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InvisibleMountainMist
Stranger

Registered: 01/01/03
Posts: 53
Loc: Seattle, Washington
Internet Utopia
    #1195608 - 01/06/03 06:47 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

These internet forums are a very interesting way to communicate with other people. Let's consider some of the advantages:

--We cannot see one another. Therefore we cannot judge one another on the basis of physical appearance.

--We cannot touch one another. Therefore we cannot use force or physically intimidate one another.

--We are not engaged in commerce or exchanging money. We are not trying to sell anything to each other. We have no designs on one anothers' pocketbooks.

--We are anonymous. Therefore we don't have to share any information about ourselves unless we wish to. In fact, we can even create imaginary identities and personae.

--We can write down our thoughts. We don't have to reply immediately. Therefore we have the time to carefully think about what we are going to say. If we lose our temper, we can regain our calm before saying anything.

Despite all of these advantages, despite the absence of so many factors that normally spoil relationships, there seems to be so many people on these forums (not just the Shroomery, I mean all over the net) who use them to attack other people. Things they wouldn't dream of saying to a person's face they just come right out and say. Insults, flames, racial slurs, you name it, the whole gamut. All standards of humanity, decency, and civility go out the window. Such people use the anonymity of these forums as a shield behind which to hide, and from which to spew every kind of poison imaginable.

Sometimes, in the real world, one cannot be as nice as one wants. Perhaps somebody is trying to intimidate us physically, or trying to get our money, or simply invading our space. Perhaps they say something upsetting or inflamatory and we just shoot back without thinking. Maybe we're just tired or in a bad mood, which makes us lose our temper or patience quickly. All of these things make it difficult for us to be as kind, or as patient, or as good, as we might want to be.

None of that applies to a forum like this, however. On an internet forum, YOU ARE FREE TO BE AS ANGELIC OR AS DEMONIC AS YOU WISH TO BE. In a sense, the "true you" comes out much more clearly in these internet forums than it does even when you are with friends and family. Of course, it could all be just an act. Yet simply trying to put up the act of being nice says something about a person, doesn't it? At least it's an effort.

Being nice in the real world takes energy, self-discipline, patience, and a compassionate heart. It takes much less than that to be nice on the net. And yet, there are still people who simply use it as an opportunity to spew hatred and anger in each and every direction.

I like to think of these internet forums as "training wheels for the soul." If you can learn to be kind, wise, and dignified on an internet forum, that becomes an easy and risk-free way to learn how be kind, wise, and dignified in the real world. How can you beat that?


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OfflineMurex
Reality Hacker

Registered: 07/28/02
Posts: 3,599
Loc: Traped in a shell.
Last seen: 9 years, 9 months
Re: Internet Utopia [Re: MountainMist]
    #1195760 - 01/06/03 07:50 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

That's why I'm choosing to be here.


--------------------
What if everything around you
Isn't quite as it seems?
What if all the world you think you know,
Is an elaborate dream?
And if you look at your reflection,
Is it all you want it to be?



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OfflineJackal
Well Versed In Etiquette
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Registered: 10/16/02
Posts: 4,571
Last seen: 2 years, 8 months
Re: Internet Utopia [Re: MountainMist]
    #1196169 - 01/06/03 10:41 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Let's consider some of the advantages:



All the advantages you listed, I consider disadvantages - You can tell a lot about someones character with just a look. We are anonymous; yes, but creating false identites is just deceitful. The Internet shouldn't be about people hiding who they are. If you want to socialise either virtually or in the "real world" then you should be honest.

Quote:

We can write down our thoughts. We don't have to reply immediately. Therefore we have the time to carefully think about what we are going to say. If we lose our temper, we can regain our calm before saying anything.



I also consider this a prelude to dishonesty. You can find out much more about a persons true self when they don't have time to think - i.e. during normal conversation. I am wary of people who take too long to answer a question, it is as though they are concocting a lie.

Quote:

All standards of humanity, decency, and civility go out the window.



