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InvisibleLeopardMan
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How LM makes his cakes * 10
    #12002751 - 02/10/10 04:11 PM (9 years, 2 months ago)

First off, a few words of introduction. As many of you already know, English is not my first language so I’ll be probably making quite a few mistakes along the way. I hope you will generously forgive my errors and go to the heart of the matter.
As I started my first grow only 5 months ago I am still a beginner. I've never used agar, never isolated any strain and never used horse manure (only coir). I focused almost completely on the PF tek and since I had some good results I started to observe all the process of growing mushrooms from germination to fruiting trying to understand why I got these results. This tek should be considered as a partial and humble answer to those questions.

THE TEK

This modified version of the PF tek is composed by three main parts (1-Heat shock 2-FAE increase 3-Slow dunk) and it is therefore based on three basic assumptions which would probably arise some criticism.

1-Contrary to a cold shock, a heat shock is not believed to be a pinning trigger but only to be the best way to get your cakes dried.
2-During the first days in the FC, FAE is much more important than RH.
3-A dried substrate can produce an excellent pinset if properly but slowly hydrated.

I do not believe that the substrate composition will make much a difference as long as it is nutritious. I normally use brf, buckwheat or brown bread flour. I still prefer buckwheat but brf is foolproof so just stick to it. I prepare my jars in the usual way:verm+brf+water (2:1:1 ratio). I do not add anything else.

THE HEAT SHOCK

As RR pointed out many times cubes are tropical species and a cold shock will not be beneficial for their growth. I guess a heat shock works in a different way. Jules Renard (a french writer whom I much admire) once wrote:”Laziness is nothing more than the habit of resting before you get tired”. This quote serves my purpose: we want our mycelium to be as healthy as possible but we don’t want it to become lazy. My hypothesis is that a mycelium living in a dried substrate will become much more aggressive than a mycelium living in optimal moisture conditions. Here is the complete procedure:

-Once your cakes have reached full colonization, you should proceed with the consolidation week. The heat shock will start only once full colonization has been reached. It will last 7-10 days and at any rate until the end of the consolidation period.
-In order to get your cakes heat shocked you can use a heatbomb (Ohmatic's heatbomb). Put your cakes close to your heatbomb and set the temperature on 32C/90F (MAX temp). This is just an example:



Let them sit and do not worry about them. You can probably use a heatpad as well but I’ve never tried that. What you want is a just a slightly higher temperature, you don’t want to kill your mycelium. So do not use space heaters or radiators.
-At the end of the consolidation week your cakes will be very dried. They can also show some blue spots: that's normal.
-Go on with a 24 hours dunk, then roll and double end. Don’t expect the 24 hours dunk to replenish all the moisture lost. After the dunk, your cakes will still be pretty dried.

FAE INCREASE

Now your cakes are in the FC. I use a SG terrarium but since I need to significantly increase FAE I make a few holes more. What does this mean? Build a SG terrarium per tek then add about 3-5 holes to every side of the tub (3 for the smaller ones and 5 for the bigger ones). These will be our extra holes. These extra holes should be open during the first 3-5 days after your cakes have been placed into the FC and closed only after the first pins have appeared. This means you are going to sacrifice your RH in order to stimulate pinning. There are probably other ways to increase FAE but this is what I did ( maybe fanning 10+ times every day could be an option but it is a very demanding job) . If you don't have a SG terrarium I am afraid I can't help you.Try to experiment yourself.

SLOW DUNK

Since your cakes are still quite dried and since you increased the amount of fresh air in your FC you need more water as well. This is essential. If you don’t do this, your pins won’t be able to develop and they will dry out very soon like in this picture:



Now, that’s how I add more water to my cakes. I guess this method has been previously used but I am not sure if it was called “slow dunk”. Anyway we don’t care about labels and names that much, do we?

-Mist and fan as usually required ( I do this 3 times a day but you can do it more often)
-Once you misted your cakes, use your misting bottle to hydrate them. Let some drops gently fall on top of your cakes and create a pool of water.


(sorry for the out of focus pic)

You want this pool of water to stay there at least until lots of pins have appeared so I suggest you to repeat this procedure every time you mist and fan.
-With this method you shouldn't need to add more water to your cakes and your pins should be able to reach full maturity without any other problem. But as sometimes you can have between 50 and 100 pins on your cake, an additional 12 hours dunk could be necessary in order to support pins growth ( I tried a 3, 5, 8 and 12 hours dunk and I noticed the last choice to be the best one).

This is pretty much all I did in order to get cakes like these:






I am not saying this tek will work for everyone of you because there are too many variables involved in growing mushrooms. However I decided to post it because I felt like sharing with you some ideas and because I hope you will contribute to this in any way you feel appropriate. Thank you all. Long live the shroomery!

Edit: Other details

-Light: a 6500k fluorescent bulb, 12/12
-Temps: between 60F (night) and 74F(day).


--------------------



You have to die a few times before you can really live.

