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Icelander
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Have you ever considered.
#12609022 - 05/22/10 10:45 AM (13 years, 10 months ago) |
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All the great spiritual teachers and great philosophers and such may only be understanding a tiny portion of what the universe really is about. It could be vast beyond their truest understanding just as possibly they know some things beyond our understanding.
Maybe we, as humans, and as minds, and as consciousness, were never designed to know the whole and it's not possible.
So without being able to know the whole we might be only best guessing about the meaning of things, or the goals, or anything really.
Have you ever considered that? Shit when I get high I seem to consider everything. That's why I can't be sure of anything.
Sorry if there are misspellings, my spell check seems to have checked out.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
Edited by Icelander (05/22/10 10:45 AM)
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c0sm0nautt
Registered: 05/19/08
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Re: Have you ever considered. [Re: Icelander]
#12609051 - 05/22/10 10:51 AM (13 years, 10 months ago) |
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I think you are on to something. I think what a lot of spiritual teachings are is that we can't know any truth through convention, and ultimate truth is non-existent. Therefore, the only way to bypass this paradox is to become the truth, not understand it. Like I said, it's futile to try and put the idea into words.
It's the whole 'the map is not the territory' idea.
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g00ru
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Re: Have you ever considered. [Re: c0sm0nautt]
#12609092 - 05/22/10 10:59 AM (13 years, 10 months ago) |
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Yeah but in that case I'll use Occam's razor. Maybe there is crazy shit going on that we literally can't understand. But for all intents and purposes, if we cannot ever perceive it and it doesn't effect us, then it doesn't exist. And if we can't perceive it directly but it does effect us, then I think most spiritual masters are probably aware of it.
This line of thinking is really better for something like Physics though, where mental understanding is key, rather than spirituality, which like Cosmonaut said can really be viewed as a process of becoming rather than understanding.
-------------------- check out my music! drowse in prison and your waking will be but loss
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Icelander
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Re: Have you ever considered. [Re: g00ru]
#12609148 - 05/22/10 11:14 AM (13 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
guruu said: Yeah but in that case I'll use Occam's razor. Maybe there is crazy shit going on that we literally can't understand. But for all intents and purposes, if we cannot ever perceive it and it doesn't effect us, then it doesn't exist. And if we can't perceive it directly but it does effect us, then I think most spiritual masters are probably aware of it.
This line of thinking is really better for something like Physics though, where mental understanding is key, rather than spirituality, which like Cosmonaut said can really be viewed as a process of becoming rather than understanding.
Well I've used that razor on the whole spiritual mystique. And so far it doesnt' exist for me. Wish like hell it did. But I'm a very logical person and logic is part at least of how I approach all experience. And it would be impossible imo to really know what spiritual masters are aware of with out being one. Because if you are going by the things they say then you are using your logical mind to evaluate them. And even if we have an experience we use our mind and thought process to evaluate and interpret it. This imo means we cannot be sure of anything.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Icelander
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Re: Have you ever considered. [Re: c0sm0nautt]
#12609166 - 05/22/10 11:18 AM (13 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
c0sm0nautt said: I think you are on to something. I think what a lot of spiritual teachings are is that we can't know any truth through convention, and ultimate truth is non-existent. Therefore, the only way to bypass this paradox is to become the truth, not understand it. Like I said, it's futile to try and put the idea into words.
It's the whole 'the map is not the territory' idea.
But if the ultimate truth is beyond us and we can't know it or be sure we know it, why can't we at least acknowledge that as the core of our knowledge. Then we can make a best guess in good conscience. We never have to pretend we know what ultimate truth is. It's all just a journey and we don't know the destination until we arrive and we know we may never arrive.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Krackatus
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Re: Have you ever considered. [Re: Icelander]
#12610465 - 05/22/10 04:14 PM (13 years, 10 months ago) |
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Yes. DMT has made me very open to that idea. In fact, i believe its true. We as a species will never be intelligent enough to understand the universe, just as chickens will never be intelligent enough to understand rocket science.
-------------------- "I thought I knew a lot about psychedelics before I encountered DMT... it showed me that I knew virtually nothing." - Terence McKenna
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Icelander
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Re: Have you ever considered. [Re: Krackatus]
#12610484 - 05/22/10 04:19 PM (13 years, 10 months ago) |
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-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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rikuni
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Re: Have you ever considered. [Re: Icelander]
#12610732 - 05/22/10 05:11 PM (13 years, 10 months ago) |
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...
Edited by rikuni (03/15/14 04:11 AM)
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Icelander
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Re: Have you ever considered. [Re: rikuni]
#12610871 - 05/22/10 05:39 PM (13 years, 10 months ago) |
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That's not my quote but will you please explain to me what the universe is all about and how you know?
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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g00ru
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Re: Have you ever considered. [Re: Icelander]
#12611002 - 05/22/10 06:04 PM (13 years, 10 months ago) |
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You gotta understand when you ask that, a lot of time people's internal justification is going to be "well, it was like this one time when I was on acid" or, "that's just like when you meditate." I can't convey these experiences to you when you ask for my reasoning, but for me in my private thinking, it's perfectly valid.. That doesn't mean I expect to get a good grade if I write a thesis paper on it though.
-------------------- check out my music! drowse in prison and your waking will be but loss
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Middleman
Registered: 07/11/99
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Re: Have you ever considered. [Re: Icelander]
#12611011 - 05/22/10 06:06 PM (13 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said:
were never designed to know the whole and it's not possible.
We obviously cannot know everything about it, yet we each are the whole and we can know it.
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Icelander
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Re: Have you ever considered. [Re: Middleman]
#12611233 - 05/22/10 06:57 PM (13 years, 10 months ago) |
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We can? You mean you can. Or say you can. You cannot speak for anyone else.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Middleman
Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
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Re: Have you ever considered. [Re: Icelander]
#12611412 - 05/22/10 07:29 PM (13 years, 10 months ago) |
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Who are you to say for whom I may speak? Don't make me throw you back to the Domestic Circuit forum.
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Icelander
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Re: Have you ever considered. [Re: Middleman]
#12611455 - 05/22/10 07:37 PM (13 years, 10 months ago) |
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I'm the one.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Middleman
Registered: 07/11/99
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Re: Have you ever considered. [Re: Icelander]
#12611462 - 05/22/10 07:38 PM (13 years, 10 months ago) |
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You'll get it upon your death, and it will all totally be worth it.
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Icelander
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Re: Have you ever considered. [Re: Middleman]
#12611470 - 05/22/10 07:39 PM (13 years, 10 months ago) |
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Prove it.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Middleman
Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
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Re: Have you ever considered. [Re: Icelander]
#12611481 - 05/22/10 07:42 PM (13 years, 10 months ago) |
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(√5+1) ÷ 2 = Ø
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Icelander
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Re: Have you ever considered. [Re: Middleman]
#12611516 - 05/22/10 07:49 PM (13 years, 10 months ago) |
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I don't speak french.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Evolving
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Re: Have you ever considered. [Re: Icelander]
#12611539 - 05/22/10 07:55 PM (13 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: I don't speak french.
Do you know the meaning of a white flag?
-------------------- To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.' Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence. Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains. Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.
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Icelander
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Re: Have you ever considered. [Re: Evolving]
#12611569 - 05/22/10 08:01 PM (13 years, 10 months ago) |
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Not any more.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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