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Anonymous #1
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Am I just paranoid?
#12193827 - 03/13/10 02:33 AM (14 years, 2 months ago) |
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I'll try to make this an easy read...
Basically, I started a large mushroom grow operation at Jack's house with Don and Jack, and Ronald hung out and watch. I've been buying weed from Don for over 5 years, and been occasionally buying weed from Jack for about a year. I brought over the pressure cooker, brown rice flour, jars, and spore syringes. I found out while mixing substrate jars with Jack and Don that Jack grows weed, and later he showed me his plants. Ronald hung out and watched and I hardly know him, but he lives there at the moment. I dont know Jack very well either but I've known him for about 5 years. I've know Don for about 10 years but have never been close friends with him. I sold Don 1 oz of shrooms on about 5 different occassions around 6-8 months ago. While mixing, one asked what kind of shrooms we're growing and I said "Cubensis".
Three days after mixing the jars and sterilizing them, I came over and injected spores into them with Jack while Ronald watched. Don was not there. I took the empty syringes but left one full one(the extra) there.
During the next week I started to think about how easily they could be informants(maybe they got busted and nobody knows) and be setting me up. I also started thinking about how Don went to school recently to become a cop but dropped out. I began to realize that it wasn't worth it. I started to worry, a lot.
So, about one week after injecting spores into the jars, I went to go check on the jars and(shitty if thier not informants...) sabatoge them. I called and asked Jack if I could come over and he said he'd be home in 30 minutes. I went right then. When I arrived, Ronald was the only one home and he let me in. I said I was there to check on the jars. I went to the jars and put a dirty papper clip into each hole of each to contaminate them. Jack and Ron showed up and we all hung out for a while.
Two weeks later, some how, 12 of the 36 jars(this was only the first part of a much larger grow) had perfect looking mycelium. I couldnt believe it. Since they have never grown before, I said the jars were contsminated and we dumped them all out.
I know I'm sketchy but I cant take such a big risk and I didn't think it through in the beginning. I'm gonna feel so bad if I later find out Im wrong. I also know I fucked up on a lot which is why I retire from growing forever.
If it was a sting operation and was all on camera, how fucked am I? They probably would have kept at least one good jar for evidence.
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Anonymous #2
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Have the confidence to say in front of them that growing was a mistake that you regret, and due to your personal feelings about breaking the law or whatever you will not continue. that's way better than sabotaging your own project! It would show that you discontinued the project instead of coming up with a dirty product.
Involving other people -anyone you don't know well, but pretty much just anyone else- in an illegal activity like this is not a good idea for many reasons.
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Frinkz
Strange



Registered: 02/25/10
Posts: 580
Loc: Yorkshire
Last seen: 13 years, 5 months
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What are you doing here?
Get on the next flight to mexico!
-------------------- uk grow logs
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Anonymous #1
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I may have said when mixing the jars, that the only reason I was doing it was because Don kept bugging me about doing it. Couldn't that be cohersion?
I've noticed lately that I see the exact same group of cars when driving and when I constantly look at one, it turns and then I see another. I've also noticed some of the same faces. Im not on drugs, I'm healthy.
I also was involved in other organized crime about three months ago but I've stopped that completely. I've cleaned house, except for a small amount of marijuana.
I'm almost certain I'm being investigated. As soon as I tell myself that it's all in my head, another thing points to me being investigated...
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Jabbawaya

Registered: 07/10/05
Posts: 1,479
Last seen: 10 years, 5 months
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Quote:
Anonymous said: I've noticed lately that I see the exact same group of cars when driving and when I constantly look at one, it turns and then I see another. I've also noticed some of the same faces. Im not on drugs, I'm healthy.
Whether or not it's all in your head I don't know, but obviously it's starting to get to you. If you really think you're being investigated, it's clear that you need to scrap the grow. Otherwise it still sucks living with unnecessary paranoia.
If I were you I'd get rid of everything illegal and any obvious cultivation-only equipment, tell them that you want nothing to do with it and that it was a bad idea, as said above.
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fastfred
Old Hand



