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Arete
    #11174644 -

I have low regard for specialization and thus low regard for modern culture. Initially it was a shock to me to find an "expert" in a subject I was interested in often was a total klutz in most other aspects of life. Without a pathological (read total)reliance on culture this "expert" would soon be buzzard bait.

But what is lost IMO is far greater than just staying alive. It's experience, and self reliance and especially excellence. Sadly, we all suffer from this and most will never know what "disease" they have.  There really is no use to complain however as it's a sign of the  times.

One of the results of my intense fixation on my death anxiety is a realization that sometimes life may not always be worth living. Or as Veritas sez, "survival is overrated". Once one realizes that this life in not actually a preference one can take a more philosophical outlook toward death. But this realization is not an intellectual exercise but one of a gut level awakening bought at a great price in suffering. And then it's only part of a process. At least this is how it has worked out for me.

Can you grok what I'm saying?

"Arete implies a respect for the wholeness or oneness of life, and a consequent dislike of specialization. It implies a contempt for efficiency -- or rather a much higher idea of efficiency, an efficiency which exists not in one department of life but in life itself.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11174668 -

Quote:
Without a pathological (read total)reliance on culture this "expert" would soon be buzzard bait.


Buzzards are specialization experts, are they not?


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Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11174678 -

Quote:
Or as Veritas sez, "survival is overrated".


She may be planning a 'surprise' for you. Tread carefully... :shiftyeyes:


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Re: Arete [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #11174687 -

OrgoneConclusion said:
Quote:
Without a pathological (read total)reliance on culture this "expert" would soon be buzzard bait.


Buzzards are specialization experts, are they not?


no they even eat dead humans (not picky) and can insure their own survival. But I'm talking about humans here.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Arete [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #11174696 -

She is the sole heir to my vast fortune.:shrug:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11174749 -

Uh oh! :lipsrsealed:


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Re: Arete [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #11174753 -

once I'm gone she can retire and live a carefree life like old Ice.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11175224 -

Quote:
One of the results of my intense fixation on my death anxiety is a realization that sometimes life may not always be worth living. Or as Veritas sez, "survival is overrated". Once one realizes that this life in not actually a preference one can take a more philosophical outlook toward death. But this realization is not an intellectual exercise but one of a gut level awakening bought at a great price in suffering. And then it's only part of a process. At least this is how it has worked out for me.


Such is the thrownness of this existence; none of us asked nor had the choice to be [here], and especially not for this finite life that is bound simply to end. Yet through the terror we find things to live for, and we invest ourselves deeply enough into the experience that the terror of losing the things we've made important to us may almost surmount the terror of our death.

Sometimes I wonder if the truest misery in your life is the incapability to triumph your death anxieties and take your own life.
And then sometimes I wonder if that is mine as well.

Quote:
Can you grok what I'm saying?


And how. :heart:

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Re: Arete [Re: Tropism]
    #11175612 -

Sometimes I wonder if the truest misery in your life is the incapability to triumph your death anxieties and take your own life.
And then sometimes I wonder if that is mine as well.


Gee I wait and wait for responses like these. That's a pretty interesting question and their may be some real truth to it. Overriding survival instincts can be very difficult indeed. I admit to fascination with suicides. I would like to get inside their heads to see what's really going on. As in, do they really grok that they might be completely disappearing for good or do they some how believe in some sort of convoluted continuation in some afterlife? I'm pretty sure I'm temporary and as good as dead now. There's a part of me that craves life (immortality) and then the part that can see that life as it actually is is a wash. I grew up on fairy tales and those programs run deep. Lately however I don't feel so afraid of leaving all this for good. But it's hard to know what that means. I'm never beyond some kind of fooling myself with mental gymnastics if you know what I mean.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Arete [Re: Tropism]
    #11175619 -

btw I am making plans for a final exit just in case. I want the means at hand if I ever need it. I've made a fairly in depth study.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11175629 -

takin' the easy way out huh??


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LAGM v.2.024 Grow log

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Re: Arete [Re: cyb3rtr0n]
    #11175648 -

What the fuck are you talking about? Not that you would have any idea about that.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11175699 -

You're right...  I don't because I've never once considered an "exit plan", even while looking down a barrel of a pistol pointing at my head by a crackhead as I entered my car.


suicide is a cowardly action.


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LAGM v.2.024 Grow log

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Re: Arete [Re: Tropism]
    #11175706 -

Quote:
none of us asked nor had the choice to be [here],


One fine 'day' I was 'floating' in The Void and said, "I wish I could be!" And here I yam.


