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h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions
    #12546992 -

what grade is usually recommended?

and where would you usually obtain it?

dose it kill shroom spores in direct contact?

cheers

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: Dreamtime]
    #12547004 -

san rainbow said:
what grade is usually recommended?

and where would you usually obtain it?

dose it kill shroom spores in direct contact?

cheers


3% is what I've seen recommended.  I buy 6% and dilute.

I ask for it at the pharmacy.  They keep it behind the counter because it can be used to make bombs.  Tell 'em it's for your first aid kit.  Or tell 'em it's for growing mushrooms I guess. :shrug:

Allegedly, yes, it kills spores.  I've seen RR say something along the lines of H2O2 "has no valid uses in mycology" (except for killing cobweb, I guess) so you might want to save yourself the trouble.  I give agar wedges a brief dip in H2O2 when I'm transferring them.  It doesn't noticeably hurt them though I haven't done any empirical tests.


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How I make spore prints
FFU build

"The idiots are taking have taken over" -NOFX

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: Dreamtime]
    #12547006 -

Approx. 3% H2O2.
Any pharmacy or retailer should carry it near the medical supplies usually in a dark round bottle near the rubbing alcohol.
Yes, if not completely it will damage them almost to the point of being nonviable.
Generally if it isn't for cobweb its not worth using.


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"Surely all Americans have the right to give their money only to those causes which they support. But what kind of society has this created? A society where the ignorant reign. A society where enlightened must hold their tongues. A nation whose politicians must profess half-hearted devotion to an ancient fable or face the disastrous consequences of speaking their true mind." -Chris Mccandless 1987

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: andymc]
    #12547016 -

andymc said:
I ask for it at the pharmacy.  They keep it behind the counter because it can be used to make bombs.  Tell 'em it's for your first aid kit.  Or tell 'em it's for growing mushrooms I guess. :shrug:


Really what country do you live in?
I live in probably the most paranoid ban happy state in the US and I can walk up grab 10 gallons off the shelf and walk out with it without being questioned, hell potasium nitrate is even pretty easy to come by if you know where to look.
But H2O2? I know its somewhat reactive but unless its being concentrated i don't imagine it making anything spectacular. :lol:


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"Surely all Americans have the right to give their money only to those causes which they support. But what kind of society has this created? A society where the ignorant reign. A society where enlightened must hold their tongues. A nation whose politicians must profess half-hearted devotion to an ancient fable or face the disastrous consequences of speaking their true mind." -Chris Mccandless 1987

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: Khaos]
    #12547021 -

I'm in the UK.

I believe it's a main ingredient in fertilizer bombs (or maybe liquid ones).  I'm not sure which exactly.  I'd go do a google search for bomb-making instructions to double-check, but I have a feeling that would be a bad move :grin:


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How I make spore prints
FFU build

"The idiots are taking have taken over" -NOFX

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: andymc]
    #12547027 -

Should be right next to rubbing alc in any drug store in UK.


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CASING = GETTING IT RIGHT

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: Khaos]
    #12547030 -

Ah, here we go.  According to Wikipedia:
Quote:
Hydrogen peroxide was said to be one of the ingredients in the bombs that failed to explode in the 21 July 2005 London bombings.[46]



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How I make spore prints
FFU build

"The idiots are taking have taken over" -NOFX

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: myco.alchemist]
    #12547040 -

myco.alchemist said:
Should be right next to rubbing alc in any drug store in UK.


Myco, no offence intended, but there's a sticky about finding supplies in the UK, because for whatever reason, things that you'd find in "any drug store" or "any hardware store" in the US (I'm just assuming you're in the US) can be very difficult to find here.  Not sure why.

Rubbing alcohol is something I've never seen on a shelf here, and I've looked around.


--------------------
How I make spore prints
FFU build

"The idiots are taking have taken over" -NOFX

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: andymc]
    #12547045 -

3% is a common antimicrobial topical application worldwide.


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CASING = GETTING IT RIGHT

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: andymc]
    #12547046 -

you can get it at the dollar store, here...


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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: myco.alchemist]
    #12547054 -

I get mine from Superdrug for 97p a bottle of 6% solution, just go up to the pharmacy counter and ask for it. They have never asked me about what it's for except for that time I tried to buy it with a pack of codeine and paracetamol pills.

