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Lott is a racist
    #1135419 -

Hey, great! Our senate majority leader is a racist! The next few years will be soooo exciting! I bet invert and ehud cant wait!

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Buddha5254]
    #1135535 -

Yep he is,but only talks about it every 22 years.Ripped off from the Daily show.


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"Little racoons and old possums 'n' stuff all live up in here. They've got to have a little place to sit." Bob Ross.

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Buddha5254]
    #1135983 -

could be worse, he could be an anti-semite....


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1136023 -

Could be worse, he could be a PETA freak and hate all of humanity.


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1136025 -

Got some proof Invert? Otherwise cut it out.

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Buddha5254]
    #1136100 -

"All the laws of Washington and all the bayonets of the Army cannot force the Negroes into our homes, our schools, our churches."

Strom Thurmond is zany.

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Buddha5254]
    #1136124 -

i'm just wondering why noone has been demanding sen. thurmond to step down or be censured? or why noone was demanding for sen. lott to step down or be censured back in '80 when he originally made those statements? could it be that he is a republican and not a democrat? could it be that it is just because he is about to be senate majority leader again and the democrats are seeking a little payback for their poor performance this past election? i definitely have to wonder about the timing of all this. in my opinion it is much ado about nothing.  :smirk: 


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"in your pockets with red hot rockets!"

"I love it when a plan comes together!"


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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: htownkid28]
    #1136351 -

inv.. arnt anti-semites racist?

and why would it be worse if he were an anti-semite?

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: foghorn]
    #1136544 -

Ding ding, you're kidding right? "hey, I get Jokes" Homer Simpson.


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"Little racoons and old possums 'n' stuff all live up in here. They've got to have a little place to sit." Bob Ross.

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Buddha5254]
    #1136606 -

Show's the kind of minds our leaders have.

They're ignorant people voted in by ignorant people.



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--------------------------------


Mp3 of the month: The Doors - Five To One (live in Miami 03/01/1969)


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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: htownkid28]
    #1137051 -

I think Strom should have been asked to leave years ago. I hate to say it but he's just too old. They basically prop him up against the wall and hope he doesn't fall...

****in my opinion it is much ado about nothing****

While i'm no strom fan i do think that lott just said something stupid trying to kiss the ass of a 100 year old on his B-Day. I'm sure he didn't wake up one morning and say "ya know what? i'm going to call for segregation today"


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: foghorn]
    #1137052 -

****inv.. arnt anti-semites racist?****

you're right it is the same as being a racist..thanks :smirk:


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

Edited by Innvertigo (12/12/02 11:21 PM)

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1137122 -

I listened to his interview by Sean hannity and he sounds like a bullshitter. Isn't it a cardinal sin of rhetoric to keep saying "ya know" before every statement you make? Especially when you're a politician trying to apologize to your constituents for a "misunderstood comment"?

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: bivalve]
    #1137426 -

Actually he said "Nigger Race" instead of Negro

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Buddha5254]
    #1138376 -

fuckin lame.

there must be so many politicians who are more racist than this Lott duff... I hate how shit works...
... its only wrong if you get caught

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Grav]
    #1140016 -

Well, he still deserves to be put on the hot seat at least. i think he should resign. He obviously is a racist. The sad thing is people like Clinton aren't really much better. Clinton was just a lot smoother. He was "down" with the people.

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Buddha5254]
    #1140166 -

That is just digusting.

Something that needs to be absoultely removed from the US to establish a better life right here in America is being rebounded in the wrong direction by our "government officials".

I know it's hard for the white upper class business men sitting in our white house and government poisitions that there is actually poverty and problems right here in America. Maybe they should stop dicking with other countries and work on their own. Domestic affairs...huh, what?

Could I please get a link to the article to where he says that or it is referred to?

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Re: Lott is a racist *DELETED* [Re: angryshroom]
    #1140280 -

Post deleted by Component

Reason for deletion: ...


Edited by Component (05/03/08 12:43 PM)

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Component]
    #1142184 -

****Lott won't step down and Bush doesn't want him to because that would even out the Senate***

Lott was never going to resign, rather step down as senate majority leader which would not even out the senate because another republican would be elected.

as a side note Al Gore Sr. voted against the Civil rights Act. of 1964 (i believe that is the year)..so there really is no difference from one politician to the next


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1142218 -

In reply to:
as a side note Al Gore Sr. voted against the Civil rights Act. of 1964 (i believe that is the year)..so there really is no difference from one politician to the next


Why can't more people understand this?


