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Offlineurbanfarmer
l'estranger
Registered: 12/22/08
Posts: 614
Last seen: 10 years, 11 months
Re: I wish i were a liberal [Re: Seuss]
    #11904247 - 01/26/10 09:26 AM (14 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Seuss said:
> How will providing it en masse lower the cost?

You just aren't looking long term.  First we provide free healthcare to everybody that wants it.  This means people that used to take their child to the ER for the sniffles can now go to a doctor instead.  It also means that we will be providing preventive healthcare to people from childbirth until they are able to work, thus we will have a more healthy workforce.  This will reduce costs associated with sick leave, allow people to work to an older age, and reduce the costs of healthcare later in life as problems were corrected early.

Of course, this plan will create a massive shortage of doctors and nurses.  To fix this, we will give scholarships to minorities to help fill the positions.  We will also lower the requirements to become a healthcare professional to help get the numbers up.  Although the standard of healthcare will drop, it will be equally available to everybody.  We will also probably have to prioritize who gets healthcare first with the able workers at the top of the list.  Long waiting lines will eventually decrease as more people that can afford good healthcare travel to Mexico or China.

We will also have to raise tax rates to pay for everything.  It is a good thing that we will have a large and healthy workforce to help pay for treatment.  We will also have to start limiting risky behavior that can lead to costly injuries.  We have already begun this campaign, requiring children to wear helmets and pads when outdoors, requiring drivers to wear seatbelts and crash helmets.  Soon however, we will begin to outlaw various dangerous activities, such as running with scissors, walking around sharp corners, playing sports, or going outside after dark.

Finally, we will probably have to take over the pharmaceutical industry.  We will already have taken over the healthcare professionals and insurance industry, so this shouldn't be difficult or a big surprise.  Once the government owns the pharmaceutical companies, it can provide cheap drugs.  Unfortunately, this will stifle competitive innovation in the pharmaceutical field.  I'm sure other countries, such as Israel, will be more than willing to carry the slack in exchange for lucrative deals with the US on newly discovered drugs.

Oh, I almost forgot, the above will probably generate a lot of negative press.  We may need to take over the media as well, to protect the people from sensationalism.  There is no telling how hurt some people might become if they are allowed to read misleading 'freedom' propaganda.  Riots, spurred by freedom of the press, are detrimental to the function of a smoothly engineered socialist society and must be prevented at all costs.  Giving up a few basic rights to benefit society as a whole is a minor sacrifice to make.




That got a chuckle out of me this morning.

Look at the actual numbers on our health care system versus the rest of the first world.  We get awful care here and pay out the nose for it.  Here's a quick graphical rendering:
http://blogs.ngm.com/.a/6a00e0098226918833012876a6070f970c-800wi
...but you can look at wikipedia, the cia factbook, WHO, CDC, etc.  They all say about the same: we pay more than anyone else for below-average care.

On pharma, government grants and university labs invent/discover almost every drug on the market.  The FDA then licenses these drugs to pharma companies, who do formulations, testing, marketing, and of course, upcharging obscene rates.

You're a good writer.  Need to do more research, though.

Edited by urbanfarmer (01/26/10 01:50 PM)

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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 9 months
Re: I wish i were a liberal [Re: urbanfarmer]
    #11904683 - 01/26/10 11:03 AM (14 years, 2 months ago)

We do not get awful care.  In fact, we get great care.

Quote:

urbanfarmer said:


On pharma, government grants and university labs invent/discover almost every drug on the market.  The FDA then licenses these drugs to pharma companies, who do formulations, testing, marketing, and of course, upcharging obscene rates.





Bullshit.  Total.


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OfflineEgo Questio
Ghost in the Machine
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Registered: 10/25/09
Posts: 1,141
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Re: I wish i were a liberal [Re: Pony]
    #11904712 - 01/26/10 11:09 AM (14 years, 2 months ago)

I've been out of the loop for a while on this thread and have a bit of catching up to do, but this caught my eye

Quote:

Pony said:
I'm not a racist, but statistically speaking, blacks have a lower IQ and they vote democrat, Jews on the other hand have statistically high IQs and they vote democrat.  The problem with using Jewish people in this statistic is that with their culture, they help their family members start their own businesses/get an education.