Registered: 05/17/04
Posts: 6,899
Loc: Dark side of the moon
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Re: Am I just paranoid? [Re: Jabbawaya] 1
#12206393 - 03/15/10 01:35 PM (14 years, 2 months ago) |
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> If it was a sting operation and was all on camera, how fucked am I?
Well, they'd have you on "attempted manufacturing" and "conspiracy to manufacture a controlled substance". You'd be pretty well fucked.
You've broken almost every rule there is to growing and this is one of the most idiotic stories I've ever read here.
You got 3 other people involved. None of whom you even know well. One guy you didn't even know, and another was a wannabe cop. That's as stupid as things get, especially since it only takes one person of marginal intelligence to grow shrooms.
All of these people witnessed you committing multiple felonies. They're all criminally active, with other drugs to boot. If you think, even for a second, that all three wouldn't rat you out in a heartbeat when they get busted then you're even dumber than this story makes you sound.
They don't even need to be setting you up. If any one of them ever gets busted they'll roll on you. Then they'll lean on the other two people and they'll have 3 witnesses providing enough testimony to put you away for a long time. They don't need tape, or any physical evidence for that matter. Their testimony would be more than enough to put you away.
All four of you are guilty of conspiracy. If they get any one of you to talk they'll quickly get the others.
The 1st person that talks gets a deal on whatever charges they were facing, the 2nd and 3rd get deals on the conspiracy charge, and you get a no lube ass raping by our legal system. That's exactly how it would play out since you're the "kingpin" of the conspiracy.
> Don kept bugging me about doing it. Couldn't that be cohersion?
To use that as a defense not only would he have had to threaten you with physical violence, but you'd have to be able to prove it. Even then your repeated cooperation in the conspiracy would nullify your defense. e.g. why didn't you go to the cops if he was threatening you?
The only time that would work is if he had a gun to your head and kept you prisoner for the entire process.
If they are investigating you then you need to find out. It's not hard to start writing down license plates and/or lay some traps to see if they're following you.
Good luck to you, but you fucked up royally and I hope you learned your lesson, along with anyone else reading this thread.
-FF
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Anonymous #1
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Re: Am I just paranoid? [Re: fastfred]
#12208033 - 03/15/10 06:11 PM (14 years, 2 months ago) |
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But if the grow is off(hoping no jars were kept by them in secret), and the substrate has been tossed, what are the chances of getting convicted if they have all been friends for longer than they've known me?
Couldn't people just make something up and blame someone, but with no physical evidence...?
Put it this way, three guys that have been friends for years, say that someone who is not close to them tried to manufacture shrooms one time. Would not that result in an indictment? What would be the chances of a conviction?
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Prof. Astro
acirebma

Registered: 04/15/08
Posts: 4,084
Last seen: 6 months, 24 days
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If he indicates that you are manufacturing a large scale (enough to distribute) and pleas out, you will get a knock, a raid, some jail.
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Anonymous #1
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What if the raid yeilds nothing? Like a raid at a law abidding citizens resident.
3 guys say that someone they dont know well tried to grow shrooms one time, the police raid this guys place and find nothing illegal. Conviction chances?
Is that an indictment...when people say you did something illegal?
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S33D
this side up

