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Offlinefarmboy
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Is it possible to wait TOO LONG to birth?
    #11004343 - 09/05/09 01:33 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Hey guys,

I have several jars that are now 41 days post-inoculation. This is my first batch ever. I did not incubate the jars so the mycelium has grown rather slowly, but steadily nonetheless. Out of 7 total jars, only 4 of them are approaching full colonization. Even these 4 do not look as dense as pictures I've seen on tutorials. The mycelium is more whispy. I think I may have mixed the substrate on the dry side... and also maybe made it a bit too dense.

So I guess I have a couple questions: first, should I just go ahead and birth the ones that are farthest along? If I wait another week or 2, is the fungus going to exhaust its food supply and die? Mind you this isn't a matter of patience... I have no problem waiting longer if I have to. I just don't want to ruin my batch by doing so. Any help would be greatly appreciated!

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OfflineHiddenIdentity
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Re: Is it possible to wait TOO LONG to birth? [Re: farmboy]
    #11004384 - 09/05/09 01:42 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Ive never heard of jars taking that long to colonize, but I guess anything is possible with multi spore.  Pics would help, that way we could tell you if its actually mycelium or not.  I have had "thin wispy mycelium" that turned out to be cobweb mold, or mucor.

  BTW incubating is not generally recommended.  Sure it speeds up colonization slightly, but its not worth the risk of inviting contams with the higher heat.

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Offlinefarmboy
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Re: Is it possible to wait TOO LONG to birth? [Re: HiddenIdentity]
    #11004443 - 09/05/09 01:57 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

I'm fairly certain it's not cobweb. I originally inoculated 10 jars -- 7 with mexicube and the other 3 with F+. the F+ jars all fell victim to green mold within 10 days, so I'm assuming the spore solution was contaminated somehow. But the mexicubes have remained sterile.

Unfortunately I don't have access to a camera at the moment. I guess what I'm really asking is... if mycelial growth slows to the point that I can't tell if it's spreading anymore, then should I just go ahead and birth? If so, should I birth the whole cake or cut off the small portions of substrate here and there that haven't colonized?

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OfflineProject
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Re: Is it possible to wait TOO LONG to birth? [Re: HiddenIdentity]
    #11004446 - 09/05/09 01:57 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

If you're talking about birthing PF cakes, then birth them as they become ready.  After 100% colonization, wait about 7 days before you birth to let the mycelium consolidate.  If you birth earlier, you're not going to save any time because the mycelium will still have to consolidate.  By keeping the substrate in the jar during this time, you allow the substrate to retain most of its moisture.

So birth them once they're 1 week past full colonization.  Just keep in mind that eventually your perlite will start to dry out, but if you have 4-5", it'll last a while.  If your humidity ever starts to consistently drop, due to perlite drying out, and you still have cakes going, just sit them aside in a clean place long enough for you to rehydrate your perlite again.  Shouldn't take very long and your cakes sitting out won't hurt anything, as long as it's a clean place and not super hot or dry or something.

Good luck

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Offlinenastos
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Re: Is it possible to wait TOO LONG to birth? [Re: Project]
    #11004450 - 09/05/09 01:58 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

could be too moist


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Offlinefarmboy
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Re: Is it possible to wait TOO LONG to birth? [Re: nastos]
    #11004467 - 09/05/09 02:04 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

hmm... hadn't though of that nastos. there does seem to be a lot of condensation on the inside of the jar, but this being my first attempt, i just assumed that was to be expected as the mycelium spread.

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OfflineHiddenIdentity
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Re: Is it possible to wait TOO LONG to birth? [Re: farmboy]
    #11004570 - 09/05/09 02:22 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Yea, all my jars start to "sweat" as they are close to full colonization.  A little bit of water forming on the inside of the jar is completely normal.  Do you not have a camera?  We could help you better with pics!

