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InvisibleBEEP
Registered: 01/06/08
Posts: 1,385
Need help building a flowhood. *DELETED*
    #12379669 - 04/12/10 05:02 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

Post deleted by BEEP

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OfflineCloneufc
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: BEEP]
    #12379722 - 04/12/10 05:10 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

Save yourself the trouble and order it here. http://www.fungi.com/tools/airfilters.html
The filters are designed just for mycology and all the spec's on the filter are posted. It's 99.99% efficient. The smallest filter is only $89.95.

Edited by Cloneufc (04/12/10 05:11 PM)

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InvisibleBEEP
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: Cloneufc]
    #12379753 - 04/12/10 05:16 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

I've looked into buying one already made, they're too expensive, the cheapest one i saw there was $530.00 and it's really small.

They don't hgave the size I want either.

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OfflineDragonChaser
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: BEEP]
    #12379758 - 04/12/10 05:17 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

He's just talking about the filter dude, not the actual flowhood.


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OfflineTheBandit
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: DragonChaser]
    #12379776 - 04/12/10 05:20 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

oh wow.

never realized they sold the filters.
that with a blower, and some wood & screws....you've got yourself a flow hood.

very nice.


--------------------




[quote]RogerRabbit said:
Ah, that explains it.  Typical know-it-all noob.  We get a few thousand just like you register here every year.  They try a few grows, fail miserably and then after a few months or one bad trip, go back to sniffing glue, never to be seen again.

We have a basic pf tek that's idiot proof enough for noobs to get fucked up with their friends. 

Mycologists on the other hand grow for the love of growing.  They want to experiment with various species, substrates, and fruiting environments. They'll move on to isolate strains, attempt hybridization, and in general treat cultivation as an artform, rather than a chore that must be performed as a means to an end.  They'll work twice as hard for a ten percent gain, just for the love of perfection.  These are the ones who will isolate strains, not the dumb fucks who treat mushrooms as a drug, or even worse, a pathogen, as if mushrooms cause disease.
RR [/quote]

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OfflineCloneufc
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: DragonChaser]
    #12379807 - 04/12/10 05:26 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

DragonChaser said:
He's just talking about the filter dude, not the actual flowhood.




Exactly. Just the filter. I bought the filter that cost $129 dollars. I was able to grow several pounds of cubensis dry weight in a month and half from that filter. You wouldnt need a bigger filter than that unless you were a commercial mushroom farmer.Why wouldnt they have the size filter you need?

Edited by Cloneufc (04/12/10 05:29 PM)

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OfflineDragonChaser
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: Cloneufc]
    #12379865 - 04/12/10 05:36 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

I think he just doesn't realize they sell individual filters, he looked at the website earlier and only saw flowhoods.

Thanks for the link though, now I know where to go when I want to buy a reliable filter.


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InvisibleBEEP
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: Cloneufc]
    #12380088 - 04/12/10 06:16 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Cloneufc said:
Quote:

DragonChaser said:
He's just talking about the filter dude, not the actual flowhood.




You wouldnt need a bigger filter than that unless you were a commercial mushroom farmer.




That is actually the long term goal.

I had no idea Fungiperfecti sold filters, I'll have to look more, I guess the sell the matching blowers too?

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OfflineTheBandit
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: BEEP]
    #12382116 - 04/12/10 10:49 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

so the all-purpose blower for $179 on this page: http://www.fungi.com/tools/fans.html


& the 12X24 hepa filter on this page: http://www.fungi.com/tools/airfilters.html


plus some wood, and screws....and you've got a flow hood?
is it really all that simple?


& is 12X24 a decent size for bags?
because g2g with bags would be amazing.


--------------------




[quote]RogerRabbit said:
Ah, that explains it.  Typical know-it-all noob.  We get a few thousand just like you register here every year.  They try a few grows, fail miserably and then after a few months or one bad trip, go back to sniffing glue, never to be seen again.