Registered: 11/13/05
Posts: 511
Loc: skylabONE
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Re: Am I just paranoid? [Re: fastfred]
#12208354 - 03/15/10 07:03 PM (14 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
fastfred said: Their testimony would be more than enough to put you away.
??? So if I and two of my buddies were to tell the cops that my mailman had manufactured 2 tons of meth but had since disposed of the evidence our statements alone would be enough to "put him away"? I don't think so.
OP, if this was a sting operation and they had had you on camera you would most likely be arrested by now. They would have a solid case and there would be no reason to leave you on the street. You would be much more useful as an informant at this point.
-------------------- If my calculations are correct, when this baby hits eighty-eight miles per hour... you're gonna see some serious shit. ~Dr. Emmett Brown
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Anonymous #1
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Re: Am I just paranoid? [Re: S33D]
#12208709 - 03/15/10 08:06 PM (14 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
S33D said:
Quote:
fastfred said: Their testimony would be more than enough to put you away.
??? So if I and two of my buddies were to tell the cops that my mailman had manufactured 2 tons of meth but had since disposed of the evidence our statements alone would be enough to "put him away"? I don't think so.
OP, if this was a sting operation and they had had you on camera you would most likely be arrested by now. They would have a solid case and there would be no reason to leave you on the street. You would be much more useful as an informant at this point.
I figured that more evidence would have been needed.
What if they kept a jar or two, replaced with others so I wouldn't notice, and were waiting for fruits?
This guy grows weed, with that in mind, chances of sting operation?
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Prof. Astro
acirebma

Registered: 04/15/08
Posts: 4,084
Last seen: 6 months, 24 days
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It doesn't really matter, you're operating on "maybe." Unless this guy indicates that he is an informant, or you have real reason to believe, simply ending contact with them should be sufficient. If they are informants and have snitched to the DEA or DA of your area, then you are fucked anyway.
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fastfred
Old Hand



