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OfflineGrapefruit
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Re: Does weed cause anxiety chemically? [Re: Noteworthy]
    #11478464 - 11/18/09 01:03 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Noteworthy said:
Weed is a chemical and thus any affects it has are chemical. If the mind is not totally chemical, that doesnt matter. The interface between the drug and the mind is most probably chemical, even if there is some other non-chemical relationship between the drug-interface and the mind.




I believe he meant to ask whether the anxiety was a side effect of cannabis' main affects or a direct effect to the brain.

I believe the effect is mostly direct personally. I know nothing about neuroscience really (perhaps RGV can give a hand on this one) but THC is known have it's own receptor that is next to the GABA receptors (controlling fight or flight reactions). Reduced flow of GABA would cause anxiety, so my best guess is that THC causes anxiety partially by blocking the flow of GABA and partially through it's psychedelic effects.


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Little left in the way of energy; or the way of love, yet happy to entertain myself playing mental games with the rest of you freaks until the rivers run backwards. 

"Chat your fraff
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OfflinexFrockx
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Re: Does weed cause anxiety chemically? [Re: Grapefruit]
    #11478512 - 11/18/09 01:14 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

I think blaming chemicals on how you feel, in terms of anxiety and fear, is just a nice comfortable way of not taking responsibility for your own thoughts.  I can smoke DMT and feel nothing but a body high with my eyes closed even, all I have to do is focus on my body and not thinking.  As soon as I start thinking, the feelings I get about words and thoughts of mine, merely amplified by the DMT, spin me into whatever it is that DMT does.  Still though, if I can voluntarily control a smoked DMT experiece, you can quit being paranoid, just stop thinking paranoid thoughts, or at least re-fix your way you think about those thoughts when they have them.  Think of them as unjustified, unwanted, meaningless terrors, and eventually they will subside.

But I'm probably just lying, after all, thoughts are out of our control to some extent, right?  There's no way someone on this earth is sane enough to have control over their emotions and thoughts.

Edited by xFrockx (11/18/09 01:16 PM)

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InvisibleChronic7
Registered: 05/08/04
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Re: Does weed cause anxiety chemically? [Re: xFrockx]
    #11478577 - 11/18/09 01:23 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

xFrockx said:
There's no way someone on this earth is sane enough to have control over their emotions and thoughts.




You can control them to the extent that you don't try to control them at all, you don't identify with them so dont feed into them

Thoughts & emotions only affect you if you are identified with them on some level


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OfflinexFrockx
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Re: Does weed cause anxiety chemically? [Re: Chronic7]
    #11478679 - 11/18/09 01:38 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Yeah, that looks like what I meant.  I think after a while of treating your thoughts and opinions as outsiders (in a broad sense) they tend to slip away though, and concentration focuses outward.

Edited by xFrockx (11/18/09 01:39 PM)

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OfflineGrapefruit
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Re: Does weed cause anxiety chemically? [Re: xFrockx]
    #11478720 - 11/18/09 01:46 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

DMT/Psychedelics is a different thing to me. I would agree with you talking about those psychedelics but cannabis feels different to me.


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Little left in the way of energy; or the way of love, yet happy to entertain myself playing mental games with the rest of you freaks until the rivers run backwards. 

"Chat your fraff
Chat your fraff
Just chat your fraff
Chat your fraff"

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InvisibleChronic7
Registered: 05/08/04
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Re: Does weed cause anxiety chemically? [Re: Grapefruit]
    #11478751 - 11/18/09 01:52 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Next time you toke up meditate before during & after :wink:


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OfflineGrapefruit
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Re: Does weed cause anxiety chemically? [Re: Chronic7]
    #11478769 - 11/18/09 01:55 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

I'll give it a go, why not...


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Little left in the way of energy; or the way of love, yet happy to entertain myself playing mental games with the rest of you freaks until the rivers run backwards. 