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Evolving]
    #1142389 -

But that was 1964...


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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: angryshroom]
    #1142403 -

Didn't Lott give a similar explanation about the deal with not letting blacks into his fraternity?


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Evolving]
    #1142408 -

Yeah, but that was now :smile:


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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Component]
    #1142423 -

There's no need for someone to step down for voicing their opinions. Remember free speech?

The guy is still an asshole.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: angryshroom]
    #1142821 -

so what if that was in 1964....that's like saying what Lott said was sooooo last week can't we move on?...kind of hypocritical don't ya think?


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1143877 -

No... 1964 was a long time ago, things have changed. Things have changed since last week but not in the same sense of over 30 years.

A lot of people would have still believed that segregationism was a good think 30 years ago, now people can actually realize its not. Im not saying what Gore sr. said was good thing, but still, that wasn't Al that was running for this presidential race, or even in the same timeframe ... I bet Lott's father still had a slave. hah

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: angryshroom]
    #1144385 -

talk about a double standard...personally i couldn't careless but it's just amazing that the standards seem to lower when the politicians that libbies support screw up. Do you feel the same about Strom Thurman? It was a long time ago he believed what he believed. (i have no love for Strom, mind you)


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

Edited by Innvertigo (12/15/02 11:51 PM)

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1144651 -

Strom is worse because he was the one who ran for president under a segregationist platform. Almost all the old skool southern politicians, and many today are rascists. Just ask Jesse Helms.

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: angryshroom]
    #1144730 -

Al Gore Jr. was in The Klan according to a friend of mine who is in his family, his family also made their money from tobacco.


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Buddha5254]
    #1144857 -

It doesn't matter because it was a long time ago....... :smirk:

****and many today are rascists***

yes some even hate jews...


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Evolving]
    #1144859 -

***his family also made their money from tobacco. ***

say it isn't so :shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked: :shocked:


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Buddha5254]
    #1145478 -

Could someone post a link where I can read everything that Lott said?

I've been looking and can't seem to find anythign but his apology.

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Anonymous]
    #1145493 -

He said.....


// In case you missed it; Lott said to Thurmond's birthday audience "I want to say this about my state. When Strom Thurmond ran for president, we voted for him. We're proud of it. And if the rest of the country had followed our lead, we wouldn't have had all these problems over all these years, either."

http://vikingphoenix.com/news/madminute/2002/mm2002-04.htm


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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

Edited by luvdemshrooms (12/16/02 09:33 AM)

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1145672 -

And Strom thurmond said this during the campaign Trent now wishes Strom had won:


"I wanna tell you, ladies and gentlemen, that there's not enough troops in the army to force the southern people to break down segregation and admit the nigger race into our theatres, into our swimming pools, into our homes and into our churches."



Trent Lott is trying backtrack his statements but in 1980 he felt the same way:"You know, if we had elected this man (Thurmond) 30 years ago, we wouldn't be in the mess we are today"


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"Little racoons and old possums 'n' stuff all live up in here. They've got to have a little place to sit." Bob Ross.

Edited by sir tripsalot (12/16/02 10:46 AM)

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: sir tripsalot]
    #1145714 -

Lott was just trying to say some nice things to an old coot on his 100th birthday. I think he was about 3 years old when the now fossilized former democrat ran for president.

How come nobody raises a stink about West Virginia Democrat, Robert Byrd a former member of the Ku Klux Klan? He used the word 'nigger' on nationwide television, not once, but twice. Odd how Klan membership and racial epithets get ignored for democrats.


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

Edited by Evolving (12/16/02 11:01 AM)

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Evolving]
    #1145722 -

Maybe because Byrd isn't as well-known as Trent Lott.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Evolving]
    #1145726 -

I hardly see how Lott endorsing Thurmond makes HIM racist.

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Anonymous]
    #1145734 -

I agree. Lott was probably referring to other aspects of Thurmond's campaign, like state rights. Still, he should've known better than to make that statement.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: silversoul7]
    #1145735 -

Maybe not to you. The last time the Democrats took control of the Senate (when Jeffords left the Republicans), Byrd was sworn in as president pro tempore, a post that is third in line for presidential succession.