We have a basic pf tek that's idiot proof enough for noobs to get fucked up with their friends. 

Mycologists on the other hand grow for the love of growing.  They want to experiment with various species, substrates, and fruiting environments. They'll move on to isolate strains, attempt hybridization, and in general treat cultivation as an artform, rather than a chore that must be performed as a means to an end.  They'll work twice as hard for a ten percent gain, just for the love of perfection.  These are the ones who will isolate strains, not the dumb fucks who treat mushrooms as a drug, or even worse, a pathogen, as if mushrooms cause disease.
RR [/quote]

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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: TheBandit]
    #12382191 - 04/12/10 11:00 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

Make it air tight.  You don't want leakage of air around the HEPA filter. Build a plenum at least as large as the filter, to equalize pressure on the back side. That blower and filter combo should be fine.  You might end up wanting a motor speed controller, as about 200 cfm to 250 cfm is what you'll want out the front.

I do LOTS of large spawn bags with a 12 X 24 flowhood, about 4,000 in the last three months.  You do G2G with the receiving bag laying on its side to keep it in the sterile air flow.
RR


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"I've never had a failed experiment.  I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison

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OfflineTheBandit
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #12382272 - 04/12/10 11:11 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

very interesting.

it's time to start saving my pennies, because i would love being able to work outside the confinements of a glovebox. i'd feel so much more safe doing agar this way too.


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[quote]RogerRabbit said:
Ah, that explains it.  Typical know-it-all noob.  We get a few thousand just like you register here every year.  They try a few grows, fail miserably and then after a few months or one bad trip, go back to sniffing glue, never to be seen again.

We have a basic pf tek that's idiot proof enough for noobs to get fucked up with their friends. 

Mycologists on the other hand grow for the love of growing.  They want to experiment with various species, substrates, and fruiting environments. They'll move on to isolate strains, attempt hybridization, and in general treat cultivation as an artform, rather than a chore that must be performed as a means to an end.  They'll work twice as hard for a ten percent gain, just for the love of perfection.  These are the ones who will isolate strains, not the dumb fucks who treat mushrooms as a drug, or even worse, a pathogen, as if mushrooms cause disease.
RR [/quote]

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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: TheBandit]
    #12382279 - 04/12/10 11:12 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

Don't forget the pre-filter.  It will make your expensive HEPA last a lifetime of hobby use.
RR


--------------------
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semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat

"I've never had a failed experiment.  I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison

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OfflineTheBandit
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #12382667 - 04/13/10 12:13 AM (14 years, 9 months ago)

pre-filter?

what would that just be the same filter, but behind the original one?


--------------------




[quote]RogerRabbit said:
Ah, that explains it.  Typical know-it-all noob.  We get a few thousand just like you register here every year.  They try a few grows, fail miserably and then after a few months or one bad trip, go back to sniffing glue, never to be seen again.

We have a basic pf tek that's idiot proof enough for noobs to get fucked up with their friends. 

Mycologists on the other hand grow for the love of growing.  They want to experiment with various species, substrates, and fruiting environments. They'll move on to isolate strains, attempt hybridization, and in general treat cultivation as an artform, rather than a chore that must be performed as a means to an end.  They'll work twice as hard for a ten percent gain, just for the love of perfection.  These are the ones who will isolate strains, not the dumb fucks who treat mushrooms as a drug, or even worse, a pathogen, as if mushrooms cause disease.
RR [/quote]

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InvisibleBEEP
Registered: 01/06/08
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: TheBandit]
    #12384201 - 04/13/10 09:33 AM (14 years, 9 months ago)

No, It's a furnace filter in front of the blowers intake to keep large particles like hair and dirt away from the hepa filter.


Does anyone know if it matters which direction the blower is facing, like does it have to blow towards the filter or can it blow against a side wall or something? I'm not sure if it would make a difference or not it doesn't seem like it would since it's air tight and building the same pressure.