"Chat your fraff
Chat your fraff
Just chat your fraff
Chat your fraff"

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InvisibleChronic7
Registered: 05/08/04
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Re: Does weed cause anxiety chemically? [Re: Grapefruit]
    #11478962 - 11/18/09 02:31 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Meditation & just a lil lil lil toke of weed can be very very very great :grin:

I prefer meditating in a room where people are smoking it, rather than smoking it myself

Its an inscence  :levitate:

Edited by Chronic7 (11/18/09 02:42 PM)

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OfflineCynosure
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Re: Does weed cause anxiety chemically? [Re: xFrockx]
    #11479441 - 11/18/09 03:50 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

xFrockx said:
I think blaming chemicals on how you feel, in terms of anxiety and fear, is just a nice comfortable way of not taking responsibility for your own thoughts.  I can smoke DMT and feel nothing but a body high with my eyes closed even, all I have to do is focus on my body and not thinking.  As soon as I start thinking, the feelings I get about words and thoughts of mine, merely amplified by the DMT, spin me into whatever it is that DMT does.  Still though, if I can voluntarily control a smoked DMT experiece, you can quit being paranoid, just stop thinking paranoid thoughts, or at least re-fix your way you think about those thoughts when they have them.  Think of them as unjustified, unwanted, meaningless terrors, and eventually they will subside.

But I'm probably just lying, after all, thoughts are out of our control to some extent, right?  There's no way someone on this earth is sane enough to have control over their emotions and thoughts.




I'm not sure what caused it (as I used to be a dextromorphan addict), but most times when I smoke these days I get extremely paranoid and it's even starting to carry over into my sober life.. which scares me a bit.

Usually it's about things that I know are ridiculous and could never happen. For example, I convinced myself the other night in bed, while smoking with the girlie, that she was a psychic.  In this fear I found my mind doing crazy things (making the television tilt) and at one point got an extremely weird feeling in my head and heard something say "This is my psychic power!".  A few nights later we were smoking at a party and were sitting on the couch.  I was watching something on the TV and felt someone poke me on the left shoulder (the couch was against the wall and her arm was behind my back-- no one tapped me on the shoulder).  I looked over and she was staring at me.. which just built up more fear.  These are just recent examples.

A couple of months before, in a friends apartment, I convinced myself that I was on a TV show.  This thought continued every time I smoked afterwards and started to carry over to my sober life!  I started watching what I say, my actions, and started looking everywhere for cameras and the such.  It eventually subsided.  Other times I've noticed I am sitting or laying down and my body just starts twitching in different areas.

I can control it if the setting is just right, I have music, and there are a limited number of people around me.  If the settings aren't perfect it gets out of hand.  I know and tell myself that I'm just high, but it doesn't work.  During any other sort of trip I have the mentality and self control to let myself know that whatever's happening isn't real and can normalize myself.. but as of late, weed is raping me.

Any suggestions on how to steal my brain back from the paranoia fiends?
I've smoked for a while; the paranoia hadn't set in until about three/four months ago.  I also don't ever smoke that often, a couple of times a month is my max.


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OfflinexFrockx
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Re: Does weed cause anxiety chemically? [Re: Cynosure]
    #11479540 - 11/18/09 04:01 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

"I know and tell myself that I'm just high, but it doesn't work. "

This is exactly your problem.  Its not that you're just high, its that you're thinking dumb things.  Its not that you're thinking these dumb things because you are high, its because you might not have yet accepted that these thoughts are yours, it is squarely your fault for taking them seriously.  Until you do that, you're only going to be lying to yourself in respect to the source of the problem.  Its not the weed.  Its you.  And what are you?

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OfflineCynosure
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Re: Does weed cause anxiety chemically? [Re: xFrockx]
    #11479845 - 11/18/09 04:39 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Paranoid?

..I understand that these are my thoughts and do believe that they are my own.  I just feel that the weed triggers them.  They are under control until I smoke, it's like smoking breaks the barrier keeping them locked away.


