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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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My plan to clean up the Pharmaceutical industry.
    #1243489 - 01/23/03 04:49 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

The pharmaceutical industry spends nearly as much on marketing and promotion as it does on Research and development.

Since there are no controlls, they are basically forced to do this because of the simple fact that everybody else still will even if they stop, and they will lose money.

There should be a single source, government owned, for all information about pharmaceutical drugs. It should be factual, and contain pages, and pages of boring statistics, and data. All pharmaceutical marketing, and promotion would be banned.

Then they can compete where they should be competing; in the lab, and in price control.


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Anonymous

Re: My plan to clean up the Pharmaceutical industry. [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #1243528 - 01/23/03 05:02 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

They are corparations. Keeping their executives pockets fat is what they are for. Not to help medicine.


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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Re: My plan to clean up the Pharmaceutical industry. [Re: ]
    #1243584 - 01/23/03 05:17 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

We should damn them like we dammed the rivers.

"The Pharmaceutical Industry" isn't a single conciousness, but it does obey similar laws to that of a force of nature.


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OfflineDilauded
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Re: My plan to clean up the Pharmaceutical industry. [Re: ]
    #1243651 - 01/23/03 05:40 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

They are corparations. Keeping their executives pockets fat is what they are for. Not to help medicine.




YOU DON'T KNOW SHIT ABOUT THE MEDICINE INDUSTRY. There's so much fucking shit out there and you say "not to help medicine" What kinda stupid fucking talk is that. Medicine is constantly changing. And these CORPORATIONS, which you seem to hate, don't make any money unless their bio-chemist make a better drug that people will buy. I know a surgeon who donates a qtr of his earnings to a hospital to research a cure to cancer and aids. Yes, Corporations promote their drugs a lot, DO YOU KNOW HOW LONG IT TAKES FOR A FUCKING DRUG TO FINALLY BE ABLE TO THE PUBLIC??? Havn't you got something better to worry about other than people who make it big and make corporations. What about your polio vaccination and those anti-biotics you had to take. Viruses and diseases are constantly changing, so chemists need to produce different and better drugs to kill them. Its an on-going process. And those Corporations are the ones getting the drugs distributed. This is America, those people worked a hard life to get where they are and you bitch and whine about it. Why can't you just respect them for making it that far. And if you think you're being swindled by a company, go to one of their competitors who has a lower price. You know, competition.

You've got no room to talk shit for something you don't know about,
Dilauded


Edited by Dilauded (01/23/03 05:43 PM)


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Invisiblesir tripsalot
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Re: My plan to clean up the Pharmaceutical industry. [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #1243679 - 01/23/03 05:48 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

You sound stressed! Can I recommomend Sinnitrex? It WILL cause Diarrhea, Headaches or migranes, Anal leakage, shrinking of testicles and make you go blind. But hey, you won't be so stressed anymore. :grin:


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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Re: My plan to clean up the Pharmaceutical industry. [Re: Dilauded]
    #1243720 - 01/23/03 05:59 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

>>>these CORPORATIONS, which you seem to hate, don't make any money unless their bio-chemist make a better drug that people will buy.<<<

They don't make any money unless they sell their products. The quality of the products isn't the only major factor, but It should be.

>>>I know a surgeon who donates a qtr of his earnings to a hospital to research a cure to cancer and aids.<<<

People like that should be running shit, but they ain't.

They're run by stockholders who are blind to everything except numbers and symbols.

BXLN.........+3/4......149 7/8 -- " YAAAY! "


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Anonymous

Re: My plan to clean up the Pharmaceutical industry. [Re: Dilauded]
    #1243805 - 01/23/03 06:32 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

What are you so stressed out about? One of your parents must be in the industry or something. Corporations = money makers. I stick by what I said. Baby Hitler is basically saying corporations shouldn't be charged with the medicine industry, the gov't should. But I'm sure you already knew all that, that's why you went on off on that tangent screaming about something that has nothing to do with the subject at hand for 5 minutes.


