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m00nshine
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Registered: 11/18/05
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Coir without pasteurization
#11616487 - 12/09/09 11:55 AM (15 years, 1 month ago) |
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I've seen a couple posts about coir being really contam resistant and decided to give it a go. Everything is going really well. I made a tray with 4 pf cakes and a bunch of coir. Maybe a 1:4 or 1:5 ratio. Just hydrated the block, took out chunks of coir, squeezed them well, and threw them into the tray with the crumbled cakes. This is what it looks like 6 days later:
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skullhuman
the skullman cometh



Registered: 06/15/09
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Re: Coir without pasteurization [Re: m00nshine]
#11616507 - 12/09/09 11:58 AM (15 years, 1 month ago) |
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No need to pasteurize coir, as it has no thermophilic bacteria content to preserve. I just hydrate it myself these days, no heat treatment.
You should pasteurize verm however, if you're using that.
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m00nshine
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Re: Coir without pasteurization [Re: skullhuman]
#11616517 - 12/09/09 11:59 AM (15 years, 1 month ago) |
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Yes, I've had poorly prepared verm/peat contaminate.
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skullhuman
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Re: Coir without pasteurization [Re: m00nshine]
#11616715 - 12/09/09 12:34 PM (15 years, 1 month ago) |
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Perilous shit.
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RogerRabbit
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Re: Coir without pasteurization [Re: m00nshine]
#11616722 - 12/09/09 12:35 PM (15 years, 1 month ago) |
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That's because fungi spores will germinate and grow on peat and/or vermiculite. However, for reasons that remain unknown, fungi spores don't seem to germinate on coir, although live mycelium will rip right through it. RR
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boomsaway
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Re: Coir without pasteurization [Re: RogerRabbit]
#11616740 - 12/09/09 12:38 PM (15 years, 1 month ago) |
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so y not case with straight coir too?
EDIT: well besides the fact that its nutritious...
but people still use it for casing with success
-------------------- So, smoking pot = "child endangerment." Storming a home with guns, then firing bullets into the family pets as a child looks on = necessary police procedures to ensure everyone's safety. -Radley Balko
Edited by boomsaway (12/09/09 12:39 PM)
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m00nshine
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Re: Coir without pasteurization [Re: RogerRabbit]
#11616745 - 12/09/09 12:39 PM (15 years, 1 month ago) |
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Well I'm just excited about cutting down on my preparation time, I usually spend over an hour pasteurizing manure. If this all works out and I get similar or better results I'm ditching the manure.

COIR FTW
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m00nshine
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Re: Coir without pasteurization [Re: boomsaway]
#11616753 - 12/09/09 12:40 PM (15 years, 1 month ago) |
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You spawn to coir, you can make a casing layer with it but it's essentially just laying down more sub.
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skullhuman
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Re: Coir without pasteurization [Re: RogerRabbit]
#11616766 - 12/09/09 12:41 PM (15 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
RogerRabbit said: That's because fungi spores will germinate and grow on peat and/or vermiculite. However, for reasons that remain unknown, fungi spores don't seem to germinate on coir, although live mycelium will rip right through it. RR
That fills in some blanks for me, thanks.
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boomsaway
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Re: Coir without pasteurization [Re: skullhuman]
#11616878 - 12/09/09 01:03 PM (15 years, 1 month ago) |
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>You spawn to coir, you can make a casing layer with it but it's essentially just laying down more sub.
I know... but it will still serve the purpose of a casing layer. just that the mycelium will eventually over take it.
But, with coir's good capability of hold water, if you have an optimal enviroment, you wont need a casing.
just dunk between flushes.
-------------------- So, smoking pot = "child endangerment." Storming a home with guns, then firing bullets into the family pets as a child looks on = necessary police procedures to ensure everyone's safety. -Radley Balko
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dancefloordale
Research Assistant


