiletDuk said:
it's way too greasy for me.


Then settle for a low carb Kentucky Grilled Chicken.


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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Watchtower]
    #12868352 -

Watchtower said:
Quote:
ModusPwnd said:
The question is better stated as this, "What came first, the chicken or the chicken egg?"



It still has the same answer, the same logic still applies. The egg that held what we know as a chicken today, before it hatched, had to have been a chicken egg. :-P


how can a prechicken lay a chicken egg, it would have been a prechicken egg containing a mutant offspring


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California Has Legalized Child Prostitution

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #12868537 -

Is the chicken egg different from the pre chicken egg?:shrug:


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Orissa India Bulk Grow (Tub Tek)
Bulk Steamer Pasteurizer Tek

"Our intention is our eternal fingerprint in the universe."

We know that God is good, and so are hamburgers and hot dogs. We know that hamburgers and hot dogs definitely do exist, so then by deduction of logic God too must also exist. Hamburgers + Hot dogs = God.... Duh

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Akira]
    #12868728 -

What do you think the pre-chicken tasted like?


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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: CosmicFool]
    #12868737 -

CosmicFool said:
What do you think the pre-chicken tasted like?


eggs over easy


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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Akira]
    #12868743 -

Prisoner#1 said:
Watchtower said:
Quote:
ModusPwnd said:
The question is better stated as this, "What came first, the chicken or the chicken egg?"



It still has the same answer, the same logic still applies. The egg that held what we know as a chicken today, before it hatched, had to have been a chicken egg. :-P


how can a prechicken lay a chicken egg, it would have been a prechicken egg containing a mutant offspring


This is true, though really the difference between the pre-chicken and the modern chicken would've been small enough to make zero difference to the shell. I figure the chicken egg has been around much longer than the modern chicken, seeing as dinosaurs laid eggs as well, giving the egg idea a couple million years to continue to develop before we had even protochickens. Also, depends whether you name it for the creature that made the egg (protochicken) or for what the egg contains (modern chicken).

Akira said:
Is the chicken egg different from the pre chicken egg?:shrug:


Exactly. Protochickens were also laying eggs, I figure the mechanism for that had been established before the minor changes that make up a modern chicken took place.

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Watchtower]
    #12868884 -

Somewhere in Africa our black ancestors are buried along with pre-chicken bones; geological indication of a long standing affinity for this yard bird.

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Arden]
    #12868908 -

Arden said:
Somewhere in Africa our black ancestors are buried along with pre-chicken bones; geological indication of a long standing affinity for this yard bird.


what are you trying to say?
are they buried with watermelon seeds and empty 40's too?
:macdre:


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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: CosmicFool]
    #12868935 -

Quote:
what are you trying to say?
are they buried with watermelon seeds and empty 40's too?


According to the History channel, I'm afraid so.

Which came first, the 40 or the hoodlum?

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Akira]
    #12869043 -

Akira said:
Is the chicken egg different from the pre chicken egg?:shrug:


of course




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California Has Legalized Child Prostitution

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Arden]
    #12869953 -

Arden said:
Quote:
what are you trying to say?


Which came first, the 40 or the hoodlum?




LOL


Hey Watchtower you made some great points about the egg had been part of organic life long before the chicken. Im sure the chicken has significantly changed genetically since we first labled it the chicken, with all those hormones and selective breeding.


Aden about the pre chicken in Africa, that is very interesting. That means homosapiens have been raising chicken in captivity as part of a food source for a very long time.


--------------------

Orissa India Bulk Grow (Tub Tek)
Bulk Steamer Pasteurizer Tek

"Our intention is our eternal fingerprint in the universe."

We know that God is good, and so are hamburgers and hot dogs. We know that hamburgers and hot dogs definitely do exist, so then by deduction of logic God too must also exist. Hamburgers + Hot dogs = God.... Duh

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Akira]
    #12869982 -

Quote:
That means homosapiens have been raising chicken in captivity as part of a food source for a very long time.



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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Akira]
    #12870415 -

Akira said:
Arden said:
Quote:
what are you trying to say?


Which came first, the 40 or the hoodlum?




LOL


Hey Watchtower you made some great points about the egg had been part of organic life long before the chicken. Im sure the chicken has significantly changed genetically since we first labled it the chicken, with all those hormones and selective breeding.


Aden about the pre chicken in Africa, that is very interesting. That means homosapiens have been raising chicken in captivity as part of a food source for a very long time.


True, but the modern chicken doesn't even resemble the normal chicken 100 years ago, for starters.

It's like weed through history, we've selectively bred it for certain benefits for thousands of years, I figure any change in the egg for as long as we've been breeding them, has been in adaptation to other changes we bred into them, like more meat, growing faster and bigger (thicker shells, quicker hatching times, etc.). Our ancestors would probably shit themselves if they saw a modern chicken. :lol:

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Watchtower]
    #12870623 -

I always found this question to be stupid, and of course trivially easy. Of course "the" egg predates the chicken! duh!

