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Post deleted by Moe Howard [Re: donahue]
    #1226540 -



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I'm a huge idiot

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Re: Liquid Shrooms [Re: X.O]
    #1226959 -

My buddy gets pure alcohol from his sister-in-law she make her owm cologne and perfume he used that We never take by mouth we always put them in are eyes couple drops in each and that all it takes. Hell he even put it in his ears and tripped.

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Re: Liquid Shrooms [Re: debianlinux]
    #1227012 -

"i heard that you could do this with marijuana, you can extract pure THC from it with everclear, if it would work with marijuana why not with mushrooms."

You can't extract pure thc with everclear. Its more like a combo of hash and hash oil. Not crystals or powder. Mushrooms don't have the resins plants do so you might be able to extract a powder. I would imagine its problely off colored if your lucky enough to get a powder. I don't know I've only made plant extracts and never get pure chemicals like many of you seem think a simple extraction will provide. You can't just set the mushrooms in everclear and expect a strong extract which will evaporate to pure crystals. Maybe a powder but not pure. I doubt it will even be a powder. If you ever cook mushrooms in a small amount of water the water turns brown and doesn't evaporate to a fine powder but leaves a brown mess in the pan. Everclear will problely extract more of the stuff you dont want then water will. I could be wrong. I hope someone can prove me wrong. I don't know I'm really tired and problely not making much sense so bed ways is right ways now.

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Post deleted by Moe Howard [Re: ]
    #1227015 -



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I'm a huge idiot

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Re: Liquid Shrooms [Re: X.O]
    #1227180 -

Quote:
I'd rather just put it on my tongue than put it in my motherfucking eye,I don't know man,I'm pretty sure alcohol and VitaminC solutions on my eyeball would at least temporarily blind me




puttin a fan over the it will evaporated all the alcohol you will have white shit on the side of the jar just take a scraper or spoon and push it back into the liquid then keep doing it till there no more white shit on the sides then it's done. There will be no alcohol in it. Shit just take the Vitamin C before you do it. Hell you don't even need it. My buddy had 3/4 of Logic Class trippin thrusday need something to make that 3 hour class fun

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Re: Liquid Shrooms [Re: ]
    #1228016 -

Heet methanol is anhydrous, no water, and if you dry it 100% which is pretty easy to do it is completely safe, leaves nothing dangerous behind, and is in fact the best extraction method. I am curious about this vitamin C making the psilocybin more stable theory? Can anyone rationalize or justify why this may be? As far as I can tell, there is no relationship between vitamin C and psilocybin, and they will not effect each other in any way. The vitamin C isn't doing shit, it is the acid you are dissolving your crystals in that is stabalizing it more, since by dropping the pH of the psilocybin you are changing any psilocybin that may remain as basic to acidic, therefore creating more salt, which with any alkaloid that I'm aware of is a more stable compound and degrades much slowly (if at all) with light air and heat than does it's freebase counterpart. If you really want to get into the chemistry of this stuff and do a REAL extraction and recrystalization, try something like this:

Dry Mushrooms and powder them.
Use Heet methanol to extract, use in abundance, at least 5 times the volume of methanol to mushroom powder.
Do a 2nd and even a 3rd extraction to ensure you got everything.
Dry the methanol off using a low temp fan. This should be done in relative darkness.
Dissolve your extraction in water.
Pour a non polar solvent like Naptha into your water/alkaloid mix. The water will remain on the bottom, the Naptha on top. Next take a small amount (maybe 1/4 teaspoon) of sodium hydroxide (Red Devil Lye, found at grocery store) and pour it into your solution, stirring vigorously.
At this point it's a good thing to have a digital pH meter. Stick your pH meter down into the solution so it's in the water and check the pH.
Continue adding lye until you reach a pH of 13, and keep stirring like hell. Add the Lye VERY slowly because it will get HOT as a motherfucker if you add it too quick, and in fact you could end up boiling the whole thing all over the place. So add it slow and you'll be safe.
Once the pH hits 13, siphon off the naptha layer (or use a sep funnel if you know what that is) and keep the Naptha. Don't toss the water just yet because you can go back and put more naptha in to ensure you got it all.
Get some table salt, some Liquid Fire drain cleaner. Get a container that you can attach a small tube to, like a fish tank tube, and that you can make the container air tight with just the tube coming out. Put a gram or two of salt into the container, then pour in a about 5 ml of liquid fire, close up the container quick, and stick the tube that's coming out of the container into the Naptha containing your alkaloids. It will bubble. You may have to swirl your container around a little bit to keep the gas coming out. You want it to keep bubbling through the Naptha. If it stops bubbling or gets too slow add a little more salt and then quick tighten it up again and see if more gas bubbles through the naptha. If it's still slow then add more liquid fire. Continue this. You should see some white stuff form and fall to the bottom. Continue to do this until no more white stuff is coming out.
Filter off your white stuff, save the naptha to bubble it again later to see if there's any more in there.
Dissolve your white stuff in Heet isopropyl alcohol (red bottle). It may be a little tough to dissolve, use pretty much iso, try making your iso a little warm before adding it, mix and stir and shake the hell out of it. Then put it in the freezer for a few hours.
Remove from freezer, siphon off the alcohol and you should have almost 100% pure crystals remaining.