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Evolving]
    #1145743 -

Hmm...Interesting. Well, I blame the media for not covering it enough. I was not aware of this incident.


--------------------


"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: silversoul7]
    #1145749 -

Sadly, and to be expected, the media only covers what will draw ratings. I guess that's why you see so many stories about local people and their pets.

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Anonymous]
    #1145754 -

I would think that a high-profile politician saying the word "nigger" twice on television would draw ratings.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1145779 -

You gonna back that up Invert? THis is the third time at least I've called on you to back up your comments saying that I am anti-semite.

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Buddha5254]
    #1145793 -

This is what it's all about...



--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: silversoul7]
    #1145810 -

>I would think that a high-profile politician saying the word "nigger" twice on television would draw ratings.

If you're talking about Byrd, he is a Democrat, and the media loves Democrats. He said it on Fox, and apologized on Fox.

What I said wasn't really relevant here, I was just pissed cause I had to sit through a 5 minute bit about some guy who is raising 10 dogs.

Fox News didn't make a big deal about it, because Fox is fair. What Byrd said was not racist, he was pointing out that the stereotypical black person could also be white, that it is a personality, not a race that is defined by the word nigger. Brett Hume realized this and didn't make a big deal about it.

The media is making a big deal about what Trent Lott said even though he did NOT say anything outwardly racist because he is a Republican.

Read this article from my local newspaper, and tell me it is not biased:

Sunday, December 15, 2002 - PASCAGOULA, Miss. - Trent Lott arrived on the Mississippi coast just after lunch on Friday and disappeared into his antebellum-style home on the beach. The lush yard between the white house and the rippling saltwater is anchored by twisted, giant oaks that have bent but not broken against the storms of a hundred years.
The embattled senator from Mississippi found safe harbor among friends and family here after a week of bruising controversy and repeated apologies over remarks widely interpreted as an endorsement of racism. A sign outside a roadside hotel on U.S. 90 no doubt brought him comfort: "We love you, Trent," it declared.

While some say the media and Democrats are just hankering to take a bite out of one of the nation's leading conservative voices, others here say what's on a man's lips is also in his heart. The sentiments Lott has sought to distance himself from this past week have left many, including President Bush, wondering where such an unthinking choice of words came from in the first place.

They came from here.

Mississippi is a place, perhaps the last place, where such remarks don't deeply wound, unless you do something about them. Four decades after the Freedom Summer murders, the assassination of Medgar Evers and scores of lynchings, bombings and beatings, a few words are a small affair.

Lott grew up in the meanest kind of segregated South, in a region that still clings to its worst traditions the way Scarlett O'Hara clutched a parasol.

Some folks here in Pascagoula say Lott should have proudly stood his ground.

"Why apologize?" said Glenna Barnes, a waitress who has worked behind the Sav-Rex lunch counter for 29 years. Barnes was the only white waitress among the crew of four working on Friday; her co-workers were black. "When you're right, you're right."

Nursing a cup of coffee nearby, E.H. Johnson, 72, spoke viciously, but with a smile on his face.

"If the white man don't wake up, the niggers are going to take over," he said. Johnson, who spoke just a few feet from black patrons and waitresses, considers himself a Dixiecrat, and he does believe that the nation would have prospered had it been racially divided. Minutes later, however, he would flirt with one of the black waitresses.

Ron Sisk, painfully thin with bushy black hair and a beard salted with gray, flies a Confederate battle flag the size of a shrimp boat on a 100-foot pole above his home along U.S. 49. "It's still segregated," Sisk said of Mississippi. "It's just voluntary. Whites stay with whites, and blacks stay with their own kind. That's the way it is, man."

Old times here are not forgotten.

Lott's comments that the country would have been better off if Strom Thurmond had been elected president in 1948 made the incoming Senate majority leader particularly vulnerable because he's from Mississippi, where the flames of racism are easily fanned and the fire burns particularly hot.

Older whites and blacks remember a 1959 incident, for example, in which a white gang armed with baseball bats, bottles, chains and rocks beat a group of blacks, killing two, for wading in the water at the whites-only beach in Biloxi. Last year, Mississippians voted nearly 3-to-1 to leave the Confederate battle emblem in the upper left corner of the state flag, for the sake of heritage, supporters said. And last month, nearby Harrison County residents voted in favor of leaving the Confederate battle flag, the favorite symbol of the Ku Klux Klan, flying above public facilities.