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OfflineTheBandit
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: BEEP]
    #12384210 - 04/13/10 09:34 AM (14 years, 9 months ago)

furnace filter?


they got one of those on fungi.com?


--------------------




[quote]RogerRabbit said:
Ah, that explains it.  Typical know-it-all noob.  We get a few thousand just like you register here every year.  They try a few grows, fail miserably and then after a few months or one bad trip, go back to sniffing glue, never to be seen again.

We have a basic pf tek that's idiot proof enough for noobs to get fucked up with their friends. 

Mycologists on the other hand grow for the love of growing.  They want to experiment with various species, substrates, and fruiting environments. They'll move on to isolate strains, attempt hybridization, and in general treat cultivation as an artform, rather than a chore that must be performed as a means to an end.  They'll work twice as hard for a ten percent gain, just for the love of perfection.  These are the ones who will isolate strains, not the dumb fucks who treat mushrooms as a drug, or even worse, a pathogen, as if mushrooms cause disease.
RR [/quote]

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InvisibleMrPinkFloyd


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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: TheBandit]
    #12384371 - 04/13/10 10:14 AM (14 years, 9 months ago)

No, they sell them at all the *mart places and supermarkets.  Something like this

I use a small 12x12 one.

As for the way the blower is blowing, you want it blowing NOT directly at the filter.  You want the pressure that builds in the plenum to be the driving force of the air leaving the face of the filter.

Edited by MrPinkFloyd (04/13/10 10:16 AM)

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OfflineDragonChaser
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #12384384 - 04/13/10 10:17 AM (14 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

RogerRabbit said:
Build a plenum at least as large as the filter, to equalize pressure on the back side.





Sorry, I'm confused now... I just thought a plenum was a little plate (like dinner sized plate thing) that you would place under the blower output (assuming your blower is pointed downwards)... how do you fit something as big as a whole side of the flow hood into the flow hood itself?


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My name is Mud

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InvisibleMrPinkFloyd


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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: DragonChaser]
    #12384979 - 04/13/10 12:18 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

The "plenum" in your flowhood is just the inside of the box that is not the filter.  So say your HEPA is 8 inches deep, you want your box to be a total of 16 inches deep, so you have 8 inches of empty space, aka the "plenum," behind your filter.  The blower blows into the plenum, creating pressure (which is all happening behind the filter, in the box) and what happens is when that pressure becomes enough that the air in the plenum (your box) is forced through the filter.  This pressure is what creates the "laminar flow" of sterile air.

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InvisibleBEEP
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #12409110 - 04/17/10 01:37 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

OK, I got them in the mail, I ordered a 18" x 24" filter and the universal blower, now I'm trying to wire it and I just want to make sure I got it right, I've also been reading this thread with the same blower.

I figured on my own that the black and blue go together and connect to the black on my 2 prong cord, the white is by it self connected to the white on my cord and the orange and red go together and are put aside, is this correct?

Also the manual and everything stresses it needs to be grounded somehow, there is a half green half yellow wire coming from the motor housing going to the blower output area screwed into it and theirs a ground symbol sticker next to it, so is it safe to assume that it's already been grounded for me or is there something else I need to do?

I really don't want to blow this thing up the first day I get it :lol:

E: I'm reading more threads and I'm starting to get confused, do I need a special plug or something?

Edited by BEEP (04/17/10 01:46 PM)

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InvisibleBEEP
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: BEEP]
    #12409966 - 04/17/10 04:12 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Hmm, Will I need to put duct tape or something over half the intake, FP for some reason say they match but in the thread above RR says it's way to big even for a 4' x 4'?

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InvisibleSci-Fi
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: BEEP]
    #12410147 - 04/17/10 04:49 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

BEEP said:

OK, I got them in the mail, I ordered a 18" x 24" filter and the universal blower, now I'm trying to wire it and I just want to make sure I got it right, I've also been reading this thread with the same blower.