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Offlinefarmboy
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Re: Is it possible to wait TOO LONG to birth? [Re: HiddenIdentity]
    #11004657 - 09/05/09 02:40 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

I'll try to borrow a camera from someone and post some pics tonight

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Offlinefarmboy
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Pics [Re: farmboy]
    #11005442 - 09/05/09 05:59 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Okay, this is the most developed jar:

side:


bottom:


I apologize for the quality of the pics, but you can still see vermiculite by looking at the bottom. Am I being too picky? I thought I was supposed to wait till it's completely white, but like I said, it's been almost 6 weeks now.

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Re: Pics *DELETED* [Re: farmboy]
    #11005453 - 09/05/09 06:02 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Post deleted by Shea25

Reason for deletion: Redundant


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Offlinefarmboy
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Re: Pics [Re: Shea25]
    #11005464 - 09/05/09 06:04 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

shea, I already started another batch two days ago. Just wondering if this one can be salvaged.

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InvisibleShea25
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Re: Pics [Re: farmboy]
    #11005474 - 09/05/09 06:07 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Ah I didn't catch that sorry. Um you could try birthing it now and do a dunk and roll then fruit it in say a 2 liter pop bottle to see if it will work. And that way if it does mold on you its not in your main FC and instead in a nice little container


Usually you do wait for it to be all colonised and then wait a few days after that but 6 weeks should have been done fruiting by now so might as well experiment The pic in my avatar was fruited with a 2 liter pop bottle worked great.

Edited by Shea25 (09/05/09 06:10 PM)

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Offlinefarmboy
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Re: Pics [Re: Shea25]
    #11005491 - 09/05/09 06:11 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

That's good advice, thanks! I'll try it.

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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Pics [Re: farmboy]
    #11005832 - 09/05/09 07:55 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

You should have removed the foil as soon as you removed the jars from sterilization.  Don't put the foil back on after inoculation.  Were the holes covered?  Generally, substrates made on the dry side colonize much faster than wet ones.  If it was packed, or if the holes were blocked, preventing gas exchange, that would explain the slow colonization.
RR


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Offlinefarmboy
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Re: Pics [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #11005847 - 09/05/09 07:58 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Roger, I used two layers of foil; the first layer being the one with the holes in it. So yes, I covered them with the foil. I've seen that others use tape. How is this different? Should the holes not be covered at all?

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Re: Pics [Re: farmboy]
    #11006002 - 09/05/09 08:27 PM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Holes should be covered while Pc'ing. Right after you inoculate theres no need to cover the holes thats means no micropore tape or any tape over the holes, no foil nothing.

Edited by Shea25 (09/06/09 11:23 AM)

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Offlineajaxism
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Re: Pics [Re: Shea25]
    #11007609 - 09/06/09 01:35 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

I was under the impression that you start off with two layers of foil.

You remove the second layer to inoculate through the first, and then keep the 1st layer remaining that has the holes.

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OfflineFuCha
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Re: Pics [Re: ajaxism]
    #11008268 - 09/06/09 08:00 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Got BRF jars with GT and Combodian thats been going for 6 weeks now, and still not fully colonised, but they still look good and no contam.
Birthed 4 of them a week ago, but still no pins. They have some blue bruising on. I'm gonna wait another week then I will birth the other 6 cakes. That will be 7 weeks in the jars.

We just comming out of winter now so temp inside is 65F

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Offlinefarmboy
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Re: Pics [Re: FuCha]
    #11008409 - 09/06/09 09:18 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

Well, I took the top layer of foil off all the jars. Hopefully it's not too late and this will speed the process. I guess I was so paranoid about contamination that I forgot to think about gas exchange. I was also keeping the jars inside a tupperware container -- again, to avoid foreign invaders. I suppose this probably hampered the gas exchange as well?

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OfflineMagicMaker
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Re: Pics [Re: farmboy]
    #11008470 - 09/06/09 09:45 AM (15 years, 4 months ago)

ya you should not keep it sealed in a Tupperware either def not good for GA

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