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Anonymous

We Haven't Had a Rant in a While...
    #1183240 - 01/01/03 04:23 PM (13 years, 11 months ago)

With every day that goes by, with every massacre committed by Israel, by the Palistinians, by the Muslims in Africa and the Catholics in eastern Europe, I hate religion more and more. Don't give me the typical arguement, "There are only a few bad apples in each religion that ruin the reputation of the rest." On the contrary, there are only a few good apples.

Sure, there are only a few Muslims in the middle east who are actually doing the killing, but almost the entire middle eastern Islam population stands by idle and indifferent to this violence. The majority of Americans are religious, mostly Christian, and the majority of Americans also support a war with Iraq not out of self defense, but for preventative reasons.

I really have nothing against religion in theory, if you want to belive in an afterlife, more power to you. But don't live your life based on a damn book, live it based on your feelings, desires, and personal morals.

This is why I have so much respect for Buddhism. Granted, I know very little about the religion itself, but as far as I know, there have been no wars started by Buddhist nations, with lust for blood. Here is a quote from an Onion article posted in another thread:

"The Muslims massacre the Hindus, the Hindus massacre the Muslims. The Buddhists, everybody massacres the Buddhists. The Jews, don't even get me started on the hardline, right-wing, Meir Kahane-loving Israeli nationalists, man. And the Christians? You people believe in a Messiah who says, 'Turn the other cheek,' but you've been killing everybody you can get your hands on since the Crusades."

You have to admire a religion that, in the face of violence and hatred, can truely "turn the other cheek."


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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
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Re: We Haven't Had a Rant in a While... [Re: Anonymous]
    #1183299 - 01/01/03 05:10 PM (13 years, 11 months ago)

For the love of God man, it's all for the love of god.  God WANTS us to kill each other, God WANTS us to blindly follow dogmas which leads to our destruction.  We're all created in his image, and he's a violent, hateful, vengeful, destructive blind follower of myths and superstition... oh, and it's all because he loves us. :wink:


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To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.


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OfflineGrav
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Re: We Haven't Had a Rant in a While... [Re: Anonymous]
    #1183412 - 01/01/03 06:26 PM (13 years, 11 months ago)

Fear is their only god.


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OfflineAdamist
ℚṲℰϟ✞ЇѺℵ ℛ∃Åʟḯ†У
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Re: We Haven't Had a Rant in a While... [Re: Grav]
    #1183430 - 01/01/03 06:33 PM (13 years, 11 months ago)

Fear of the unknown.


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OfflineStrumpling
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Re: We Haven't Had a Rant in a While... [Re: Adamist]
    #1183606 - 01/01/03 08:39 PM (13 years, 11 months ago)

Fear of having to say "aww shit ya know what? we were pretty wrong... hehe whoops sorry about that - lets try another theory"

??


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Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
In addition: SHPONGLE


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OfflineAdamist
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Re: We Haven't Had a Rant in a While... [Re: Strumpling]
    #1183615 - 01/01/03 08:52 PM (13 years, 11 months ago)

That's going more specific with it, but your example does apply in many cases. :smile: 


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InvisibleMountainMist
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Re: We Haven't Had a Rant in a While... [Re: Anonymous]
    #1183642 - 01/01/03 09:20 PM (13 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

This is why I have so much respect for Buddhism. Granted, I know very little about the religion itself, but as far as I know, there have been no wars started by Buddhist nations, with lust for blood.




Actually, Buddhist kings through history have started a few wars now and then, and various Buddhist monasteries throughout Asia have fought one another for various kinds of political (worldly) power. On the whole, though, Buddhism is aided by the fact that

a) The Buddha made no claims for himself to be anything other than a man like any other, simply one with special understanding. No magic, no miracles, no direct hotline to God (no talk about "God" whatsoever, in fact), none of that. All he said was: here are a few truths I've discovered about life on the physical plane. Take them or leave them.

b) Because of point a), Buddhism has been relatively relaxed about finding converts, and only on the rarest of occasions have Buddhists ever resorted to force to make converts. The problem with using force for anything of course is that it creates hatreds that last for centuries, even millennia, turning round and round in an endless cycle of revenge.


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InvisibleRevelation

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Re: We Haven't Had a Rant in a While... [Re: MountainMist]
    #1183969 - 01/02/03 04:37 AM (13 years, 11 months ago)

Well said.


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OfflineCrowHeart
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Re: We Haven't Had a Rant in a While... [Re: Anonymous]
    #1184001 - 01/02/03 04:50 AM (13 years, 11 months ago)

The problem isn't religion in itself ie. the belief in an higher power. The problem are the organized, ritualistic religions, led by men who think they are better than the rest of us because of it.