I figured on my own that the black and blue go together and connect to the black on my 2 prong cord, the white is by it self connected to the white on my cord and the orange and red go together and are put aside, is this correct?

Also the manual and everything stresses it needs to be grounded somehow, there is a half green half yellow wire coming from the motor housing going to the blower output area screwed into it and theirs a ground symbol sticker next to it, so is it safe to assume that it's already been grounded for me or is there something else I need to do?

I really don't want to blow this thing up the first day I get it :lol:

E: I'm reading more threads and I'm starting to get confused, do I need a special plug or something?

Hmm, Will I need to put duct tape or something over half the intake, FP for some reason say they match but in the thread above RR says it's way to big even for a 4' x 4'?




OK first of all I completely agree with RR. This fan is WAY TOO BIG! The smaller fan FP sells is still a little stronger than I recommend for that size filter, but it will work. If you connect your filter to that fan you're likely going to damage it. You should shoot for a feet per minute speed of between 80- 100. The fan you bought will push a minimum 350 Feet per minute through your filter! Three times more than you want! I'm afraid their website is completely inaccurate in this regard. I have never seen a hepa filter rated for even close to that speed even if money was no object. You need to return that fan and buy this one. It's almost perfect for your filter. it's still just a little bit to big.

The all those leads on your current fan are for different voltage sources. Connecting the two different colors together doesn't sound right to me at all. It's possible it will short out and blow up. It's very possible it will permanently damage the fan. I can't tell you exactly how to wire it up without some information from the manual. Type out word for word anything in regard to the wiring and I can tell you how to connect it. OR Take a picture of the manual especially if there are any wiring diagrams (basically a bunch of lines) The green/yellow wire is the ground and should only be connected to the ground.
And no you don't need a special plug.

Edited by Sci-Fi (04/17/10 05:09 PM)

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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: BEEP]
    #12410248 - 04/17/10 05:12 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Post a picture of the data plate showing the electrical connections and I'll tell you how to wire it.  You might have to send a PM and link me back to the thread.  I'm only here for a few minutes at a time, and a few days in between sometimes.

The green ground wire connects to the chassis of the motor and also to the green wire on your cord.  For the rest, I'll need the diagram.
RR


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"I've never had a failed experiment.  I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison

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InvisibleSci-Fi
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #12410383 - 04/17/10 05:47 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

LOL, just quote my post next time, it's faster :awetongue:


Edited by Sci-Fi (04/17/10 06:06 PM)

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InvisibleBEEP
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: Sci-Fi]
    #12431595 - 04/21/10 11:54 AM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

RogerRabbit said:
Post a picture of the data plate showing the electrical connections and I'll tell you how to wire it.  You might have to send a PM and link me back to the thread.  I'm only here for a few minutes at a time, and a few days in between sometimes.

The green ground wire connects to the chassis of the motor and also to the green wire on your cord.  For the rest, I'll need the diagram.
RR




So you're saying I need a 3 prong cord and I connect this wire to the green wire on my cord
I'm a little confused. Do I need another wire and connect it to the once pictured then connect that to the green on my cord?


here is everything I could get off the blower.




Also, when I build the plenum around the filter does the filter have to be facing a certain way, theres a foam strip around it on one side that I want to hide in the box but the top says "test air flow this way" like the air needs to be pushing out that side, i'm not sure.

Oh and I called fungiperfecti and spoke to someone about the blower, they still swear that it's the perfect blower for that filter, they said they have been building them and using them that way for 10+ years. :shrug:

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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: BEEP]
    #12431908 - 04/21/10 12:53 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

The foam is usually to seal around the seat you make to push the filter into.  Make the air flow the direction of the arrow on the side of the filter.

Get a three pronged cord.  It's usually cheaper to buy a three prong heavy duty extension cord, which you then cut the female end off and strip the wires back.  That's usually more economical than buying the parts separately.

Connect the green on your power cord to the green on your motor.  This should also bond to a screw on the metal parts of the blower/motor.

