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InvisibledeCypher
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The Paradox of Desire and the Quest for Happiness
    #11365357 - 11/01/09 10:35 PM (8 years, 19 days ago)

Suppose we accept that happiness ought to be our primary goal in life.  How best to achieve this state?  It seems apparent that both the fulfillment and the abolition of our desires is correlated to our level of happiness; we become happier when we satisfy a particular goal of ours and we eliminate the chance of becoming unhappier when we stop caring whether or not we satisfy a particular goal of ours.  But which specific goals are the most conducive towards producing happiness?  Studies have shown that attaining material possessions only temporarily increase one's level of happiness for about six months or so, and that after this it decreases right back to its original level.  Having a higher income is also correlated here, but only to a certain point after which the richer are no happier.  Some say that doing what you love and satisfying the healthy desires of your soul is key to contentment; others in the Buddhist tradition say that renouncing all attachment to desire brings you into Nirvana.  Is it better to influence external reality with Will to satisfy your goals or is it better to influence internal reality with Thought until the external world doesn't matter anymore and has no effect on your happiness?  Epictetus, a leading Stoic, echoes this latter philosophy in the quotes "Do not seek to bring things to pass in accordance with your wishes, but wish for them as they are, and you will find them," and "Freedom is not procured by a full enjoyment of what is desired, but by controlling the desire."  Can this truly be correct, though?  Suppose we were a slave imprisoned in a cell; should we aim to break out of the cell and find happiness in freedom or rather find acceptance and peace in our situation?

Are we truly satisfied only when we undergo the basic biological drives of our inner animal (to survive, find a mate, and reproduce to have a family) or do these attachments and the possibility of their breakage only lead to heart-break and misery?  Alternatively, if we satisfy these basic biological drives then what else can we do to increase our level of happiness?  Is it better to have loved and lost than never have loved at all?  Is the person who chooses to satisfy his or her desire doomed to an eternity of Samsara, or is the person who chooses to eliminate his or her desire doomed to a meaningless, accomplishment-less existence?  Who will lead a more satisfied life; the Magician who alters the objective universe to reflect back happiness or the Mystic who alters the subjective realm to prevent unhappiness?  Or do both paths work equally well?  What about pleasure; is this synonymous with happiness and if so why shouldn't we hypothetically implant an electrode in our reward center and stimulate it until the end of days?  If not, then how often should we satisfy our desire for pleasure?  A common saying states that ignorance is bliss; is this true and if we can't tell then should we seek to satisfy our desire for knowledge knowing that it may doom us to unhappiness?  Does ultimate happiness only come with 'Union with God' which is the culmination of the Great Work of both mysticism and magick?  If so, then which route is preferable to obtain this?

Your thoughts? 

1. Which desires, if any, should we satisfy in order to increase our level of happiness?
2. Which desires, if any, should we abolish in order to decrease our level of unhappiness?
3. How should we go about satisfying and/or abolishing these desires in the most efficient way possible?


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.


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Offlinezombi
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Re: The Paradox of Desire and the Quest for Happiness [Re: deCypher]
    #11365494 - 11/01/09 10:54 PM (8 years, 19 days ago)

I actually just finished reading a piece called "Happiness and the Virtues" from The Ethics of Aristotle which I think made a pretty good argument that leading a virtuous life brings about happiness. or something to that effect. i would love to sum it up quickly but I think I am a little too stoned for that right now.

i'll either find a link later or expound later.

ice cream and bed now. :stoned2:  :sleep:


--------------------
My words, too, are only an echo; but there is no reason why I should not repeat what I have heard.                    :zombie5:
-Socrates                                                                Let the rabbits wear glasses!
:gd_icon::trippycow::gd_icon:


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OfflineC.M. Mann
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Re: The Paradox of Desire and the Quest for Happiness [Re: deCypher]
    #11365781 - 11/01/09 11:40 PM (8 years, 19 days ago)

What's up! :peace:  Happiness is a goal your ego constructs, as a means to control the thought process.  Your ego tells you that this is a logical goal, that you should expect.  I think the word desire, is trumped by the word attitude. Worrying about happiness is an exercise in futility.


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OfflineAlphaFalfa
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Re: The Paradox of Desire and the Quest for Happiness [Re: C.M. Mann]
    #11365905 - 11/02/09 12:00 AM (8 years, 19 days ago)

I think the question has to be more specific and contextualized further. The first two questions, should be placed in the context of the present and future.