"Think for yourself", that's the answer, if for instance there wasn't such a thing as the vatican, the crusades would never have happened, the inquisition would never have happened, the prolem is that men follow men...


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What the hell am I supposed to write here???


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Offlineribbit
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Re: We Haven't Had a Rant in a While... [Re: CrowHeart]
    #1184177 - 01/02/03 06:49 AM (13 years, 11 months ago)

the problem is religion itself IMO, man wants to believe his religion is correct and will kill in that name to prove it. its fear, they fear other beliefs...that if their are other beliefs, that his is not the 'all mighty'

im against organized religion, more people have been killed in the name of God than anything else


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InvisibleMountainMist
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Re: We Haven't Had a Rant in a While... [Re: ribbit]
    #1185461 - 01/02/03 03:54 PM (13 years, 11 months ago)

I don't think religion is the only culprit. One could also point one's fingers at Nationalism, Fascism, Stalinism, Maoism, etc. Anybody, whether religious or not, can kill people for money, for power, or simply because he thinks he's right and everybody else is wrong.

It's true that many people have been killed in the name of religion. That makes a nice, tidy body count. On the other side of the coin, however, it's impossible to know how many more or less people would have been killed if religion had never existed. Although many people kill in the name of religion, a large number of people whom we cannot count probably refrain from murder and other immoral acts because of their faith. It would be impossible to figure the balance.

I think there are two ways of looking at other living beings. Either you fixate on the differences or you try to keep in mind the similarities. Personal egotism, family or clan pride, patriotism/nationalism, racial identity, class consciousness, religious intolerance, species arrogance--all of these create an us/them mentality which allows us to strip the other of worth and dignity. All of these things allow us to hate, and if that hatred is allowed to fester, to kill. If not hatred, then indifference and the disregard for life that comes from that.

If, on the other hand, one keeps in mind similarities--that we are all born, that we all suffer, that we all seek happiness in the best way that our limited intellects tell us to (and all mortal intellect is limited, by definition), that we all need love, that we all die--then it is much harder to hate and to kill.

All I'm trying to say is: Don't hate religion--hate hatred. Or ideally, stop hating altogether.


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OfflineDogomush
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Re: We Haven't Had a Rant in a While... [Re: MountainMist]
    #1185507 - 01/02/03 04:21 PM (13 years, 11 months ago)

Bhutan is a buddhist country in the Himalayas, and there are 80 000 refugees from it living in Nepal. Something's wrong here. You don't run from a peaceful Buddhist country into NEPAL! :tongue:

Conclusion: Buddhism is a violent religion.


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OfflineMurex
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Re: We Haven't Had a Rant in a While... [Re: MountainMist]
    #1185683 - 01/02/03 06:07 PM (13 years, 11 months ago)

5 shrooms for your intituative comments. I have concluded that you are a fairly wise person MountianMist. Good to have you join us!

:wink:



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What if everything around you
Isn't quite as it seems?
What if all the world you think you know,
Is an elaborate dream?
And if you look at your reflection,
Is it all you want it to be?



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OfflineAdamist
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Re: We Haven't Had a Rant in a While... [Re: MountainMist]
    #1185707 - 01/02/03 06:14 PM (13 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Personal egotism, family or clan pride, patriotism/nationalism, racial identity, class consciousness, religious intolerance, species arrogance--all of these create an us/them mentality which allows us to strip the other of worth and dignity.



I agree! I think what you listed has just as much, if not a greater effect on someone's actions rather than what their religion is.

I think what the Us/Them mentality first creates is a state of fear. When this fear is temporarily pacified by the disease of hate, it can lead to violence. The Us/Them mentality is something that lies within all humans, but it does not have to conclude in violence. I believe we should always work to compromise, because that's how the Universe is... a compromise between the Light and Dark.


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OfflineCrowHeart
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Re: We Haven't Had a Rant in a While... [Re: ribbit]
    #1186191 - 01/03/03 02:05 AM (13 years, 11 months ago)

Maybe you're right, but, if no one told them to kill in the name of a god, maybe thei wouldn't kill...

Maybe...


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What the hell am I supposed to write here???


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OfflineCrowHeart
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Re: We Haven't Had a Rant in a While... [Re: MountainMist]
    #1186193 - 01/03/03 02:07 AM (13 years, 11 months ago)

I agree with your post, except for the nationalism part, the fact that you love your country does not necessarely mean that you hate all others, i know i don't, and O LOVE my country...




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What the hell am I supposed to write here???


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