No, I'm not going to pull the racist card on you (although I do have my own opinions on this statement). But I think I have to mention, blacks do not have lower IQs, statistically speaking or otherwise. IQ tests are massively slanted to formal academic education and it is an unfortunate fact that a lot of black kids in the education system do poorly in it due to economic factors,broken families,shitty neighbourhoods or actual ghettos, struggling schools compared to white middle class suburbia,predjudice from society and the education system, cultural influences, Christ, a million things make it harder for black kids in education, meaning a)they do poorly at biased tests that supposedly measure their intellience :facepalm:-bollocks  and b)find it nearly impossible without a decent education to lift themselves out of their situation or break the cycle for their kids when they go to school.

Conversely, with the example you gave with the Jewish community, who actually club together to provide an education for their kids, who then go on to do well because they have a decent education and you get positive reinforcement-surely that's a shining example of the reason for state-funded education?! Expand the model to society at large, instead of one cultural niche-society helps these kids get an education and they come out with higher IQs, the capacity to lift themselves upwards with the tools to then "work hard" as you all call it and do something with their lives, benefiting society at large.


--------------------
Over one's mind and over one's body the individual is sovereign.
John Stuart Mill, On Liberty
(1806 - 1873)
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To all you good gents, I say :hatsoff:

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Offlinelemur
Stranger

Registered: 01/19/10
Posts: 2
Last seen: 13 years, 6 months
Re: I wish i were a liberal [Re: Ego Questio]
    #11910813 - 01/27/10 10:35 AM (14 years, 2 months ago)


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
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Re: I wish i were a liberal [Re: lemur]
    #11910862 - 01/27/10 10:44 AM (14 years, 2 months ago)

Old.  Maybe you should get current with the world.


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Offlinejimbotron
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Registered: 02/24/09
Posts: 2,324
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Re: I wish i were a liberal [Re: zappaisgod]
    #11911958 - 01/27/10 01:41 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Old.  Maybe you should get current with the world.






The song remains the same :rofl:


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BEST TEAM IN THE UNIVERSE

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InvisiblePony
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Registered: 11/01/09
Posts: 287
Loc: Oklahoma
Re: I wish i were a liberal [Re: jimbotron]
    #12081062 - 02/22/10 11:36 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

that's fucking retarded anyway, alright, first of all with that link and the suicide thing.  I took sociology of death and dying in college, even though common sense would make you figure it out anyway.  People in more Rural areas commit suicide more often, it doesn't matter how you vote, people are social creatures, and if you live out in the middle of no where, you're going to get depressed.  Hence why young Indian males on reservations have the highest suicide rate.  Hormones, plus being secluded.

Secondly, they've found that a good education up your IQ about three points, but IQ is mostly genetic, that's why they pay so well at sperm banks if you have a PhD.  I am not a racist, that's just the way it is.  I can also accept that the athletic black people are probably considerably more athletic than me, even though I'm in decent shape.  The idea of "colorblindness" is absurd.  We are all different, and it's ridiculous to think that can be ignored.  I'm not saying that my race is better in anyway, just different.

Lastly, don't be a idiot, you expect me to believe that the average person has a higher than average IQ?  No, that's why it's average, don't post bogus statistics by anything political based.


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Sacred cows make the best hamburgers.

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OfflineSeussA
Error: divide byzero


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Registered: 04/27/01
Posts: 23,480
Loc: Caribbean
Last seen: 1 month, 19 days
Re: I wish i were a liberal [Re: Pony]
    #12081725 - 02/23/10 04:31 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

> Hence why young Indian males on reservations have the highest suicide rate.  Hormones, plus being secluded.

Interesting claim.  I don't suppose you have any journal published studies to back up these claims, or did you just decide that is the way it must be?

> Secondly, they've found that a good education up your IQ about three points

I don't know if this is true or not, but IQ is supposed to represent your ability, or potential, to learn and is supposed to be independent of education.

> The idea of "colorblindness" is absurd.  We are all different, and it's ridiculous to think that can be ignored.

The only thing absurd is assuming that skin color somehow relates to ones potential across an entire culture.  One of the founding tenants of racism is stereotyping, which is exactly what you are doing.  Perhaps you don't mean to be racist, but that doesn't excuse the racist statements you are making.  There is nothing genetic that prevents a person with dark skin from being smart and there is nothing that prevents a person with light skin from being a good athlete.  Genetically, on average, we all have equal potential.


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Invisiblememes
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Registered: 01/11/05
Posts: 27,785
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Re: I wish i were a liberal [Re: Seuss]
    #12081800 - 02/23/10 05:42 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Seuss said:

> Secondly, they've found that a good education up your IQ about three points

I don't know if this is true or not, but IQ is supposed to represent your ability, or potential, to learn and is supposed to be independent of education.




