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 Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir
 
Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,372
Loc: SF Bay Area 
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 Cognitive Dissonance 
#11955992 - 02/03/10 05:03 PM (14 years, 2 months ago) |
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From Cognitive Dissonance - Wikipedia:
Quote:
Cognitive dissonance is an uncomfortable feeling caused by holding two contradictory ideas simultaneously. The "ideas" or "cognitions" in question may include attitudes and beliefs, the awareness of one's behavior, and facts. The theory of cognitive dissonance proposes that people have a motivational drive to reduce dissonance by changing their attitudes, beliefs, and behaviors, or by justifying or rationalizing their attitudes, beliefs, and behaviors. Cognitive dissonance theory is one of the most influential and extensively studied theories in social psychology.
Dissonance normally occurs when a person perceives a logical inconsistency among his or her cognitions. This happens when one idea implies the opposite of another. For example, a belief in animal rights could be interpreted as inconsistent with eating meat or wearing fur. Noticing the contradiction would lead to dissonance, which could be experienced as anxiety, guilt, shame, anger, embarrassment, stress, and other negative emotional states. When people's ideas are consistent with each other, they are in a state of harmony, or consonance. If cognitions are unrelated, they are categorized as irrelevant to each other and do not lead to dissonance.
A powerful cause of dissonance is an idea in conflict with a fundamental element of the self-concept, such as "I am a good person" or "I made the right decision." The anxiety that comes with the possibility of having made a bad decision can lead to rationalization, the tendency to create additional reasons or justifications to support one's choices. A person who just spent too much money on a new car might decide that the new vehicle is much less likely to break down than his or her old car. This belief may or may not be true, but it would likely reduce dissonance and make the person feel better. Dissonance can also lead to confirmation bias, the denial of disconfirming evidence, and other ego defense mechanisms.
I think this theory implies that people love to feel that they're right, and hate to feel that they're wrong about whatever given belief/idea; humans prefer consonance over dissonance since it makes them feel comfortable with themselves, and the feeling of being right is more important than actually being right.
I'm just wondering why some people feel uncomfortable when they're wrong about something--why would being wrong be anxiety-provoking? Why must people feel "in the right" about everything in order to live comfortably? If one accepts that they are most likely not right about everything, would that person feel anxiety when confronting information that is contradictory to his/her current world-view?
It almost seems to me like the drive to be "in the right" is competitive in nature; if so, then I would assume that any anxiety symptoms that a person feels as the result of cognitive dissonance are due somehow to societal conditioning, since if there were no other people to compete with (and also, if there were no other people to condition you) then there would be no drive to be "in the right".
Any thoughts? 
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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylan   fireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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 andrewss
precariously aggrandized
Registered: 08/17/07
Posts: 8,725
Loc: ohio
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 Re: Cognitive Dissonance [Re: Poid]
#11956044 - 02/03/10 05:10 PM (14 years, 2 months ago) |
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you're wrong I am right, this example and appeal to psychology is bullshit, I am never wrong actually.
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Jesus loves you.
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir
Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,372
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance [Re: andrewss]
#11956076 - 02/03/10 05:17 PM (14 years, 2 months ago) |
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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylanfireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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P.weilii
Stranger
Registered: 01/31/10
Posts: 177
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance [Re: Poid]
#11956208 - 02/03/10 05:30 PM (14 years, 2 months ago) |
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Actually I think this relates more directly to peoples need to feel like they understand themselves and their motives. For instance, just with one of the examples given, someone who has a strong belief in animal rights wouldn't suffer anxiety while eating meat because they think they're wrong, the concepts would lead deeper than that. If people were innately afraid of being wrong, then we wouldn't have politicians lying to us everyday. This cognitive dissonance is derived from anxieties about not being true to yourself, and not understanding who you are, which makes anyone uncomfortable for understandable reasons.
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir
Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,372
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance [Re: P.weilii]
#11956316 - 02/03/10 05:42 PM (14 years, 2 months ago) |
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Actually I think this relates more directly to peoples need to feel like they understand themselves and their motives. For instance, just with one of the examples given, someone who has a strong belief in animal rights wouldn't suffer anxiety while eating meat because they think they're wrong, the concepts would lead deeper than that.
If a vegetarian were eating a sandwhich which, without his/her knowledge, contained meat, then it is likely that that peson wouold experience cognitive dissonance because s/he thought that s/he was eating a meatless sandwich; in this hypothetical example, the cognitive dissonance was provoked by the feeling of being wrong about the contents of the sandwich.
If people were innately afraid of being wrong, then we wouldn't have politicians lying to us everyday.
How do you figure?
This cognitive dissonance is derived from anxieties about not being true to yourself, and not understanding who you are, which makes anyone uncomfortable for understandable reasons.
Yes--finding out that you are not true to yourself is also finding out that you were wrong about yourself, and I would imagine usually results in feeling cognitive dissonance.
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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylanfireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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P.weilii
Stranger
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance [Re: Poid]
#11956396 - 02/03/10 05:52 PM (14 years, 2 months ago) |
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Now that i consider your points more, maybe this is entirely derived from a fear of being wrong. However I still feel like there maybe classifications of this wrongness, after all, being wrong about whats on your sandwich is a much different wrong than being wrong about who you are as a person. Perhaps best defined as an external wrongness, and an internal wrongness. (but then again all things can be broken down to internal and external)
I think that it may also be less of a fear of being wrong, and more about chasing the security that comes with understanding whats going on around you, and within you. You could really say it either way, perhaps im an optimist in preferring to think about it as a preferred security rather than a fear of the unavoidable.
