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Re: Benny Hinn Faith-Healing Expose [Re: World Spirit]
    #1184902 -

if railgun doesn't reply (perhaps he didn't have the chance untill now), could you enter?? i always find your views from a christian point of view one of the most intelligent i hear out of that corner, so i'm very curious. *too bad there isn't a smiley available with a tongue hanging out of his mouth*

my opinion is indeed one based on the facts. Where religion contradicts in its outspoken beliefs with reality, nature (science if you will) NEVER does. It merely chooses its victims and "miraclous" healings based on biologic disruptments , indifferent of race, religion, heteros or gays, men or women, democrats or republicans :smile:

damn, i hate the fact english ain't my first language. In dutch i like to let the words drop of my tongue in beautiful phrases (just because my joy of it i guess), and i notice on this board i'm just trying to survive in english  :frown: 

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Re: Benny Hinn Faith-Healing Expose [Re: quemo]
    #1185008 -

wouldn't be an idea if you ppl just all learnt dutch?? YES THAT WOULD BE A GOOD IDEA!!! :grin: 

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Re: Benny Hinn Faith-Healing Expose [Re: quemo]
    #1185657 -

Quote:
Quote:
Actually, the human body is pretty resiliant. It can heal itself pretty well in many different situations. A lot of people who don't believe in god, or even those who curse him are "miraculously" healed all the time. Also, many who pray desperately, and love Jesus with a zealous passion, die.
 


railgun, could you give a reply to the above statement?? because i do second phlucks remark on this one....thanks :smile:

oh yeah and all the best bla bla bla by the way....no seriously! 


Sorry for taking so long to reply. I work second shift and didn't a chance until now.

I agree with most of it. The body is resiliant and has an immense ability to heal itself. But there are also miracles. Some people that curse God recieve miracles, I have no disagreement with that. I don't have an explanation for it. And as far as Christians dieing, well, everyone dies physically, at least for a short time.

There are some documented miracles. At myt friends pentacostal church a man went there and asked for the minister to pray for him because he had full blown AIDS. The minister prayed for him that God would be with him in his time of suffering. The man said "No, pray for God to heal me." The minister said He didn't have that kind of faith. The man with AIDS grabbed him and put his arms around him in a bear hug adn said "I'm not leaving until you pray for God to heal me." The minister said a short prayer to the LORD while that man continued holding him and the minister claims God told him "You don't have the faith for him to be healed but he does, pray for him." or words similar to those. The minister agreed to pray for the man and he let go of him. The man then left and said he'de go and get tested for AIDS again. 2 weeks later he came in with a letter from his physician saying somthing like "I don't believe this was a miracle as my patient does but he did have full blown AIDS and now he doesn't." That medical documentation that somthing changed. God has som miracle power and just because one guy is a fraud doens't mean God is. 


--------------------
"If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do."-King Solomon

And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

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Re: Benny Hinn Faith-Healing Expose [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #1185718 -

So rail gun, this guy had full blown aids and two weeks later he tested negative? Or, he just got better without actually having beat the disease?

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Re: Benny Hinn Faith-Healing Expose [Re: Buddha5254]
    #1185797 -

I don't know. I'll inquire about it the next time I get the chance. I hope the guy beat it. I don't know though. At the very least it went from full blown AIDS in to not full blown AIDS. I'll ask within the next few days.


--------------------
"If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do."-King Solomon

And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

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Re: Benny Hinn Faith-Healing Expose [Re: Adamist]
    #1186661 -

Yeah, but as your spiritual beliefs change, so does your diet and lifestyle.
So those beliefs do have a role in cancer rates, right?

Actions (and emotions) determine cancer rates, not whether you believe in Jesus, Mohammed, Buddha or none of the above.

If prayer and faith had value, disease rates would change along faith lines rather than eating/smoking/drinking lines.

How can I make that any clearer?


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.

Edited by Swami (01/03/03 06:04 AM)

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Re: Benny Hinn Faith-Healing Expose [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #1186821 -

"At the very least it went from full blown AIDS in to not full blown AIDS. I'll ask within the next few days. "

Well, first off, I've heard a good deal of horseshit about miracles, and you might want to check to make sure this isn't just a silly little story from "Chicken Soup for the AIDS Victim's Soul" before you believe in it whole heartedly. Secondly, I'm not expert on AIDS, and I'm sure you're not either, but I do know that what kills you is other diseases, since it's an immune system deficiency. Surely the victim's health will fluctuate for a while before they die.

Just because something seems implausible doesn't mean it's miraculous. People win their battles with diseases on a regular basis, I'm not sure why this isn't possible without God's divine intervention.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us

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Re: Benny Hinn Faith-Healing Expose [Re: World Spirit]
    #1194101 -

If I feel the atmosphere is suitable when I return, I will give you guys as objective of an opinion as possible.

How can you be "objective" when you can't possibly know if the "miracles" he performs are real or not? The only way to be objective would be to do what the Dateline crew did and follow up with people after they are ?healed?, and to determine if they were ever sick to begin with. If you base your opinion strictly on his charisma, which it sounds like you will do, then you will easily be suckered by this guy.