But others here want to cast off the old ways and resent the negative attention Lott has brought to the state. And some say Lott has been unfairly labeled as a racist, period.

"Some people say holding on to the flag is holding on to heritage," said 22-year-old Jason Whitfield of nearby Gulfport, who camped in the shadows of the Confederate flag at the public beach where it was displayed for 77 days last summer, protesting what he called an offensive symbol.

"But Trent Lott has shown us the old ways Mississippi is holding on to - the segregated South."

State Rep. Carmel Wells-Smith of Pascagoula, an up-and-comer in the state Republican Party, said Mississippi has weathered far tougher struggles in trying to come to grips with the race issue. The label of racism will not stick, she hopes, to Lott or Mississippi.

"You can call Trent Lott a lot of things," she said, "but 'racist' isn't one of them."

Lott's pastor at First Baptist Church in Pascagoula, the Rev. Rex Yancey, preaches routinely about peace, unity and inclusion to a congregation that includes white and black parishioners. Lott is no racist, he said.

"Every Mississippian, every Southerner, has had to grow through some things," said Yancey, referring to racism of the past. "He's grown through it."

Mac Clark, owner of the Sav-Rex Pharmacy, where blacks and whites congregate for news and gossip at the drugstore lunch counter, is deeply concerned about having Mississippi's turbulent racial history rekindled on a national stage. Clark, like many here, is not only concerned about the image of Pascagoula being tarnished, but also worries about how Lott is perceived.

"I've been knowing him just about his whole life, and I know that he has never looked down on nobody," Clark said. "You can't judge a man by a few words, but look at his whole life."

In a state where 38 percent of the residents are black, and most of them poor, Lott's presence in Washington has meant jobs and food on the table. Ingalls Shipyard, which can be seen from the senator's home in Pascagoula, employs 10,000 of Lott's constituents, about 40 percent of whom are black. During his long tenure in the Senate, Lott has steered millions of dollars in defense contracts to the shipyard.

To many, he is a hero, indirectly responsible for their paychecks, their mortgage payments and their pride in building America's fighting fleet.

"There's a lot of mixed feelings," said Chico McGill, business manager for the electrical workers union at the shipyard. "Trent Lott has been good to Ingalls, bringing in a lot of work, but there are a lot of black people in our (union) membership. People don't know what to think."

Rip Daniels knows what he believes and has no problem saying it - and including thousands of listeners in on the conversation.

A radio station owner and host, Daniels is as well known among blacks and whites on the Mississippi Gulf Coast as Lott is among conservatives in Washington.

Daniels delivers a firebrand sermon on the sad state of race in Mississippi and the demons that perpetuate it for two hours each morning on his call-in radio show, "It's a New Day," the highest-rated radio program in southern Mississippi.

"Trent Lott is a bigot. He's always been a bigot. He was raised in a bigoted environment," said Daniels, before going on the air Friday morning.

"Does that mean he is unfit to represent Mississippi? No. That means he represents Mississippi."

From the Sunday Denver Post

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Anonymous]
    #1145825 -

If the media loves Democrats so much then why have they been kissing Bush's ass since 9/11?


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: silversoul7]
    #1145831 -

They haven't been. Every poll on ABC about Bush's popularity attempts to show it as dropping. There was one a few months ago saying "over half of the population rates Bush's job as being preformed fair to poor." As even you will agree, fair is by no means poor, but the poll was worded as such to make Bush look bad.

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: silversoul7]
    #1145838 -

Actually, the media love statists, they love big government. Bush is a statist, big government Republican. If Bill Clinton had done half of what George Bush has pushed through to increase the power of government the Republican would have been screaming like a bunch of hyenas with hot pokers up their asses.


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To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Evolving]
    #1145841 -

I agree Bush is far from the small government conservative he tries to come off as. BUT the media still hates Republicans because the Democrats are even worse.

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Anonymous]
    #1146307 -

Gonna have to disagree with you on that last point. In my book, the Democrats are the lesser of two evils.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

Edited by silversoul7 (12/16/02 03:53 PM)

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: silversoul7]
    #1146381 -

The lesser of two evils is still evil.


