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OfflinePsilocybeingzz
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Registered: 12/15/02
Posts: 14,463
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Last seen: 4 years, 8 months
As Stalin used to say, we're "dizzy with success."
    #1251322 - 01/26/03 09:50 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Devastation abroad

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Our Good Neighbor policy
How well have the precepts put forth by George Kennan been followed? How thoroughly have we put aside all concern for "vague and unreal objectives such as human rights, the raising of the living standards, and democratization"? I've already discussed our "commitment to democracy," but what about the other two issues?

Let's focus on Latin America, and begin by looking at human rights. A study by Lars Schoultz, the leading academic specialist on human rights there, shows that "US aid has tended to flow disproportionately to Latin American governments which torture their citizens." It has nothing to do with how much a country needs aid, only with its willingness to serve the interests of wealth and privilege.

Broader studies by economist Edward Herman reveal a close correlation worldwide between torture and US aid, and also provide the explanation: both correlate independently with improving the climate for business operations. In comparison with that guiding moral principle, such matters as torture and butchery pale into insignificance.

How about raising living standards? That was supposedly addressed by President Kennedy's Alliance for Progress, but the kind of development imposed was oriented mostly towards the needs of US investors. It entrenched and extended the existing system in which Latin Americans are made to produce crops for export and to cut back on subsistence crops like corn and beans grown for local consumption. Under Alliance programs, for example, beef production increased while beef consumption declined.

This agro-export model of development usually produces an "economic miracle" where GNP goes up while much of the population starves. When you pursue such policies, popular opposition inevitably develops, which you then suppress with terror and torture.

(The use of terror is deeply ingrained in our character. Back in 1818, John Quincy Adams hailed the "salutary efficacy" of terror in dealing with "mingled hordes of lawless Indians and negroes." He wrote that to justify Andrew Jackson's rampages in Florida which virtually annihilated the native population and left the Spanish province under US control, much impressing Thomas Jefferson and others with his wisdom.)

The first step is to use the police. They're critical because they can detect discontent early and eliminate it before "major surgery" (as the planning documents call it) is necessary. If major surgery does become necessary, we rely on the army. When we can no longer control the army of a Latin American country -- particularly one in the Caribbean-Central American region -- it's time to overthrow the government.

Countries that have attempted to reverse the pattern, such as Guatemala under the democratic capitalist governments of Ar?valo and Arbenz, or the Dominican Republic under the democratic capitalist regime of Bosch, became the target of US hostility and violence.

The second step is to use the military. The US has always tried to establish relations with the military in foreign countries, because that's one of the ways to overthrow a government that has gotten out of hand. That's how the basis was laid for military coups in Chile in 1973 and in Indonesia in 1965.

Before the coups, we were very hostile to the Chilean and Indonesian governments, but we continued to send them arms. Keep good relations with the right officers and they overthrow the government for you. The same reasoning motivated the flow of US arms to Iran via Israel from the early 1980s, according to the high Israeli officials involved, facts well-known by 1982, long before there were any hostages.

During the Kennedy administration, the mission of the US-dominated Latin American military was shifted from "hemispheric defense" to "internal security" (which basically means war against your own population). That fateful decision led to "direct [US] complicity" in "the methods of Heinrich Himmler's extermination squads," in the retrospective judgment of Charles Maechling, who was in charge of counterinsurgency planning from 1961-66.

The Kennedy Administration prepared the way for the 1964 military coup in Brazil, helping to destroy Brazilian democracy, which was becoming too independent. The US gave enthusiastic support to the coup, while its military leaders instituted a neo-Nazi-style national security state with torture, repression, etc. That inspired a rash of similar developments in Argentina, Chile and all over the hemisphere, from the mid-sixties to the eighties -- an extremely bloody period.

(I think, legally speaking, there's a very solid case for impeaching every American president since the Second World War. They've all been either outright war criminals or involved in serious war crimes.)

The military typically proceeds to create an economic disaster, often following the prescriptions of US advisers, and then decides to hand the problem over to civilians to administer. Overt military control is no longer necessary as new devices become available -- for example, controls exercised through the International Monetary Fund (which, like the World Bank, lends Third World nations funds largely provided by the industrial powers).

In return for its loans, the IMF imposes "liberalization": an economy open to foreign penetration and control, sharp cutbacks in services to the general population, etc. These measures place power even more firmly in the hands of the wealthy classes and foreign investors ("stability") and reinforce the classic two-tiered societies of the Third World -- the super-rich (and a relatively well-off professional class that serves them) and an enormous mass of impoverished, suffering people.

The indebtedness and economic chaos left by the military pretty much ensures that the IMF rules will be followed -- unless popular forces attempt to enter the political arena, in which case the military may have to reinstate "stability."

Brazil is an instructive case. It is so well endowed with natural resources that it ought to be one of the richest countries in the world, and it also has high industrial development. But, thanks in good measure to the 1964 coup and the highly praised "economic miracle" that followed (not to speak of the torture, murder and other devices of "population control"), the situation for many Brazilians is now probably on a par with Ethiopia -- vastly worse than in Eastern Europe, for example.