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir
Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,372
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance [Re: P.weilii]
#11956519 - 02/03/10 06:10 PM (14 years, 2 months ago) |
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However I still feel like there maybe classifications of this wrongness, after all, being wrong about whats on your sandwich is a much different wrong than being wrong about who you are as a person. Perhaps best defined as an external wrongness, and an internal wrongness. (but then again all things can be broken down to internal and external)
Yeah there are many ways to classify the different things that cause people to experience cognitive dissonance, but all such classifications are arbitrary.
I think that it may also be less of a fear of being wrong, and more about chasing the security that comes with understanding whats going on around you, and within you.
But many people have false understandings of what's going on around and inside of them, so if this is true, then many people are chasing a false sense of security.
Like I said, people prefer the feeling of consonance rather than dissonance, regardless of whether or not their feelings are actually based in truth.
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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylanfireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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P.weilii
Stranger
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Posts: 177
Last seen: 13 years, 6 months
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance [Re: Poid]
#11956652 - 02/03/10 06:29 PM (14 years, 2 months ago) |
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Yes, but what matters beyond the feeling you get from it? after all, if you're wrong and you never realize it, does it really matter that you're wrong? The age old adage, ignorance is bliss.
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir
Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,372
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance [Re: P.weilii]
#11956678 - 02/03/10 06:33 PM (14 years, 2 months ago) |
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after all, if you're wrong and you never realize it, does it really matter that you're wrong?
It only matters if one makes it matter.
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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylanfireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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deCypher
Registered: 02/10/08
Posts: 56,232
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance [Re: Poid]
#11957818 - 02/03/10 09:12 PM (14 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Poid said:
Any thoughts?
Yeah, I think you're wrong.
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We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.
  
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group
Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,441
Loc: Under the C
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance [Re: Poid]
#11958332 - 02/03/10 10:26 PM (14 years, 2 months ago) |
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It largely has to do with three things:
1. The intensity of emotion involved in a belief
2. The time and effort involved in a belief
3. The ego being embarassed at being wrong (as you have already wrote)
If 1 and 2 are minimal, then 3 is also minimal and vice versa.
Example: Religious Joe Researcher spends 20 years totally wrapped up (pun intended  ) in the Shroud of Turin.
He gets excited that carbon dating will prove him correct about it being the burial cloth of Christ, at least as to time period. When the results are pretty damned conclusive that it was made 1300 years later, he refuses to believe it. How can he and admit he was played for a fool for 20 years?
This same thing plays out with auras, chi, UFOs, crop circles, alien abduction, miracles and what have you; time and time again.
When three crop circle researchers claimed a certain circle to be 'genuine', i.e. not man made, and then were shown the video step-by-step from start to finish, being done by students; two of the three still refused the clear-as-day evidence.
How is this possible? Because of time and emotion invested will not allow them to let go of a failed idea.
Sad, but that is how it all-too-often works. The Search for Truth gets lost along the way.
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Sleepwalker
Overshoes
Registered: 05/07/08
Posts: 5,503
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People hate on Mr. Ock but you're obviously a smart guy...
I've experienced some weird things that I can't (yet) explain, but I hope that I will continue to allow myself to be wrong if it looks that way.
btw, Have you found that Truth yet?
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group
Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,441
Loc: Under the C
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Quote:
btw, Have you found that Truth yet?
The basics: sex, drugs, rock & roll. 
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skatealex2
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Registered: 07/04/08
Posts: 18,699
Last seen: 6 months, 9 days
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said:
This same thing plays out with auras, chi, UFOs, crop circles, alien abduction, miracles and what have you; time and time again.
When three crop circle researchers claimed a certain circle to be 'genuine', i.e. not man made, and then were shown the video step-by-step from start to finish, being done by students; two of the three still refused the clear-as-day evidence.
How is this possible? Because of time and emotion invested will not allow them to let go of a failed idea.
Sad, but that is how it all-too-often works. The Search for Truth gets lost along the way.
Details? 
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir
Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,372
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance [Re: skatealex2]
#11961571 - 02/04/10 12:49 PM (14 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
deCypher said:
Yeah, I think you're wrong.
Damn, now I feel embarassed and anxious...
Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said:
Sad, but that is how it all-too-often works. The Search for Truth gets lost along the way.
Yeah it's pretty pathetic...
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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylanfireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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Freedom
Pigment of your imagination
Registered: 05/26/05
Posts: 6,016
Last seen: 19 days, 5 hours
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance [Re: Poid]
#11962456 - 02/04/10 03:11 PM (14 years, 2 months ago) |
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I think there is a difference between cognitive dissonance and not being right. Briefly,
cognitive dissonance: 
not being right: 
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Freedom
Pigment of your imagination
Registered: 05/26/05
Posts: 6,016
Last seen: 19 days, 5 hours
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance [Re: Poid]
#11962513 - 02/04/10 03:20 PM (14 years, 2 months ago) |
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I think there is a difference between cognitive dissonance and not being right. Briefly,
cognitive dissonance:
not being right:
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir
Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,372
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Re: Cognitive Dissonance [Re: Freedom]
#11962542 - 02/04/10 03:24 PM (14 years, 2 months ago) |
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True; like I said, people prefer the feeling of consonance over dissonance--as being right and feeling right are two different things, people prefer to feel right regardless of whether or not they actually are.
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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylanfireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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