Connect the white on your cord to the white on the motor.

Since you're using 115 volts, twist the blue and black motor leads together, and then connect them to the black wire on your power cord.

Connect the orange and red wires together, and then insulate them away from the others.

Doing this, the motor will run any time you have it plugged in.  The cord and wall socket become your 'switch', which is perfectly legal and safe.  Should you decide to add a switch later, be sure to get a 'motor rated' switch, not a light switch.  Connect it in series with the black wire on your cord.
RR


--------------------
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semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat

"I've never had a failed experiment.  I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison

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InvisibleBEEP
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #12432759 - 04/21/10 03:22 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

RogerRabbit said:
The foam is usually to seal around the seat you make to push the filter into.  Make the air flow the direction of the arrow on the side of the filter.





T%he foam is supposed to go on the inside of the plenum into the seat that's there to hold the filter in place? well the arrow is pointing toward the foam side and there aren't any other arrows on the filter :confused:




Back to the blower, I'm still a little unsure on what to do about the green/yellow one, I disconnected it from where it was originally like pictured a few posts up and connected one end to the other grounding thing then connected the other to the green on the cord.

here's what it all looks like

It's hard to tell whats what but everything is how it's supposed to be, I just want to make sure I got the grounding right.

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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: BEEP]
    #12432933 - 04/21/10 04:00 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Yes, it's grounding the chassis of the motor/blower and that's what you want.  The idea is if the motor shorts out or a wire comes loose and touches the metal, it will trip the breaker.  If the metal wasn't grounded, the breaker wouldn't trip and you could get electrocuted from touching it.  It looks ready to plug in.  Once you see that it runs, route your cord through the knockout into that junction box, and then put the cover on.  Get a romex connector to act as a strain relief and to protect the cord.

The foam is to help seal around the seat.  Your box is going to need a lip at the exit end of the filter to get a good seal.  You don't want air bypassing the filter and coming out around the edges.
RR


--------------------
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semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat

"I've never had a failed experiment.  I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison

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InvisibleSci-Fi
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #12435516 - 04/22/10 12:04 AM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

BEEP said:
Oh and I called fungiperfecti and spoke to someone about the blower, they still swear that it's the perfect blower for that filter, they said they have been building them and using them that way for 10  years. :shrug:




What does the test sheet say for the rated CFM of that filter? It should have been packaged with the filter or on a label on the side of the frame. They give you the maximum CFM the filter will still be hepa rated. I'd be really interested to see a 24 x 18 hepa rated  @ 1200 cfm. Either way It's going to be windy in front of that hood.

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InvisibleBEEP
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: Sci-Fi]
    #12437377 - 04/22/10 11:53 AM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Like, 450 or something, I'm just going to put it together and see, maybe seal a couple furnace filters in front.

What do you think I should do?

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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: BEEP]
    #12437411 - 04/22/10 11:57 AM (14 years, 8 months ago)

I think you should build it and if it blows to hard, block off part of the intake to restrict flow.  A more expensive fix is a motor speed controller. 

Always use a pre-filter.  Otherwise, your expensive hepa will need to be changed twice a year when it clogs up.  Using a good pre-filter, the HEPA will last for thousands of hours.
RR


--------------------
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semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat

"I've never had a failed experiment.  I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison

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InvisibleBEEP
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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #12437491 - 04/22/10 12:08 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

My idea was to put two in front of the intake and insted of them just sitting there, make an airtight seal with silicone or something, if that doesn't work I'll block more off.

I don't think I got the chance to thank you for coming back to this thread so many times, so thanks :smile:

And thanks to everyone else that helped out too :thumbup:

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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: BEEP]
    #12439334 - 04/22/10 05:28 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

I would recommend a 3M Filtrete Ultimate Allergen Reduction filter. They can actually be ordered in a in 18 x 24 size. They will reduce most of the contaminates before they ever make it to the HEPA making your Flow hood much more efficient and your HEPA will last much longer. It would normally cause a slight loss in airflow, but in your case it's only going to help you. A similar filter would be anything rated MERV 10, 11, or 12.