Quote:
andymc said:They keep it behind the counter because it can be used to make bombs.


They keep it behind the counter, normally in a draw or cupboard to minimise the amount of light the bottles are exposed to.  Also remember in "Modern Britain" you aren't a terrorist unless you are Muslim.

Edited by Psil (05/12/10 05:03 AM)

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: andymc]
    #12547056 -

Yep what you mentioned about the London bombings is probably the cause behind it then. H202 in HIGH concentrations can be uses as a monopropelant for rockets or a oxidizer when used properly in conjunction with a fuel source. Interesting.


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"Surely all Americans have the right to give their money only to those causes which they support. But what kind of society has this created? A society where the ignorant reign. A society where enlightened must hold their tongues. A nation whose politicians must profess half-hearted devotion to an ancient fable or face the disastrous consequences of speaking their true mind." -Chris Mccandless 1987

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: Khaos]
    #12547066 -

If anyone asks, tell them you have an infected big toe nail.
Or, a boil on your ass.
They will not want to see it, I assure you.


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CASING = GETTING IT RIGHT

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: Khaos]
    #12547070 -

hey, cheers for replies!

I live in oz (Australia) probably they most paranoid country in the world, I am surprised we can still use the net, LOL  :grin:

I will have a look in my local chemist store, just need to know what I am asking it for :wink:

vibes

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: andymc]
    #12547078 -

andymc said:
myco.alchemist said:
Should be right next to rubbing alc in any drug store in UK.


Myco, no offence intended, but there's a sticky about finding supplies in the UK, because for whatever reason, things that you'd find in "any drug store" or "any hardware store" in the US (I'm just assuming you're in the US) can be very difficult to find here.  Not sure why.

Rubbing alcohol is something I've never seen on a shelf here, and I've looked around.


Well, the UK and probably most if not all of Europe is heavily regulated and controlled, much more so than the US.  Gotta love that socialist idealism in Europe.  Pretty soon everybody will be forced to buy only certain products from a certain company and only allotted a certain amount of times a year to buy it.

The fact that Europe bans such simple items that can be easily found anywhere in the US is just another way to control the people.  Be thankful you still have a choice in what you can buy and where you can buy it, because it won't last long.  Hell the way our commie president is running things now we might lose those freedoms sooner than you guys.  Which would be a first in world history, since the US usually trails Europe by about 10 years in politics, laws and regulations.

As far as the OP question goes, I use 3%.  I use the stuff for a ton of things in mycology, since it is as good a sanitizer as alcohol, yet it also kills/mutates molds and bacterias.  It's pretty much the perfect cleaner solution for mycology.  Because not only does it kill practically everything, but once it is spent it turns into harmless h2o.  So no nasty by products.  Probably would be great for sterilizing syringes without boiling/PCing them. Just suck up some h202, let it sit, plunge out, and now you have a clean syringe. 

I have actually been successfully using it as a water substitute in my BRF jars.  So instead of mixing water with verm and BRF, I mix h2o2, then let it sit for a few hours.  Then once I sterilize it, the heat breaks down the h202 and just leaves h20, ready for inoculation.  Can't get any more sterile that that. :thumbup:


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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: Nanoid]
    #12547090 -

Nanoid said:
Well, the UK and probably most if not all of Europe is heavily regulated and controlled, much more so than the US.  Gotta love that socialist idealism in Europe.  Pretty soon everybody will be forced to buy only certain products from a certain company and only allotted a certain amount of times a year to buy it.

The fact that Europe bans such simple items that can be easily found anywhere in the US is just another way to control the people.  Be thankful you still have a choice in what you can buy and where you can buy it, because it won't last long.  Hell the way our commie president is running things now we might lose those freedoms sooner than you guys.  Which would be a first in world history, since the US usually trails Europe by about 10 years in politics, laws and regulations.


Are you going to start with the offtopic political shit again nanoid?  :facepalm:  Take it to OTD please.  Please.

It's not because stuff is banned.  I don't know where you got that from, but I imagine your fevered, paranoid political rantings were just busting to get out, so you didn't take the time to grok what anyone was saying.

