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conoshoto
Mycologist In Training



Registered: 01/28/10
Posts: 563
Loc: The Other Side
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Re: UPDATE #3: Trays 100% Colonized - A Fuiting We Will Go [Re: pairshroom]
#12529100 - 05/08/10 09:33 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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The best location for the Vicks is on the bottom and putting some perlite in the bottom tray to catch moisture helps put it back into the air. You can use the ultrasonic with it but the Vicks should be fine to hold the humidity. Just make sure you get plenty of fae along with keeping the humidity in the 90+
-------------------- "Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside in a cloud of smoke, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming "Wow! What a Ride!'" - Hunter S. Thompson
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pairshroom
Jabberwocky



Registered: 01/01/10
Posts: 57
Last seen: 13 years, 7 months
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Re: UPDATE #3: Trays 100% Colonized - A Fuiting We Shall Go [Re: conoshoto]
#12529302 - 05/08/10 10:15 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Any thoughts about adding a casing layer or sealing the bottom with plastic, etc.?
Edited by pairshroom (05/08/10 10:38 PM)
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scatmanrav
Brainy Smurf


Registered: 05/08/04
Posts: 11,483
Loc:
Last seen: 12 years, 15 days
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Re: UPDATE #3: Trays 100% Colonized - A Fuiting We Shall Go [Re: pairshroom]
#12529784 - 05/09/10 12:25 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Casing is optional and optimal. If it seems like a hassle to you, then just skip it..no big deal. A vicks is better, but an ultasonic can work. I wouldnt bother with the wax paper and I wouldnt seal the bottom.
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anonjon
Partially Right

Registered: 11/03/08
Posts: 6,322
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Re: UPDATE #3: Trays 100% Colonized - A Fuiting We Shall Go [Re: pairshroom]
#12534533 - 05/09/10 10:27 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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1. Don't case.
rest i'll let a greenhouse xpert chime in.
-------------------- The above post is fictional, hypothetical, or downright nonsensical.
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pairshroom
Jabberwocky



Registered: 01/01/10
Posts: 57
Last seen: 13 years, 7 months
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Re: UPDATE #3: Trays 100% Colonized - A Fuiting We Shall Go [Re: anonjon]
#12536378 - 05/10/10 11:04 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Here are some pics of my setup. I have decided to go without casing, based on others' advice and info I acquired on this site. Perhaps I might add casing after the first flush, maybe to just some of the trays.
I got an impeller coolmist humidifier (made by Kaz, #4100), which gets my humidity quickly up to 96% or so. Compared to the ultrasonic I tried initially, the coolmist generates much more airflow and doesn't saturate everything like the ultrasonic does. However, the substrate surface doesn't seem to be as moist, so I guess I need to mist with this setup? Or maybe I can run the ultrasonic on some occasional short cycles to perform this task.
I have two aquarium pumps delivering fresh air into each side of the greenhouse. I am using 1/4 vinyl tubing connected to brass barb connectors which are threaded into the sides of the shelf supports. This way, since the coolmist in within the greenhouse, I am certain that there is a continual supply of fresh air. I also have slits in the plastic cover in multiple locations.
I'm still a bit concerned that the surface of the trays has some areas that are more translucent than others. Everything is white, but in the thinner areas of colonization, I can see the brown color of the coir telegraphing through. Is this normal?
Thanks for the feedback.



-------------------- "Beware the Jabberwock, my son!
The jaws that bite, the claws that catch!
Beware the Jubjub bird, and shun
The frumious Bandersnatch!"
— L. Carroll
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KillaFoRilla
Heretic