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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: Sci-Fi]
    #12445727 - 04/23/10 06:34 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Thanks sci-fi, I got some filters over it already though, but I am going to look for a speed controller at home depot. It is blowing pretty hard.

It's also not blowing through consistently, the area where the blower is positioned is pushing more air through (go figure..) is it going to be a problem?

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Re: Need help building a flowhood. *DELETED* [Re: BEEP]
    #12446767 - 04/23/10 10:16 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: Sci-Fi]
    #12446831 - 04/23/10 10:35 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

It's also not blowing through consistently, the area where the blower is positioned is pushing more air through (go figure..) is it going to be a problem?




The blower should pressurize the plenum as shown in the pic of the fp hood above.  It shouldn't be blowing right on the filter.  Block off part of the pre-filter to reduce flow.  It will accomplish the same thing as reducing speed, and reduce load and power consumption on the motor too.
RR


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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #12446939 - 04/23/10 11:00 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

The blower is definatly not blowing towards the filter, it's blowing straight down like in that picture, it's not centered though, but my guess is, even if it was it wouldn't be consistent at the center and the sides either.

Tomorrow I'm going to take the blower off and add some wood on the inside of the plenum so it hits that first.

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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #12446958 - 04/23/10 11:05 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

The blower should pressurize the plenum as shown in the pic of the fp hood above.  It shouldn't be blowing right on the filter.  Block off part of the pre-filter to reduce flow.  It will accomplish the same thing as reducing speed, and reduce load and power consumption on the motor too.
RR




You don't think blocking the intake would cause the motor to have to work harder and draw more electricity??

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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: Sci-Fi]
    #12447140 - 04/23/10 11:35 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

You don't think blocking the intake would cause the motor to have to work harder and draw more electricity??




No.  Air doesn't work like hydraulic fluid. In commercial HVAC systems, a varicone is commonly used to regulate airflow, thus keeping the building at the correct static pressure.  If static pressure is too high, the doors don't close, if too low, dirt enters the building.  However, the blower motor runs at the same speed all the time and the intake is blocked to control pressure.  You can test this yourself.  Block part of the intake on a blower while  a clamp-on ammeter is around one of the motor leads.  You'll see a decrease in current.

To BEEP, it sounds like you didn't build your plenum large enough.  If the same pressure is exerted across the back of the filter, the flow will be even out the front.
RR


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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #12455527 - 04/25/10 06:47 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Beep, I don't know much about flowhoods, but do you think this type of  ceiling fan dimmer would work for regulating your blower speed?

Would it work? it's cheap though.. but you should ask a pro.

:cheers:


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Looking for Lion's Mane and Yellow Oyster culture. Will trade for: Shiitake/King Oyster/Blue Oyster/White Beech.
Me for info.



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Re: Need help building a flowhood. *DELETED* [Re: ElSeta]
    #12457615 - 04/26/10 01:04 AM (14 years, 8 months ago)

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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: Sci-Fi]
    #12458647 - 04/26/10 09:24 AM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Don't be so sure about that.  I wouldn't use it on a flowhood blower.  Also, speed controllers don't function as rheostats.  A rheostat is a variable resister which heats up as the voltage is dropped across it.  You don't want the voltage dropping on a blower motor.

That unit may or may not work depending on how the motor windings are laid out.  Some motors can't be controlled by other than frequency variation.  The speed is determined by the 60 hz current.  That's why the same motor running in Europe on 50 hz will run slower.

With all the made in china crap on the market these days, you never know what's going to work or not and they don't give enough info on that link to make a positive determination.
RR


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Re: Need help building a flowhood. *DELETED* [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #12461190 - 04/26/10 05:35 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: Sci-Fi]
    #12498334 - 05/03/10 10:54 AM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Sci-Fi said:
There are very few fans that don't work with a rheostat.




