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OfflineGlacius
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TIME
    #1133947 - 12/12/02 02:49 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Time, can only be perceived. We can never know time, objectively because we are unable to perceive in with persition. We can olny perceive time, through points of reference in objective, or exoreality. It has no solid perception. Thus the meaning behind"time flies when yer havin fun"!! If we can only perceive time subjectively, then only a god, all knowing all seeing can really know objective time. In exoreality, time flows at the same rate. It is all a matter of our perception of time. For example: The fly. Why can we never get it with our hand?? Becuase it perceives time differently than we do. Now, we know that in subjective reality the time it takes for our hand to get from point A to point B can not be altered with another conciousness. Point A being the pisition of our upright hand, ready to strike, and point B being the pisition in which our hand is, when it comes in contact with the surface that the fly is positioned, respectively.
We know that, objectively the time it takes us to go from point A to point B does not change, yet the fly sees this action in slow motion, thus giving it time to move out of the way. Because its brain has a faster metabolic rate, and he perceives it in slow motion, yet objective reality does not change. BEcause his mind is working faster, therefore making the hand appear to travel slower. This might be said for some famous athletes. They may perceive time differently, thus giving them an advantage on the feild. They have more time to strategize. Maybe practive changes our perception of time, yet so gradually we do not notice it??

A dream, has constantly changing variables of time. In endoreality(subjective), we dont have the objective points of reference that we do in exoreality, thus making time appear differnt. This is why we may fall asleep into a dream, only sleeping for five minutes, yet the dream may seem like it spanned a caurse of an entire day, or hour, or whatever, because our points of reference to perceive time, are constantly changing and different from subjective reality. That is why there are "moments of eternity". Its all a matter of perception. Well, I wish I could go on, but I have to go to work. I want to find a way to perceive work differently, through points of refence so that it doesnt seem to take as long. I know, if I focus, and get into it, my expereince will seem shorter, even though I am still slaving away for 12 bucks an hour for 10 hours. It will seem shorter. Maybe there are other ways to manipulate our conciousness into perceiving time differntly?? Drugs of caurse, but I only smoke pot, and that slows time down. Hmmmmmmmm..........


--------------------
addicted to reason
a hollow understanding trapped me
I cannot see outside but its calling


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OfflineDavid_Scape
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Re: TIME [Re: Glacius]
    #1134720 - 12/12/02 08:54 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

"We can olny perceive time, through points of reference in objective, or exoreality. It has no solid perception. "

I thought our perception of time had more to do with the amount of thoughts we have under attention at a particular moment. Is this what you mean by constantly changing frames of reference? If so, how would you go about inducing this state of mind to percieving your workday to be shorter?


--------------------
focusing
Flow
The Enneagram


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Offline3eyedgod
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Re: TIME [Re: Glacius]
    #1134890 - 12/12/02 10:19 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

No matter how long you think, no matter how fast your mind, never will you comprehend time.

I don't think time exists. Only this moment right now. You can remember the moments you experienced but they don't exist anymore. You can predict what the now will be like down the road but it's not a sure thing.

You only smoke pot, buy ya post in the shroomery? Eat some shrooms dude, trip out. You will find it's effects on time far more interesting than weeds.


--------------------
Without everything wouldn't nothing be everything and without nothing wouldn't everything be nothing.I am the beginning and the end,the source and the void, the light and the darkness,i am but a small drop of the ocean yet i am an ocean unto myself


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OfflineJackal
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Re: TIME [Re: 3eyedgod]
    #1134894 - 12/12/02 10:23 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

The present doesn't exist, only past and future. They join seamlessly.


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Offline3eyedgod
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Re: TIME [Re: Jackal]
    #1134915 - 12/12/02 10:36 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Interesting perspective. I can't disagree. Like I said though, I don't think time is something a human mind can fully grasp. We all theorize but really, we're just stumbling around in the dark.


--------------------
Without everything wouldn't nothing be everything and without nothing wouldn't everything be nothing.I am the beginning and the end,the source and the void, the light and the darkness,i am but a small drop of the ocean yet i am an ocean unto myself


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OfflineAmber_Glow
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Re: TIME [Re: Glacius]
    #1134939 - 12/12/02 10:51 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Interesting this comes up, because bored in my study hall today, I read the chapter in my Physics book about Einstein's space-time theories.

It really is hard to comprehend, and I certainly can't explain it well. If you really want to know more about time, read what Einstein said.