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Evolving]
    #1146384 -

I know. That's why I'm a Socialist.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: silversoul7]
    #1146430 -

So you believe that your fellow man should be enslaved to the state (for the greater good of course), and perhaps periodically be allowed to vote on who his masters are...


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Evolving]
    #1146478 -

No. I believe the government has a responsibility to take care of those who can't take care of themselves, and that it's worth paying extra taxes to help out our fellow man.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: silversoul7]
    #1147352 -

who determines WHO can take care of themselves or not? It is not the responsibility of any government to do this.

Less government = More Freedom = Individual Rights


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America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1147844 -

Look, the point is that no one deserves to go without food, clothing, shelter, or health care. All these things should be provided to those who can't afford it. And this is obviously where we differ: I believe it IS the responsibility of the government to do this. It's a government of the people, by the people, and for the people. Not just rich people, not just the middle class, but ALL people.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

Edited by silversoul7 (12/17/02 04:44 AM)

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: silversoul7]
    #1148021 -

silversoul7 writes:

Look, the point is that no one deserves to go without food, clothing, shelter, or health care. All these things should be provided to those who can't afford it.

Provided by whom?

It's a government of the people, by the people, and for the people.

Correct. But governments are formed in order to secure the rights of the individuals in a given society, not to act as farmers or tailors or house builders or doctors.

This is off-topic, and has nothing to do with whether or not Lott is a racist. Why don't you post these views in the thread titled "When you say you hate corporate America..."?

pinky



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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: silversoul7]
    #1148041 -

***Look, the point is that no one deserves to go without food, clothing, shelter, or health care. ***

Also, noone should be forced to give up their hard-earned money to make sure these people have these things

****Not just rich people, not just the middle class, but ALL people. *****

who said anything about the rich? What do you think "Rich" is?


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1148064 -

In reply to:
Also, noone should be forced to give up their hard-earned money to make sure these people have these things


So, they should just give up their hard-earned money to pay for tanks and bombers, right?
Unless you can show me how taxes are totally unnecessary to run a government, then I fail to see why they can't go toward helping to provide others with their means of living.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Phred]
    #1148077 -

In reply to:
But governments are formed in order to secure the rights of the individuals in a given society, not to act as farmers or tailors or house builders or doctors.


Don't those rights include LIFE, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness? It seems to me that to secure one's right to life, they must be provided with the basic means to sustain it.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: silversoul7]
    #1148167 -

****So, they should just give up their hard-earned money to pay for tanks and bombers, right?****

did i say that?

****Unless you can show me how taxes are totally unnecessary to run a government, then I fail to see why they can't go toward helping to provide others with their means of living. ****

They should only go for those aspects that protect it's people, (law enforcement, fire department, public schools, national defense, etc.) not provide them with free handouts because there are many out there that have no desire to ever work or contribute to society (there are a small minority of people that actually can't provide for themselves, those are the ones that should be taken care of)


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: silversoul7]
    #1148184 -

****Don't those rights include LIFE, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness? ****

Where in there does it say free handouts?

Life: we all have it and it's all relative
Liberty: can't have it in a statist society because the rights of the individual are not taken into consideration.
Pursuit of Happiness: That is something that cannot be GIVEN to you, happiness that is. However we all have this ability even though it's all relative


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

Edited by Innvertigo (12/17/02 06:52 AM)

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1148210 -

In reply to:
They should only go for those aspects that protect it's people, (law enforcement, fire department, public schools, national defense, etc.) not provide them with free handouts because there are many out there that have no desire to ever work or contribute to society (there are a small minority of people that actually can't provide for themselves, those are the ones that should be taken care of)


While I would contest the fact that those that can't provide for themselves are a "small minority," I don't have the statistics to prove it, so I won't go there. In any case, if there's a way to sort out the lazy from those that really can't support themselves, I'm all for it, but it's very difficult to define who can support themselves and who can't. For example, have you seen "Bowling for Columbine"? They talk about this one single mother who was forced to work 2 jobs by the city's "Welfare to Work" program. She had just been evicted from her apartment and moved in with her brother(I think. In any case, it was some relative), who happened to own a gun. While she was on the bus to work(around 6am I think), her 6-year-old son discovered the gun and brought it to school, then shot a classmate. I know this case is anecdotal, but it raises the question of what makes someone "incapable of supporting themselves," or more appropriately, "Is it a good idea to make her support herself?"