This is just the nature of the beast. You criticise people behaviour in one breath, then you encourage deceit and endorse demonic behaviour in another! Where do your morals lie?
Quote:

Being nice in the real world takes energy, self-discipline, patience, and a compassionate heart. It takes much less than that to be nice on the net.



I can't understand why you would say this! Isn't the energy, self-discipline and compassion worth it all? Personally I get a bigger boost from a smile off a stranger, than any praise I have ever recieved on the Internet. I don't mean to offend, but with an attitude like that, you are going to be very lonely!

The Internet is great, and I enjoy using it to socialise and interact with others. However, it shouldn't be considered as an alternative to an active social life - with real friends!

I could go on, but I need to calm down!


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InvisibleMountainMist
Stranger

Registered: 01/01/03
Posts: 53
Loc: Seattle, Washington
Re: Internet Utopia [Re: Jackal]
    #1196790 - 01/07/03 06:22 AM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Dear Jackal,

Thank you for your very interesting reply. I think you're perfectly right that deceit is to be avoided. I wasn't trying to ENCOURAGE deceit, simply to point out that people can experiment with different ways of being, different ways of thought. Identity to some extent is fluid, and perhaps people have been forced by society or other factors to adopt an identity with which they don't feel truly comfortable. But outright deceit, e.g., "I'm a billionaire," or "I've got a twelve inch cock" or "I helped starving kids in Mozambique" or anything else of the sort is surely to be condemned.

This is just the nature of the beast. You criticise people behaviour in one breath, then you encourage deceit and endorse demonic behaviour in another! Where do your morals lie?

My goodness! It was never my intention to encourage deceit and certainly not to endorse demonic behavior. I apologize if I didn't make that clear enough. My point was simply that one has that FREEDOM on the net, one can get away with it, which is why personal responsibility is so important.

The Internet is great, and I enjoy using it to socialise and interact with others. However, it shouldn't be considered as an alternative to an active social life - with real friends!

Once again, I apologize for any misunderstanding. Never did I mean to suggest that the internet should be an alternative to real connections with real people. Quite the contrary! Internet "relationships" are not that at all, they are more fantasy than anything else. Genuine face-to-face relationships are truly most important in the end.

My point was simply this: it's so easy to be nice on the net--so why not just do it? Why use the shield of anonymity to attack and insult other people? Of course the energy, discipline, and compassion of being nice to others in real life is worth it all! That's the whole point, the whole goal! The point is simply that if one is incapable of being nice on the net, how much more difficult it must be to do so in real life.

Thank you for pointing out the confusions and lack of clarity in my previous post, and for your thoughtful remarks. It has given me a chance to clarify myself.


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Invisiblechodamunky
Cheers!

Registered: 02/28/02
Posts: 2,030
Loc: sailing the seas of chees...
Re: Internet Utopia [Re: MountainMist]
    #1197036 - 01/07/03 08:41 AM (14 years, 5 months ago)

you raised some interesting points on the advantages, and Jackal you made a few suprising and equally good replies. you both get 5 Shrooms from me......ehmm..that was just me exercising my "nice" side on the net  :wink: Now I most go sacrifice a goat and surrender to the dark forces  :blush: 


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Offline3eyedgod
trippinkid

Registered: 11/24/02
Posts: 684
Loc: Far away and very near
Last seen: 13 years, 10 months
Re: Internet Utopia [Re: Jackal]
    #1197050 - 01/07/03 08:49 AM (14 years, 5 months ago)

I also consider this a prelude to dishonesty. You can find out much more about a persons true self when they don't have time to think - i.e. during normal conversation. I am wary of people who take too long to answer a question, it is as though they are concocting a lie.

I see, so you are yet another that would rather engage in inane senseless chatter, rather than letting someone take the time to put their thoughts together. Intelligent conversation with well thought out, well laid out concepts and ideas are kept out of the main stream society because of attitudes like that. Beleive me people can let lies roll off their tongue just as quickly as they could the truth. How long someone takes to answer is irrelevant when considering whether they are lieing or not. They are either gonna tell you a quick truth, a well thought out truth, or a quick lie, a well thought out lie.