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OfflineDilauded
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Re: My plan to clean up the Pharmaceutical industry. [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #1243821 - 01/23/03 06:38 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

The quality of the products isn't the only major factor, but It should be.




Ok I'll try to explain this better. There's 3 different types of drugs that do the same thing, which is kill a virus/infection. There's the generic brand which is the cheapest, weakest and you need to be on it for a week to get over the illness and must take 2 pills three times a day. The second drug is stronger and you only need to take 1 pill 3 times a day. Little more expensive and has different approach to killing the virus. The third drug is the strongest drug on the market against infections. Say you have a throat infection/virus from mucus dripping down your throat and finally it gets infected. You take 1 pill once a day and after an hour or two of taking the first pill your sore throat goes away. And by the end of the day that one pill has fought off a majority of the germs. You take it the next 2 days to make sure its gone. This drug is called Levaquin.

They even have a drug to kill anthrax if you ever come in contact with it. There's a drug that stops pain without being an opiate and you can function normally without feeling doped up.

Drugs that have just come out have gone through YEARS of testing before they can be finally used on humans. Drugs are in development and testing right this moment. This all cost a LOT of money, so what if the company promotes it, they ought to, they made the drug and might as well make the money off it.

So really, they do spend time on the quality of their drugs,
Dilauded


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OfflineDilauded
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Re: My plan to clean up the Pharmaceutical industry. [Re: ]
    #1243847 - 01/23/03 06:49 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Oh well the government is the last thing I want to be managing medicine. If anyone would fuck up the government would.

Quote:

There should be a single source, government owned, for all information about pharmaceutical drugs. It should be factual, and contain pages, and pages of boring statistics, and data.



They already have something like that. If you goto Ekards, you can ask them and they'll give you a print out. Or you can go on www.pubmed.com and search whatever. Or go buy a pill book and have all the pills and what category they fall under. Or a pill website. Anything but the fucking government.

I work in a hospital and my parents have nothing to do with medicine.
Dilauded


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Invisiblecarbonhoots
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Re: My plan to clean up the Pharmaceutical industry. [Re: Dilauded]
    #1243849 - 01/23/03 06:49 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

The generic is the weakest? No way! It's the same.

medicine shouldn't be profit driven.


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OfflineDilauded
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Re: My plan to clean up the Pharmaceutical industry. [Re: carbonhoots]
    #1243907 - 01/23/03 07:08 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

The generic is the weakest? No way! It's the same.



Yea you're right generic is same, my bad. Then I change the wording to a weaker drug instead of generic.

Quote:

medicine shouldn't be profit driven.



I take it you live in Canada. Isn't the medicare socialized there?



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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Re: My plan to clean up the Pharmaceutical industry. [Re: Dilauded]
    #1243932 - 01/23/03 07:16 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

But why would they spend billions on marketing, and promotion if they didn't have to? They pay off the doctors to push their products off on people. This often results in doctors prescribing some new drug that is no more effective, or even less effective than a cheaper one.

If they weren't blowing nearly half their resources on pushing their drugs, they'd have better drugs for doctors to choose from. People would get better treatment for less, and the companies would still get the money they deserve.


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OfflineDilauded
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Re: My plan to clean up the Pharmaceutical industry. [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #1244001 - 01/23/03 07:44 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

I'll talk more bout this tomorrow, i'm tired.

G'night


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OfflinePhred
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Re: My plan to clean up the Pharmaceutical industry. [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #1244067 - 01/23/03 08:07 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Baby Hitler writes:

But why would they spend billions on marketing, and promotion if they didn't have to?

They wouldn't. No successful company stays successful for long by expending revenue on unnecessary expenses.The fact is, they DO have to.

They pay off the doctors to push their products off on people.

Not exactly so. Most of the "promotional" costs spent on Doctors are in fact in the form of free samples and pamphlets.