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1148223 -

In reply to:
Where in there does it say free handouts?


I object to the minimum requirements of living being referred to as "free handouts," but I think perhaps I made a mistake in using the Constitution and Declaration of Independence as arguments, since the writers of these documents were clearly not Socialist. This, however, doesn't mean Socialism isn't the right choice, but merely that the Constitution doesn't provide a precedent for it.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1148682 -

In reply to:
They should only go for those aspects that protect it's people, (law enforcement, fire department, public schools, national defense, etc.)



So you believe in government funded fire departments, and public schools? shouldn't people have to pay for these things out of their own pockets. If you don't pay the fire department shouldn't they just let your house burn down? If you don't pay for education, why should you get any?


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https://www.gofundme.com/f/support-for-renee-goods-wife-and-son

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #1148811 -

****So you believe in government funded fire departments, and public schools?****

I don't have to believe in it, it is reality.

****shouldn't people have to pay for these things out of their own pockets.****

we do they're called state and city taxes...keep up

****If you don't pay the fire department shouldn't they just let your house burn down?****

If you own a house you pay these taxes already, if you live in an apartment, the landlord pays these taxes.  Property taxes pay for these services.

****If you don't pay for education, why should you get any?*****

Unfortunatly everyone that has the above examples pays for education, even those that are smart enough and make enough money to send their kids to private schools...

so what was your point? :smirk:


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1150435 -

Once again, people, this has nothing to do with either Lott or racism... it has become a debate about Collectivism vs Individualism; force vs freedom; mob rule vs natural rights -- Socialism vs Capitalism; however you want to describe it. If you all want to get involved in an ongoing debate on EXACTLY that topic, come on over to "When you say you hate corporate America..." and you will be welcomed with open arms.

Otherwise, I suggest returning to the topic at hand... is Lott a racist himself, or was he just making a nice speech for a senile old racist monster?

pinky


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Edited by pinksharkmark (12/17/02 11:43 PM)

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Phred]
    #1150438 -

****or was he just making a nice speech for a senile old racist monster?****

sorry...yes he was just trying to make an old milkshake happy.....it was still stupid to say because he should of known the PC crowd would of blown a nut.


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1151592 -

If the Republicans are smart they'll get rid of him. If they don't, the entire party may be damaged, which is why I hope he stays.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: silversoul7]
    #1152349 -

personally i couldn't care less whether he stays or goes, but what i can say is that i feel the libbies are going to make this their only issue which will hinder them from trying to establisg some sort of agenda. So maybe i'd like to see him stay for that aspect alone...democrate, republican, what's the difference?


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1153145 -

In reply to:
what i can say is that i feel the libbies are going to make this their only issue which will hinder them from trying to establis[h] some sort of agenda.


Indeed...I think that we have focused on it enough. The Democratic party is really in need of reform, we need some redefinition. Finger pointing really wastes time and accomplishes nothing in the longrun. I feel that the Republican party will probably be damaged from some extent if Lott continues to hold his position. While he may have been trying to blow some smoke up Thurman's ass, what he said was stupid, no matter if you agree with his comments, his remarks were stupid. The Republican party has had a longstanding minority relations problem, and while it is getting better, it is still a long way from good. If Lott continues to hold his position it will give the impression to the public that the Republican Party is tollerant to racist matters. That is hardly what they need. Bush is no dummy for asking him to step down. If Lott has any amount of intelligence he will realize that he needs to make the sacrifice and step down. No ammount of appology will erase what he said or make it right. It makes him look like Slick Willie.


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"A study of the history of opinion is a necessary preliminary to the emancipation of the mind. I do not know which makes a man more conservative-to know nothing but the present, or nothing but the past." -John Maynard Keynes

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1153150 -

In reply to:
They should only go for those aspects that protect it's people, (law enforcement, fire department, public schools, national defense, etc.) not provide them with free handouts



Free lunch programs for school children, what are your thoughts. Should an 8 year old child be punished because his or her mother is a crack fiend? I have a hard time letting children go hungry. There is little they can do to improve their situation, unlike adults. Not to mention the detrimental effects malnourishment has on a child's IQ. This has a pretty high economic cost does it not?