When trying decide whether you are being deceived or not it is best to consider the character of the person(if you've known them long enough) and most importantly what could they gain by lieing to you in the situation.


--------------------
Without everything wouldn't nothing be everything and without nothing wouldn't everything be nothing.I am the beginning and the end,the source and the void, the light and the darkness,i am but a small drop of the ocean yet i am an ocean unto myself


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OfflineAdamist
ℚṲℰϟ✞ЇѺℵ ℛ∃Åʟḯ†У
Male User Gallery

Registered: 11/24/01
Posts: 10,211
Loc: Bloomington, IN
Last seen: 2 years, 3 months
Re: Internet Utopia [Re: 3eyedgod]
    #1197562 - 01/07/03 12:28 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

I agree, 3eyedgod!  :smile:

I think that the advantages listed by MountainMist can also be disadvantages, but the good always comes with the bad, as I'm sure everyone here knows. 


--------------------
:heartpump: { { { ṧ◎ηḯ¢ αʟ¢ℌ℮мƴ } } } :heartpump:


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OfflineJackal
Well Versed In Etiquette
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Registered: 10/16/02
Posts: 4,571
Last seen: 2 years, 8 months
Re: Internet Utopia [Re: 3eyedgod]
    #1199327 - 01/08/03 03:06 AM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

would rather engage in inane senseless chatter,



No, A persons first thoughts are the most telling. If someone takes time to answer everything you put to them, then I don't think you get a true impression of that person. It maybe just me but I prefer to act on impulse.


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Anonymous

Re: Internet Utopia [Re: Jackal]
    #1199337 - 01/08/03 03:18 AM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Thank you for visiting with us. :smile:


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OfflineJackal
Well Versed In Etiquette
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Registered: 10/16/02
Posts: 4,571
Last seen: 2 years, 8 months
Re: Internet Utopia [Re: ]
    #1199359 - 01/08/03 03:31 AM (14 years, 5 months ago)

I like to drop by from time to time :wink:


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Anonymous

Re: Internet Utopia [Re: Jackal]
    #1199375 - 01/08/03 03:45 AM (14 years, 5 months ago)

How's everyone down at the OTD pub?  How many dead, etc?

I haven't been there because I am studying for my Doctorate in BS which should be finished baking any time now.

I missed you. :frown:


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Invisiblephreakyzen
My God is anAwesome God

Registered: 12/16/02
Posts: 274
Loc: Under the sea
Re: Internet Utopia [Re: MountainMist]
    #1199932 - 01/08/03 09:02 AM (14 years, 5 months ago)

The advantages you list are indeed good but should we excuse ourselves from doing these things in face to face situations? Think of how mad people get in cars, they yell and curse because there is usually no direct confrontation. Most people I know get real worked up in cars where they would never say a thing if the same person were to cut in line or take their cab.

Prejudice will exist no matter what, it is now just based on the person's intellect and spelling ability.

Everybody is selling all the time whether or not it is themselves they are selling for opinion or actual items for money.

Anonymity is also quickly disappearing. It is not that hard to get somebody's IP address and do the work to find out where they live.

In any instance you should think before replying, the internet does not make it any easier unless you are intimidated into babbling BS as a reply when face to face. You can read somebody's words, get emotional and reply before thinking on the internet as well.


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Offline3eyedgod
trippinkid

Registered: 11/24/02
Posts: 684
Loc: Far away and very near
Last seen: 13 years, 10 months
Re: Internet Utopia [Re: Jackal]
    #1200066 - 01/08/03 09:42 AM (14 years, 5 months ago)

I beg to differ. People's first thoughts are often just a part of the "front" they put up for other people. Their first thoughts are often the simplest to express and socially safe. I'm very careful about revealing myself in social situations, and I suspect that many other people aren't willing to completely share there "true" self with everyone all the time either.


--------------------
Without everything wouldn't nothing be everything and without nothing wouldn't everything be nothing.I am the beginning and the end,the source and the void, the light and the darkness,i am but a small drop of the ocean yet i am an ocean unto myself


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