Registered: 12/23/09
Posts: 1,520
Last seen: 4 years, 8 months
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Re: UPDATE #3: Trays 100% Colonized - A Fuiting We Will Go [Re: conoshoto]
#12536467 - 05/10/10 11:25 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
conoshoto said: The best location for the Vicks is on the bottom and putting some perlite in the bottom tray to catch moisture helps put it back into the air. You can use the ultrasonic with it but the Vicks should be fine to hold the humidity. Just make sure you get plenty of fae along with keeping the humidity in the 90+ 
Don't use perlite in the bottom of your GH. Its pointless, unless you are trying to boost RH. If you have cool mist and or sonic humidifiers running you don't need perlite in the bottom. Wet perlite and all the stuff falling off of your subs going into it creates a nasty soup at the bottom of your GH. Contam city.
Its a pain in the ass to clean as well. Just use an empty under bed storage bin. Clean with bleachy water every 1.5 MOs.
You can kinda see the tun if you look at the bottom of the pick.
 Also, you don't need to hack up your Mini-GH to pipe in FAE and raise RH. Get some zip ties and plumb through the zipper in the front to your humidifiers and bang.
I've mod'd my setup a bit more with a shop light and a few strategically places holes. Will post more pics if ya like. Hope this helped
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KillaFoRilla
Heretic



Registered: 12/23/09
Posts: 1,520
Last seen: 4 years, 8 months
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Re: UPDATE #3: Trays 100% Colonized - A Fuiting We Will Go [Re: KillaFoRilla]
#12536473 - 05/10/10 11:27 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Pairshroom, is your GH in a shower?
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anonjon
Partially Right

Registered: 11/03/08
Posts: 6,322
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Re: UPDATE #3: Trays 100% Colonized - A Fuiting We Shall Go [Re: pairshroom]
#12536647 - 05/10/10 12:12 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
pairshroom said: I'm still a bit concerned that the surface of the trays has some areas that are more translucent than others. Everything is white, but in the thinner areas of colonization, I can see the brown color of the coir telegraphing through. Is this normal?
Fairly normal. The surface of colonized coir varies depending on how moist it is and how much nutrient is close to the surface. Sometimes its completely white with dewdrops on top, sometimes you can still see the brown thru wispy mycelium.
-------------------- The above post is fictional, hypothetical, or downright nonsensical.
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scatmanrav
Brainy Smurf


Registered: 05/08/04
Posts: 11,483
Loc:
Last seen: 12 years, 15 days
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Re: UPDATE #3: Trays 100% Colonized - A Fuiting We Shall Go [Re: anonjon]
#12536723 - 05/10/10 12:28 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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I put tubs with perlite under my GH to catch drips and keep up humidity. I may or may not continue though..
Your stuff is all looking good, ready to go.
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pairshroom
Jabberwocky



Registered: 01/01/10
Posts: 57
Last seen: 13 years, 7 months
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Re: UPDATE #3: Trays 100% Colonized - A Fuiting We Will Go [Re: KillaFoRilla]
#12536745 - 05/10/10 12:34 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Nice setup, KillaFoRilla. No, it's not in a shower. It was in a whirpool tub in a guest bathroom, but the tub has never been used or even turned on. Also, the bottom of the greenhouse is sealed with 5 mil plastic sheeting and duct tape so it doesn't communicate with the tub. The tub was also thoroughly cleaned with Lysol. Despite all of this, the whole greenhouse was moved into the guest bedroom after a few hours, instead of the bathroom (where the pics were taken). It appears that we don't get many guests.
-------------------- "Beware the Jabberwock, my son!
The jaws that bite, the claws that catch!
Beware the Jubjub bird, and shun
The frumious Bandersnatch!"
— L. Carroll
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KillaFoRilla
Heretic



Registered: 12/23/09
Posts: 1,520
Last seen: 4 years, 8 months
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Re: UPDATE #3: Trays 100% Colonized - A Fuiting We Will Go [Re: pairshroom]
#12536912 - 05/10/10 01:17 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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 Very nice!
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pairshroom
Jabberwocky



Registered: 01/01/10
Posts: 57
Last seen: 13 years, 7 months
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Re: UPDATE #4: Trich contamination?? [Re: KillaFoRilla]
#12541915 - 05/11/10 08:22 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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UPDATE #4: Trich contamination??
Well, I've been incubating in the greenhouse for a couple of days and I noticed today the bluish green hue over most of one tray (a couple other trays show a hint of bluish green in a few spots, too). I noticed that many of the trays seem a bit dry on top, so I've started to mist manually a bit more often.
Is this Trich or bruising?

