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OfflineRiverRat427
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Patchouli Fermentation Info for CactusDan and Community
    #12175069 - 03/10/10 12:43 AM (13 years, 11 months ago)

(This post is a response to a question from CactusDan originally posted HERE but I made made it it's own thread to avoid hi-jacking the original one)

I've never grown or harvested patchouli myself so I don't know the process from personal experience but I've heard about it and I know that when you buy it dried it can't be mistaken for any other herb; having a wilty, brownish-green, almost dirt-like appearance.

I've read mentions here and there of having to ferment it prior to distillation but alas, Google didn't end up yielding much more info on the process than a simple mention here and there either.

Some things I picked out were:
-Steaming the freshly harvested leaves and then allowing them to sit in a pile in a dark place to ferment (i.e. get to the point before they're beginning to brown and are about to rot) for a few days before drying/distilling them.

-Making bales/bundles of the freshly harvested leaves and allowing them to ferment in a dark place before drying/distillation

-Making a pile of the fresh leaves and covering them with a burlap sack to ferment for a few days " "

The length of fermentation time regardless of method depends on the temperature and humidity of your area, so check them every day.

You're right that the oils are already present in the plant material but the fermentation process develops/enhances that deep, rich scent that patchouli is famous for. Like I said I've never done this personally so I can't give exact specs (sorry), but I know that it's a quite common practice from reading about it and the unique look of dried patchouli compared to most other dried, light green, cut 'n sifted herbs. It's also unique that oil gets much better over time rather than degrading like most others. I found a bottle of 5-6 year old (since I bought it) patchouli EO that I didn't even know I still had at the bottom of a chest and it had a thicker, syrupy, consistency and much richer smell than any patchouli oil I've seen for sale at any store.

Sorry I can't go further in depth but at least now I may have a new project idea for next year's growing season. If I do end up experimenting with it I'll be sure to post my findings.

:peace:Peace:peace:


Edited by RiverRat427 (03/10/10 01:00 AM)


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OfflineCactusdan
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Re: Patchouli Fermentation Info for CactusDan and Community [Re: RiverRat427]
    #12175130 - 03/10/10 01:00 AM (13 years, 11 months ago)

Thanks for the info mate :thumbup:

It is definitely something I have had an interest in!


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Offlinebenitoamanito
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Re: Patchouli Fermentation Info for CactusDan and Community [Re: Cactusdan]
    #12178824 - 03/10/10 05:11 PM (13 years, 11 months ago)

from wikipedia
"Extraction of the essential oil is by steam distillation, requiring the cell walls of the leaves to be first ruptured. This can be achieved by steam scalding, light fermentation, or by drying."


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InvisiblelIXII
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Re: Patchouli Fermentation Info for CactusDan and Community [Re: RiverRat427]
    #12182668 - 03/11/10 11:22 AM (13 years, 11 months ago)

I have been sensitized to patchouli so that it smells pretty gross to me now, unless it is nice fresh plants or EO freshly distilled from fresh plants.

"You're right that the oils are already present in the plant material but the fermentation process develops/enhances that deep, rich scent that patchouli is famous for." Haha, yep, different strokes & all...

The more volatile fraction of the EO is more typical of its' mint family characteristics (i always expected patchouli EO to be a wood or root when younger), and is readily lost (because it's so volatile) by storing the EO @ room temperature, 'fermentation' (the commercial  industry does this with wintergreen & other plants too, steam distillation breaks down the cell walls just fine, they are simply changing the EO profile to have more 'base notes' (the thicker, less volatile stuff)).

I have experimented with this stuff & this plant, and the longer one lets any plant matter sit around, in any form, let alone in contact with heat, fermentation, the less EO you will have left in the plant (it's volatile) (unless you are fermenting it in the same closed system (air-tight) in which you will distill, now, you are just degrading or catalysing change).

Additionally, though I never stuck patchouli under a microscope, plants of Lamiaceae typically have extremely volatile aromatics, the 'oil' glands typically being right on the surface of the plant tissue. I wouldn't be surprised to find out that patchouli has additional oil glands deeper into its tissue, though steam distillation is plenty digestive to extract this. I do understand the use of the thicker, less volatile fraction of the patchouli EO as a 'carrier' (you can mix more fleeting, volatile EO's (rose, Melissa etc) with it & they will 'last' for much longer), though I personally really prefer several heart-wood EO's for this purpose (this has a major use in medicinal delivery of EO's).


Edited by lIXII (03/11/10 11:26 AM)


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OfflineRiverRat427
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Re: Patchouli Fermentation Info for CactusDan and Community [Re: lIXII]
    #12182795 - 03/11/10 11:55 AM (13 years, 11 months ago)

I'm more familiar with using EOs and patchouli plant material in perfumery, especially in the composition of oils and powders, than the medicinal and aromatherapy qualities of essentials oils. I made the mention because most of us are familiar with the heavy, sweet, deep, earthy, sensual patchouli aroma. I was just replying to CactusDan's mention of the plant material having a slight smell, when every time I've bought dried patchouli it had that distinct earthy smell (not green and herbal), though obviously not as strong as the EO, it was always there with fermented material.

I've never come into contact with un-fermented patchouli EO that has the volatile components still intact or un-fermented plant material in trade, but that too might be interesting to experiment with, although I'm sure you'd have to treat it as a different animal from the more familiar patchouli. No?


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InvisiblelIXII
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Re: Patchouli Fermentation Info for CactusDan and Community [Re: RiverRat427]
    #12183699 - 03/11/10 02:32 PM (13 years, 11 months ago)

Certainly a different creature chemically, the fresh stuff is reminiscent of Lycopus (read, more monoterpene / cyclic terpene composition) with a note of sweet/earth. Both types of preparation (lighter/more concentrated) certainly have their proponents & applications. I didn't see the instigating discussion, so not sure about it, though tropical/subtropical herbs grown in their native climates are also a different creature from the same species in a temperate zone. Additionally, as with most plants, there is of course other significant variation in constituent concentration based on life cycle,  time of year, soils. I can certainly vouch that the fresh herb, collected in late flower, from a sub-tropical region is quite aromatic.


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OfflineRiverRat427
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Re: Patchouli Fermentation Info for CactusDan and Community [Re: lIXII]
    #12183746 - 03/11/10 02:39 PM (13 years, 11 months ago)

Yeah, that makes sense. He was talking about a patchouli plant he had owned and noted that it only had a slight smell and I'd assumed he was talking about it lacking the more familiar rich scent produced by fermented patchouli.


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