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OfflineNyawinge
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Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once
    #12498035 - 05/03/10 09:31 AM (14 years, 8 months ago)

I have been unable to find a good recipe for making several jars worth of BRF substrate at once. I don't want to wing it and risk messing things up because of the ratios. Has anyone had success with a particular method?


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OfflineBreakfast Crew
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: Nyawinge]
    #12498039 - 05/03/10 09:32 AM (14 years, 8 months ago)

:awesurprise:

---Edited---

Edited by Breakfast Crew (05/14/10 04:03 PM)

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OfflineNyawinge
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: Breakfast Crew]
    #12499414 - 05/03/10 02:31 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Why do you ask?


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InvisiblePluth
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: Breakfast Crew]
    #12499438 - 05/03/10 02:35 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Breakfast Crew said:
The ratio of one jar times your desired amount. Are you over 18?



:lolsy:


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OfflineL-Shroom-D
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: Pluth]
    #12499489 - 05/03/10 02:43 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

5 jars is

1 cup water
2 cups vermiculite
1 cup brown rice flour :wink:


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OfflineNyawinge
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: L-Shroom-D]
    #12499729 - 05/03/10 03:26 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

I will try it out- but have you had successful results with that recipe before? I ask because I know it's tricky to scale up the BRF recipe without throwing off the ratios...


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InvisibleSmartweed
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: Nyawinge]
    #12499739 - 05/03/10 03:27 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Nyawinge said:
I will try it out- but have you had successful results with that recipe before? I ask because I know it's tricky to scale up the BRF recipe without throwing off the ratios...




How is that throwing off the ratios?


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OfflineSpongiform
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: Smartweed]
    #12499750 - 05/03/10 03:29 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

2:1:1 regardless of scale
20 cups verm, 10 cups brf, 10 cups water.
2 cups verm, 1 cup brf, 1 cup water.


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OfflineL-Shroom-D
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: Spongiform]
    #12499759 - 05/03/10 03:30 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Spongiform said:
2:1:1 regardless of scale
20 cups verm, 10 cups brf, 10 cups water.
2 cups verm, 1 cup brf, 1 cup water.





100 cups verm, 50 cups brf, 50 cups water :wink:


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OfflineJosh84
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: Nyawinge]
    #12499802 - 05/03/10 03:40 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Nyawinge said:
I have been unable to find a good recipe for making several jars worth of BRF substrate at once. I don't want to wing it and risk messing things up because of the ratios. Has anyone had success with a particular method?




Are you serious?  The recipe is 1/2 cup verm, 1/4 cup water and 1/4 cup BRF per 1/2 pint.  Just multiply if you are doing more than a single 1/2 pint.

or

2 part verm
1 part water
1 part BRF

It is so freaking simple.

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OfflineL-Shroom-D
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: Josh84]
    #12499815 - 05/03/10 03:42 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

2verm:1water:1brf ration for one 1/2 pint jar. just multiply each number by how many jars you have.

20 1/2 pint jars = 40verm:20water:20brf :wink:


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OfflineNyawinge
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: Spongiform]
    #12499819 - 05/03/10 03:42 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Spongiform said:
2:1:1 regardless of scale
20 cups verm, 10 cups brf, 10 cups water.
2 cups verm, 1 cup brf, 1 cup water.




If you say so, but I've always heard that simply upping the quantity without adjusting the ratios appropriately will throw off the moisture content. I just don't have any time, money, or syringes to waste on a bad substrate recipe (not that I'm saying yours is- just haven't tried it myself)...

Sorry to be busting out such an simple question, but I wanted to make sure before I just assumed and screwed things up...especially since I've heard that you can't just up the quantity


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OfflineL-Shroom-D
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: Nyawinge]
    #12499823 - 05/03/10 03:43 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

its be really helpful to tell us how many jars you want to do :wink:


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OfflineJosh84
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: L-Shroom-D]
    #12499845 - 05/03/10 03:47 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Also adding 1 tablespoon of gypsum per 1 cup verm is also really good.

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OfflineSpongiform
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: Josh84]
    #12499925 - 05/03/10 04:00 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Josh84 said:
Also adding 1 tablespoon of gypsum per 1 cup verm is also really good.




I recommend 1 tablespoon gypsum and 1 tablespoon spent coffee grounds per quart of vermiculite used. 

Can't argue with the results of such a recipe: :-D






If you find your moisture content to be off you can add more verm or more water as needed.  I prefer to make mine a bit on the dry side and then when inoculating with LC, use extra lc without throwing off the moisture.

By doing so with my plastic containers, they're fully colonized within a week with containers ranging from 1/4 pint to quarts.





With spawn bags up to 6 quarts of pf mix, looking at about 2 weeks to fully colonize.




It's worked out pretty well for me.


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OfflineL-Shroom-D
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: Spongiform]
    #12499941 - 05/03/10 04:02 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

whats mushies is that spongiform?


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OfflineJosh84
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: Spongiform]
    #12499952 - 05/03/10 04:03 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Spongiform said:
Quote:

Josh84 said:
Also adding 1 tablespoon of gypsum per 1 cup verm is also really good.




I recommend 1 tablespoon gypsum and 1 tablespoon spent coffee grounds per quart of vermiculite used. 

Can't argue with the results of such a recipe: :-D






If you find your moisture content to be off you can add more verm or more water as needed.  I prefer to make mine a bit on the dry side and then when inoculating with LC, use extra lc without throwing off the moisture.