Also, desires are not ever going to be in our control always....why control a tool, it would be better to wield it.

Another thing I noticed, is that desires that make you seek respect, honor, status, do not seem to return the amount of time and energy you invest in it, in relation to putting that time into other projects. I hated status, because it thought it was good to hate it, but now I see that it is simply not worth it, it just takes to much work

I also used to believe really strongly that all the happiness was better experienced, the closer you can bring your awarness to the present moment. This in our world is impossible...you need to plan years in advance constantly and not even just that, adapt to harsh conditions that were unforseeable....Its a challenge to say the least.


In short;

1. Fullfillment of pride through status, honor, respect, loving others seems to cause more pain than pleasure, especially because god doesnt exist to give us a reward for any of them.

2. The desire to raise a family is also something with little payback, it seems....kids eventually are destined to be influenced strongly by their peers and change dramatically from the attitudes of their parents and thus find huge conflicts with them....why have a kid, why breed the chance for conflict?


--------------------
if you ever feel lost, just remember, life is not a journey, it is entertainment, all 4 fun...



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OfflineAlphaFalfa
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Re: The Paradox of Desire and the Quest for Happiness [Re: AlphaFalfa]
    #11365957 - 11/02/09 12:07 AM (8 years, 19 days ago)

3. materialism is worthless, unless its food, health and warmth. I learnt this the hard way and apply it the easy way(without trying) Ie. Didnt buy much stuff in my hippy years to save the environment, then I realized that theres no need to save the environment, then i realized that buying stuff was expensive and that i could live off my savings without working hard....The last time I went to the movies was one time when my mom had some tickets. The last time I bought clothes was 5 years ago. The last time I bought video games was 7 years ago. All my money goes towards, food and shelter...oh and a little weed and a bottle of wine here and there, possibly some zoom zoom pslyobuddies.  I bought a dejembe and that is the only thing in the last 5 years that i bought for myself besides nessecity...i dont even buy birthday gifts, velntines for my girl and also dont expect it either.... I can honestly say im pretty damn happy.....Oh i also stopped smoking weed to cure my depression and i go head on with it and its much better now....so i dont even need weed more than once a week anymore. I can honestly say its a better life and I dont need to think much about it because it became a part of my experience...

One thing that can help reduce your cravings for materilism is a fast...it makes u appreciate food, its that simple.

4. another one i stumbled upon is to not fullfill the desire to have a great big group of 4 or more friends.
This has worked to my advantage and it happened surprisingly when i went away to a different city for university and found that the majority of the people there were still rascals and not mature...it forced me to be with one to 2 all the time and it helped.


--------------------
if you ever feel lost, just remember, life is not a journey, it is entertainment, all 4 fun...



Edited by AlphaFalfa (11/02/09 12:16 AM)


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InvisibledeCypher
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Re: The Paradox of Desire and the Quest for Happiness [Re: AlphaFalfa]
    #11367489 - 11/02/09 09:06 AM (8 years, 18 days ago)

Quote:

zombi said:
I actually just finished reading a piece called "Happiness and the Virtues" from The Ethics of Aristotle which I think made a pretty good argument that leading a virtuous life brings about happiness.




Yeah, that's the cornerstone of virtue ethics.  The existence of happy Mafia dons who die in their sleep at a ripe old age and of miserable, suffering saints leads me to disbelieve this moral theory, however.

Quote:

C.M. Mann said: I think the word desire, is trumped by the word attitude. Worrying about happiness is an exercise in futility.




Are you saying we should focus on changing our attitude about things rather than changing the external world?  If so, then in the prisoner example would you focus merely on your mental states rather than trying to escape?  This seems completely counter-intuitive.  And why shouldn't I worry about my happiness?  If I'm unhappy, why shouldn't I strive to become happier?

Quote:

AlphaFalfa said:
2. The desire to raise a family is also something with little payback, it seems....kids eventually are destined to be influenced strongly by their peers and change dramatically from the attitudes of their parents and thus find huge conflicts with them....why have a kid, why breed the chance for conflict?




Good post on the whole, AlphaFalfa.  This particular comment was rather puzzling, though.  Surely the love and affection garnered from watching your kids grow up is worth the times of petty conflict and argument?


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.