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: antiPock]
    #12871673 -

I figured this one out when I was high once, using a different argument.  Then I lost it...

Cool Story Hansel


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All posts I make are completely fictional.

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Watchtower]
    #12871752 -

Watchtower said:
True, but the modern chicken doesn't even resemble the normal chicken 100 years ago, for starters.


that's absolutely incorrect because the primitive ancestor of the
domesticated chicken is still alive and well, it's known as the red
jungle fowl and is found throughout asia where the chicken originated



this is the brown leghorn... notice there's little difference



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California Has Legalized Child Prostitution

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Akira]
    #12871941 -

If presented with an egg and told it was laid by a Greater Crested Shroomhen, but what came out was a new species Lesser Crested Shroomhen due to a genetic mutation, is the egg that it hatched from a greater or lesser crested shroomhen egg?

Or something.


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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Jackal]
    #12872136 -

the egg was created by the greater therefor the egg would be the greater,
the offspring would be a mutation of the parents assuming the parents were
both from the species of the greater


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California Has Legalized Child Prostitution

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #12872188 -

Q: "What came first, the chicken or the egg?"

A1: Chicken
A2: Egg
A3: Darwinian Evolution by Natural Selection

A3 :thumbup:

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Akira]
    #12872255 -

Actuality exceeds potentiality.

The chicken came first, as the egg is only a potential chicken.


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Ratings are bullshit, opt out...
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/10525736#10525736

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: stedenko]
    #12872334 -

stedenko said:
Actuality exceeds potentiality.

The chicken came first, as the egg is only a potential chicken.


This would be true assuming you believed in creationism where the chicken simply came into existence out of nowhere one day!

Genesis 2:2 And on the 7th day God made the chicken. And then he cooked that shit and fried it and God said, "Chicken is good."
:pope:


--------------------

Orissa India Bulk Grow (Tub Tek)
Bulk Steamer Pasteurizer Tek

"Our intention is our eternal fingerprint in the universe."

We know that God is good, and so are hamburgers and hot dogs. We know that hamburgers and hot dogs definitely do exist, so then by deduction of logic God too must also exist. Hamburgers + Hot dogs = God.... Duh

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Akira]
    #12872374 -

Akira said:
stedenko said:
Actuality exceeds potentiality.

The chicken came first, as the egg is only a potential chicken.


This would be true assuming you believed in creationism where the chicken simply came into existence out of nowhere one day!



no I can see where he's coming from, if a pullet lays an egg the egg
could hatch to be either the same as the parent or have the mutation
that makes it a chicken, the potential to be either but the problem is
that egg still came first


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California Has Legalized Child Prostitution

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Akira]
    #12872389 -

Quote:
The chicken came first, as the egg is only a potential chicken


And that chicken came from where?

This joke is so universally puzzling because it screws up the overly simplistic way that we divide up space and time.


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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #12873848 -

Prisoner#1 said:
the egg was created by the greater therefor the egg would be the greater,
the offspring would be a mutation of the parents assuming the parents were
both from the species of the greater


I think cloning my disagree with that.
Now I'll admit I know very little of the cloning process but...

my understanding is
you can take an egg (a single large cell) remove the DNA of one animal (animal A)
replace the DNA of another animal (animal B)
reinsert the egg into animal A,B or even C
and wind up with animal B

now assuming I'm not entirely off my mark, it's doesn't sound like it matters which animal the egg comes out of but rather which animals DNA was contained inside the egg.


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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: CosmicFool]
    #12873871 -

since chickens have no thumbs and a brain the size of a peanut, it might be difficult for them to start cloning


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California Has Legalized Child Prostitution

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Akira]
    #12898006 -

bump

Scientists solve chicken and egg riddle*
By Hilary Whiteman, CNN
July 14, 2010

Editor's Note: *Maybe

London, England (CNN) -- Researchers in Britain have been credited with cracking the age-old conundrum about the chicken and the egg. But are they right?

After the publication of the rather dry-sounding scientific paper, "Structural Control of Crystal Nuclei by an Eggshell Protein," press headlines proclaimed the answer was... the chicken.

However, one of the paper's lead authors, Colin Freeman, from the University of Sheffield in northern England, told CNN that the result was not as conclusive as it seemed.

"I would argue that the concept of an eggshell came about way before the chicken, it's dinosaur or even pre-dinosaur thing. That's something to talk to an evolutionary biologist about probably," he said.

So how did a paper about "crystal nuclei" become proof that the chicken pre-dated the egg?

Freeman and his team, which included colleagues from the University of Warwick, were researching a protein found in eggshells called ovocledidin-17. It is also found in chickens' ovaries, but until the team's research its purpose was not clear.