IQ is a relative measure (100 is always the mean for the population) and follows a normal distribution.  So while IQ may not have any direct linkage to education, the link exists:  if more of the population is illiterate/uneducated - they will have a relatively low (and you, a relatively high) IQ.

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OfflineSeussA
Error: divide byzero


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Registered: 04/27/01
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Re: I wish i were a liberal [Re: memes]
    #12082380 - 02/23/10 10:02 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

> IQ is a relative measure (100 is always the mean for the population) and follows a normal distribution.

Modern IQ scores are based upon a gaussian bell curve, centered at 100, with and a standard deviation of 15.

> if more of the population is illiterate/uneducated - they will have a relatively low (and you, a relatively high) IQ.

Incorrect.  Again, education has little to nothing to do with IQ.  It is typically a measure of mathematical and spatial reasoning, logical ability, and language understanding.  An uneducated child can still have a very high IQ while an educated child can still have a very low IQ.  See: Mingroni, Michael A., 2007, Resolving the IQ Paradox: Heterosis as a Cause of the Flynn Effect and Other Trends, pp. 806–829.

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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Registered: 01/22/03
Posts: 193,665
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Re: I wish i were a liberal [Re: Pony]
    #12082427 - 02/23/10 10:12 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Pony said:
People in more Rural areas commit suicide more often




why then would Seattle Washington have the highest rate of suicides of
residents in the US, Las Vegas having the highest in the nation of non
residents is easily explained

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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
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Re: I wish i were a liberal [Re: Seuss]
    #12082434 - 02/23/10 10:13 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

You sure it's 15?  I thought it was 10.


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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: I wish i were a liberal [Re: memes]
    #12082541 - 02/23/10 10:43 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

meams said:
IQ is a relative measure (100 is always the mean for the population) and follows a normal distribution.




which is why the tests are constantly re normalized to try and maintain that 100 IQ as the mean


Quote:

if more of the population is illiterate/uneducated - they will have a relatively low (and you, a relatively high) IQ.




but the tests will be adjusted to make sure the mean remains 100, a
redistribution of IQ points that we can certainly blame on obama :smirk:

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InvisiblePony
Part-Time Bra
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Registered: 11/01/09
Posts: 287
Loc: Oklahoma
Re: I wish i were a liberal [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #12150943 - 03/05/10 09:14 PM (14 years, 26 days ago)

Seuss, no offence, but you're a retard.  Like it or not different races have different genetics, I don't see how anyone can argue that.  Racism in the most common sense of the word is a belief that your race is better than another or that another race is worse than another.  I just said they're different.  I can't stand people that are so fucking dumb that they can't realize that people/races/cultures are different because the MTV fad says they aren't.

Secondly, Seattle doesnt have the highest suicide rate.  I can tell you what text book it's in, but not what page.  Sociology of Death and Dying.  It was a text book i had in (guess which class) sociology of death and dying.

But anyway, back to my point, if the average IQ is 100, no matter what, and those statistics someone posted where the average population was like what, 110?  is rediculous.


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Sacred cows make the best hamburgers.

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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Posts: 193,665
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Re: I wish i were a liberal [Re: Pony]
    #12151042 - 03/05/10 09:38 PM (14 years, 26 days ago)

Quote:

Pony said:
Seuss, no offence, but you're a retard.  Like it or not different races have different genetics, I don't see how anyone can argue that.




no one can argue that especially when people of the same race have
different genetics, if you were not being an ignorant bigot you'd
mention that, who knows, you might even realize that you share mane of
these genes with those other races

and no offense, but flaming is against the rules

Quote:

Racism in the most common sense of the word is a belief that your race is better than another or that another race is worse than another.




it can also be describes as certain races portray undesirable traits

Quote:

I can't stand people that are so fucking dumb that they can't realize that people/races/cultures are different because the MTV fad says they aren't.




it must be unbearable living with yourself, having such a narrow view
that you cant tell that each individual is different

Quote:

Secondly, Seattle doesnt have the highest suicide rate.  I can tell you what text book it's in, but not what page.  Sociology of Death and Dying.  It was a text book i had in (guess which class) sociology of death and dying.




correct, Las Vegas does but those suicides in Vegas are generally not
from residents, it's from visitors, as for your text book, by the time
it's written and hit the publisher, it's obsolete, the information can
change and I was wrong... it's Portland Oregon with the #1 ranking
outside of Vegas


Quote:

But anyway, back to my point, if the average IQ is 100, no matter what, and those statistics someone posted where the average population was like what, 110?  is rediculous.




it's always 100 because they normalize the tests so that the average IQ is always 100

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