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OfflineLion
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Re: The Paradox of Desire and the Quest for Happiness [Re: deCypher]
    #11367508 - 11/02/09 09:16 AM (8 years, 18 days ago)

Quote:

Suppose we were a slave imprisoned in a cell; should we aim to break out of the cell and find happiness in freedom or rather find acceptance and peace in our situation?


We are like slaves trying to break out of our cells by fulfilling our desires over and over again - gnawing at the cell walls.  The problem is, the desire is the cell, and the door to freedom is and has ever been open.  But maybe the cell has grown comfortable, and freedom is a great unknown expanse...

Or maybe I do not know what I am talking about.

(Welcome back! :grin: )


--------------------
“Strengthened by contemplation and study,
I will not fear my passions like a coward.
My body I will give to pleasures,
to diversions that I’ve dreamed of,
to the most daring erotic desires,
to the lustful impulses of my blood, without
any fear at all, for whenever I will—
and I will have the will, strengthened
as I’ll be with contemplation and study—
at the crucial moments I’ll recover
my spirit as was before: ascetic.”


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Offlineweshroom
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Re: The Paradox of Desire and the Quest for Happiness [Re: Lion]
    #11368600 - 11/02/09 01:41 PM (8 years, 18 days ago)

Ok im in a rush so im just gonna post a couple links to articles ive read about happiness and found interesting in the past. One is in response to OP comment on material possessions and happiness, and the other one is in relation to kidshttp://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/03/090319152210.htm...
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/10/091029120900.htm...http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/02/090207150518.htm
I know this isnt that great because im not giving any of my personal insite into the questions, but i dont give a fux


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Offlineandrewss
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Re: The Paradox of Desire and the Quest for Happiness [Re: weshroom]
    #11368669 - 11/02/09 01:55 PM (8 years, 18 days ago)

Good post, you kind of did it in a sort of dialectic style and set the issue up without much more to be said at this point, lol!

You wont tell us what you think? Or are you kinda like me and not really sure...

Either way I guess I would say that, duh, this is an extremely subjective area of life... but at the bare minimum I think the happiest of people are at least exerting themselves some way. Just doing a crappy 9-5 brainless job and going home to a 6pack and pizza almost every night sounds like a recipe for an unhappy (even if surpressed) life. I guess happiness at a bare minimum is most properly a state of being where the individual human is exerting its talents to some degree and pursuing them. I am not sure if we can determine at what point of material excess would constitute diminishing returns on their enjoyment of luxury....

But it is quite true, material and luxury do not bring happiness, if anything the rich man is just at a different magnitude of progressing with his things, moving on and on with new toys and such, where as the poorer man is moving on in a different way... or maybe has learned some wisdom to realize calmness of spirit and making happiness out of what one has to be happy with in the moment, a stiller spirit or something...

/rambling


--------------------
Jesus loves you.


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InvisibleChronic7
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Re: The Paradox of Desire and the Quest for Happiness [Re: deCypher]
    #11368794 - 11/02/09 02:18 PM (8 years, 18 days ago)

Quote:

deCypher said:

1. Which desires, if any, should we satisfy in order to increase our level of happiness?
2. Which desires, if any, should we abolish in order to decrease our level of unhappiness?
3. How should we go about satisfying and/or abolishing these desires in the most efficient way possible?





Great post :thumbup:

IMO, its not about abolishing or satisfying particular desires, its just about seeing through 'Desire' itself
To see that no desire, no matter how dirty or righteous, can bring lasting happiness
Then desire as you will, but inwardly, your not attached to any of it...

Quote:

Lion said:
Quote:

Suppose we were a slave imprisoned in a cell; should we aim to break out of the cell and find happiness in freedom or rather find acceptance and peace in our situation?



the desire is the cell, and the door to freedom is and has ever been open.  But maybe the cell has grown comfortable, and freedom is a great unknown expanse...





Nice!

:peace:


--------------------
________________________________


Edited by Chronic7 (11/02/09 02:26 PM)


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OfflineAlphaFalfa
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Re: The Paradox of Desire and the Quest for Happiness [Re: deCypher]
    #11369107 - 11/02/09 03:02 PM (8 years, 18 days ago)

Quote:

AlphaFalfa said:
2. The desire to raise a family is also something with little payback, it seems....kids eventually are destined to be influenced strongly by their peers and change dramatically from the attitudes of their parents and thus find huge conflicts with them....why have a kid, why breed the chance for conflict?




Good post on the whole, AlphaFalfa.  This particular comment was rather puzzling, though.  Surely the love and affection garnered from watching your kids grow up is worth the times of petty conflict and argument?





