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InvisibleCracka_X
Spiritual Dirt Worshipper
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Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/25/03
Posts: 8,808
Loc: Swamp
Re: datura [Re: EvilGir]
    #1293711 - 02/09/03 01:39 PM (21 years, 16 days ago)

And if not in a hospital most likely in jail and you'll come to when your sitting in court not knowing what the fuck is going on and being accused of prowling.


--------------------
The best way to live
is to be like water
For water benefits all things
and goes against none of them
It provides for all people
and even cleanses those places
a man is loath to go
In this way it is just like Tao        ~Daodejing


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OfflineAudi0
have ur cake andbeat it 2
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Registered: 06/27/02
Posts: 10,334
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Re: datura [Re: Cracka_X]
    #1294508 - 02/09/03 06:19 PM (21 years, 16 days ago)

i walked in a store wearing just my boxers and mumbling about buying a new playstation game. or thats what my friend told me happened later. i know i went in the store and did something bc they look at me funny now


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: datura [Re: Audi0]
    #1310859 - 02/16/03 02:10 AM (21 years, 9 days ago)


Datura can be handled, but it is highly potent and very easy to overdo. If allowed to return to the land of Psychedelix I'll post about my findings a few months from now. No PMs about this, please, but if used correctly the amount needed usually lies around 1/50-1/25 of a single gram with a max. dose of 1/20 gram and a ceiling of 1/10! gram of dried leaf, flower or seed. You've read me right, that's the 20-100mg range. Teaspoons & thimbles can kill and madden, trust the Wiccan on this.

When your mouth dries up... you took too much
When you get OEVs... you took too much
When your CEVs exceed those of 1gr of decent Shrooms... you took too much
When strong emotions develop... you took too much
When you want something other than subtle... Datura is the WRONG DRUG.

Datura is for Spiritual Seekers only, since only a Spiritual quest is important enough to enter Atropia and only the Spiritually inclined can find anything of value there worth taking this kind of risks. Scopolamine and Hyoscyamine are SERIOUS Entities, toying with them is toying with your health.
You have been warned.


--------------------
Omnicyclion.org
higher knowledge starts here


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OfflinePsilocybeingzz
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Re: datura [Re: Cherk]
    #1313145 - 02/17/03 02:19 AM (21 years, 8 days ago)

Quote:

Datura's not a drug, it's makes you delerious. 



YES ! :blush: 


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OfflineSuperunknown
Stranger

Registered: 10/14/02
Posts: 208
Last seen: 20 years, 1 month
Re: datura [Re: Psilocybeingzz]
    #1313586 - 02/17/03 07:55 AM (21 years, 8 days ago)

I was on a relatively small dose and it was not enjoyable at all. I dont really find any recreational use in this plant at all.

-Chris


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Anonymous

Re: datura [Re: EvilGir]
    #1313676 - 02/17/03 08:42 AM (21 years, 8 days ago)

For a good lesson about Datur yall should read Carlos Castaneda's books
The Teachings of Don Juan: A Yaqui Way of Knowledge.  Good Good book
peace :grin:


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OfflineMitchnast
Toadmonger
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Posts: 8,656
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Re: datura [Re: EvilGir]
    #1315348 - 02/17/03 06:51 PM (21 years, 8 days ago)

Quote:

But if you want to take it just make sure you have some fly agaric for antidote just in case of od.




fly agaric is too low in muscarine to be an effective antidote to atropine poisoning.
youed poison yourself worse on the muscimol/ ibotenic acid, before you got enough muscarine out of the mushroom.

youed be looking for more of an inocybe or clitocybe, but be warned muscarine is as poisonous as atropine, seldom do either lead to death. and oddly enough they negate each other if taken in even quantity.
still, the idea of using a poisonous, potentiall deadly mushroom to cure the effects of a poisonous, potentially deadly plant. all in the name of cheap recreational intoxication....
hmmm, thats like dancing on libras balance under he sword of damecles over hell while playing russian roullette with a psychic ghost and smoking an immaginary ciggarette with the worst cottonmouth of your life.


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: datura [Re: Mitchnast]
    #1315713 - 02/18/03 12:47 AM (21 years, 7 days ago)

Worse still...