Registered: 02/13/09
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Re: Coir without pasteurization [Re: boomsaway]
#11617028 - 12/09/09 01:23 PM (15 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
boomsaway said: >You spawn to coir, you can make a casing layer with it but it's essentially just laying down more sub.
I know... but it will still serve the purpose of a casing layer. just that the mycelium will eventually over take it.
But, with coir's good capability of hold water, if you have an optimal enviroment, you wont need a casing.
just dunk between flushes.
I've cased with leftover substrate material (coir/verm/gypsum) on second flushes and it generally works pretty well. At this point the myc doesn't really colonize it. Never cased for the first flush though.
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m00nshine
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I've gone ahead and thrown the tray into a SG style FC. It was "birthed" today. I should see some pins within the next two weeks. 
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m00nshine
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Re: Coir without pasteurization [Re: m00nshine]
#11692541 - 12/21/09 02:28 PM (15 years, 30 days ago) |
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Firt flush, and it's pretty weak. Hopefully more pins come. I'm getting a lot of side pinning, what's up with that? I used a kitty litter tray so I assumed no light would get through to the sides, but somehow it has. I'm guessing it's because the SG lid is opaque and the fact that it's on a shelf where the light comes in through the sides. It was hard to make all the coir level, that may be the problem, manure was easier to pat down.
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m00nshine
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Re: Coir without pasteurization [Re: m00nshine]
#11697752 - 12/22/09 09:26 AM (15 years, 29 days ago) |
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RogerRabbit
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Re: Coir without pasteurization [Re: m00nshine]
#11697804 - 12/22/09 09:41 AM (15 years, 29 days ago) |
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Light from the sides doesn't cause side pinning. Light anywhere on a substrate will trigger pinning anywhere else on the substrate where conditions are correct. Primordia like to form in the high humidity gap between the substrate and tray. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms
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"I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
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Doc_T
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Registered: 03/06/09
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Re: Coir without pasteurization [Re: RogerRabbit]
#11697833 - 12/22/09 09:49 AM (15 years, 29 days ago) |
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Quote:
RogerRabbit said: Light from the sides doesn't cause side pinning. Light anywhere on a substrate will trigger pinning anywhere else on the substrate where conditions are correct. Primordia like to form in the high humidity gap between the substrate and tray. RR
I believe that- but I see that taping the sides *seems to* reduce side pinning in otherwise similar tubs. Any ideas what else might be a difference between two tubs that look the same besides tape?
Because I feel like I'm taping out of superstition- but I definitely see a difference in results.
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m00nshine
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Re: Coir without pasteurization [Re: RogerRabbit]
#11697848 - 12/22/09 09:52 AM (15 years, 29 days ago) |
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Thanks for clearing that up, I guess it's just something I'll have to deal with
Do you think that directly misting the top of the tray (sub) will encourage more pins to form there because of the extra moisture? I've laid cakes atop wet perlite and have had pins form mostly in the spot that got waterlogged:
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m00nshine
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Re: Coir without pasteurization [Re: Doc_T]
#11697873 - 12/22/09 09:57 AM (15 years, 29 days ago) |
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Quote:
Doc_T said:
Quote:
RogerRabbit said: Light from the sides doesn't cause side pinning. Light anywhere on a substrate will trigger pinning anywhere else on the substrate where conditions are correct. Primordia like to form in the high humidity gap between the substrate and tray. RR
I believe that- but I see that taping the sides *seems to* reduce side pinning in otherwise similar tubs. Any ideas what else might be a difference between two tubs that look the same besides tape?
Because I feel like I'm taping out of superstition- but I definitely see a difference in results. 
This is what happens with no tape around the sides of your tub:

Notice all the side pins? This did not happen with my other properly constructed tub, I used duct tape and saw no side pinning.
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wygram
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Registered: 01/28/07
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Re: Coir without pasteurization [Re: m00nshine]
#11698144 - 12/22/09 11:03 AM (15 years, 29 days ago) |
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Quote:
m00nshine said: Notice all the side pins? This did not happen with my other properly constructed tub, I used duct tape and saw no side pinning.
Do you think it might be that you didn't see them because the tape was in the way and not because they weren't there?
Side pinning may be a result of light, but it definitely is related to the fresh air and humidity. Pins form where the conditions are the best, in this case in between the tub's side and the substrate. This happens because the environment at the top of the substrate was lacking in something, probably humidity.
I don't think taping the sides does anything significant to prevent side pinning. The gap inside the tub still exists and if the light is as bright as it should be, it will still get to the gap. A liner inside the tub is a much better choice, in my opinion. It clings to the substrate preventing fresh air (the best pinning trigger) from getting to the sides, as well as blocking out the light.
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FlyingMonk
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Re: Coir without pasteurization [Re: wygram]
#11698169 - 12/22/09 11:07 AM (15 years, 29 days ago) |
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Quote:
wygram said:
Quote:
m00nshine said: Notice all the side pins? This did not happen with my other properly constructed tub, I used duct tape and saw no side pinning.
Do you think it might be that you didn't see them because the tape was in the way and not because they weren't there?
Side pinning may be a result of light, but it definitely is related to the fresh air and humidity. Pins form where the conditions are the best, in this case in between the tub's side and the substrate. This happens because the environment at the top of the substrate was lacking in something, probably humidity.
I don't think taping the sides does anything significant to prevent side pinning. The gap inside the tub still exists and if the light is as bright as it should be, it will still get to the gap. A liner inside the tub is a much better choice, in my opinion. It clings to the substrate preventing fresh air (the best pinning trigger) from getting to the sides, as well as blocking out the light.
I promise the side pins were there and you couldnt see them. I normally line my tubs with Aluminum/Trashbag to prevent side pinning, but one time i just taped around the sides of the tub. And boy oh boy did I have side pinning. First I thought I just had a shitty first flush, then when I took the cake out of my mono. The sides and even the bottom had a lot of pins. Line with a trash bag dude.
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