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Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11175773 -

Quote:
There's a part of me that craves life (immortality) and then the part that can see that life as it actually is is a wash.I grew up on fairy tales and those programs run deep. Lately however I don't feel so afraid of leaving all this for good. But it's hard to know what that means. I'm never beyond some kind of fooling myself with mental gymnastics if you know what I mean.


I do, and sometimes it seems that I only exists to trick itself in some kind cyclic game of charades. The desire for immortality is entirely present, yet still death can be a relieving reminder that I won't have to spend an eternity with myself, 'cause that would certainly drive me mad. :tongue:

Quote:
btw I am making plans for a final exit just in case. I want the means at hand if I ever need it. I've made a fairly in depth study.


What are your possible plans? I've been quite intersted in the idea of being the one to take my own life, if dying is inevitable I'd rather use what little power I have to try and make it as comfortable as possible, one final desperate assertion of what little control I have over my own life.

Still though the cat's curiousity on where it might go and how it might end leaves me waiting.

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Re: Arete [Re: cyb3rtr0n]
    #11175789 -

cyb3rtr0n said:
You're right...  I don't because I've never once considered an "exit plan", even while looking down a barrel of a pistol pointing at my head by a crackhead as I entered my car.


suicide is a cowardly action.


Oh boy aren't you brave. I've been on the receiving end of several guns. But please tell me what that has to do with killing oneself?

Killing oneself can be a act of great bravery. I don't have the guts for it so far.  If I had a painful degenerative disease I would surely end it as an act of mercy to myself.

I find your superior self righteous attitude disgusting to say the least.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11175874 -

I find your "exit plan" to be... well, cowardly...:shrug:

I guess were both misunderstood.  I'm not afraid to admit it, are you?


please tell me, what final solution will your particular suicide prove?


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LAGM v.2.024 Grow log

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Re: Arete [Re: cyb3rtr0n]
    #11176533 -

and I find your position to be ignorant:shrug:

I don't believe I have misunderstood anything here but I'm not surprised you have.

I never said I will surely kill myself but under the conditions that life no longer provides me satisfaction or becomes extremely painful I see no point in continuing and hope to have the courage for it. The courage to override all my "cowardly" (fear based) survival instincts and guilt trips implanted by ignorant cultural programming (like religion)

Most people IMO who live on and on with no hope and in extreme pain or confusion (like my mother did) and try to "survive" under any circumstances are the cowards if anyone is. The fear of death and the dissolution of their personality structure. It doesn't surprise me that some one young and ignorant of how painful life can become would make, IMO, statements of such extreme folly.:shrug:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11177122 -

Icelander said:
and I find your position to be ignorant:shrug:

I don't believe I have misunderstood anything here but I'm not surprised you have.

I never said I will surely kill myself but under the conditions that life no longer provides me satisfaction or becomes extremely painful I see no point in continuing and hope to have the courage for it. The courage to override all my "cowardly" (fear based) survival instincts and guilt trips implanted by ignorant cultural programming (like religion)

Most people IMO who live on and on with no hope and in extreme pain or confusion (like my mother did) and try to "survive" under any circumstances are the cowards if anyone is. The fear of death and the dissolution of their personality structure. It doesn't surprise me that some one young and ignorant of how painful life can become would make, IMO, statements of such extreme folly.:shrug:



the focus needs to go on ridding that guilt.  Then the alternative plan will not even be an option one would consider.


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LAGM v.2.024 Grow log

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Re: Arete [Re: cyb3rtr0n]
    #11177225 -

Bull shit. If I was in extreme pain from cancer or slipping into dementia I would want a way out and guilt would not play into it.

Guilt is one part of a complex issue. Of course once guilt free then one is free to choose life or death based more in reality. Choosing to live or die is not that important considering we all die anyway. IMO only those with severe unconscious death anxiety care who chooses what. It's a completely personal choice and neither good nor bad, right or wrong. :tongue:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11177267 -

I'm a believer that people can do what they want to themselves as long as it don't effect others..

but there is no reason to ever consider quitting.


In extreme conditions I could see having an option between two ways to die, but that's not suicide..


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LAGM v.2.024 Grow log

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Re: Arete [Re: cyb3rtr0n]
    #11177290 -

I'm a believer that people can do what they want to themselves as long as it don't effect others..

but there is no reason to ever consider quitting.

Have you noticed you contradict your self from sentence to sentence?:crazy2:

And could you please explain your last sentence as it seems confusing to me.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11177344 -

Quote:
Have you noticed you contradict your self from sentence to sentence?



Wouldn't that require some degree of awareness?


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Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11177378 -

as far as the first comment.  It was intentional.  Your actions to yourself are one thing, but your reasoning leading to the action is what is open for debate..



as far as the clarification of the last sentence..


well  If I was given two weeks to live I could see suicide as an option for someone.  personally I would wait it out, because you never know... 

but, to each his own....