Doctors for the most part are inherently cautious when it comes to new medications. To make matters worse, they rarely have a lot of spare time to keep up with all the developments in a multiplicity of fields, so they depend on abstracts and case studies and survey results (funded by the pharmacos as part of the government required approval process) to decide when to start recommending a new drug to their patients. Left on their own, they rarely change the prescribing habits they have acquired. When I lived in Canada, I had a friend who was a pharmaceutical rep, so I know a bit more about how this works than many people do.

To make matters worse, a typical G.P. will often know less about treatment options for relatively rare conditions than some of his patients who suffer from it. It is not unusual for a patient to come to his doctor with a specific request for a new medication that the doctor himself has yet to hear of. I have done this myself on more than one occasion. How did I hear about it? Through the advertising of the pharmaco. If that company had never advertised it, but restricted its publicity to peer-reviewed epidemiology studies in The Lancet or the New England Journal of Medicine, I would never have heard of it.

This often results in doctors prescribing some new drug that is no more effective, or even less effective than a cheaper one.

Sometimes it does. Sometimes it doesn't. The point is that without advertising, many doctors would still be prescribing penicillin rather than ampicillin or erythromycin, and aspirin rather than acetaminophen or ibuprofen.

If they weren't blowing nearly half their resources on pushing their drugs, they'd have better drugs for doctors to choose from.

If they can't SELL the drugs they have, they have no resources to develop better ones.

People would get better treatment for less...

Not necessarily true.

... and the companies would still get the money they deserve.

Not necessarily true.

pinky


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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Re: My plan to clean up the Pharmaceutical industry. [Re: Phred]
    #1244082 - 01/23/03 08:19 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

>>>Most of the "promotional" costs spent on Doctors are in fact in the form of free samples and pamphlets.
<<<

I doubt that, a lot of it is spent on 4 day cruises to the Bahamas.


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OfflineJammer
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Re: My plan to clean up the Pharmaceutical industry. [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #1244088 - 01/23/03 08:22 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

All pharmaceutical marketing, and promotion would be banned.





While were at it, lets also bann hospitals, lawers and politicians from ANY commerical advertising!  :smirk:     


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>>Jammer>>


Edited by Jammer (01/23/03 08:24 PM)


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OfflineGoBlue!
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Re: My plan to clean up the Pharmaceutical industry. [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #1244094 - 01/23/03 08:27 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

>>>Most of the "promotional" costs spent on Doctors are in fact in the form of free samples and pamphlets.
<<<

I doubt that, a lot of it is spent on 4 day cruises to the Bahamas.




I can verify that. My girlfriend works in a hospital, and she says the doctors will always push the drugs whose sales reps provide them with the best perks.


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:smile:  Just stating my thoughts, not trying to offend  :smile:


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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Re: My plan to clean up the Pharmaceutical industry. [Re: Jammer]
    #1244147 - 01/23/03 08:51 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

But what about the poor, poor advertising industry?

WON'T SOMEONE PLEASE THINK ABOUT THE ADVERTISING INDUSTRY!!!!!


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OfflineJammer
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Re: My plan to clean up the Pharmaceutical industry. [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #1244193 - 01/23/03 09:13 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

But what about the poor, poor advertising industry?

WON'T SOMEONE PLEASE THINK ABOUT THE ADVERTISING INDUSTRY!!!!! 




Yea I can just see it now.. The advertising industry would run a billion dollor ad campaign promoting it's self.

Face it, somethings dont need to be advertised. Decades ago it was ileagle for lawers to advertise... Also why the hell do we need HOSPITALS advertising? I mean like, why stop here...why not just allow PRISIONS to advertise too!! (might be pretty damm entertaining anyway)  :smirk:

Shesh hospital ads just kill me (so to speak)... Like when I need to dial #911 I'm going to be thinking about which hospital had the slickest commercial... it's just stupid, and should be stoped... let people use there own heads when it comes to life's most important decisions thats not influenced by a subconscious reaction to TV/RADIO advertising.       


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>>Jammer>>


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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Re: My plan to clean up the Pharmaceutical industry. [Re: Jammer]
    #1244257 - 01/23/03 09:41 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Have you seen the commercials for plastic?

I was like "Man I gotta get me some palstic!"


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