Whether it was good depends on whether or not it will prove itself as such.

I find it ironic that you just asked this question and then I just had a huge argument with my rents again, for the fifth time in like 10 days. Both of them were adament that I get out of the house..Its freezing outside, I always cannot feel happy outside with people in general, it make no difference how much i try(its hard to think in public settings and why, if all i want(intellectual discussion, ample time for playing and research, music, my girlfriend when she stays here, are inside) The real problem between us too is that we come from compleltly different lines of thought and experience....I mean i find it hard to get along with my younger brother, imagine trying to do so with people who have no capacity to think, and watch people kick a ball around with their feet as if they are somehow gods....Then they also have the ridiculous idea that experience is not influenced by perception and tell me that they know more than me because of experiences they have experinced....also they have odd ways of conflict resolution that involves what most parents do: the expression of anger towards someone other than their partner for the stability of the family unit...we are ill with ignorance and the will to uphold that ignorance cannot be undone, by anything but death...atleast in death...

In short, I believe you are taking a chance in becoming a parent that is highly skewed towards negative outcomes...it really depends largly on what your child is influence by at especially their teenage and early 20's which decides the fate of the relationship both because you wont be changing and because relationships are based on agreement - it is my beleif that a sense of agreement with another is the basis to the happiness felt through stabiliy and lack of conflict in a relationship, with them as with anybody with a mind, capable of exchange.

Also children tend to ravage the existing relationship that the individuals parenting the child experience...it is usually not a source of strength through compatability, but rather a source of stress through commitment that occurs....If you look at family life around the western world, divorce, children/parental conflicts which we have had different experiences about because mine makes me believe they are anything BUT PETTYy(my friend 23 beat his father, down, my other younger friend, about my bro's age, beat his father with a bat, my father almost killed me one time by throwing me to the ground where I nearly smashes the back of my head on the corner of a table.... ) suicide amongst children...there is a great disbalance...ontop of this, the economic situation of the world is not ripe for future people, rather rotting with a stench so foul that it severly downgrades any chances the child will thrive, even with half of what he had.

I could go on, but i would like to hear your words.


--------------------
if you ever feel lost, just remember, life is not a journey, it is entertainment, all 4 fun...



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InvisibledeCypher
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Re: The Paradox of Desire and the Quest for Happiness [Re: AlphaFalfa]
    #11369571 - 11/02/09 04:03 PM (8 years, 18 days ago)

Quote:

Lion said:
We are like slaves trying to break out of our cells by fulfilling our desires over and over again - gnawing at the cell walls.  The problem is, the desire is the cell, and the door to freedom is and has ever been open.  But maybe the cell has grown comfortable, and freedom is a great unknown expanse...

Or maybe I do not know what I am talking about.

(Welcome back! :grin: )




Nicely done, and thanks!

Quote:

andrewss said:
You wont tell us what you think? Or are you kinda like me and not really sure...




I find myself stymied on this sort of puzzle, actually.  :crazy:

Quote:

Chronic777 said:
IMO, its not about abolishing or satisfying particular desires, its just about seeing through 'Desire' itself
To see that no desire, no matter how dirty or righteous, can bring lasting happiness
Then desire as you will, but inwardly, your not attached to any of it...




So lasting happiness comes only when you see that all desires are ineffectual, or do we need to do other things in addition to get to this (desired, LOL) state?

Quote:

AlphaFalfa said:
I could go on, but i would like to hear your words.




I'm not sure on this point as I'm not a parent (yet), but it appears just from this study alone that you might be correct.  On the other hand, it would also be nice to have someone you can rely on to take care of you once you get old enough, and I'm also optimistic enough to think that I could establish a good, loving relationship with my children if and when I have them.  Of course, I could be utterly mistaken on this point.  :grin:


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.


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InvisibleChronic7
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Re: The Paradox of Desire and the Quest for Happiness [Re: deCypher]
    #11369667 - 11/02/09 04:17 PM (8 years, 18 days ago)

Quote:

deCypher said:

Quote:

Chronic777 said:
IMO, its not about abolishing or satisfying particular desires, its just about seeing through 'Desire' itself
To see that no desire, no matter how dirty or righteous, can bring lasting happiness
Then desire as you will, but inwardly, your not attached to any of it...




So lasting happiness comes only when you see that all desires are ineffectual, or do we need to do other things in addition to get to this (desired, LOL) state?