For example: people in the UK don't really do canning.  So finding PF tek-style jars, Mason jars, pressure cookers, etc., is a little more difficult and/or expensive.

It's not a communist plot, guy.


--------------------
How I make spore prints
FFU build

"The idiots are taking have taken over" -NOFX

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: andymc]
    #12547104 -

Well, maybe not from the lack of canning jars or H2o2, but there is definitely a communist one world government control plot in the works.  Of which Europe has always been in the lead.  But our terrorist foreign president is surly changing that...


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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: Nanoid]
    #12547131 -

Nanoid said:
I mix h2o2, then let it sit for a few hours.  Then once I sterilize it, the heat breaks down the h202 and just leaves h20, ready for inoculation.


The LIGHT breaks it down.  This is something to keep in mind when diluting 6% to 3% as decomposition is fairly rapid.  Great idea about using it in syringes though, I will defiantly be trying that out.

Also can we clear up this nonsense about hydrogen peroxide and bombs.  It is NOT a watched chemical and sales are not monitored.  If you buy a bottle everyday for a month they might start asking questions but apart from that I promise you, they will not care.

Edited by Psil (05/12/10 05:46 AM)

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: andymc]
    #12547148 -

andymc said:
Are you going to start with the offtopic political shit again nanoid?  :facepalm:  Take it to OTD please.  Please.

It's not a communist plot, guy.


:rofl:

This is not OTD but nanoid must have never of the patriot act we have here in states.

I wish i had a nickle for every time I've heard this rant, I would be one rich a$$ motherFucker.

But lets get back to the fact this is MUSH CULT not OTD.


--------------------
"Surely all Americans have the right to give their money only to those causes which they support. But what kind of society has this created? A society where the ignorant reign. A society where enlightened must hold their tongues. A nation whose politicians must profess half-hearted devotion to an ancient fable or face the disastrous consequences of speaking their true mind." -Chris Mccandless 1987

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: Psil]
    #12547159 -

Psil said:
Also can we clear up this nonsense about hydrogen peroxide and bombs.  It is NOT a watched chemical and sales are not monitored.  If you buy a bottle everyday for a month they might start asking questions but apart from that I promise you, they will not care.


In the pharmacists where I've bought it, they keep it behind the counter and you have to ask for it.  The very first time I ever bought some, the lady asked me what I wanted it for (because, she explained somewhat reluctantly, it could be used for bombs).  I told her the truth and that was that.

I don't know what a "watched chemical" is though, or whether she had to ask me that, or whether she was just trying to be a responsible vendor, or whether she was a nut, or what.  It's just my experience.

Anyway there doesn't seem much point in continuing to bash on about the shelf-stocking habits of UK pharmacies.  It's available, you can buy it.


--------------------
How I make spore prints
FFU build

"The idiots are taking have taken over" -NOFX

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: andymc]
    #12547218 -

By watched I mean they appear on "watch lists" like the UN Red List and DEA List.  Hydrogen peroxide is not on either of those so no worries.

For anyone interested: http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=45007 and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DEA_list_of_chemicals

Most of the other ingredients used home made bomb manufacture like Acetone (Acetone + H202 = Acetone Peroxide) or Nitric Acid and Sulfuric Acid (add to OTC cough suppressant Glycerol gives Nitroglycerin) are all on there as is hydrochloric acid which was also an ingredient in the London Bombs.

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: Psil]
    #12547278 -

Psil said:
Nanoid said:
I mix h2o2, then let it sit for a few hours.  Then once I sterilize it, the heat breaks down the h202 and just leaves h20, ready for inoculation.


The LIGHT breaks it down.  This is something to keep in mind when diluting 6% to 3% as decomposition is fairly rapid.  Great idea about using it in syringes though, I will defiantly be trying that out.

Also can we clear up this nonsense about hydrogen peroxide and bombs.  It is NOT a watched chemical and sales are not monitored.  If you buy a bottle everyday for a month they might start asking questions but apart from that I promise you, they will not care.



Both heat and light break it down. Along with other 'contaminates' which speed up the process.  When I mix it in with BRF and verm, then heat it, h2o2 loses all stability and leaves behind nice plain old water.