-------------------- "Beware the Jabberwock, my son!
The jaws that bite, the claws that catch!
Beware the Jubjub bird, and shun
The frumious Bandersnatch!"
— L. Carroll
Edited by pairshroom (05/15/10 03:25 PM)
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RogerRabbit
Bans for Pleasure


Registered: 03/26/03
Posts: 42,214
Loc: Seattle
Last seen: 1 year, 10 months
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Re: UPDATE #4: Trich contamination?? [Re: pairshroom]
#12541923 - 05/11/10 08:26 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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It looks more like bruising from being too dry.
The easy way to tell mold spores from bruising, is that bruising will look just like a bruise on your own body. It will be the color of the mycelium itself and will fade at the edges, just like when you bang your shin against a board. Mold spores will be like a layer of green sand on the surface and will look more like a scab on your body where a wound is healing. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms
semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat
"I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison
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pairshroom
Jabberwocky



Registered: 01/01/10
Posts: 57
Last seen: 13 years, 7 months
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Re: UPDATE #4: Trich contamination?? [Re: RogerRabbit]
#12542230 - 05/11/10 10:10 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Thanks, RR. That was my original thought, too, but when I saw this tray progress so quickly over the past 12 hours (plus it was not as blue as I recall when seeing bruising on cakes), I became paranoid and isolated it (?sacrificed it) and took it outside. I cut in in half and sliced in horizontally, and see pretty healthy mycelia throughout with no signs of internal green/blue. It smells ok, too. The color does seem to be integral to the mycelia and not sitting on top and doesn't look "sandy" (plus, no transfer onto Q-tip, etc. - I know, bad test), so bruising it is (thankfully).
Oh, well, 1 tray gone - 4 still left. "Better safe than sorry" -- or is it "Live and learn!"?
-------------------- "Beware the Jabberwock, my son!
The jaws that bite, the claws that catch!
Beware the Jubjub bird, and shun
The frumious Bandersnatch!"
— L. Carroll
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anonjon
Partially Right

Registered: 11/03/08
Posts: 6,322
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Re: UPDATE #4: Trich contamination?? [Re: pairshroom]
#12542513 - 05/11/10 11:23 AM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
pairshroom said: Oh, well, 1 tray gone - 4 still left. "Better safe than sorry" -- or is it "Live and learn!"?
"Throw away the baby with the bathwater" may be apt in this case.
-------------------- The above post is fictional, hypothetical, or downright nonsensical.
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windex
old hand
Registered: 06/27/01
Posts: 1,294
Last seen: 7 months, 1 day
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Re: UPDATE #4: Trich contamination?? [Re: anonjon]
#12543104 - 05/11/10 01:35 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
anonjon said:
Quote:
pairshroom said: Oh, well, 1 tray gone - 4 still left. "Better safe than sorry" -- or is it "Live and learn!"?
"Throw away the baby with the bathwater" may be apt in this case.
or "Don't Panic!"
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pairshroom
Jabberwocky



Registered: 01/01/10
Posts: 57
Last seen: 13 years, 7 months
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Re: UPDATE #4: Trich contamination?? [Re: windex]
#12544065 - 05/11/10 04:32 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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I feel much better -- now that I had a shot of my single barrel Casa Noble anejo tequila. I knew that would do the trich (sic)!
-------------------- "Beware the Jabberwock, my son!
The jaws that bite, the claws that catch!
Beware the Jubjub bird, and shun
The frumious Bandersnatch!"
— L. Carroll
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pairshroom
Jabberwocky