Wrong.

The speed of an AC motor is determined by the frequency in cycles per second(HZ), not the current or voltage.  If you reduce voltage on an AC motor and leave the frequency of the supply constant, you'll burn out the motor.  Don't confuse an AC motor with a DC motor.  In addition, the NEC requires devices to be listed for the application.  Dimmers and/or rheostats are not listed for AC motor speed control.
RR


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Re: Need help building a flowhood. *DELETED* [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #12500155 - 05/03/10 04:42 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

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Edited by Sci-Fi (05/03/10 05:00 PM)

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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: Sci-Fi]
    #12500354 - 05/03/10 05:19 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Those are not for use on a blower motor.  In addition, it would be a violation of the National Electrical Code article 430 to do so.  There's a huge difference in the design and windings between a ceiling fan which runs at 50 to 150 RPM, and a blower which runs at 1750 RPM.  This isn't a point to argue.  The individual is free to do whatever he wishes, but no licensed electrician would ever connect a ceiling fan dimmer/controller to a squirrel cage blower motor.
RR


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Re: Need help building a flowhood. *DELETED* [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #12500584 - 05/03/10 05:58 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: Sci-Fi]
    #12500801 - 05/03/10 06:35 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

I won't continue to argue the point with you.  Finish your apprenticeship, get your electrical license, and if you still wish to argue, go for it.

As said already, the best way to reduce air flow is to reduce part of the intake.  This cuts down on the current drawn by the motor, and it's not being dissipated across a resistor as heat/wasted energy.  This is standard operating procedure in HVAC applications.
RR


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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #12500963 - 05/03/10 07:00 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Maybe in some Jurassic era installation before modern VFD controllers. Duct static  is maintained by a VFD controlled air handler motor.

Edited by Sci-Fi (05/11/10 10:29 PM)

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Re: Need help building a flowhood. *DELETED* [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #12501131 - 05/03/10 07:27 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Reason for deletion: Busy removing foot from mouth

Edited by Sci-Fi (05/17/10 03:47 PM)

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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: Sci-Fi]
    #12501736 - 05/03/10 09:25 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

I'm starting to doubt you as a cultivator RR




And I'm starting to feel really sorry for your journeyman.  :nono:

I had an apprentice like you once.  His previous two journeymen had sent him back to the union hall for arguing all the time rather than trying to learn.  I was the oldest journeyman on the job so told the steward I'd take the kid, because after raising four of my own, I had the patience of a saint.  Two weeks was all I could take before washing my hands of him, and he was kicked out of the program.  You only get two chances and the third journeyman to fire you is your last straw.

Electrical equipment must be listed for the use.  A ceiling fan dimmer is not listed as a motor speed controller.  They don't give the horsepower rating, which is required for motor speed controllers.  A ceiling fan dimmer is also not a VFD.  As for your Jurassic Park analogy, varicones are still used to this day in brand new data centers to maintain positive pressure in buildings with hundreds of thousands of square feet.  When the varicone closes, the amperage of the BLOWER motor is reduced.  Squirrel cage blowers are not fans.  You need to learn the distinction before you embarrass yourself further. 

Just because you say it will work on 90% of the motors out there does not mean it will.  However, to humor you perhaps he doesn't want to find out if his is one of the ten percent of the motors that will burn up. 

You should also be aware of an 'electrician' in NY a few years ago who hooked up a dimmer switch to a 'non rated' ceiling fan.  He tested it and it worked, so he left the house.  A few hours later, the fan overheated and shorted out, catching the house on fire and killed two children.  He was charged with 2nd degree murder, later reduced to manslaughter and sentenced to ten years in prison.  He also has to live with the fact that he killed two kids.  Electricity is not to be fooled with and it's the reason we have codes.
RR


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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #12501781 - 05/03/10 09:34 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

SHAM-POW! :spank:

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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: Sci-Fi]
    #12502254 - 05/03/10 10:50 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Sci-Fi said:

Amp Readings from a fan I just tested




A fan? This discussion is not about fans. Fans are very different creatures than blowers. I have done this test properly with a clamp on amp meter and a blower and have seen the amperage drop in real time. I know someone very well who has worked in heating and cooling for 15 years who has verified this...as well as my other friend who is a mechanical engineer and one of the smartest people I know.