Quote:
Decreased Stability

# Hydrogen peroxide is a very stable chemical. When hydrogen peroxide decomposes and looses stability, it releases oxygen. One factor that reduces the stability of hydrogen peroxide is contamination. Hydrogen peroxide that has been diluted with water is considered contaminated hydrogen peroxide and it looses stability quickly. Hydrogen peroxide which has been diluted with water has stabilizing ingredients added to it in order to offset the effects of the water. Heating H2O2 also causes loss in stability. Unlike diluting hydrogen peroxide with water, heating hydrogen peroxide causes violent loss in stability and increased pressures. Hydrogen peroxide decomposes to oxygen and water when it is heated and then cooled. Storing hydrogen peroxide in hot temperatures without proper ventilation can cause rapid loss of stability and can be dangerous.


http://www.ehow.com/list_6187449_effects-heating-h2o2-stability.html


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Edited by Nanoid (05/12/10 07:04 AM)

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: Psil]
    #12547293 -

Those lists seem to only list DEA controlled chemicals used for the manufacturing of controlled substances.
As many chemicals used in explosive manufacturing that I am POSITIVE are watched and regulated are not on those lists.
Therefor it is only really relevant to the United States and only items that have use in substance manufacturing, not explosive manufacturing.


--------------------
"Surely all Americans have the right to give their money only to those causes which they support. But what kind of society has this created? A society where the ignorant reign. A society where enlightened must hold their tongues. A nation whose politicians must profess half-hearted devotion to an ancient fable or face the disastrous consequences of speaking their true mind." -Chris Mccandless 1987

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: Khaos]
    #12547461 -

Nanoid said:
Both heat and light break it down.


Apologies for being unclear.  The point of my post was to highlight that light can also decompose it which is something I think a lot of people talking about diluting from 6% to 3% forget.  Adding say 500ml of water to a 500ml 6% solution will leave you with a significantly weaker solution than intended when you take into account the light it's exposed and anything in the water you use.

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: Psil]
    #12547500 -

Chemist Grade (3% and 6%) Hydrogen Peroxide is not watched per say,but anything above 15 percent is definatley flagged at any large purchases (1 litre of this has the potential to make kilos of High explosive. The explosives manufactured using H202 are the organic peroxides, think AP, MEKP, HMTD. They are all easy as piss to make and brilliant fun, but highly sensitive to shock, heat and friction, and some will react with everyday metals and detonate at unexpected moments.
H202 will kill your fungi, it kills pretty much all organic cells, especially at higher concentrations, it liberates highly reactive oxygen free radicals when it decomposes, but as has been mentioned is an excellent disinfectant as once it does its job it leaves only water and oxygen gas behind.


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:mushroom2: I hunt Shrooms :mushroom2:

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: Nanoid]
    #12548097 -

Nanoid said:
Quote:
Decreased Stability

# Hydrogen peroxide is a very stable chemical. When hydrogen peroxide decomposes and looses stability, it releases oxygen. One factor that reduces the stability of hydrogen peroxide is contamination. Hydrogen peroxide that has been diluted with water is considered contaminated hydrogen peroxide and it looses stability quickly. Hydrogen peroxide which has been diluted with water has stabilizing ingredients added to it in order to offset the effects of the water. Heating H2O2 also causes loss in stability. Unlike diluting hydrogen peroxide with water, heating hydrogen peroxide causes violent loss in stability and increased pressures. Hydrogen peroxide decomposes to oxygen and water when it is heated and then cooled. Storing hydrogen peroxide in hot temperatures without proper ventilation can cause rapid loss of stability and can be dangerous.




I would imagine loading your jars full of H202 in a hot PC would cause rapid loss of stability and can be dangerous, no? Id guess the BRF itself would break it down if you let them sit a few minutes..but if someone were to try and copy you and didnt, and the H202 hadnt broken down...according to your quote there it may be dangerous. Of course so is crossing the street...just saying.


--------------------
"life is like a drop of rain getting closer and closer to falling into a lake, and then when you hit the lake there is no more rain drop, only the lake."

Growing with bags, start to finish (including my new grain and substrate prep)
Anyone looking to start bulk tubs/mono tubs/shotgun hybrids? Good tubs to use..
How I do grain (old still good tips)
Turn your closet into a fruiting chamber
Casing layer colonization and overlay

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: andymc]
    #12548252 -

rofl, he said grok.
Thats from the book "Stranger in a Strange Land" or something similar.

