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Chronic7
Registered: 05/08/04
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Moments of Surrender
#11191974 - 10/06/09 06:29 AM (14 years, 5 months ago) |
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If i look back over my life i can see that everything that i enjoy came to me through moments of surrender, not through a moments of 'trying' or 'hard work' but total letting go & pleading to life/the universe to bring it to me
For example, im in a job i love, but i never went looking for it, i just used to be in jobs i didn't enjoy that much then i surrendered to life to guide me to a job i would enjoy, then it just happend by itself
The same goes for my accomadation, friends, exercise routines, eating healthy & my general environment, all of it came from me surrendering to life, not from me trying to control life, of course i tried to control these things in the past, but they all only actually came to fruition when i eventually surrendered
Im not one to beleive in things like 'law of attraction' books or whatever but i genuinely feel from my own experience that there is something in having an intense burning desire then relasing it to life to be fullfilled...
'Surrender' is a funny word, as universally speaking you only ever surrender to yourself, so surrender is less of a surrender & more of a dissolution of the beleif in having control
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Edited by Chronic7 (10/06/09 06:54 AM)
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Band of Gypsys
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Re: Moments of Surrender [Re: Chronic7]
#11191993 - 10/06/09 06:38 AM (14 years, 5 months ago) |
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You can't fight the universe, surrender is the best option.
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Smitington
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I like what your saying but it's not always true. Sometimes we have to work hard to make the changes in our world that we want. If Martin Luther King Jr. surrendered, he wouldn't be nearly as influential as he is today, and equality might not be where it is today.
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Band of Gypsys
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Re: Moments of Surrender [Re: Smitington]
#11192104 - 10/06/09 07:27 AM (14 years, 5 months ago) |
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That's surrendering to people, not the universe.
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Icelander
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Re: Moments of Surrender [Re: Chronic7]
#11192142 - 10/06/09 07:46 AM (14 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Chronic777 said: If i look back over my life i can see that everything that i enjoy came to me through moments of surrender, not through a moments of 'trying' or 'hard work' but total letting go & pleading to life/the universe to bring it to me
For example, im in a job i love, but i never went looking for it, i just used to be in jobs i didn't enjoy that much then i surrendered to life to guide me to a job i would enjoy, then it just happend by itself
The same goes for my accomadation, friends, exercise routines, eating healthy & my general environment, all of it came from me surrendering to life, not from me trying to control life, of course i tried to control these things in the past, but they all only actually came to fruition when i eventually surrendered
Im not one to beleive in things like 'law of attraction' books or whatever but i genuinely feel from my own experience that there is something in having an intense burning desire then relasing it to life to be fullfilled...
'Surrender' is a funny word, as universally speaking you only ever surrender to yourself, so surrender is less of a surrender & more of a dissolution of the beleif in having control
Really I think it's more about a balance between effort and surrender
"The secret of the Shaman is he knows when to hold on and when to let go".
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Chronic7
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Re: Moments of Surrender [Re: Icelander]
#11192153 - 10/06/09 07:52 AM (14 years, 5 months ago) |
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I suppose in a way its like if we dont first make the effort then that momentum wouldn't be there, but then there comes a time when the momentum just takes itself, no more effort...
This is how i see meditation at times, an effort which is only to maintain recognition of that which is already effortless
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Icelander
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Re: Moments of Surrender [Re: Chronic7]
#11192164 - 10/06/09 07:55 AM (14 years, 5 months ago) |
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Surrender is key, because we rarely can let that happen. It's too scary to trust in the process of life. We have invested so much of ourselves in convincing ourselves that we are masters of life.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
Edited by Icelander (10/06/09 07:56 AM)
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Chronic7
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Re: Moments of Surrender [Re: Icelander]
#11192190 - 10/06/09 08:03 AM (14 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: Surrender is key, because we rarely can let that happen. It's too scary to trust in the process of life. We have invested so much of ourselves in convincing ourselves that we are masters of life.