Before Muscimol/Ibotenic Acid were identified it was designated the name "Pilzatropin", German for "Mushroom Atropine". Muscimol is an anticholinergic just like Hyoscyamine and Scopolamine, it just has less peripheral (side) effects.

Should one use Fly Agaric in the case of Tropane poisoning, one would effectively worsen the delirium and enhance the risk for coma & respiratory depression which generally are the killers in Tropane poisoning.

So... In fact Datura and Fly Agaric basically boil down to Anticholinergic Delirium. The safest of both would be Fly Agaric, but slightly high doses of it can plunge you in a coma too.
Anticholinergics are among the most dangerous psychotropix because they're easily misused and as far as I know they're the substances surrounded by the most (dangerous) misinformation.



--------------------
Omnicyclion.org
higher knowledge starts here


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Invisiblewhiterasta
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Registered: 04/09/02
Posts: 1,780
Loc: Oregon
Re: datura [Re: Asante]
    #1315758 - 02/18/03 01:43 AM (21 years, 7 days ago)

Wiccan is 100% right on! The Dark ones are only to be approached with training and caution.They can in fact, Take over your mind so all of his indications for use are correct to prevent unwanted intrusion by a very dark controlling plant (I do not use the term ally for Datura,it is much more making a bargain with the Dark for any insight recieved.
WS Please stay away from this Majick,it is directly working through your "heart energy" Stay with the benevolent teachers such as S/P,fungi,and peyote.Ask them for healing for your heart once you regain strength.If your asking is sincere healing will come(perhaps not physical miracles but certainly spiritual).
Bon Chance WR


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To old for this place


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Anonymous

Re: datura [Re: whiterasta]
    #1316346 - 02/18/03 08:19 AM (21 years, 7 days ago)

word


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InvisibleLazerouth
Drunkard

Registered: 10/15/00
Posts: 1,091
Loc: England
Re: datura [Re: ]
    #1324260 - 02/21/03 07:10 AM (21 years, 4 days ago)

jesus the man asked for some seeds not a lecture.

we all know datura is bad yes? im sure he's heard this all before.


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OfflineMitchnast
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Re: datura [Re: Asante]
    #1325577 - 02/21/03 09:01 PM (21 years, 4 days ago)

tropane related deaths i would think would result more likely from heart failure, dehydration, and/or hyperthermia.
coma would be the result of the latter two effects, or a complication of the first (or all three)

respiratory depression would be so far down the line that it would be the LEAST of your troubles.

mucarine is ALSO a mushroom-atropine.
or at least thats what i was told by some guy.
it just so happens to be the antidote to plant-based atropine....
i dont know all the details, but i do know that if i was ever stupid enough to eat too much datura, i wouldnt be smart enough to doll out my own dosage of potentially deadly-toxic mushrooms.

oh yesssss, and i have some seedlings going of the double queen variety.
the pack says burgmansia. but by the picture i tend to dissaggree. looks like dature (the herb) to me as opposed to tree-like burgmansia.


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: datura [Re: Mitchnast]
    #1325616 - 02/21/03 09:53 PM (21 years, 3 days ago)

True, in the depressant stage of lethal Atropine poisoning the heart gives out OR the respiration goes, according to my sources. The stimulant phase of the Hyoscyamine/Atropine is followed by a depressant one. In Scopolamine/Atroscine it usually is the only phase, unless extreme doses are taken. It's this depressant phase that causes the coma. (CNS Depression + Exhaustion)

Muscarine is a Cholinergic, the exact opposite of an Anticholinergic, but it is no exact match. It is a quaternary amine, which means it's highly active against peripheral symptoms, but does nothing against the central Tropane effects.

The correct amount of homogenized Datura combined with correct quantities of homogenized Inocybe opens the gates to Atropia wide with very little side-effects. Only 2 things, tho: Since both are highly toxic, one has to be an expert herbalist to balance this out. Secondly, an expert herbalist wouldn't DREAM of opening the gates of Atropia to the extent that this would be needed.