The Ministry of Education reports that over a third of the education budget goes to school meals, because most of the students in public schools either eat at school or not at all.

According to South magazine (a business magazine reporting on the Third World), Brazil has a higher infant mortality rate than Sri Lanka. A third of the population lives below the poverty line and "seven million abandoned children beg, steal and sniff glue on the streets. For scores of millions, home is a shack in a slum...or increasingly, a patch of ground under a bridge."

That's Brazil, one of the naturally richest countries in the world.

The situation is similar throughout Latin America. Just in Central America, the number of people murdered by US-backed forces since the late 1970s comes to something like 200,000, as popular movements that sought democracy and social reform were decimated. These achievements qualify the US as an "inspiration for the triumph of democracy in our time," in the admiring words of the liberal New Republic. Tom Wolfe tells us the 1980s were "one of the great golden moments that humanity has ever experienced." As Stalin used to say, we're "dizzy with success."



--------------------


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Re: As Stalin used to say, we're "dizzy with success." [Re: Psilocybeingzz]
    #1252051 - 01/27/03 06:04 AM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Unfortunately, the United States has been in bed with some pretty unsavory
characters(dictators, governments with questionable human rights records, etc..).

I have been reading up on the whole Allende/Pinochet/Chile incident. From what
I have read, it appears as if the whole thing was a misunderstanding. The CIA
Director was in the White House and Nixon was ranting and raving about
Chile and things needed to be "fixed". The CIA Director took this as a direct order
to induce a coup in the country. Later, Kissinger told the CIA Director that Nixon
had a bad temper and acted irrationally at times, and he was not to be taken
literally. But, it was already too late.

Z magazine seems to think that every single one of these interventions happened
because the United States government was acting at the behest of corporations.
Actually, most of these interventions were attempts(however misguided) to stop
communism. The Soviets and Cubans were very active in trying to export
revolution. We were very active in trying to stop them. A lot of innocent
people got caught in the cross-fire.




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Invisiblecarbonhoots
old hand

Registered: 09/11/01
Posts: 1,351
Loc: BC Canada
Re: As Stalin used to say, we're "dizzy with success." [Re: Psilocybeingzz]
    #1252473 - 01/27/03 09:04 AM (14 years, 5 months ago)

The Chillean coup...the other september 11...

I know a family who were exiled from chili because of their support for Allende...

Quote:


Brazil is an instructive case. It is so well endowed with natural resources that it ought to be one of the richest countries in the world, and it also has high industrial development. But, thanks in good measure to the 1964 coup and the highly praised "economic miracle" that followed (not to speak of the torture, murder and other devices of "population control"), the situation for many Brazilians is now probably on a par with Ethiopia -- vastly worse than in Eastern Europe, for example.

The Ministry of Education reports that over a third of the education budget goes to school meals, because most of the students in public schools either eat at school or not at all.

According to South magazine (a business magazine reporting on the Third World), Brazil has a higher infant mortality rate than Sri Lanka. A third of the population lives below the poverty line and "seven million abandoned children beg, steal and sniff glue on the streets. For scores of millions, home is a shack in a slum...or increasingly, a patch of ground under a bridge."

That's Brazil, one of the naturally richest countries in the world.






Brazil and Canada have a lot in common...except Canada still has whats left of a social welfare system, and unions/workers rights movements were allowed to get intrenched somewhat...so we still have a middle class, for now.

But yeah, Brazil could be a textbook example of what's wrong with right-wing, libertarian economic policies. Laisez-faire economics always creates a have, have-not situation.

Your post is good. In Canada, it's easy to think that the corrupt system owes it's existance to ignorance. Your post reminded me it is also enforced by guns.





--------------------
  -I'd rather have a frontal lobotomy than a bottle in front of me

CANADIAN CENTER FOR POLICY ALTERNATIVES


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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/26/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: As Stalin used to say, we're "dizzy with success." [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #1253020 - 01/27/03 12:00 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Later, Kissinger told the CIA Director that Nixon

To be honest if Kissenger told me it was raining outside I'd go to the window and look just to make sure. I don't think these things happen "by mistake".

"Stopping communism" sounds better than "Killing innocent people for profit" i suppose.


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi


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InvisibleMushMushi
Registered: 08/23/02
Posts: 480
Loc: Canada
Re: As Stalin used to say, we're "dizzy with success." [Re: Xlea321]
    #1253496 - 01/27/03 02:23 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Heh American logic

Henry Kissinger, who should be interrogated about this crimes against humanity infront of the international world court, has been rewarded with a nobel prize (for peace).

Another example of american logic:
We should bomb Iraq if they find chemical/biological weapons.
We should also bomb Iraq if they don't find chemical/biological weapons because they are hiding them.

Pretty twisted huh? And I'm sober.
:mad: 


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Re: As Stalin used to say, we're "dizzy with success." [Re: Xlea321]
    #1253510 - 01/27/03 02:27 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)


"Stopping communism" sounds better than "Killing innocent people for profit" i
suppose.

I don't think that every intervention the U.S. has ever made was a sadistic attempt
to get "profit". I seriously think that most were to fight communism, and to prop up
governments that were friendly to us.