While I've never tried this entire method with these alkaloids, I've tried it with several others and would bet that this recipe isn't far off for psilocybin. The lye that you add takes the pH very high, therefore turning the psilocybin basic. The psilocybin should then be soluable in a non polar solvent, naptha is usually the best way to go. The gas that you are producing is hcl, therefore producing psilocybin hydrochloride, or the stable salt form of psilocybin (this is where your "vitamin C" idea is replaced with the proper science). The last thing with the iso alcohol is a recrystalization, to remove any excess hcl or any other impurities that might be sticking to your goods. It's probably not necessary to do this recrystalization, unless you prefer clearer crystals as opposed to a white powder. It's really just a matter of preference, but if you do recrystalize with the iso your stuff will be cleaner but weigh a bit less.

I do guarantee that the Methanol works 100%, I also guarantee that the lowering of the pH by dissolving in acid is what makes it more stable and not the vitamin C, and gasing with hcl is the superior way to accomplish making it a salt. The intermediates can be altered accordingly however, for example perhaps chloroform might work better than a water/lye mix, or perhaps aqueous ammonia, or other such basic solutions. Naptha might not be the best non-polar to use for this particular alkaloid (although I bet it is) you can try mineral spirits or camp fuel or whatever. But these are the general ideas you want to go by to ensure you are getting a clean, stable, perfect alkaloid extraction.

Hope this helps. Good luck, have fun, be safe. Post your results. When I have an abundance of fruits I will be trying this method myself and determining the best method to go about it.

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Post deleted by Moe Howard [Re: InMyVersion]
    #1228134 -



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I'm a huge idiot

Edited by X.O (01/18/03 07:58 AM)

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Re: Liquid Shrooms [Re: X.O]
    #1231801 -

I see most people are doing this with jars. Would this work on rye berrys I see no reason it wouldn't but figured i'd ask.


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Teach a man to make cakes he will trip for a night. Teach a man to case he will trip forever

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Re: Liquid Shrooms [Re: X.O]
    #1235304 -

Quote:
Wow,thanks man.it does sound good,especially since it would be stable already and you wouldn't have to worry about oxidization. I don't have any access to methanol even if I wanted to try this though.Ethanol seems to work quite well,and if the VitaminC theoretically has the same outcome as "the proper science" then why is it so bad? I think the simpler ethanol extractions should be tried first.Otherwise,that's like skipping the PFtek and going into multispore and grain


You do have access to methanol, go to your local *Mart store, auto section, yellow HEET. It's 100% anhydrous Methanol. It is my understanding that methanol is superior, but if ethanol works well for you go for it. I would bet that you are not using anhydrous ethanol and that the water in the alcohol is what is making your ethanol extractions so good though, but what you're not seeing is that the water is taking along a bunch of crap with it. I think once you try the methanol you'll agree. As far as the vitamin C having the same outcome, I think you misunderstood... It's not the vitamin C, it's the acid that the Vitamin C is dissolved in which you are adding to your alkaloid extract that is stabalizing your alkaloids, not the actual Vitamin C. Get the same acid without vitamin C and your results will be the same if not better. Hope that clarifies it. Good luck with your experiments, let us know how they go. If you need any detail help PM me and I'll try to walk you through.

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Re: Liquid Shrooms [Re: InMyVersion]
    #1235311 -

>it's the acid that the Vitamin C is dissolved in which you are adding to your
>alkaloid extract that is stabalizing your alkaloids, not the actual Vitamin C

What acid is this supposed to be?
Vitamin C is ascorbic acid, so it?s an acid by itself....
http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&hl=de&q=ascorbic+acid


--------------------
Grow Mushrooms from Spores - PF-Tek for Simple Minds

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Re: Liquid Shrooms [Re: Anno]
    #1235337 -

Hey what'dya know I guess you're right...  Sorry not as up on my vitamins as I am on stuff that removes vitamins from my body  :tongue:

Ascorbic acid is flammable though, definitely not preferable when working with heat sensitive alkaloids.

Also:
pH:
3 for 5mg/L aqueous solution; 2 for 50mg/L aqueous solution.

Seems like a pretty weak acid in the quantities available commercially and industrially.  I'd still stick with hcl gas, non flammable, strong acid, bonds easily to just about anything especially in gas form, gas is visible and easy to direct with a simple fan out the window or blowing onto running water, and probably more easily available than any kind of concentrated ascorbic acid (at least for these purposes).  Basically, I'd rather have a completely safe and stable psilocybin-hydrochloride than a weakly stable and flammable psilocybin-ascorbide.