If I were on a 100th floor of a building and  jumping or facing 5 floors of fire was an option, I would consider jumping.  but I would certainly test the fire first before giving that option up, because you can possibly turn back from that decision.


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LAGM v.2.024 Grow log

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Re: Arete [Re: cyb3rtr0n]
    #11177395 -

so now you have totally contradicted yourself.

Good fucking job.:thumbup:

This place is a fucking hoot. I can't see why Veritas doesn't want to post here anymore?


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11177406 -

Quote:
I've been on the receiving end of several guns.


That will teach you to diss the 'Love Drives the Universe' crowd.


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Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11177410 -

ok..

how did I contradict myself..??


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LAGM v.2.024 Grow log

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Re: Arete [Re: cyb3rtr0n]
    #11177429 -

You stated suicide was a cowardly act. No one ever need resort to it.

Fuck dood, are you for real. Did the educational system really treat you that badly.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11177452 -

suicide is cowardly when it is an option of life..


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LAGM v.2.024 Grow log

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Re: Arete [Re: cyb3rtr0n]
    #11177469 -

cyb3rtr0n said:
suicide is cowardly when it is an option of life..


Im repeating myself.  but like I was saying.. unless in extreme conditions, but then it is not suicide..


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LAGM v.2.024 Grow log

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Re: Arete [Re: cyb3rtr0n]
    #11177479 -

Get a fucking dictionary. Suicide is the act of taking your own life.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Arete [Re: cyb3rtr0n]
    #11177488 -

cyb3rtr0n said:
suicide is cowardly when it is an option of life..



Wtf does that mean? Is english a second language?


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11177528 -

Sorry, I will capitalize the first letter in my sentences from here on out:  At least, until the end of this post.


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LAGM v.2.024 Grow log

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Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11177535 -

Suicide is never a brave thing...

Suicide is the cowards way to escape difficult life issues...

Even in the worst of times, life has so much to offer that you can never entertain the thought of ending your own life.

Are you serious?

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Re: Arete [Re: cyb3rtr0n]
    #11177548 -

This is your idea of an answer?:thumbup:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Arete [Re: Knobby Tops]
    #11177579 -

Knobby Tops said:
Suicide is never a brave thing...

Suicide is the cowards way to escape difficult life issues...

Even in the worst of times, life has so much to offer that you can never entertain the thought of ending your own life.

Are you serious?


I am serious and not a tool.

Your death anxiety is screaming morality boy.

In other words thanks for your personal  opinion with nothing worthwhile to back it up.

Why don't you just mind your own life and quit deciding what is right or good for someone else. Fuck I have 0 respect for opinions like these.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11178862 -

Icelander said:
One of the results of my intense fixation on my death anxiety is a realization that sometimes life may not always be worth living. Or as Veritas sez, "survival is overrated". Once one realizes that this life in not actually a preference one can take a more philosophical outlook toward death.


We live complete lies, but its fun for a while...

You don't have to physcially die, you just have to see the lie & stop feeding into it all

You know, it really all comes down to this - we can be taken in by what we see & suffer from it or we can just observe what we see not interfere with it & be perfectly happy

I guess the question to how happy you can be is how much you are willing to take a step back & stop trying to control your life

To me 'Arete' is the french for STOP, which is the point, don't follow anything, just stop...

:peace:


--------------------

Edited by Chronic7 (10/04/09 06:33 AM)

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Re: Arete [Re: Chronic7]
    #11179059 -

I don't have to physically die? Wow! I'm immortal.

Arete=excellence.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11179790 -

I meant you don't have to phsyically die to feel the liberation of death

All this suicidal talk is for one thing, the liberation that death brings, to get over this meat suit your wearing


:peace:


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Re: Arete [Re: Chronic7]
    #11179801 -

I don't know what death brings. I wouldn't mind it being a liberation.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11179837 -

i dont mean to be rude, but if you dont know what death brings
then sorry but you dont grok what im talking about

all i talk about really is death, just dressed up as something else...

:peace:


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Re: Arete [Re: Chronic7]
    #11179857 -

:rofl2:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11179868 -

exactly

:peace:


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Re: Arete [Re: Chronic7]
    #11179880 -

Yes I grok your position quite well. That's why I reject it.:satansmoking:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11180187 -

Icelander said:
Yes I grok your position quite well. That's why I reject it.:satansmoking:


Dude if you're gonna Grok grok in this cup. 

:pm:


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Anxiety is what you make it.

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Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11180361 -

Everything is specialized though, including those who specialize in being unspecialized.  This is just wordplay though, but enough to show that your point is not much more than an assertion, a fart into a stiff wind. 