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OfflinexFrockx
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Re: Does weed cause anxiety chemically? [Re: Cynosure]
    #11480235 - 11/18/09 05:28 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Why on earth would you have to put your own thoughts "under control"?

For me, it sounds like you mean that you repress them.  Is that what you mean?

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OfflineNoteworthy
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Re: Does weed cause anxiety chemically? [Re: Grapefruit]
    #11480585 - 11/18/09 06:15 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Grapefruit said:


I believe he meant to ask whether the anxiety was a side effect of cannabis' main affects or a direct effect to the brain.





May I ask what the difference is between a 'main effect' and a 'side effect' other than magnitude of effect or intended effect? Side effects are as much effects of any drug as the main effects, but they are called side effects because they are not the effects that are desired when taking or prescribing the drug? Unless you have a different take on the matter?


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OfflineGrapefruit
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Re: Does weed cause anxiety chemically? [Re: Noteworthy]
    #11480698 - 11/18/09 06:27 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Yeh, I did think about that before I posted. Tricky one. Difference IMO is that a side effect might mean amplification of what is already there through the confusion of senses with the unconscious whereas main effect would be through straight out blocking a chemical as a direct effect as described in my original post.


--------------------
Little left in the way of energy; or the way of love, yet happy to entertain myself playing mental games with the rest of you freaks until the rivers run backwards. 

"Chat your fraff
Chat your fraff
Just chat your fraff
Chat your fraff"

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Invisiblelavod
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Re: Does weed cause anxiety chemically? [Re: Grapefruit]
    #11481089 - 11/18/09 07:25 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

I've a strong suspicion that the activity of the cannabinoids, particularly THC, at the kappa sites might be attributed to this anxiety.  It's surely not as simple as that, but the fact that THC has been shown to be a partial kappa agonist is often overlooked.  And that this anxiety seems to be inconsistent between sundry people with different methods and frequency of usage, despite similar marijuana being consumed,  may be due to extra sensitivity to kappa agonism either naturally, or from different rates of tolerance in comparison to its activity on other receptors.  Just an idea.


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OfflinexFrockx
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Re: Does weed cause anxiety chemically? [Re: lavod]
    #11481117 - 11/18/09 07:29 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

But maybe they only recognize it because when they test it, people are anxious on their own, so its only correlated, and not caused by, the active chemical.  I could be totally wrong though.

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OfflineLife Upon Death
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Re: Does weed cause anxiety chemically? [Re: dopestone]
    #11481147 - 11/18/09 07:33 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

dopestone said:
i always thought it has to do with being worried about getting caught.

jail sucks no one wants to go to jail!

it'd be interesting to see if pot was legal if people were still getting anxious, i bet if it was legal the anxiety would be a minimal factor.




no its definitely beyond the fear of being caught

weed induces extreme anxiety in me at times(and yet I still like it now and then)

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OfflineNoteworthy
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Re: Does weed cause anxiety chemically? [Re: Life Upon Death]
    #11481256 - 11/18/09 07:49 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

what goes through your head?


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OfflineCynosure
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Re: Does weed cause anxiety chemically? [Re: xFrockx]
    #11485292 - 11/19/09 12:43 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

xFrockx said:
Why on earth would you have to put your own thoughts "under control"?

For me, it sounds like you mean that you repress them.  Is that what you mean?




Because when I smoke they become out of control, I can't suppress them.

...and yes, that is what I mean.


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Offlineskatealex2
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Re: Does weed cause anxiety chemically? [Re: Cynosure]
    #11485353 - 11/19/09 12:52 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

i noticed smoking before class today actually reduced my anxiety.  its a strong sativa too.  i think this relates to this thread but ma b a problem with me is that i like to smoke at night when blazing during the day can make me be more in the now.  i think how you approach your session can make the difference  and weed could be used to be here now    buti can also see how having repressed thoughtss  would give you bad highs

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