Thats where I got it from anyway, sry for offtopic.

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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: scatmanrav]
    #12549059 -

Psil said:
Nanoid said:
Both heat and light break it down.


Apologies for being unclear.  The point of my post was to highlight that light can also decompose it which is something I think a lot of people talking about diluting from 6% to 3% forget.  Adding say 500ml of water to a 500ml 6% solution will leave you with a significantly weaker solution than intended when you take into account the light it's exposed and anything in the water you use.


Plus, if you checked out that site, it also says mixing H202 with water is one way to destabilize it.  So when people dilute it with water, it actually breaks down the h202 and makes it useless for cleaning.  Although I dunno how fast water breaks it down.  But you are also correct about the light and other contaminates inside the water that breaks down the h202.

Buying straight 3% is the best IMO.


scatmanrav said:
Nanoid said:
Quote:
Decreased Stability

# Hydrogen peroxide is a very stable chemical. When hydrogen peroxide decomposes and looses stability, it releases oxygen. One factor that reduces the stability of hydrogen peroxide is contamination. Hydrogen peroxide that has been diluted with water is considered contaminated hydrogen peroxide and it looses stability quickly. Hydrogen peroxide which has been diluted with water has stabilizing ingredients added to it in order to offset the effects of the water. Heating H2O2 also causes loss in stability. Unlike diluting hydrogen peroxide with water, heating hydrogen peroxide causes violent loss in stability and increased pressures. Hydrogen peroxide decomposes to oxygen and water when it is heated and then cooled. Storing hydrogen peroxide in hot temperatures without proper ventilation can cause rapid loss of stability and can be dangerous.




I would imagine loading your jars full of H202 in a hot PC would cause rapid loss of stability and can be dangerous, no? Id guess the BRF itself would break it down if you let them sit a few minutes..but if someone were to try and copy you and didnt, and the H202 hadnt broken down...according to your quote there it may be dangerous. Of course so is crossing the street...just saying.


I don't think anybody would need to worry about this at all.  Especially with a 3% mix and GE holes in the jars.  With the GE holes pressure wouldn't build up, and  3% solution is practically harmless.  Plus I let the h202 sit in the jars for 5-8 hours before PC/boiling them.  It's probably nearly 100% broken down at that point anyway due to it interacting with the BRF and verm which also destabilize it.

Plus I have done a dozen jars so far using this method, and never once has anything happened.


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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: Nanoid]
    #12549603 -

As I said, if OTHERS try to copy the method you tell them about and DONT let the jars sit.

I'm not saying the h202 would be trapped in the jars..but in the pressure cooker. Hot and sealed..only a small amount vents. If to much oxygen got into the PC while it was on..I dont really know what would happen...but I would just mention to let the jars sit before PCing..better safe than sorry, no?


--------------------
"life is like a drop of rain getting closer and closer to falling into a lake, and then when you hit the lake there is no more rain drop, only the lake."

Growing with bags, start to finish (including my new grain and substrate prep)
Anyone looking to start bulk tubs/mono tubs/shotgun hybrids? Good tubs to use..
How I do grain (old still good tips)
Turn your closet into a fruiting chamber
Casing layer colonization and overlay

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: scatmanrav]
    #12549681 -

Like I said, I seriously doubt 3% is volatile at ALL even if it was super heated in a sealed chamber.  That webpage mentions 74% peroxide... 3% is so freaking weak.

Nobody has to worry about it at all.  I bet even less than a minuet inside the jars is enough to break it down almost all the way.  Not to mention it's only 3%.


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Re: h202 hydrogen peroxide quick questions [Re: Nanoid]
    #12550440 -

3% hydrogen peroxide is often measured in volume. 3% is equivalent to 20 vol, this means that when all the peroxide decomposes it will release 20 volumes of pure O2 as a function of its own mass.
20 volumes of 250 ml is lots of oxygen, its not volatile in that it quickly evaporates like solvents (acetone, methanol), but it is capable of producing large amounts of pure O2


--------------------
:mushroom2: I hunt Shrooms :mushroom2:

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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > Mushroom Cultivation
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