:lol:

Do we 'need' something to be 'desireless' :wink:
Its enough to see through desire... to see its not serving any truth

The fallacy of desiring spiritual enlightenment or 'Truth' is that it is desiring a state that is already here
A state of pure Awareness....

We already are Awareness
So if anything the desire is to know ourself beyond our projections, not to find out about something 'new'






--------------------
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InvisiblePoid
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Re: The Paradox of Desire and the Quest for Happiness [Re: deCypher]
    #11370348 - 11/02/09 05:46 PM (8 years, 18 days ago)

Quote:

deCypher said:
Your thoughts? 

1. Which desires, if any, should we satisfy in order to increase our level of happiness?


Whichever are necessary in order to increase our level of happiness.




Quote:

deCypher said:
2. Which desires, if any, should we abolish in order to decrease our level of unhappiness?


Whichever are necessary in order to decrease our level of unhappiness.




Quote:

deCypher said:
3. How should we go about satisfying and/or abolishing these desires in the most efficient way possible?


There ain't no one magic cure for every person's blues, man. :sad:


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.


Edited by Poid (11/02/09 05:56 PM)


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Offlinetraviedigital
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Re: The Paradox of Desire and the Quest for Happiness [Re: AlphaFalfa]
    #11370358 - 11/02/09 05:47 PM (8 years, 18 days ago)

Quote:

AlphaFalfa said:
Quote:

AlphaFalfa said:
2. The desire to raise a family is also something with little payback, it seems....kids eventually are destined to be influenced strongly by their peers and change dramatically from the attitudes of their parents and thus find huge conflicts with them....why have a kid, why breed the chance for conflict?




Good post on the whole, AlphaFalfa.  This particular comment was rather puzzling, though.  Surely the love and affection garnered from watching your kids grow up is worth the times of petty conflict and argument?





Whether it was good depends on whether or not it will prove itself as such.

I find it ironic that you just asked this question and then I just had a huge argument with my rents again, for the fifth time in like 10 days. Both of them were adament that I get out of the house..Its freezing outside, I always cannot feel happy outside with people in general, it make no difference how much i try(its hard to think in public settings and why, if all i want(intellectual discussion, ample time for playing and research, music, my girlfriend when she stays here, are inside) The real problem between us too is that we come from compleltly different lines of thought and experience....I mean i find it hard to get along with my younger brother, imagine trying to do so with people who have no capacity to think, and watch people kick a ball around with their feet as if they are somehow gods....Then they also have the ridiculous idea that experience is not influenced by perception and tell me that they know more than me because of experiences they have experinced....also they have odd ways of conflict resolution that involves what most parents do: the expression of anger towards someone other than their partner for the stability of the family unit...we are ill with ignorance and the will to uphold that ignorance cannot be undone, by anything but death...atleast in death...

In short, I believe you are taking a chance in becoming a parent that is highly skewed towards negative outcomes...it really depends largly on what your child is influence by at especially their teenage and early 20's which decides the fate of the relationship both because you wont be changing and because relationships are based on agreement - it is my beleif that a sense of agreement with another is the basis to the happiness felt through stabiliy and lack of conflict in a relationship, with them as with anybody with a mind, capable of exchange.

Also children tend to ravage the existing relationship that the individuals parenting the child experience...it is usually not a source of strength through compatability, but rather a source of stress through commitment that occurs....If you look at family life around the western world, divorce, children/parental conflicts which we have had different experiences about because mine makes me believe they are anything BUT PETTYy(my friend 23 beat his father, down, my other younger friend, about my bro's age, beat his father with a bat, my father almost killed me one time by throwing me to the ground where I nearly smashes the back of my head on the corner of a table.... ) suicide amongst children...there is a great disbalance...ontop of this, the economic situation of the world is not ripe for future people, rather rotting with a stench so foul that it severly downgrades any chances the child will thrive, even with half of what he had.

I could go on, but i would like to hear your words.







What are you doing on a message board about mushrooms???

How can you not be optimistic about recreating ?

Do you live on the same planet the rest of us do? Its a pretty rad place , you would seriously hold back your future you's, because of fighting?

Everyone fights with their parents - 99% of the time the kid is wrong


just cause you do psychedelics don't make you smarter than 40 years experience, if that is in fact what you believe makes up intelligence


no need to argue, parents just don't understand , so let it be


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Re: The Paradox of Desire and the Quest for Happiness [Re: traviedigital]
    #11370397 - 11/02/09 05:51 PM (8 years, 18 days ago)

I'm sorry,


I just re-read, your friend beat his father with a fucking bat???


