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Invisibledanielx
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Registered: 10/13/08
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house passes health care bill
    #11408144 - 11/07/09 11:30 PM (7 years, 11 months ago)

http://www.ajc.com/business/house-passes-health-care-189225.html

Quote:

The 220-215 vote cleared the way for the Senate to begin debate on the issue that has come to overshadow all others in Congress.

A triumphant Speaker Nancy Pelosi likened the legislation to the passage of Social Security in 1935 and Medicare 30 years later.




I suspect Obama will play this out as a great victory, but it will die in the senate.


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OfflineJT
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Re: house passes health care bill [Re: danielx]
    #11408795 - 11/08/09 02:14 AM (7 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

danielx said:
it will die in the senate.




we can only hope.


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InvisibleShad0w
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Re: house passes health care bill [Re: JT]
    #11409239 - 11/08/09 04:27 AM (7 years, 11 months ago)

I thought they just tightened up the legalese of PRO abortion funding.
  Which..... probably shouldnt be funded anymore than plastic surgery. Abortion, a kind of a "cosmetic surgery" isnt it?


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: house passes health care bill [Re: Shad0w]
    #11409350 - 11/08/09 05:25 AM (7 years, 11 months ago)

> Abortion, a kind of a "cosmetic surgery" isnt it?

Not really.  Abortion isn't really surgery at all.  And given the problems of over population and global warming, I would think people would be supportive of abortion as it nips a problem in the bud, so to speak.

> we need to buck up and do it like UK

Ah yes... where you can only get the flu vaccine by invitation; you either have to be considered 'high risk' or know somebody well placed.  Viva the Soviet Union, er UK.


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InvisibleGI_Luvmoney
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Re: house passes health care bill [Re: Seuss]
    #11409687 - 11/08/09 08:27 AM (7 years, 11 months ago)

Proof once again that only the Republicans can save America!

Committee Confirms: Comply With Pelosi-Care Or Go To Jail
by Publius

Today, Ranking Member of the House Ways and Means Committee Dave Camp (R-MI) released a letter from the non-partisan Joint Committee on Taxation (JCT) confirming that the failure to comply with the individual mandate to buy health insurance contained in the Pelosi health care bill (H.R. 3962, as amended) could land people in jail.  The JCT letter makes clear that Americans who do not maintain “acceptable health insurance coverage” and who choose not to pay the bill’s new individual mandate tax (generally 2.5% of income), are subject to numerous civil and criminal penalties, including criminal fines of up to $250,000 and imprisonment of up to five years.

n response to the JCT letter, Camp said:  “This is the ultimate example of the Democrats’ command-and-control style of governing – buy what we tell you or go to jail.  It is outrageous and it should be stopped immediately.”

Key excerpts from the JCT letter appear below:

“H.R. 3962 provides that an individual (or a husband and wife in the case of a joint return) who does not, at any time during the taxable year, maintain acceptable health insurance coverage for himself or herself and each of his or her qualifying children is subject to an additional tax.” [page 1]

- – - – - – - – - -

“If the government determines that the taxpayer’s unpaid tax liability results from willful behavior, the following penalties could apply…” [page 2]

- – - – - – - – - -

“Criminal penalties

Prosecution is authorized under the Code for a variety of offenses.  Depending on the level of the noncompliance, the following penalties could apply to an individual:

• Section 7203 – misdemeanor willful failure to pay is punishable by a fine of up to $25,000 and/or imprisonment of up to one year.

• Section 7201 – felony willful evasion is punishable by a fine of up to $250,000 and/or imprisonment of up to five years.” [page 3]

When confronted with this same issue during its consideration of a similar individual mandate tax, the Senate Finance Committee worked on a bipartisan basis to include language in its bill that shielded Americans from civil and criminal penalties.  The Pelosi bill, however, contains no similar language protecting American citizens from civil and criminal tax penalties that could include a $250,000 fine and five years in jail.

“The Senate Finance Committee had the good sense to eliminate the extreme penalty of incarceration.  Speaker Pelosi’s decision to leave in the jail time provision is a threat to every family who cannot afford the $15,000 premium her plan creates.  Fortunately, Republicans have an alternative that will lower health insurance costs without raising taxes or cutting Medicare,” said Camp.