I can't stress enough: Datura is EXTREMELY DANGEROUS, Physically, Psychologically and Spiritually, but with strict precautions it can be handled. Any dose that gives rise to "cottonmouth" or the
"Hot as a Hare, Red as a Beet, Dry as a Bone, Mad as a Wet Hen"
symptoms signals you've taken a seriously dangerous dose & this includes OEV in the light.


--------------------
Omnicyclion.org
higher knowledge starts here


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Offlinerhizo
herb eater
Registered: 10/31/02
Posts: 599
Loc: Superposition of possible...
Last seen: 5 years, 5 months
Re: datura [Re: Asante]
    #1325661 - 02/21/03 10:53 PM (21 years, 3 days ago)

it sounds like you're saying that OEVs would indicate that one has taken too much. What really, is too much?


*note* I have no experience with this plant/entity


--------------------
An optimist is never pleasantly surprised.


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: datura [Re: rhizo]
    #1325704 - 02/22/03 12:01 AM (21 years, 3 days ago)

I ment to say precisely that :grin:

What IS too much? Hmm... exact amounts would not do, because some people are WAY more/less sensitive than others to the Visionary Tropanes. The best gouge would be the intensity of effects you experience.
My old, old medical books pin the maximal medical doses of Datura Stramonium (That's Hyoscyamine-based) between 50-200mg. This means that most people can manage these amounts without serious side effects. Please note -most- in that. The average max. is 100mg, and here usually saliva starts to dry up in most.

Teaspoons & thimbles reccommended at Erowid by dumbass users may kill and madden, I've said that before. Doses of 2.5mg Hyoscyamine, 5mg Atropine and/or 1mg of Scopolamine tend to be harmful and acutely toxic in -most cases-. But in alot of cases alot less can do alot of damage.
Each individual is unique. One man's high makes another man die.



 


--------------------
Omnicyclion.org
higher knowledge starts here


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Offlinegnrm23
Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 08/29/99
Posts: 6,488
Loc: n. e. OH, USSA
Last seen: 4 months, 15 days
Re: datura [Re: Asante]
    #1325854 - 02/22/03 03:49 AM (21 years, 3 days ago)

aren't there recipes that use monkshood as an admixture to tropanaceous flying ointments? aconite or aconitine ?
(a reputed european expert on flying-ointments died a few years ago from rubbing some medicated goo on his body, so... exercise caution, eh? even people who "know what they are doing" can run into trouble with these plants...)


--------------------
old enough to know better
not old enough to care


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InvisibleLazerouth
Drunkard

Registered: 10/15/00
Posts: 1,091
Loc: England
Re: datura [Re: gnrm23]
    #1326262 - 02/22/03 08:59 AM (21 years, 3 days ago)

grnm yes monkshood foxglove datura mandrake belladonna henbane all sorts went into those nutty potions


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: datura [Re: gnrm23]
    #1327637 - 02/22/03 10:18 PM (21 years, 2 days ago)

Indeed.
But aconitine is soooo dangerous, way more so than Muscarine. Aconite (Aconitum Napellus) would be used to counteract heart effects, but it's main ingredient is on the more toxic end of the plant toxin spectrum.

Again: Anyone who NEEDS antidotes in the mix is on the wrong path.
Most "recipies" I've seen were made up by people that didn't really understand the matter they wrote on. In Atropia getting fucked up generally means getting fucked over.


--------------------
Omnicyclion.org
higher knowledge starts here


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Offlinecanid
irregular meat sprocket
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Re: datura [Re: Asante]
    #1327675 - 02/22/03 10:35 PM (21 years, 2 days ago)

Quote:


In Atropia getting fucked up generally means getting fucked over.




that's themost fitting explanation i've heard yet.


--------------------



Attn PWN hunters: If you should come across a bluing Psilocybe matching P. pellicolusa please smell it.
If you detect a scent reminiscent of Anethole (anise) please preserve a specimen or two for study and please PM me.


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OfflineRoger_irrelevant
War's boring,change thechannel!

Registered: 11/22/01
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Re: datura [Re: canid]
    #1513842 - 05/02/03 01:56 AM (20 years, 9 months ago)

So may warnings yet people still feel they NEED to mess with this stuff...i dont understand?


--------------------
We are the music makers, We are the dreamers of dreams...


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