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InvisibleTinMan
Stranger

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 2,956
Loc: Russia
Best Casing Type
    #1261501 - 01/30/03 11:00 AM (14 years, 2 months ago)

I've tried straight verm casings before with absolutely no luck at all. I'm about to start a new grow and I'm wondering what the best type of P. cubensis casing is for beginners? I have access to verm among some other things, but I don't wanna get into millet, poo, or anything else like that yet.


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Offlineflawed
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Registered: 10/31/02
Posts: 87
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 14 years, 1 month
Re: Best Casing Type [Re: TinMan]
    #1261637 - 01/30/03 11:44 AM (14 years, 2 months ago)

yes, that's a good suggestion. i've done coco coir (bed-a-beast) mixed with vermiculite.. i used a 50/50 ratio though and added some crushed oyster shells. it works great.. you could leave out oyster shells if you want.

also, i add a thin layer of straight vermiculite at the bottom of the casing to make sure water doesn't collect under the mycelium. although that isn't likely to happen, so you could leave that out as well.


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OfflineNorthernsoul
Your Reality

Registered: 11/17/01
Posts: 2,290
Loc: Inner Eye
Last seen: 6 years, 4 months
Re: Best Casing Type [Re: TinMan]
    #1261649 - 01/30/03 11:49 AM (14 years, 2 months ago)

Hmmm, no luck at all huh?? Did yoiu ever investigate why you didnt have any luck with that? Maybe it was t0oo wet or something? No poit going into something more difficult if you cvant get plain old verm to work


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OfflineHexum311
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Registered: 12/11/02
Posts: 120
Loc: NOYFB (new state)
Last seen: 14 years, 1 month
Re: Best Casing Type [Re: flawed]
    #1261803 - 01/30/03 12:45 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

i've done coco coir (bed-a-beast) mixed with vermiculite.. i used a 50/50 ratio though and added some crushed oyster shells. it works great




What is the PH of coco coir ? I am about to case some poo using 60/40 verm coco, was just wondering if its necissary to adjust the ph balance like when using peat/verm...


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"The shade is a tool, a device, a saviors seceret try... and look up to the sky..... but my eyes burn"
-Chino Moreno, the Deftones
peace
-Hex


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InvisibleTinMan
Stranger

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 2,956
Loc: Russia
Re: Best Casing Type [Re: Northernsoul]
    #1261820 - 01/30/03 12:49 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

Maybe it was too wet, but either way I didn't see any mycelium poking through the surface. Where might I be looking for when buying coco-coir specifically as an ingredient?


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OfflineFanaTEK
Slave to theShroom

Registered: 09/19/01
Posts: 447
Loc: Midwest, US
Last seen: 10 years, 1 month
Re: Best Casing Type [Re: TinMan]
    #1261866 - 01/30/03 01:11 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that 70/30 Cactus Soil/Vermiculite is my favorite. Whatever kind of organic material Shutlz puts into their stuff, the mushies just eat it right up!

FanaTEK


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InvisibleSixTango
Mycota

Registered: 01/21/02
Posts: 1,996
Loc: A little North of Paradis...
Re: Best Casing Type [Re: TinMan]
    #1261882 - 01/30/03 01:17 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

Casing material pH & why it is important.

"pH", is a measure to describe the acidity of a medium. pH 7 is neutral; higher means alkaline, lower acidic.

Peat is a major constituent of preferred casing mixes. The pH of peat is variable, dependent on the source it came from. Meaning, the pH of peat differs from various sources.

The preferred pH range of a casing mixture is 6.5 to 8. 7.5 is optimal. Peat is acidic. Consequently, to achieve an optimal pH range of a casing mix, the pH of the casing mixture must be adjusted accordingly (within the range of 6.5 to 8).

The pH of the casing must be within certain limits to support strong mycelial growth. An overly acidic or alkaline casing mixture will depress mycelial growth and supports unwanted competitors.

It is generally easier to make casing materials more alkaline (i.e., increasing the pH) than it is to make them more acid (i.e., reducing the pH).

A movement of 0.5 is easy but, because the pH scale is logarithmic, a movement on the order of, 2.0 points becomes more difficult because there is a factor of 10x between each full point, so pH 5.0 is actually 100 times more acid than pH 7.0.

There are several common types of lime available for use, though care should be exercised with all of the products. Lime is caustic and a skin and eye irritant and can be dangerous if misused. If you choose to use such products, carefully read and follow all manufacturer directions exactly. The major types of lime products include:

Hydrated Lime: fast acting, but not long lasting. It is very effective to produce a fast change in pH level. It is also the "strongest" form of lime generally available, and you must follow all manufacturer precautions, since your skin and eyes can be easily irritated or burned if the product is misused.