Registered: 05/17/04
Posts: 6,899
Loc: Dark side of the moon
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Quote:
But if the grow is off(hoping no jars were kept by them in secret), and the substrate has been tossed, what are the chances of getting convicted if they have all been friends for longer than they've known me?
I already outlined what constitutes a conspiracy. You're already guilty of it. They can charge you with attempt or conspiracy or potentially both. You don't need to succeed at anything for either.
Quote:
Couldn't people just make something up and blame someone, but with no physical evidence...?
Sure, it happens all the time. Generally the cops would want a better case and they would lean on the turned conspirators to produce some evidence. If the rats can't produce legitimate evidence they'll often be scared enough to manufacture it.
Suppose the cops demand some physical evidence from your buddies with the threat of prison if they don't produce. That's very common. What are they going to do? They can probably already produce jars and/or syringes that you actually used. If they couldn't they'd just go buy some and turn them over to the cops as "evidence" of the grow attempt.
Frankly, their testimony would be enough for an indictment and arrest. You might be able to eventually win with a good lawyer, but you'd have to lie like a motherfucker on the stand, which is a crime in and of its' self.
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S33D said: So if I and two of my buddies were to tell the cops that my mailman had manufactured 2 tons of meth but had since disposed of the evidence our statements alone would be enough to "put him away"? I don't think so.
Well for one the evidence isn't disposed of. Remember we're only talking attempt and conspiracy. All the physical evidence would be is jars and spores, apparently the "buddies" still have both.
Even if they didn't it's a matter of three people telling the truth in court against one person who's lying his ass off. You don't give the legal system enough credit if you don't think this can usually be sorted out during interrogations and trial.
When they have three people with matching, truthful stories against one person desperately lying to avoid prison it's usually not that hard to find the truth.
One of the first things the cops would do is separately interrogate all four of the people involved. This alone usually is good enough to figure out who's telling the truth. And the OP is going to be the one lying. All they have to do is catch him in any of the many lies he'll be telling and the game is over.
In your example about the mailman... It would depend a lot on your credibility and the situation involved. If he really had manufactured or attempted to make meth their would probably be plenty of verifiable testimony to establish your credibility.
And the mailman's defense would be that 3 upstanding citizens he didn't even know are risking prison themselves, lying to the cops and the courts, and somehow come across as credible with matching stories that can't be broken. And they're all doing it just to fuck over some random stranger.
Do you really think you could convince a jury of that?
It's a really tough sell to say that "Everybody's lying except me!" and "These strangers are all in a conspiracy to put me away for no reason!"
Without physical evidence they'd decide weather to take it to trial based on the credibility of the witnesses. Most of the time your mailman would just be arrested, his house tossed, he'd have to bail out, and they'd lean on him for months to take a plea deal. If that didn't work they'd probably drop the charges a few days before trial. Your mailman would have been royally fucked.
If they believe the mailman they'd probably try to prosecute you and your friends. Most of the time they'd catch you in a lie and you'd go to prison for perjury. The mailman would also sue the fuck out of you for defamation and libel.
But your example doesn't really fit very well in this case. This would be a conspiracy case. And the only elements they have to prove usually only involve co-conspirator testimony. The case would revolve around the "act in furtherance" and they'd pick the easiest to prove. Then it would come down to weather the jury believes the OP or the three other guys when they say he helped innoc or provided the spores.
The OP would have to come up with a damn good reason why 3 people would implicate themselves in a conspiracy they face prison for AND why they would face prison for perjury AND why they would take all this risk and punishment just to fuck him over. That's a hard sell any way you figure it. And since it's the OP that would be lying it would be 10X more difficult to sell this.
Quote:
S33D said: OP, if this was a sting operation and they had had you on camera you would most likely be arrested by now. They would have a solid case and there would be no reason to leave you on the street. You would be much more useful as an informant at this point.
Nope! They always wait until they have the best case against him. They would wait until they had him with possession and would try to get him on distribution and manufacturing. They would never invest this much time just to pull the plug before the majority of the crime was committed.
They wouldn't want him as an informant since he's the kingpin and couldn't produce many convictions.
Another reason they'd wait is to get more witnesses and buyers busted. They always wait to get a slam dunk case and that means plenty of evidence and witnesses against the accused.
To the OP... Your best bet is to tell your buddies that the cops are on to you (make up some reason). And that you have to destroy all the evidence since they might know or find out about the operation. Then round up all the evidence and destroy it.
You have nothing to lose if this was a sting, you'll be making their case much weaker. If the more likely scenario, that this was just a really stupid idea and a potential land mine for you in the future, it's best to get out now and do as much damage control as possible.
Sure they'll think you're a paranoid muther fuckr, but who really cares. In a week or so you can tell them it turned out to be a bogus tip, but better safe than sorry.
-FF
-------------------- It drinks the alcohol and abstains from the weed or else it gets the hose again. -Chemy The difference between the substances doesn't matter. This is a war on consciousness, on our right to the very essence of what we are. With no control over that, we have no need to speak of freedom or a free society. -fireseed "If we are going to have a war on marijuana, the least we can do is pull the sick and the dying off the battlefield." -Neal Levine (MPP) I find the whole "my drug should be legal but yours should be illegal" mindset disgusting and hypocritical. It's what George Bush and company do when they drink a cocktail and debate the best way to imprison marijuana users. -Diploid
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ChiefThunderbong
Inhale to theChief



Registered: 10/18/02
Posts: 3,647
Last seen: 10 years, 11 months
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Why would your weed dealer and a guy who is actively growing weed be cops? I mean it certainly sounds like a terrible situation that you should never have gotten into, but your theory that they are informants is completely and utterly insane and stupid.
If they did get busted and turned into "informants", a much more probable scenario would be them setting up whoever their weed supplier was (unless it was the dude growing the weed), in which case I could see them saying "I know a guy who grows mushrooms". But they would just do a controlled buy, and purchase as much weight as they could from you then the door gets kicked in.
Do you REALLY think the cops wired this guys entire house with hidden cameras and had them get you to help them grow shrooms? They could get a manufacturing charge just by raiding you, there is no need to get you on film completing the entire several month process....
As Fastfred pointed out this was a bad idea because IF they got caught they would very likely incriminate you, but in my opinion absolutely nothing about your story indicates that they are currently working with police or that you are under investigation. I'll say it again, nothing about your story makes me think your drug dealers are trying to arrest you or you are under investigation for any reason.
You sound reckless, stupid, scared, and fucking paranoid. Selling drugs is probably not the right business for you, go find a day job.
-------------------- Yeah spinnin' around again yea caught in a tailspin
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