"I'm starting to doubt you as a cultivator RR."<====?????seriously man.
Please don't disrespect someone unless you know what you are talking about and who you are talking to...

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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: Seagoat]
    #12502278 - 05/03/10 10:55 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

i wish i hadn't posted in this thread so it wouldn't keep popping up on my list.


--------------------




[quote]RogerRabbit said:
Ah, that explains it.  Typical know-it-all noob.  We get a few thousand just like you register here every year.  They try a few grows, fail miserably and then after a few months or one bad trip, go back to sniffing glue, never to be seen again.

We have a basic pf tek that's idiot proof enough for noobs to get fucked up with their friends. 

Mycologists on the other hand grow for the love of growing.  They want to experiment with various species, substrates, and fruiting environments. They'll move on to isolate strains, attempt hybridization, and in general treat cultivation as an artform, rather than a chore that must be performed as a means to an end.  They'll work twice as hard for a ten percent gain, just for the love of perfection.  These are the ones who will isolate strains, not the dumb fucks who treat mushrooms as a drug, or even worse, a pathogen, as if mushrooms cause disease.
RR [/quote]

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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: TheBandit]
    #12546039 - 05/11/10 10:11 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Here are my 2 cents BEEP. This may illuminate your thoughts.
SPEED CONTROL


--------------------
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Looking for Lion's Mane and Yellow Oyster culture. Will trade for: Shiitake/King Oyster/Blue Oyster/White Beech.
Me for info.



Yes, you can see the real reality through a little window. Now, build a door.

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Re: Need help building a flowhood. [Re: ElSeta]
    #12546176 - 05/11/10 10:42 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

That's a good link, thanks! :lol: operation is misspelled though. But really that helps, I was going to get the triac thing when I get to it, right now the intake is covered, only 8²" is open.

IDK what FP is trying to pull, they obviously don't match. I think someone already said this but I'm pretty sure the small blower they have is even to big for the 18x24.

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Re: Need help building a flowhood. *DELETED* [Re: Sci-Fi]
    #12546232 - 05/11/10 10:54 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Here is the definition of drag. Which is exactly what your creating by covering the fan.

In fluid dynamics, drag (sometimes called air resistance or fluid resistance) refers to forces that oppose the relative motion of an object through a fluid (a liquid or gas). Drag forces act in a direction opposite to the oncoming flow velocity.[1] Unlike other resistive forces such as dry friction, which is nearly independent of velocity, drag forces depend on velocity.[2]

For a solid object moving through a fluid, the drag is the component of the net aerodynamic or hydrodynamic force acting opposite to the direction of the movement. The component perpendicular to this direction is considered lift. Therefore drag opposes the motion of the object, and in a powered vehicle it is overcome by thrust.

In astrodynamics, and depending on the situation, atmospheric drag can be regarded as an inefficiency requiring expense of additional energy during launch of the space object or as a bonus simplifying return from orbit.

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Re: Need help building a flowhood. *DELETED* [Re: teknix]
    #12546455 - 05/11/10 11:43 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

I agree and still I have no idea why you replied with this.

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Re: Need help building a flowhood. *DELETED* [Re: Sci-Fi]
    #12578952 - 05/17/10 01:23 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Beep, can you update your thread with pics?


--------------------
-  -  -  -  -  -  -  -  -  -  -  -  -
Looking for Lion's Mane and Yellow Oyster culture. Will trade for: Shiitake/King Oyster/Blue Oyster/White Beech.
Me for info.



Yes, you can see the real reality through a little window. Now, build a door.

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