Ground Limestone: a naturally occurring type of limestone that has been ground to a fine powder. How quickly it will act to modify pH and how long it will persist depends on how finely it was ground.

Generally, ground limestone is weaker than hydrated lime, needing about 30% more to raise the pH by the same amount. It has the advantage, however, of usually being significantly cheaper than the hydrated lime, and usually works more slowly and lasts much longer.

Mixed Lime: usually sold under a brand name. Most brands contain a variety of particle sizes to provide some immediate benefits, as well as a longer persistence. (this is often referred to as "time released" lime).

pH gradually falls to less than optimal by the end of cropping due to acids secreted by the mushroom mycelium. Consequently, a long lasting buffering agent is preferable.

If you wish to achieve optimal results, when adjusting pH? It is highly advisable to use litmus strips (with color chart), or acquire a pH test probe (available at most garden supply stores, under $20) to accurately test, and adjust the pH of your casing mix, prior to application.

Doing all other cultivation steps properly. Then, applying a casing mixture outside the proper pH range, most often creates poor cropping results.


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~whiskey river rafting, hot tubbing, dirty dancing & spending money on - wild women - having fun & just gonna waste the rest~


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OfflineFanaTEK
Slave to theShroom

Registered: 09/19/01
Posts: 447
Loc: Midwest, US
Last seen: 10 years, 1 month
Re: Best Casing Type [Re: SixTango]
    #1261916 - 01/30/03 01:30 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

Here's a question: On average, how much would you say the mycelium changes the acidity of the casing material during its lifecycle? What I mean is, if I put a casing layer on with a Ph of 7, but during the course of colonization and fruiting the acid secretion changes the Ph by 2 points, then the mycelium has created an unfriendly environment for itself. If 7.5 is an optimal level, shouldn't one aim for something around 8 to allow some extra alkalinity?

Just a thought.

FanaTEK


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InvisibleSixTango
Mycota

Registered: 01/21/02
Posts: 1,996
Loc: A little North of Paradis...
Re: Best Casing Type [Re: FanaTEK]
    #1262268 - 01/30/03 03:41 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

All IMHO,

A substrate pH should range from 7 to 8. A casing layer should be close to 7.5.

8 will work, but you are getting close to the edge of the upper limit. Step over the limit, even a tiny bit & you inhibit pinning ability.

As mycelium consumes a cased substrate there will be a drop of pH from the excreted metabolites until the pH reaches 5.0-5.5 at which time mushroom production will generally cease.

6T (aka Mycota)


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~whiskey river rafting, hot tubbing, dirty dancing & spending money on - wild women - having fun & just gonna waste the rest~


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OfflineSquid
withdrawn fromthe everdayworld

Registered: 03/26/02
Posts: 323
Last seen: 7 years, 9 months
Re: Best Casing Type [Re: SixTango]
    #1262296 - 01/30/03 03:49 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

nobody answered the question " does coco coir need to be ph ajusted"


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A new type of thinking is essential if mankind is to survive and move towards higher levels. -A. Einstein


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InvisibleSixTango
Mycota

Registered: 01/21/02
Posts: 1,996
Loc: A little North of Paradis...
Re: Best Casing Type [Re: Squid]
    #1262305 - 01/30/03 03:52 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

nobody answered the question " does coco coir need to be ph ajusted"




Yo................it would depend on the pH of it.

6T


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~whiskey river rafting, hot tubbing, dirty dancing & spending money on - wild women - having fun & just gonna waste the rest~


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InvisibleVoodoo
Stranger

Registered: 12/30/02
Posts: 428
Post deleted by MOE THE MAD SCIENTIST [Re: SixTango]
    #1265388 - 01/31/03 11:44 AM (14 years, 2 months ago)



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http://www.nramembership.org/


Edited by Voodoo (02/15/03 11:50 PM)


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InvisibleSixTango
Mycota

Registered: 01/21/02
Posts: 1,996
Loc: A little North of Paradis...
Re: Best Casing Type [Re: Voodoo]
    #1265410 - 01/31/03 11:51 AM (14 years, 2 months ago)

Not on the "brain". In the casing mix. Long ago, my first bulk substrates -- went pefect, until I added a casing coverfrom a tek -- said to be good. Then, they F/U. Ph was off. So, I just figured out -- how to fix it.
6T (aka (Mycota)


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~whiskey river rafting, hot tubbing, dirty dancing & spending money on - wild women - having fun & just gonna waste the rest~


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