Its true & extremely paradoxical, as even saying 'okay i surrender now' is not really surrender, cause we're still waiting for something in return for surrendering
Real surrender expects nothing in return
Its certainly something that unfolds by itself, not something that we can cause or even allow to happen
I feel that its really beyond conceptual, but then we say 'surrender' to convey that great feeling of letting go...
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Icelander
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Re: Moments of Surrender [Re: Chronic7]
#11192196 - 10/06/09 08:05 AM (14 years, 5 months ago) |
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well not for me at least. surrender entails and initial decision.
I could give a simple example but I think you get it.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Chronic7
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Re: Moments of Surrender [Re: Icelander]
#11192214 - 10/06/09 08:13 AM (14 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: well not for me at least. surrender entails an initial decision.
it appears so mentally, that at times we have to convince ourselves to surrender to use concepts to rationalize & see that surrender is the best option...
but its all coming from the centre opening up, its already happening then we attribute particular concepts to mirror that opening like 'i surrender' or 'i let go'
but really we are doing nothing, if anything we are being un-done from the inside out
i keep wanting to say its like a flower opening up
its all coming from that central point
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DiamondJoe
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Re: Moments of Surrender [Re: Icelander]
#11192233 - 10/06/09 08:20 AM (14 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said:
"The secret of the Shaman is he knows when to hold on and when to let go".
Wow! Does this make Kenny Rogers a Shaman?
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Icelander
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Re: Moments of Surrender [Re: Chronic7]
#11192246 - 10/06/09 08:24 AM (14 years, 5 months ago) |
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but its all coming from the centre opening up, its already happening then we attribute particular concepts to mirror that opening like 'i surrender' or 'i let go'
Yeah I guess you're right.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Smitington
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Quote:
Band of Gypsys said: That's surrendering to people, not the universe.
people are the universe
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Icelander
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Re: Moments of Surrender [Re: Smitington]
#11192337 - 10/06/09 08:50 AM (14 years, 5 months ago) |
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however small a part
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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laserpig
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Re: Moments of Surrender [Re: Smitington]
#11192744 - 10/06/09 10:30 AM (14 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Smitington said:
Quote:
Band of Gypsys said: That's surrendering to people, not the universe.
people are the universe
His point is that you've got the wrong idea of surrender. We're not talking about whipping out a white flag and ceasing to assert oneself on the outside world. We're talking about giving up the idea that one can effectively control, motivate, restrict, and correct oneself through planning, anxiety, and thought in a manner which is somehow superior to merely "going where your wind blows you" -- ie, following what paths appear to you & what motivations crop up of themselves.
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Icelander
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Re: Moments of Surrender [Re: laserpig]
#11192749 - 10/06/09 10:31 AM (14 years, 5 months ago) |
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well put
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Smitington
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Re: Moments of Surrender [Re: Icelander]
#11192861 - 10/06/09 10:52 AM (14 years, 5 months ago) |
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So basically what you are saying is be yourself?
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Edited by Smitington (10/06/09 10:54 AM)
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laserpig
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Re: Moments of Surrender [Re: Smitington]
#11192896 - 10/06/09 10:56 AM (14 years, 5 months ago) |
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Arguably yes, that's what we're saying, but putting it like that sounds so vague as to be almost meaningless.
Then again, if that's the label which helps you grok the concept, then ... fuck it, run with it. It's all just notation anyway.
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Smitington
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Re: Moments of Surrender [Re: laserpig]
#11192919 - 10/06/09 11:00 AM (14 years, 5 months ago) |
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the whole thing is essentially meaningless. Sure, we start going down the path where we aren't being natural to ourselves or whatever, then we realize this and let it go, and feel better. I guess the biggest thing to get out of this is try to remember to be yourself and all that
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laserpig
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Re: Moments of Surrender [Re: Smitington]
#11192957 - 10/06/09 11:06 AM (14 years, 5 months ago) |
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The whole concept of surrender to one's self and environment is meaningless? I beg differ.
Many many people get themselves and others in a world of hurt because they try to control their own desires & etc. We're essentially talking about a "cure" for that problem. I don't see why you would say that a solution to a large-scale & high-magnitude problem is not meaningful.
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