Registered: 01/01/10
Posts: 57
Last seen: 13 years, 7 months
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Re: UPDATE #5 (more PICS): The Saga Continues: Blue Trays & Side Pins [Re: pairshroom]
#12567801 - 05/15/10 03:22 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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UPDATE #5 (more PICS): The Saga Continues: Blue Trays & Side Pins
Dear Shroom Diary (i.e., Shroomery):
It's now day #6 for my four remaining trays in the greenhouse, having sacrificed one a few days ago because of mistaking bruising for Trich. Because it was felt that the bluing was due to being too dry, I decided to add ultrasonic-based humidity to the coolmist impeller-based humidity I was using. I have noticed that the coolmist (Kaz model 4100 from CVS pharmacy) was circulating a lot of air, and I think that this was drying out the surface of my colonized substrate, causing the blue-green "bruising", despite having 98-100% humidity at all times. A bit counter-intuitive to me, since I thought that evaporation was favored in low-humidity conditions, not ones at near 100%. I guess the fan was carrying all of the tray surface moisture away. What's also unusual to me is that the water level in the coolmist drops VERY slowly, over several days, but it certainly dampens a paper towel if I hold it in front of the output for 30 seconds. I have no problems with pooling of water that others have described, though.
I modified the setup as follows: (1) coolmist on bottom shelf; on for 5 mins - off for 10 mins (using Sentinel DRT-1 cycle timer, which is great) (2) simultaneous with the coolmist (which is inside the greenhouse) is fresh air from two aquarium pumps at 10 L/min rate (3) ultrasonic humidifier (SPT SU-4010) outside of greenhouse, but pumped in via 3/4 clear vinyl tubing; on for 4 mins - off for 11 mins (to coincide with on/off cycle of the coolmist) (4) the coolmist is positioned such that it blows into the ultrasonic humidity stream, rapidly circulating it (5) hand misting the surface of the trays (they are UNcased) 3-4 times per day, to keep them moist (6) 6500K fluorescent lightbox illuminating the greenhouse from 6am-6pm daily (on timer)
I notice that all trays are now blue-green, despite all of this effort to keep the surface moist. Primordial knots began 2-3 days ago, primarily on the sides, where the "humidty gap" exists from the substrate pulling away from the rigid wall of the container. The container is clear, but is nested in an opaque one, lined with black plastic a la HippieChick's old tek. Now, side pinning is rampant, although I do have surface pins on 3 trays, with one still with no surface pinning. Parts of the surface of all trays appear matted, almost like pseudo-overlay, if that's possible.
I'm not sure what the best course of action is right now. I'm tempted to just stay on course, although I'm concerned about the side pins way down deep not having enough room for stipe growth, and getting squashed and aborting. I guess I could birth the trays, but I fear that I might actually lose more moisture from the entire colonized substrate. Perhaps I can dunk and case the tray after flush #1 is complete, ensuring casing in the side cracks to keep out light.
In any event, pics are fun to look at (IMO), so here's a visual update on my first bulk grow. Thanks to all who are babying me along with this hobby.



-------------------- "Beware the Jabberwock, my son!
The jaws that bite, the claws that catch!
Beware the Jubjub bird, and shun
The frumious Bandersnatch!"
— L. Carroll
Edited by pairshroom (05/15/10 04:19 PM)
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pairshroom
Jabberwocky



Registered: 01/01/10
Posts: 57
Last seen: 13 years, 7 months
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Re: UPDATE #5 (more PICS): The Saga Continues: Blue Trays & Side Pins [Re: pairshroom]
#12574042 - 05/16/10 04:09 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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I decided to "birth" the one tray with only side pins, and place it on verm/perlite in its inverted lid within the greenhouse.
Any thoughts?
-------------------- "Beware the Jabberwock, my son!
The jaws that bite, the claws that catch!
Beware the Jubjub bird, and shun
The frumious Bandersnatch!"
— L. Carroll
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uncle_rico
my own worst enemy


Registered: 03/28/06
Posts: 2,664
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Re: UPDATE #5 (more PICS): The Saga Continues: Blue Trays & Side Pins [Re: pairshroom]
#12574187 - 05/16/10 04:35 PM (14 years, 8 months ago) |
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I've done / and seen it done a number of times.
If your substrate has plenty of moisture, you can get good results. If you are struggling with a substrate that is drying out, 'birthing' it will expose more of it to the FAE that is drying it. The perlite/verm bed will help.
I have done this after a good 1st flush and re-hydration of the substrate.
Good luck.
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