According to the Congressional Budget Office the lowest cost family non-group plan under the Speaker’s bill would cost $15,000 in 2016.


http://biggovernment.com/2009/11/06/committee-confirms-comply-with-pelosi-care-or-go-to-jail/


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OfflineTaco Chef
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Re: house passes health care bill [Re: danielx]
    #11410152 - 11/08/09 11:29 AM (7 years, 11 months ago)

the abortion restrictions added in the final hours of the voting were the only dark spot on this otherwise historic vote.

the senate will pass the senate' no dems are going to vote to stop debate; although they might vote against the final bill. (in other words they will vote closure--which is the only time for a fillibuster) and then maybe vote against the final bill) there are already 55 democratic yes votes for the bill as it stands, and 59 votes to end debate --only traitor joe --although i've heard that he has also privatively agreed to vote to end debate.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: house passes health care bill [Re: Taco Chef]
    #11411090 - 11/08/09 02:54 PM (7 years, 11 months ago)

"Traitor" Joe?  I don't think so.


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InvisibleShad0w
In trouble again.
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Registered: 06/08/08
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Re: house passes health care bill [Re: GI_Luvmoney]
    #11411121 - 11/08/09 03:01 PM (7 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

GI_Luvmoney said:
Proof once again that only the Republicans can save America!

Committee Confirms: Comply With Pelosi-Care Or Go To Jail
by Publius

  Add Signature  Preview Reply  D4D0C8Today, Ranking Member of the House Ways and Means Committee Dave Camp (R-MI) released a letter from the non-partisan Joint Committee on Taxation (JCT) confirming that the failure to comply with the individual mandate to buy health insurance contained in the Pelosi health care bill (H.R. 3962, as amended) could land people in jail.  The JCT letter makes clear that Americans who do not maintain ?acceptable health insurance coverage? and who choose not to pay the bill?s new individual mandate tax (generally 2.5% of income), are subject to numerous civil and criminal penalties, including criminal fines of up to $250,000 and imprisonment of up to five years.

n response to the JCT letter, Camp said:  ?This is the ultimate example of the Democrats? command-and-control style of governing ? buy what we tell you or go to jail.  It is outrageous and it should be stopped immediately.?

Key excerpts from the JCT letter appear below:

?H.R. 3962 provides that an individual (or a husband and wife in the case of a joint return) who does not, at any time during the taxable year, maintain acceptable health insurance coverage for himself or herself and each of his or her qualifying children is subject to an additional tax.? [page 1]

- ? - ? - ? - ? - -

?If the government determines that the taxpayer?s unpaid tax liability results from willful behavior, the following penalties could apply?? [page 2]

- ? - ? - ? - ? - -

?Criminal penalties

Prosecution is authorized under the Code for a variety of offenses.  Depending on the level of the noncompliance, the following penalties could apply to an individual:

? Section 7203 ? misdemeanor willful failure to pay is punishable by a fine of up to $25,000 and/or imprisonment of up to one year.

? Section 7201 ? felony willful evasion is punishable by a fine of up to $250,000 and/or imprisonment of up to five years.? [page 3]

When confronted with this same issue during its consideration of a similar individual mandate tax, the Senate Finance Committee worked on a bipartisan basis to include language in its bill that shielded Americans from civil and criminal penalties.  The Pelosi bill, however, contains no similar language protecting American citizens from civil and criminal tax penalties that could include a $250,000 fine and five years in jail.

?The Senate Finance Committee had the good sense to eliminate the extreme penalty of incarceration.  Speaker Pelosi?s decision to leave in the jail time provision is a threat to every family who cannot afford the $15,000 premium her plan creates.  Fortunately, Republicans have an alternative that will lower health insurance costs without raising taxes or cutting Medicare,? said Camp.

According to the Congressional Budget Office the lowest cost family non-group plan under the Speaker?s bill would cost $15,000 in 2016.


http://biggovernment.com/2009/11/06/committee-confirms-comply-with-pelosi-care-or-go-to-jail/




That sounds like a much worse darkspot than abortion issues.

I can go to jail for not wanting to buy healthcare? :frown:

Who DO these politicians work for exactly?


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OfflineTaco Chef
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Re: house passes health care bill [Re: Shad0w]
    #11411206 - 11/08/09 03:16 PM (7 years, 11 months ago)

that's an extreme misreading of the bill


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: house passes health care bill [Re: Taco Chef]
    #11411213 - 11/08/09 03:18 PM (7 years, 11 months ago)

No it isn't.  If you refuse to buy qualifying health insurance as determined by an as yet unappointed insurance czar you face financial penalties and possible incarceration.  A total fact.