-Charles Bukowski-


Edited by LeopardMan (02/13/10 07:48 PM)


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InvisibleJonEveryman88
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Re: The heat shock. A new version of the glorious PF tek [Re: LeopardMan]
    #12002811 - 02/10/10 04:21 PM (9 years, 2 months ago)

Hm. NICE WRITE-UP:thumbup:

I'll have to test this next time I do a cake. Thanks


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Invisiblemyceleus_rex
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Re: The heat shock. A new version of the glorious PF tek [Re: LeopardMan]
    #12002821 - 02/10/10 04:24 PM (9 years, 2 months ago)

Interesting ideas here. I encourage you to continue investigating. Also, your use of English in this presentation is superior to that displayed by most native speakers :wink:


--------------------
Cervantes' sclerotia thread    Citric's self-healing lid tek  Agar's Grain LC  Breaking Up Spawn Jars

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OfflineJordan2Dope
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Re: The heat shock. A new version of the glorious PF tek [Re: JonEveryman88]
    #12002863 - 02/10/10 04:31 PM (9 years, 2 months ago)

Finally lol. I like. Thanks! Will be doing this my next PF grow.


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OfflineMissShroom
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Re: The heat shock. A new version of the glorious PF tek [Re: myceleus_rex]
    #12002931 - 02/10/10 04:43 PM (9 years, 2 months ago)

Wow, seems that there's both, logic and experience, involved. And it's great that people develop also PF-tek (meaning both this and that milk-coke-pineapple -stuff) 'cause sometimes it seems to be somehow underrated, like it's only for the beginners and you should get rid of it as soon as you learn something. Great work!!! :thumbup:

Btw, you know English much better than those Americans.

:sunny:  :heartpump:


--------------------
:heart:Keep loving one another:heart:


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InvisibleLeopardMan
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Re: The heat shock. A new version of the glorious PF tek [Re: MissShroom]
    #12002997 - 02/10/10 04:53 PM (9 years, 2 months ago)

Thank you all. I hope to keep on testing this tek in the next few months. I guess the basic concepts can also be useful for bulk grows. Who knows?

To myc_rex and MissShroom: thanks for the kind words. :cheer:


--------------------



You have to die a few times before you can really live.

-Charles Bukowski-


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Invisiblemyceleus_rex
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Re: The heat shock. A new version of the glorious PF tek [Re: MissShroom]
    #12003027 - 02/10/10 04:57 PM (9 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

MissShroom said:
Btw, you know English much better than those Americans.

:sunny:  :heartpump:



Not all yanks are monosyllabic Troglodytes, Missy!! :biggrin:


--------------------
Cervantes' sclerotia thread    Citric's self-healing lid tek  Agar's Grain LC  Breaking Up Spawn Jars

World's Ugliest Cat?

If ignorance is bliss, why aren't there more happy people?


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Invisiblegeohoe
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Re: The heat shock. A new version of the glorious PF tek [Re: LeopardMan]
    #12003093 - 02/10/10 05:06 PM (9 years, 2 months ago)

LeopardMan-  First off let me start by saying bravo and thank you.  I've read many of your posts and gained a lot of useful information.  Keep up the good work.

I would suggest expanding your data set a bit by changing only one parameter at a time, and then changing multiple parameters.  Try experimenting individually with each of the three parameters- Heat shock, FAE, and low moisture.  Then move on to various combinations of each.  This will allow you to better isolate the cause of the results you see.  Any one parameter change could be the trigger for your phenomenal results, or one change may give slight adverse effects.


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Invisiblecyanara
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Re: The heat shock. A new version of the glorious PF tek [Re: geohoe]
    #12003132 - 02/10/10 05:12 PM (9 years, 2 months ago)

MERCI....
i'll be trying this with my monotub.:thumbup:


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OfflineMissShroom
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Re: The heat shock. A new version of the glorious PF tek [Re: myceleus_rex]
    #12003195 - 02/10/10 05:20 PM (9 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

myceleus_rex said:
Quote:

MissShroom said:
Btw, you know English much better than those Americans.

:sunny:  :heartpump:



Not all yanks are monosyllabic Troglodytes, Missy!! :biggrin:




Ok, maybe I "slightly" generalized...:rolleyes:
At least I censored the word you used as I was confused if it's an insult or something, didn't want to hurt anyone (trying to say that I'm actually a nice person although I don't seem like one :grin:).


--------------------
:heart:Keep loving one another:heart:


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InvisibleLeopardMan
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Re: The heat shock. A new version of the glorious PF tek [Re: geohoe]
    #12003197 - 02/10/10 05:21 PM (9 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

geohoe said:
LeopardMan-  First off let me start by saying bravo and thank you.  I've read many of your posts and gained a lot of useful information.  Keep up the good work.

I would suggest expanding your data set a bit by changing only one parameter at a time, and then changing multiple parameters.  Try experimenting individually with each of the three parameters- Heat shock, FAE, and low moisture.  Then move on to various combinations of each.  This will allow you to better isolate the cause of the results you see.  Any one parameter change could be the trigger for your phenomenal results, or one change may give slight adverse effects.