But anyway, the cool things that I learned was that time travel is possible, although only forward in time. I wish I could time travel. *sigh*


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OfflineMurex
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Re: TIME [Re: Amber_Glow]
    #1134951 - 12/12/02 10:55 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

That's not proof, that's theroy.  :wink:


--------------------
What if everything around you
Isn't quite as it seems?
What if all the world you think you know,
Is an elaborate dream?
And if you look at your reflection,
Is it all you want it to be?



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OfflineGazzBut
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Re: TIME [Re: Jackal]
    #1135028 - 12/12/02 11:24 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

many say the present is all that exists. You are never actually in the past or future. Even when you think of the past or future you are still in the present.


--------------------
Always Smi2le


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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: TIME [Re: GazzBut]
    #1135143 - 12/12/02 11:58 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

I'd say that if anything at all exists it is the past, because we do not even perceive reality as it happens. There will always be some delay (an ultra-short-term memory) between an event and it's experience. We are forever stuck in the immediate past.

I guess if you want to get into causality and such...I would say that what we normally think of as "time" is not what science refers to as time or even what the general idea is of time. I believe what we experience is causality itself - the continous flow of cause and effect - and not the "flow of time". Time is a measurement, just like distance. Time is useful for separating two events in space-time, but I don't think it is a thing to be percieved.


--------------------
You're here because you know something.
What you know you can't explain,
But you feel it;
You've felt it your entire life.
That there's something wrong with the world.
You don't know what it is, but it's there....
Like a splinter in your mind...
Driving you mad.


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OfflineStrumpling
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Re: TIME [Re: trendal]
    #1135312 - 12/12/02 12:37 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

physical AND mental time-travel is possible.

We physically time-travel all day every day. Right NOW isn't the same as right NOW! see? we're travelling through time!

Mentally, however, its much cooler - we can project forward in time and get foggy visions of what things will be like - for instance, if the bong's falling over, I would mentally travel forward in time and see the broken bong laying on the carpet in a puddle of nasty water (very undesireable), so I could then travel back to the "now" in my mind and move quickly to prevent that undesireable future from actually occuring. Or like if I lost my job I could look forward into the future and see myself still jobless and hungry, broke and homeless (very undesireable), so I could pick up the newspaper and find myself a new job to change the future.

But I guess its impossible to change the future, now that I think about it..... kuz it hasn't happened yet, so any changes simply effect the present and shift the entire view.. hmm.. lol time's confusing - thats enough ranting from me for now. :smile:

remember all this stuff is just speculation - i don't know shit

-=- Matt/Strumpling -=-
Speculating


--------------------
Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
In addition: SHPONGLE


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OfflineLOPHO.MP
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Re: TIME [Re: trendal]
    #1135400 - 12/12/02 01:09 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)


Hmmm... I was just reading the other day in Psychology book about "consciousness". What I read really went along with what you said about us allways being in the immediate past. Supposedly the part of the brain that is "me" doesn't find out about things until a while after they already happened. However my brain tricks "me" into thinking that I was aware when things were happening.... If that is hard to understand, here is an example: When a sprinter hears the shot of the starting gun he can start running in a fraction of a second.

However, the time between the sound and the time that he acts is less than the time it requires for the recognition of the sound to reach the part of the brain that is the seat of consciousness. When asked the sprinter says he started running when he heard the shot.

The truth is that he was running before his consciousness could have received the sound and consciously reacted to it. So, what happens is: The body can respond faster if it doesn't have to work through the conscious part of the brain. Therefore the body subconsciously reacts to the stimuli (the shot). THEN after the action is over the message gets to the conscious part of the brain. "We" are tricked in to thinking that "we" were in charge of the action when it was actually subconcious. Part of the brain corrects for this delay in receival and makes the conscious think it is in the present.

So if "we" are the conscious part of our brains "we" are allways experiencing the past!!

This is just what these Psychologist were saying in the book, I'm just relaying the info...

So is the past still the past if we perceive it as the present?


--------------------
---Still Searching---


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OfflineDavid_Scape
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Re: TIME [Re: LOPHO.MP]
    #1136245 - 12/12/02 06:23 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Yes, i heard somthing very much like that too. Only it was on the science channel and the analogy they used had to do with tennis. It said the subconscious is responsible for the reaction to a 100mph serve, and when questioned the player says he only saw the angle of the shot and acted.

What's more, they said that we are only conscious of events of the brain only when they have reached a certain threshold of activity.

I wonder if meditation makes one more 'sensitive' or lowers the threshold. That would explain the subtle layer of thoughts one experiences just by quieting his mind a little. Also, it might explain the distortion of time one experiences while sitting there meditating.


