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InvisibleChibboleth
member
Registered: 10/14/02
Posts: 232
Ambiguous point in the PF tek
    #1198890 - 01/07/03 08:11 PM (13 years, 11 months ago)

I'm about to start on my second attempt at cultivation, and since my last try was nearly a massive failure, I'm trying to stick closer to the actual PF tek this time. However, there's something in the sterilization phase that isn't clear to me.

PF says to put the jar lids on upside-down when steaming the jars of substrate. This is what I did last time. However, last time I took the hot jars out of the pot and flipped the lids back over, rubber side down, to create a seal. Upon closer reading of the tek, it appears that I'm supposed to leave the lids upside down - but won't the poor seal inherent in such a thing invite contams? And how tight can I screw the bands on? I won't be able to get them very tight without deforming the metal.


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OfflineOn_the_Down-Low
Polyfil-ophile-Say it 3 timesfast.

Registered: 10/15/02
Posts: 401
Last seen: 11 years, 10 months
Re: Ambiguous point in the PF tek [Re: Chibboleth]
    #1198907 - 01/07/03 08:16 PM (13 years, 11 months ago)

It will work either way. Use a polyfil 'filter' in the top.
I thought I heard someone say that the upside down lid rule appiled to GLASS lids.


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Offlinemrr0gers
A man with toomany sweaters...

Registered: 10/19/02
Posts: 113
Last seen: 11 years, 2 months
Re: Ambiguous point in the PF tek [Re: Chibboleth]
    #1198908 - 01/07/03 08:16 PM (13 years, 11 months ago)

I think the point of the upside down lids are to give more oxygen to the mycellium and I guess this is supposed to be safeguarded by the vermeculite layer.


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In loving memory of Fred Rogers.


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Offlineupupup
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Registered: 08/25/01
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Re: Ambiguous point in the PF tek [Re: Chibboleth]
    #1198928 - 01/07/03 08:21 PM (13 years, 11 months ago)

Leave the lids as per PF....

You don't need to get all crazy about the lids at all. PF thought this out for morons like us.... :tongue:

The deal is that the verm top layer acts as the "filter" as it were. In fact, one way to kick in stalled or slowed cakes is to let the lid be loose if not lightly placed on the jar. This can increase airflow and help the myc to get going, and it can introduce contams but hey, how much did the whole proccess cost you anyway?......


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Support bacteria - they're the only culture some people have.


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OfflineMister Black
smokes pot

Registered: 11/18/02
Posts: 362
Last seen: 11 years, 10 months
Re: Ambiguous point in the PF tek [Re: Chibboleth]
    #1198930 - 01/07/03 08:22 PM (13 years, 11 months ago)

Hi.

Apparently the upside-down seal is good enough to ward of contamination, at least for the time that it takes for the mycos to get established enough to do it on their own. The top layer of just vermiculite is what really keeps the contams out, as the vermiculite has nothing that they can feed on, and is dense enough to keep them from getting through it.

As for tightening, sterilize with the lids on, but loose (tighten only until you can feel them in their place on the jar); I then cover the jars with a piece of aluminum foil, but I steam mine as I have no pressure cooker. After sterilization, i tighten the lids again slightly, but not what would be considered tight, certainly not enough to deform the metal lid. Just on. Once the mycelium has established itself (80%+), I remove my inoc hole tape and I loosen the lids back to sterilization-looseness; this is an attempt at providing the developing mycelium with a little more air exchange, as it likes o2. I don't know if this is valid, but I like it.


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Invisibledog
straw dog

Registered: 06/20/02
Posts: 2,790
Loc: Route 66
Re: Ambiguous point in the PF tek [Re: Chibboleth]
    #1199582 - 01/08/03 06:24 AM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

it appears that I'm supposed to leave the lids upside down - but won't the poor seal inherent in such a thing invite contams?



You invite a much greater risk of contamination by removing your jars from the cooker and tightening the lids before they have completely cooled.

The verm acts as a contam barrier - an airtight seal is not needed.


--------------------


Fascism (fash'izem) n. A governmental system marked by a centralized dictatorship, stringent socioeconomic controls, and often belligerent nationalism. see also: the Bush Administration.


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