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"A study of the history of opinion is a necessary preliminary to the emancipation of the mind. I do not know which makes a man more conservative-to know nothing but the present, or nothing but the past." -John Maynard Keynes

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1153168 -

just out of interest, if everryone who disagrees with you is a libby...what are you??? :grin: 


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Always Smi2le

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: GazzBut]
    #1153305 -

who said that those that don't agree with me are libbies?...wipe your tears and get back to me. :smirk:


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

Edited by Innvertigo (12/18/02 11:15 PM)

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: I_Fart_Blue]
    #1153314 -

****Free lunch programs for school children, what are your thoughts. Should an 8 year old child be punished because his or her mother is a crack fiend? ****

Well if the mother is a crack fiend then there are other problems that should be explored before the free lunch program is tackled (if you can afford crack you can afford lunch for your children).  With that said, if a parent truley cannot afford lunch for their children (which most of the time is BS in my experience) then they should be helped.  The problem is that the lunch program is given to anyone who SAYS that they can't afford it while driving a nice car.  We had people in our school that used to get free lunch while the kids bought pot with the spare money they just seemed to have.

****I have a hard time letting children go hungry.****

as do all, however that sounds more like a sound bite

****Not to mention the detrimental effects malnourishment has on a child's IQ.****

so that's the problem with public school children..i was wondering why their test scores suck :smirk:...j/k\

****This has a pretty high economic cost does it not? ****

If it's even close to being the truth, yes.


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1153402 -

Well if the mother is a crack fiend then there are other problems that should be explored before the free lunch program is tackled
True, there are certainly more problems than the child or children going hungry.

if you can afford crack you can afford lunch for your children
Very true, and this is a problem. How it should be tackled is a problem as well. Really and truely a child probably shouldn't be in a household shuch as this, though it may depend on your view of narcotics such as crack, and their legality and effect and cost on society, which is a subject of a whole other discussion. The problem lies in getting a parent to spend the money on food instead of crack, by what means and what cost. And if you cannot get a parent to act as a parent(ie: spend money on food and the welfare of their children) what should we do?

which most of the time is BS in my experience
Agreed.

The problem is that the lunch program is given to anyone who SAYS that they can't afford it while driving a nice car. We had people in our school that used to get free lunch while the kids bought pot with the spare money they just seemed to have.
Well not only is it a problem with the free lunch program, it is a problem with the welfare system in general. Unfortunately I think the nature of the system lends itself towards abuse. Socialized programs like welfare and the free lunch program are very similar to communism in that people are offered no motivation to do better or to increase their status. It would be a happy world if everybody aspired to do better, but many people are content with what is, even if it is living off of welfare. And shit, some people are just plain lazy. But as you said somewhere that such programs do have a purpose and do have a benifit, and there are truely people which need them.

Welfare reform has been long overdue, and that is something which I would like to see the Democratic party take up. However, I think due to many of the extremists in my party it won't happen. The Republicans many years ago, durring the Bosnian conflit I belive it was, were complaining about the US handling problems outside of the US when things here were not so great. In my eyes not much has changed, but this situation is a bit different. However I think Bush 43 may run into the same criticism down the line for not being able to balance foreign and domestic issues, just as Bush 41 did. Time will tell.


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"A study of the history of opinion is a necessary preliminary to the emancipation of the mind. I do not know which makes a man more conservative-to know nothing but the present, or nothing but the past." -John Maynard Keynes

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: I_Fart_Blue]
    #1153497 -

I can't argue with anything you said. However i don't believe the democrates will be any more effective as the republicans.


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1153749 -

Has anyone watched the VIdeo of what Lott actually said. He never enve mentions the word segregation. He says many of the problems we have experienced wouldnt have occured had the old guy been elected. The liberal media just had a field day on this guy. They even call the party the "segregrationist party" when it was the Dixiecrat party. If you think Lotts a racist your wrong. Why not take the old guy out Lotts a good man.

Anyone see The Simpsons where there is a springfield republican party convention, and Burns says with disney animatronics we can keep senator strohm alive for ever, and he starts dancing


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We might get glimpse's of objectivity every now, and then, but we're so inherently locked in our temporal and corporeal selves that we're irrevocably locked into subjectivity :crazy:

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Re: Lott is a racist [Re: BladeLSD]
    #1153983 -

He also voted against allowing blacks into his fraternity when he was in college. That's not racist???


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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