Using Britain's national supercomputer, a machine dubbed HECToR based in Edinburgh, Scotland, they were able to simulate the process of biomineralization, or the production of minerals or solid materials inside organisms.

It was a world first and revealed that one potential purpose of the protein ovocledidin-17 is to speed up the production of eggshell within the chicken so that in 24 hours an egg is ready to be laid.

"What we have really identified is that the protein seems to accelerate the crystallization process so it can make that eggshell appear far quicker. In simple terms it accelerates calcite formation," Freeman said.

They also found that the egg can't be produced without the protein ovocledidin-17 in the chickens' ovaries, so that means that the chicken must have come first. Right?

"Obviously, it's not really what we were trying to get out of our simulations, but it's an interesting question isn't it?" Freeman said.

Rather than putting an end to bickering over the true order of the egg, the researchers were trying to understand more about how shell is formed so that they can apply their findings in other disciplines, including medicine.

"The quote my colleague John Harding always says is, 'could we ever be as clever as algae?'" Freeman said.

"They produce these wonderful shells that protect them in the North Sea. That crystal structure is far in advance of anything that we as humans can create in the lab," Freeman said, adding, "We can't make a human skeleton in the lab..."

Perhaps one day they will be able to. And perhaps one day someone will conclusively put an end to the argument -- was it the chicken or the egg?

http://www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/europe/07/14/england.chicken.egg.riddle/index.html?iref=NS1


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    classic LOVELINE

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #12898016 -

I just stumbled upon this article, published yesterday. But it still doesn't account for where the goddamn chicken came from, if not an egg. :crankey:

------------

'The chicken came first, not the egg', scientists prove
It’s an age-old puzzle that’s stumped generations of scientists.

http://www.metro.co.uk/news/835020-the-chicken-came-first-not-the-egg-scientists-prove

Eggs came after chickens... and that's a fact
But now they believe they have cracked the conundrum of what came first: the chicken or the egg.
British researchers say the chicken must have come first as the formation of eggs is only possible thanks to a protein found in the chicken’s ovaries.
‘It had long been suspected that the egg came first but now we have the scientific proof that shows that in fact the chicken came first,’ said Dr Colin Freeman, from Sheffield University, who worked with counterparts at Warwick University.
‘The protein had been identified before and it was linked to egg formation but by examining it closely we have been able to see how it controls the process,’ he added.
The protein – called ovocledidin-17 (OC-17) – acts as a catalyst to speed up the development of the shell.
Scientists used a super computer called HECToR, based in Edinburgh, to ‘zoom in’ on the formation of an egg.
It showed OC-17 was crucial in kick-starting crystallisation – the early stages of forming a shell.
The protein coverts calcium carbonate into calcite crystals which makes up the egg shell, creating six grammes of shell every 24 hours.
Prof John Harding, also of Sheffield University, said the discovery could have other uses.
‘Understanding how chickens make shells is fascinating in itself but can also give clues towards designing new materials,’ he said.
Next challenge: Why did the chicken cross the road?

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. [Re: Arden]
    #12899952 -

.


--------------------
This is the strangest life I've ever known.

Edited by scruffymafia (06/22/20 02:56 AM)

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: scruffymafia]
    #12900000 -

i'd think chickens would have evolved from reptiles which lay eggs which evolved from certain fish which lay eggs which evolved from bacteria


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ONE-EYED WANT
-------------------------
knock a hoe out this dimension, continue my ascension
-bhad bhabie
rip. todcasil, acid sloth, st1llnox, shLong, ModestMouse, vinsue, big worm (sketch), tim

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Envix]
    #12904070 -

Quote:
British researchers say the chicken must have come first as the formation of eggs is only possible thanks to a protein found in the chicken’s ovaries.
‘It had long been suspected that the egg came first but now we have the scientific proof that shows that in fact the chicken came first,’ said Dr Colin Freeman, from Sheffield University, who worked with counterparts at Warwick University.


The point is that a "pre-chicken" like species gave birth to an egg with a mutated offspring which we now call the modern "chicken".

Unless you disagree with evolution, the fucking egg came first. How does that not make sense? Their is no further argument only silly philosophical presuppositions from hence forth.


--------------------

Orissa India Bulk Grow (Tub Tek)
Bulk Steamer Pasteurizer Tek

"Our intention is our eternal fingerprint in the universe."

We know that God is good, and so are hamburgers and hot dogs. We know that hamburgers and hot dogs definitely do exist, so then by deduction of logic God too must also exist. Hamburgers + Hot dogs = God.... Duh

Edited by Akira (07/15/10 07:21 PM)

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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: Akira]
    #12908788 -

The battle rages


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Re: What Came First: The Chicken or the Egg - Final Answer [Re: CosmicFool]
    #12919909 -

Just bumped into this:


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