By doing so with my plastic containers, they're fully colonized within a week with containers ranging from 1/4 pint to quarts.





With spawn bags up to 6 quarts of pf mix, looking at about 2 weeks to fully colonize.




It's worked out pretty well for me.




I was going off your PlasticTek info.  You said 2 tablespoons gypsum to 2 cups verm.

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OfflineSpongiform
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: L-Shroom-D]
    #12499965 - 05/03/10 04:07 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

L-Shroom-D said:
whats mushies is that spongiform?



Albino Penis Envy (ape)

Quote:

I was going off your PlasticTek info.  You said 2 tablespoons gypsum to 2 cups verm.



I've been using less lately, primarily because I've been using plaster of paris which will clump if you use too much. 

You can use up to 10% gypsum by volume though I'm not sure if there's any benefit in going that high.


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OfflineNyawinge
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: Spongiform]
    #12499987 - 05/03/10 04:11 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Cool, thanks for the in-depth & pics Spongi.

I've been planning on using both gypsum and coffee in my mix (thought about ordering some tryptamine too, but I figured the experiments can wait for a bit...)

At the moment, my plan is to make 36 1/2 pint jars. I'll have 3 strains (Puerto Rican, F+, and Taz) with 12 cakes each; these will be double-stacked with skewers for an end result of 3 FCs with 6 double-stacks in each one. Of course, that's assuming everything goes to plan and I don't screw up my recipe. Which I doubt that I will, now that I have such an abundance of advice/input. Thanks all for the help


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OfflineSpongiform
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: Nyawinge]
    #12500052 - 05/03/10 04:23 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

If you haven't bought your supplies yet you might want to consider spawn bags.  You can do 4, 6 quart bags and fit them into 1 shotgun terrarium.  For the equivalent substrate of 128 1/2 pint cakes.

I think the half pints are more efficient sub/yield ratios, but the bags are much more efficient use of time and space.  4 inoculations vs 128, 1 terrarium vs several etc.

You'd want a decent size pressure cooker and while not absolutely require an impulse sealer makes it a lot easier to deal with bags.

Check out the logs in my signature for more info :-D


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OfflineNyawinge
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: Spongiform]
    #12501471 - 05/03/10 08:29 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Thanks, will definitely keep that in mind for the future. I do want to try some more efficient/interesting techniques once I get this one down. I'm already pretty set on the method I've outlined though (i.e. I have 36 Kerr jars occupying the space beneath my sink), and I don't have the funds right now for additional equipment that other techniques would require in order to be done properly. I really need to get a window AC unit ASAP before the summer heat kicks in and I'm still not sure where the cash for that is going to come from.

I'm excited about trying out the double-stacking method though...


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OfflineSpongiform
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: Nyawinge]
    #12501512 - 05/03/10 08:36 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Keep those temps in check, one of the most common mistakes I see on here are bad temps.

Quote:

I incubated my jars at 86f, why do they all suck?! :-(




Optimal growth will occur 75-82f.  Go over 82 and growth will stall and you'll promote contaminates.

Bear in mind that the mycelium produces heat as it grows though and the jars/tubs/containers/bags act as insulators to some degree.  Also the larger the substrate the more heat will be produced.

Small jars will only be a few degrees over ambient temps but larger tubs or bags can be 15f+.

If your incubation area maintains 65-80f on it's own, you won't need to do anything.  Below 65f and you probably want some heat source, over 80f and you want an AC.


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Offlinemopusophop
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: L-Shroom-D]
    #12501759 - 05/03/10 09:29 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

L-Shroom-D said:
5 jars is

1 cup water
2 cups vermiculite
1 cup brown rice flour :wink:




what he said


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OfflineTyme
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: Spongiform]
    #12502123 - 05/03/10 10:32 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Spongiform said:
Keep those temps in check, one of the most common mistakes I see on here are bad temps.

Quote:

I incubated my jars at 86f, why do they all suck?! :-(




Optimal growth will occur 75-82f.  Go over 82 and growth will stall and you'll promote contaminates.

Bear in mind that the mycelium produces heat as it grows though and the jars/tubs/containers/bags act as insulators to some degree.  Also the larger the substrate the more heat will be produced.

Small jars will only be a few degrees over ambient temps but larger tubs or bags can be 15f+.

If your incubation area maintains 65-80f on it's own, you won't need to do anything.  Below 65f and you probably want some heat source, over 80f and you want an AC.




How much extra heat do you think standard wide mouth 1/2 pints do?

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OfflineSpongiform
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: Tyme]
    #12502246 - 05/03/10 10:50 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

1-3f I believe.  It's compounded if you have a lot in a small enclosed space though.


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OfflineTyme
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: Spongiform]
    #12502295 - 05/03/10 10:58 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Ok cool, thanks!  I am incubating at 77 degrees now and they all seem to be colonizing fine.

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OfflineNyawinge
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Re: Mixing Multiple BRF Jars at Once [Re: Tyme]
    #12603927 - 05/21/10 12:48 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

Since I am finally starting my next batch of substrate this afternoon, I thought I would post the recipe I am using:


14.5 cups vermiculite
+
7.25 cups fresh-ground brown rice flour
+
7.25 cups water
+
7 tbsp gypsum


for a total of 36 1/2-pint jars

Pretty much the standard recipe :tongue: I'm excited....

Thanks to all for the advice, especially Spongiform for the badass pics and gypsum recommendation.


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