And you don't see anything wrong with that, unless your friend was being sexual molested ? ? Even if he was being hit, if he is old enough to do damage with a bat, he is old enough to fight back.



Where are all the people who think they are jesus ?!?!?!  :dancingbear:


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OfflineAlphaFalfa
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Re: The Paradox of Desire and the Quest for Happiness [Re: traviedigital]
    #11371976 - 11/02/09 09:22 PM (8 years, 18 days ago)

The only way we could exchange anything correctly is if I simplify things and use different words because I am certain you have no solid understanding in what you are critiquing in the last post and in the first post, you offer claims backed by what seems to be cultural conditioning, which I would probally find it impossible to argue against because you cannot argue reasonably with feelings.

No offense or anything negative, just that you are better off not trying to exchange anything with me, you would be wasting your time, from what it seems, because my post was relatively simply to what I consider complex and difficult to assess.

I can only hope that you can at least understand this.


--------------------
if you ever feel lost, just remember, life is not a journey, it is entertainment, all 4 fun...



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Re: The Paradox of Desire and the Quest for Happiness [Re: deCypher]
    #11381866 - 11/04/09 08:18 AM (8 years, 16 days ago)

Good to see you around again, Cyph :smile:


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Re: The Paradox of Desire and the Quest for Happiness [Re: Cameron]
    #11381879 - 11/04/09 08:23 AM (8 years, 16 days ago)

for me, happiness is freedom.

and i can't explain it any better than Krishnamurti:

So  what is freedom? Is it based on choice? Is it to do exactly what we like? Some of the psychologists are saying, if you feel something do it immediately, don't suppress it, don't restrain it, don't control it - express. And we are doing that very well, too. And it is called also freedom. Throwing bombs is also freedom. Right? Just look what we have reduced our freedom to.

So what is freedom? Does freedom lie out there, or here? I am just asking, I am not saying. Where do you begin to search for freedom? In the outward world, which is to express and do, act whatever you like, so-called individual freedom. Or does freedom begin inwardly, which then expresses itself intelligently outwardly? You understand my question? That is, freedom exists only when there is no confusion - right? - confusion inside me. When I am seeking, perhaps psychologically, religiously, not to be caught in any trap - you understand? There are innumerable traps - gurus, saviours, preachers, the excellent books, psychologists, and psychiatrists, they are all there. And if I am confused and there is disorder, mustn't I first be free of that disorder before I talk of freedom? If I have no relationship with my wife, or with my husband, with another person, because we haven't got relationship with another; our relationship is based on images. You have an image about me and I have an image about you. And so the conflict which is inevitable where there is a division - right sirs? So shouldn't I begin here, inside me, in my skin, in my mind, in my heart to be totally free of all the fears and anxieties, despairs, hurts and wounds that one has received through some psychic disorder - you follow? All that, to watch it for oneself and be free of it.

But apparently we haven't got the energy. We go to another to give us energy. The psychiatrists, by talking to him you feel much more relieved - you follow? - confession and all the rest of it. Always depending on somebody else. And so that dependence inevitably brings great conflict, disorder. So one has to begin to understand the depth and the greatness of freedom, one must begin quite near. And the nearest is you. As long as there is you and me there is no freedom. As long as you have your prejudice, and I have my prejudice, your experience, my experience, etc. etc. and so on, so on, there is no freedom. We can express, we can criticise each other, we can do all that, that is what is called freedom. The right to think what you like. But freedom, the greatness of freedom, and the enormity, the dignity, the beauty of it is in oneself when there is completely order. And that order comes only when we are a light to ourselves.


--------------------
in general, i'm not sure if i'm indecisive or not.


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Re: The Paradox of Desire and the Quest for Happiness [Re: deCypher]
    #11382737 - 11/04/09 12:26 PM (8 years, 16 days ago)

Quote:

1. Which desires, if any, should we satisfy in order to increase our level of happiness?
2. Which desires, if any, should we abolish in order to decrease our level of unhappiness?
3. How should we go about satisfying and/or abolishing these desires in the most efficient way possible?




1. Satisfy the desire for happiness whatever way you can.
2. Abolish all desires that are not for happiness.
3. Differentiate between desires.


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