--------------------
focusing
Flow
The Enneagram


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OfflineLeviathon
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Re: TIME [Re: David_Scape]
    #1136669 - 12/12/02 08:42 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

All of a sudden this crazy idea popped into my head: when we are alive we move forward with time and the present reality. When we die we stop moving forward with the living. This might explain psychics(sp?) communicating with the dead on the "other side" or something. Play with this idea i would like to hear some thoughts about this possibility of time and how life and death plays a role in our perception of time, or how it effects how time works.


--------------------
You can not recieve with hands already full.


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OfflineMurex
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Re: TIME [Re: Glacius]
    #1136690 - 12/12/02 09:04 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

A watch isn't found in nature.


--------------------
What if everything around you
Isn't quite as it seems?
What if all the world you think you know,
Is an elaborate dream?
And if you look at your reflection,
Is it all you want it to be?



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OfflineJackal
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Re: TIME [Re: Murex]
    #1136800 - 12/12/02 10:28 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

One things for sure, time is very difficult to grasp and explain. Does it even exist? We as humans seem to be the only species who acknowledge its possible presence. Is it possible that ancient farmers noticed that the Sun and Moon came and went with a certain regularity and just invented time to help them judge when crops were ready?


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OfflineGlacius
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Re: TIME [Re: 3eyedgod]
    #1141923 - 12/15/02 12:20 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

FUCK!!!!!! I just posted a fucking long post, and all the info was lost cuz I accidentally hit the BACK shortcut key. FUCK!!!!!  I dont give a shit. ARGGGG :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

Ah well, cant be mad forever, it wont bring it back :laugh: :laugh: I am going to try and find it in history. FUCK!!!!


--------------------
addicted to reason
a hollow understanding trapped me
I cannot see outside but its calling


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OfflineGlacius
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Re: TIME [Re: 3eyedgod]
    #1141927 - 12/15/02 12:27 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

In reply to:




You only smoke pot, buy ya post in the shroomery? Eat some shrooms dude, trip out. You will find it's effects on time far more interesting than weeds.

Haha, dont worry I have been higher than most have on the sacred fungus. Have expereinced ego death. It can be expereinced on even small amounts of shrooms if one does it corectly. Read timothy learys traslation of "The Book Of The Dead". I respect them, and after what I have expereinced, its time for a break from the drug, even though its my favorite. I am going to restrain from them for a long while. And even if I did not do drugs at all I would post at the shroomery. Its the best community in the world. I started CAPS, and have met some of my best freinds from the shroomery. You dont need to be high to realize how wonderful and open-minded the people are around here are!!



--------------------
addicted to reason
a hollow understanding trapped me
I cannot see outside but its calling


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OfflineMAIA
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Re: TIME [Re: David_Scape]
    #1142246 - 12/15/02 06:02 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

In reply to:

If so, how would you go about inducing this state of mind to percieving your workday to be shorter?




Imagine you go to work and put an alarm ringing every 5 minutes and try not to know what time is during the day. You have to turn the alarm off and then wait for the next 5 minutes, if you do the same thing over and over and getting used to it, you'll be making this a routine, now suddently, one day change the alarm from 5 minutes to a 20 minutes gap. For you, time will pass very slowly because you have to think about time, it will take longer between rings, surprisingly the end of the day will be reached faster because you're still working with the 5 minutes timeframe.So, you can control time by giving a reference point in your timeframe.

MAIA


--------------------
Spiritual being, living a human experience ... The Shroomery Mandala



Use, do not abuse; neither abstinence nor excess ever renders man happy.
Voltaire


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Offline3eyedgod
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Re: TIME [Re: Glacius]
    #1142463 - 12/15/02 08:06 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

You mean this translation

http://www.totse.com/en/drugs/psychedelics/psychdlc.html

I've read it before, I think it's excellent


--------------------
Without everything wouldn't nothing be everything and without nothing wouldn't everything be nothing.I am the beginning and the end,the source and the void, the light and the darkness,i am but a small drop of the ocean yet i am an ocean unto myself


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Offlinenamaste
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Re: TIME [Re: Glacius]
    #1142808 - 12/15/02 11:32 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

i love this topic! www.discover.com/search/index.html you'll have to search 2000 keyword tim folger it's a theory that we are already dead, but our perception of time is so slow that we are not able to realize it. and www.braincourse.com/timea.html it's an excersize to disort time and accelerate learning using self-hypnosis. If you only think there's five minutes to do something, you'll be all stressed and do a half-assed job, where as if you believe you have an hour, you'd be way more relaxed and focus much better.


--------------------


Edited by namaste' (12/15/02 12:05 PM)


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