Not low moisture but high moisture. Anyway I appreciate your advices. Isolating the causes of the results it's not an easy task though.
5 finnish shrooms for you (:wink:)


--------------------



You have to die a few times before you can really live.

-Charles Bukowski-


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Invisiblemyceleus_rex
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Re: The heat shock. A new version of the glorious PF tek [Re: MissShroom]
    #12003217 - 02/10/10 05:24 PM (9 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

MissShroom said:
Ok, maybe I "slightly" generalized...:rolleyes:
At least I censored the word you used as I was confused if it's an insult or something, didn't want to hurt anyone (trying to say that I'm actually a nice person although I don't seem like one :grin:).



No offense taken, hence the "biggrin", as a generalization, I agree with you, as I said in my earlier post :smile:


--------------------
Cervantes' sclerotia thread    Citric's self-healing lid tek  Agar's Grain LC  Breaking Up Spawn Jars

World's Ugliest Cat?

If ignorance is bliss, why aren't there more happy people?


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Invisiblebiologys
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Re: The heat shock. A new version of the glorious PF tek [Re: myceleus_rex]
    #12003227 - 02/10/10 05:25 PM (9 years, 2 months ago)

very well written up and very nice concept...props leopard +5 to you


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Re: The heat shock. A new version of the glorious PF tek [Re: biologys]
    #12003321 - 02/10/10 05:40 PM (9 years, 2 months ago)

I actually did this when I was birthing cakes back in the day. Fully colonized jars often went on top of my computer's base unit for a week, exposed to temperatures of 80-90 degrees Celsius, followed by a 36 hour dunk and roll. The resultant yields have always been massive, but unfortunately I don't have any pictures, and I've since moved on from cakes. If I recall correctly, a single cake usually averaged at around 10-12 grams dry on the first flush, going down by about 2-3 grams on consecutive flushes.

If you don't have a heat bomb, try putting your hand on top of your system's base unit. You'll find it's an ideal substitute, but of course, you will need your system to be on more often than it's not.

I can definitely affirm that the OP is onto something. Everything he says is right, especially the high FAE & misting requirement. That is absolutely important.


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Invisiblecyanara
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Re: The heat shock. A new version of the glorious PF tek [Re: biologys]
    #12003336 - 02/10/10 05:43 PM (9 years, 2 months ago)

you know. I wonder if this heat shock/ drying of the substrate would also apply to dryer spawn? Just 7 days ago, i put some realy old and dry B+ spawn into a tub of mixed pasteurized coi/ver/coffee/and straw... their were no signs of contamination, however the spawn was the dryest I've ever seen it! concequently, this is also the fastest growth i've whitnessed... ?
So is it possible to dry the spawn out a bit and adding it to a moisture balanced rich substrate would cause massive and fast growth?


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InvisibleLeopardMan
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Re: The heat shock. A new version of the glorious PF tek [Re: cyanara]
    #12003383 - 02/10/10 05:49 PM (9 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

cyanara said:
you know. I wonder if this heat shock/ drying of the substrate would also apply to dryer spawn? Just 7 days ago, i put some realy old and dry B+ spawn into a tub of mixed pasteurized coi/ver/coffee/and straw... their were no signs of contamination, however the spawn was the dryest I've ever seen it! concequently, this is also the fastest growth i've whitnessed... ?
So is it possible to dry the spawn out a bit and adding it to a moisture balanced rich substrate would cause massive and fast growth?




Yes I've tried this and looks like it works fine. This is a picture of one of my coir trays. The spawn has been heatshocked and the myc became very aggressive and ropey:



Unfortunately I didn't fruit it yet so I don't know if it is really working.


--------------------



You have to die a few times before you can really live.

-Charles Bukowski-


Edited by LeopardMan (02/10/10 05:50 PM)


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Invisiblecyanara
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Re: The heat shock. A new version of the glorious PF tek [Re: LeopardMan]
    #12003473 - 02/10/10 06:00 PM (9 years, 2 months ago)

if i can get my camera to work, i'll take a picture, of my box and post so you can compare as well. very ropey, and alot of the growth is occuring verticaly.. it's very exciting.


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InvisibleLeopardMan
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Re: The heat shock. A new version of the glorious PF tek [Re: cyanara]
    #12003981 - 02/10/10 07:32 PM (9 years, 2 months ago)

It has been suggested that my post is too long. Maybe a summary could help. Let me know your opinions about this.


--------------------



You have to die a few times before you can really live.

-Charles Bukowski-


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InvisibleJonEveryman88
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Re: The heat shock. A new version of the glorious PF tek [Re: LeopardMan]
    #12004029 - 02/10/10 07:43 PM (9 years, 2 months ago)

Pfff, who cares if someone thinks your post is too long.

I'd rather read a long, detailed post than a punchy short undescribing post.


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Invisiblecyanara
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Re: The heat shock. A new version of the glorious PF tek [Re: JonEveryman88]
    #12004056 - 02/10/10 07:48 PM (9 years, 2 months ago)

i'm with you on that... isn't that the whole point of this?


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