I will say this though: None of your arguments have proven Hinn to be a liar.

Hinn had two ways of dealing to the Dateline crew:

1) Share the medical case history with the Dateline crew and prove he was for real
2) Keep everything a secret and let people believe what they want without proof (or disproof)

If what he did was real, he would be a fool to choose Option #2, since Option #1 would allow him to go from making $200,000,000 a year to about $20,000,000,000 a year (hell, I?D give him my money if he proved he was for real!).

On the other hand, if what he did was fake, he would be a fool to choose Option #1, since that would prove him to be phony and reduce his earnings from $200,000,000 a year to about $2,000,000 a year (why would anyone donate if they knew he was fake?).

Hinn chose Option #2. Is he a fool, or is he a phony? He?s done a remarkable job at raising money, so I don?t think he?s a fool?


--------------------
:smile:  Just stating my thoughts, not trying to offend  :smile:

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Re: Benny Hinn Faith-Healing Expose [Re: GoBlue!]
    #1194154 -

I agree with you man.

If somebody doing this stuff was actually "the real deal," they'd be almost instantly known worldwide, and possibly kidnapped by the US government to run all sorts of experiments n shit on them.


--------------------
Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
In addition: SHPONGLE

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Re: Benny Hinn Faith-Healing Expose [Re: GoBlue!]
    #1194572 -

I don't care what the doctors say, I still think I'm healed.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us

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Re: Benny Hinn Faith-Healing Expose [Re: Phluck]
    #1194603 -

That poor little old lady with the son who had cancer as well as herself, insisting she got healed only to die shortley after.

Dateline spoke with some former employees of Benny who were very high up in the organization. From what they say he was all and only about the all mighty dollar. Apparently an old lady told Benny"this is my last 5 dollars" before she gave it to him and he came into the back room with a big smile saying " I got her last 5 dollars". He's a smart guy, being a church is the best loophole to misappropriate funds.


--------------------

"Little racoons and old possums 'n' stuff all live up in here. They've got to have a little place to sit." Bob Ross.

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Re: Benny Hinn Faith-Healing Expose [Re: sir tripsalot]
    #1194834 -

Yeah you definitely have to be pretty brilliant to pull this off and convince even several thousand people... too bad he's wasting his brain on this scam


--------------------
Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
In addition: SHPONGLE

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Re: Benny Hinn Faith-Healing Expose [Re: sir tripsalot]
    #1194954 -

"That poor little old lady with the son who had cancer as well as herself, insisting she got healed only to die shortley after."

This happens countless times. There was a really high profile case here in Canada a few years ago where some kid who had some sort of terminal disease was being taken away by his family to some special alternative healing resort in Mexico. Doctors insisted that the only way that he had a chance was if they treated him, but his family wouldn't listen. People wanted the state to step in and force the family to let the child be treated by doctors, but it was decided that wasn't the right thing to do.

After about a week of having magical rocks or whatever rubbed all over his body, the kid died.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us

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Re: Benny Hinn Faith-Healing Expose [Re: Strumpling]
    #1194964 -

"too bad he's wasting his brain on this scam"

Wasting his brain? He's a millionaire!


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us

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Re: Benny Hinn Faith-Healing Expose [Re: Phluck]
    #1195284 -

how much good does that do for anybody else?

he's a millionaire due to his facade of being helpful, spiritual, and caring - I think thats a waste of humanity.


--------------------
Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
In addition: SHPONGLE

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Re: Benny Hinn Faith-Healing Expose [Re: Strumpling]
    #1195335 -

That's another point, Benny Hinn doesn't "make" any money at all(execept for a modest salary in the area of 150k a year), a church doesn't have to disclose what it does with donations. So Benny stays in the churches purchased home( I think they may have given it some name like "prayer retreat"). This is one of the reasons he has been in the spotlight, they know somethings up but proving it hasn't been as easy..


--------------------

"Little racoons and old possums 'n' stuff all live up in here. They've got to have a little place to sit." Bob Ross.

Edited by sir tripsalot (01/06/03 02:56 PM)

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Re: Benny Hinn Faith-Healing Expose [Re: Strumpling]
    #1195390 -

He's an asshole, but so's Ron Popeil.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us

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Re: Benny Hinn Faith-Healing Expose [Re: Phluck]
    #1196289 -

Something they don't have in common however is that Ron's actually an inventor and sells real products.

I'll sell you a prayer and a pat on the head for $50 if you want.


--------------------
Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
In addition: SHPONGLE

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Re: Benny Hinn Faith-Healing Expose [Re: Strumpling]
    #1197877 -

Hinn's invented a genius system to scam people out of millions. He's selling false hope, and a teeny bit of real joy.

He's still a dishonest asshole.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us

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Re: Benny Hinn Faith-Healing Expose [Re: Phluck]
    #1198375 -

The story about the AIDs guy just makes the pastor out to be a bigoted ass-clown. Dont it?

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