The sniveling accountant, or the palefaced waif of a molecular biologist, are actually just caricatures, more or less akin to the sorts of ideas that found racial stereotypes.  They can be proved true in enough cases that you count the hits and ignore the misses.  Still totally baseless, but it is what it is.

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Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11180473 -

and so turns the wheel..

two seconds with the cruel escape in front of my minds eye were enough to dismiss it forever. i will never surrender, not to my own inflictions, not to those by another

of course i've never really been on the deep end i suppose..

i hope i find a nice girl one of these days


i hope whatever plan you have constructed can remain just that


--------------------
fashs and cops, both go down, as the aggro spreads across town, bricks n bottles fall like rain, evil coppers double up in pain

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Re: Arete [Re: xFrockx]
    #11181774 -

Everything is specialized though, including those who specialize in being unspecialized.

Yeah that makes sense. :crazy2: For someone always asserting word play you aren't very good at it.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Arete [Re: Chronic7]
    #11182128 -

i dont mean to be rude, but if you dont know what death brings
then sorry but you dont grok what im talking about



This of course brings to mind the true believer Christian who tells me straight faced that he communicates in a back and forth fasion with God. Of course when I say I have checked it out and had no experience of this God he's sure that I don't know what I'm talking about and of course I'm supposed to believe he experiences exactly what he's claiming.:crazy2::monkeydance::crazy2::monkeydance::crazy2::monkeydance:

Get the picture? (no im sure you don't)


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11182235 -

You are obviously not sincere enough in your search. Try harder.

Smoke more weed.
Watch Jesus bleed.

Eat more shrooms
Alone in your room.

Do MDA
Every other day

Eat tons of acid
And become more placid.

Meditate
While you wait
For your heart chakra
To open the gate.


--------------------

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Re: Arete [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #11182255 -

Have you been hanging out with Looner Eclipse again.:nono:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11182264 -

I have many friends here. :yesnod:


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Re: Arete [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #11182483 -

One could find waking up again to be worthwhile if one impacted other people enough, or at least so percieved that to be true.

Smashing others cheeky beliefs is a fun way to do that when coming from this angle.

Maybe get a megaphone and yell YOU MUST DIE ONE DAY AND ITS GONNA BE HILARIOUS in pedestrians faces or something, could be fun....


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Jesus loves you.

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Re: Arete [Re: andrewss]
    #11182668 -

Ice, i wrote you a poem :lol:

Everyone lives
Everyone dies
No matter how hard one cries
There will be flies
On and on
Since the first dawn
Everyone lives
And everyone dies
Like a creeper
Here comes the reaper
You’ll huff and puff
But you will be snuffed
At the gallows again
But now without chagrin
…Learnt how to grin



hooray discussing death anxiety :gethigh:


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Jesus loves you.

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Re: Arete [Re: andrewss]
    #11182679 -

sweet:heart:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11182707 -

:lol:

:chugbeer:


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Jesus loves you.

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Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11184060 -

"Yeah that makes sense" is not an argument.

I never claimed to be good at what I do, but I don't have any illusions about what can come of this.  I mainly post here against those who do.

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Re: Arete [Re: xFrockx]
    #11185440 -

I'm proud of you son.:thumbup::heart:

I was just teasing. I like most of your posts here. Youre not pretending to know very much.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11185501 -

OrgoneConclusion said:
You are obviously not sincere enough in your search. Try harder.

Smoke more weed.
Watch Jesus bleed.

Eat more shrooms
Alone in your room.

Do MDA
Every other day

Eat tons of acid
And become more placid.

Meditate
While you wait
For your heart chakra
To open the gate.


Icelander said:
Have you been hanging out with Looner Eclipse again.:nono:


My cat Grokked three times last night
This morning I had to clean it up
Paper towels can make things right
When your cat has Grokked yup


--------------------
Anxiety is what you make it.

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Re: Arete [Re: LunarEclipse]
    #11185518 -

I know how you feel. One of my dogs was abused and shit kicked before I got him at the shelter. Whenever he gets a little nervous he pees all over my house. It's a burden for sure but sometimes things just got to be the way they are.:sad::shrug:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Arete [Re: Icelander]
    #11185574 -

Icelander said:
I know how you feel. One of my dogs was abused and shit kicked before I got him at the shelter. Whenever he gets a little nervous he pees all over my house. It's a burden for sure but sometimes things just got to be the way they are.:sad::shrug:


My cat was hallucinating, it makes him Grok and then he Groks.  You would think he would learn not to eat spider plants as they make him sick.  Usually I keep the door closed to the room with the spider plants but last night I spaced it.

"Between a Grok and a hard place" - Anon


--------------------
Anxiety is what you make it.

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Re: Arete [Re: LunarEclipse]
    #11185679 -

cats


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
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