Should we be meddling about in other country's affairs in my opinion? No.


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InvisibleMushMushi
Registered: 08/23/02
Posts: 480
Loc: Canada
Re: As Stalin used to say, we're "dizzy with success." [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #1253534 - 01/27/03 02:35 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

During the Cold War, Americans noticed they had the green card to do what they wanted to do internationally, the Soviet Union never got into trouble with them.

The "protection against communism" was merely a justification.
Again, there is a book about this: what uncle sam really wants, by noam chomsky.
Might be a good idea to read it. Then criticize it. Be a human, not a robot  :wink: 


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Re: As Stalin used to say, we're "dizzy with success." [Re: MushMushi]
    #1253537 - 01/27/03 02:35 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Well how's this for "American Logic"...

My opinion on the Middle East is that we should let that festering hole of
dictators and zealots rot. America should not have anything to do with any
country over there. That includes supporting or attacking any country. Let
them wallow in their own ignorance, corruption, and violence.

The people of the Middle East do nothing but cause problems. This statement
includes the Jews and the Arabs.

Why oh why does most of the oil in the world have to be under their soil???
Things would be so much better if God had just put all of that oil under the ocean
in international waters or something.


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Re: As Stalin used to say, we're "dizzy with success." [Re: MushMushi]
    #1253545 - 01/27/03 02:37 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)


Again, there is a book about this: what uncle sam really wants, by noam chomsky.
Might be a good idea to read it. Then criticize it. Be a human, not a robot

I don't trust a damn word that comes out of that biased Left-Wing lackey. It's
distressing that a man who is so intelligent could be so stupid.


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InvisibleMushMushi
Registered: 08/23/02
Posts: 480
Loc: Canada
Re: As Stalin used to say, we're "dizzy with success." [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #1253553 - 01/27/03 02:41 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

My opinion on the Middle East is that we should let that festering hole of
dictators and zealots rot. America should not have anything to do with any
country over there. That includes supporting or attacking any country. Let
them wallow in their own ignorance, corruption, and violence.




Yeah, stop giving money and weapons to Israel, that Spartan country which is your ally.


Quote:

The people of the Middle East do nothing but cause problems. This statement
includes the Jews and the Arabs.



I believe this is far more complex than that. But I do not wish to debate this now.

Quote:

Why oh why does most of the oil in the world have to be under their soil???
Things would be so much better if God had just put all of that oil under the ocean
in international waters or something.




I guess a few powerfull countries would grab all of them.


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InvisibleMushMushi
Registered: 08/23/02
Posts: 480
Loc: Canada
Re: As Stalin used to say, we're "dizzy with success." [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #1253558 - 01/27/03 02:43 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

I guess you never saw his sources.
Perhaps you believe cnn and right wing nationalists.


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Re: As Stalin used to say, we're "dizzy with success." [Re: MushMushi]
    #1253620 - 01/27/03 03:03 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)


I guess you never saw his sources.

His source is his own twisted Left-wingish mind.

Perhaps you believe cnn and right wing nationalists.

I don't trust CNN completely. Right wing nationalists are just as bad as Left-wing
idiots.


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OfflinePsilocybeingzz
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Registered: 12/15/02
Posts: 14,463
Loc: International waters
Last seen: 4 years, 8 months
Re: As Stalin used to say, we're "dizzy with success." [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #1256958 - 01/28/03 10:57 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

"twisted let wing mind"
that DOES NOT make any sense re-read the post 7 times
and then give a summary about whats so "twisted left" about it

and as far as you saying let those countrys rot
well alot of those doctators YOUR COUNTRY created

why cant you be a "human being"?
i someone want things good or all not some he is left???
i someone wants strong control of corporations he is left ???
NO
He is smart and responsible as we all our for the actions of our countries and soon I hope we will be able to play the full democratic right we should have ALL always hade


RED AND BLACK!


--------------------


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InvisibleRandalFlagg
Stranger
Registered: 06/15/02
Posts: 15,608
Re: As Stalin used to say, we're "dizzy with success." [Re: Psilocybeingzz]
    #1257409 - 01/29/03 05:23 AM (14 years, 5 months ago)


"twisted left wing mind"


that DOES NOT make any sense re-read the post 7 times
and then give a summary about whats so "twisted left" about it

Do a search for the thread called "Liberalism", that was started by me. It details
how someone can let their mind be overrun and controlled by liberalism.


and as far as you saying let those countrys rot
well alot of those doctators YOUR COUNTRY created

We give aid to governments that are friendly to us. All governments around
the world do this. But, I can agree that America is way too involved in shit over
there.


why cant you be a "human being"?

I am a human being

if someone want things good or all not some he is left???

huh??

if someone wants strong control of corporations he is left ???

I am all for the general public being able to address their concerns in a democratic
environment; this includes regulations for corporations.




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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/26/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: As Stalin used to say, we're "dizzy with success." [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #1257447 - 01/29/03 05:45 AM (14 years, 5 months ago)

His source is his own twisted Left-wingish mind.

Nah, people always say this until they read him. Almost every line in a Chomsky book is a direct quote from right-wingers. You don't really need any bias when you have their own words.


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi


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