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Re: Liquid Shrooms [Re: InMyVersion]
    #1235420 -

Tread carefully with HEET. Although it contains methanol, according to the company's web page:
Quote:
HEET contains methanol and a corrosion inhibitor


I don't know that you would want a corrosion inhibitor in your final product...

does anyone have more info on this?

jssmthrfcknchrst


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Re: Liquid Shrooms [Re: JssMthrFcknChrst]
    #1235446 -

woah hey good research...  thanks for the link...  I don't recall seeing any corrosion inhibitor info on the bottle recently, but then again I don't think I've actually looked recently...  As far as using it for extractions, it seems to still work just fine, and I've seen no remnants of any other chems in the initial extract or the final product...  I would bet that the corrosion inhibitor is less than 1%, otherwise they'd have to list it as explicitly as the anhydrous methanol, which at that concentration is still the purest shit you're going to get unless you go with lab grade.  I know there are plenty of generic brands out there though that list 100% or 99.9%+ anhydrous methanol, so you might wanna go with them instead, at least until we get to the bottom of this corrossion inhibitor stuff...

Knowing our good friends at HEET though, their "corrosion inhibitor" is probably just a little hcl to help keep things moving in the right direction a bit better  :grin:  Who else would think to sell a "4 pack to go" of anhydrous methanol, so the poor clandestine chemists don't have to make 4 trips to different stores or risk being questioned on "hey why you have so many bottles of heet?!?!"? 

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Re: Liquid Shrooms [Re: InMyVersion]
    #1235452 -

InMyVersion
First Heet is not anhydrous. Its pure but not completely anhydrous and doesn't need to be. Second shrooms alkaloids are soluble in non-polar and polar solvents so an acid base extraction would not work. There is a document on this site for growing the fungus in liquid culture and extracting the alkaloids from it. It also states that a a/b wouldn't work. Sorry

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Re: Liquid Shrooms [Re: Dr. Slavic]
    #1235495 -

Quote:
First Heet is not anhydrous. Its pure but not completely anhydrous and doesn't need to be.


Really?  Can you show me where it states there is water in their methanol?  Considering their product is intended to remove water from the fuel system for preventing freezing it would seem quite silly for them to have water in with their methanol.  How something can be pure and contain something that is soluble in each other like water is quite contradictory, wouldn't you say?

Quote:
Second shrooms alkaloids are soluble in non-polar and polar solvents so an acid base extraction would not work. There is a document on this site for growing the fungus in liquid culture and extracting the alkaloids from it. It also states that a a/b wouldn't work. Sorry


Perhaps you're right, but if I were to try it from scratch I'd start here.  If they are 100% soluble in non-polar then basifying is not necessary, simply dissolve in non-polar and gas with hcl.  The idea is to give it a hcl bond, by whichever method works best...  Of course maybe an ether extraction followed by tartaric acid then washed up in some anhydrous hydrazine might be the preferred way to go?  Like I said in my first post, I haven't tried it, but I will when the spare fruits are at my disposal, at which point I will post the results and the exact proper methods.  I probably won't go by any articles online, considering if they were accurate I'd be producing 5,000 hits of psilocybin in a small room every week  :tongue:

btw, do you have the links to the articles you mention?

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Re: Liquid Shrooms [Re: InMyVersion]
    #1235572 -

On Heet:
http://www.lycaeum.org/forums/alchemy/Messages/445.html


--------------------
Grow Mushrooms from Spores - PF-Tek for Simple Minds

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Re: Liquid Shrooms [Re: Anno]
    #1235602 -

It appears that they didn't find out much more than we are here...

I highly doubt that the "corrosion inhibitor" would be HCl, cause thats corrosive, the exact opposite of what they would want. Zinc Oxide? Doesn't sound too bad.

jssmthrfcknchrst



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Re: Liquid Shrooms [Re: Anno]
    #1235613 -

Heet is completely safe to use, even if it has zinc oxide or whatever other <1% additives in it. It's still 99%+ anhydrous methanol, which when compared to the additional junk you would collect by using another OH or whatever, I'll take 1% crap to 50% any day. If it's really that much of an issue for you, simply distill the methanol, then you know you're getting 100%. And anything in there that has the exact same melting point and boiling point would evap with the methanol anyway after the distillation and extraction is still going to go away, so it wouldn't be an issue. But straight heet has been used countless times with perfect results and 0 byproduct or unwanted results. Also, it might be beneficial to place your mushroom/methanol mix in the freezer as it soaks. I won't stress my point on heet any further, just thought I'd save you guys some time, trouble, and $. For those brave enough to try it please post your results.

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Re: Liquid Shrooms [Re: InMyVersion]
    #1235803 -

Why would you want to put the mushroom / methanol mix in the freezer? Is this to burst the cells of the mushroom? I always thought that a warm solvent could hold more than a cold solvent. Wouldn't this slow down the process, requiring a longer extraction period?

I worry not just about what is residues are in HEET, but how they would react to other chemicals used in an extraction. Various extractions call for HCl, Naptha, Acetone, Lye, etc... I would not want a violent reaction to occur when working with flammable solvents, nor to produce some toxic side product.

Despite my concerns, my associate will most likely at least attempt an extraction using HEET. Although we do not expect to be performing this experiment until the end of next month at the earliest.

-jssmthrfcknchrst


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Re: Liquid Shrooms [Re: X.O]
    #1236646 -

what ratio of vitamin c to the mushrooms should i use

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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > Advanced Mycology
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