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OfflineTaco Chef
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Re: house passes health care bill [Re: zappaisgod]
    #11411236 - 11/08/09 03:22 PM (7 years, 11 months ago)

you mean just like you can't drive a car without car insurance?

keep up the fear mongering. maybe you can post some of those nazi death camp pics.


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Invisibledanielx
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Registered: 10/13/08
Posts: 6,457
Re: house passes health care bill [Re: Taco Chef]
    #11411391 - 11/08/09 03:52 PM (7 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

novumorganum said:
you mean just like you can't drive a car without car insurance?

keep up the fear mongering. maybe you can post some of those nazi death camp pics.





good job comparing apples to oranges.


--------------------
Long live kratom :kratom:


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?


Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,234
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Re: house passes health care bill [Re: Taco Chef]
    #11411854 - 11/08/09 05:17 PM (7 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

novumorganum said:
you mean just like you can't drive a car without car insurance?

keep up the fear mongering. maybe you can post some of those nazi death camp pics.




“H.R. 3962 provides that an individual (or a husband and wife in the case of a joint return) who does not, at any time during the taxable year, maintain acceptable health insurance coverage for himself or herself and each of his or her qualifying children is subject to an additional tax.” [page 1]

                                                        - - - - - - - - - -                                                 

“If the government determines that the taxpayer’s unpaid tax liability results from willful behavior, the following penalties could apply…” [page 2]

                                                        - - - - - - - - - -   
                                               

“Criminal penalties

Prosecution is authorized under the Code for a variety of offenses.  Depending on the level of the noncompliance, the following penalties could apply to an individual:

• Section 7203 – misdemeanor willful failure to pay is punishable by a fine of up to $25,000 and/or imprisonment of up to one year.

• Section 7201 – felony willful evasion is punishable by a fine of up to $250,000 and/or imprisonment of up to five years.” [page 3]

Just one source, there are many others if you find this one unpalatable.

Here's another.


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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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OfflineRedstorm
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Re: house passes health care bill [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #11411866 - 11/08/09 05:18 PM (7 years, 11 months ago)

Wow, that seems excessive.


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?


Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,234
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Re: house passes health care bill [Re: Redstorm]
    #11411881 - 11/08/09 05:22 PM (7 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Redstorm said:
Wow, that seems excessive.




A bit, yes.

I added a second link after your reply.


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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Registered: 02/11/04
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Re: house passes health care bill [Re: Taco Chef]
    #11412079 - 11/08/09 05:53 PM (7 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

novumorganum said:
you mean just like you can't drive a car without car insurance?




That's a pretty stupid analogy.  Only people who own cars have to buy car insurance.  I suspect this mandate will be bitchslapped in the courts.
Quote:




keep up the fear mongering. maybe you can post some of those nazi death camp pics.




Fear mongering?  It's in the bill.  Get a fucking dictionary.


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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: house passes health care bill [Re: Seuss]
    #11415347 - 11/09/09 01:13 AM (7 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Seuss said:
And given the problems of over population and global warming, I would think people would be supportive of abortion as it nips a problem in the bud, so to speak.





not the christians, the bible states 'go forth, be fruitful and multiply'
so it goes against the will of god to slow over population


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OfflineTri High
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Re: house passes health care bill [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #11417142 - 11/09/09 09:28 AM (7 years, 11 months ago)

This is kind of messed up.

Pay health tax or go to jail.

Maybe this is coincidental with those FEMA camps that've been built.

Things gonna spiral downwards.  I can feel it.

Have a bug out bag.  They never hurt :smile:

And some knowledge about your local flora and fauna, + a good team of hunters (like hunter-gatherer) for when you run out of precious bullets.


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OfflineMr.Al
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Re: house passes health care bill [Re: Seuss]
    #11417171 - 11/09/09 09:37 AM (7 years, 11 months ago)

I know dude, global warming...

It's not like all the planets in the solar system are heating up....

My "carbon footprint" must be heating up Mercury too...:lol:


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: house passes health care bill [Re: Tri High]
    #11417342 - 11/09/09 10:38 AM (7 years, 11 months ago)

> Pay health tax or go to jail.

Not a bad way to deal with the homeless... just toss them in jail for violating the health tax code.  Of course, a bit expensive for the rest of us, but the prison guard union will be happy.


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