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the_gardener
Stranger


Registered: 05/14/09
Posts: 25
Last seen: 12 years, 13 days
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the importance of light
#10963940 - 08/29/09 10:53 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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i have read a buch of diffrent posts concerning the importance of light and would like to ask a couple of questions. First i know that some mushies need light to initiate pinning but what about drawing energy from light agter pinning? is this false? Second can moving the monotub or moving the light affect the way a mushie grows? Can this cause aborts or can it cause some gnarled caps? Third what is the importance of the light schedule? Will a couple of hours off a regular schedule mess up a grow? I think i just need some clarification on this. thanks
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anonjon
Partially Right

Registered: 11/03/08
Posts: 6,322
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I was shocked when I learned of this as well. But apparently mushies utilize melanin to capture light energy.
Light doesn't seem to be the pinning trigger people used to claim it was. Seems the ebb and flow of humidity and air exchange are the real triggers.
My cat just recently started using daylight spectrum bulbs and thinks it making for more vigorous growth.
Many experienced cultivators are claiming a light schedule helps. But my cat is skeptical and is just leaving the light on 24/7.
Regarding moving the tub, its not a big deal at all. Some strains do seem to be more phototropic than others. My cat had some cambos that were really reaching for his halogen reading lamp. It was remarkable. But changing the lighting angle certainly isn't going to cause aborts.
-------------------- The above post is fictional, hypothetical, or downright nonsensical.
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the_gardener
Stranger


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Re: the importance of light [Re: anonjon]
#10964047 - 08/29/09 11:30 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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wow. melanin really. that is a shocker. so what your saying about the halogen is that the intensity or angle dont have to much affect on the mushies but the spectum does. even though i thought that most halogens where of the wrong spectrum. i too im really skeptical of the light so tell your cat im with him on that one. sounds like i need to do some more research
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Epilson Lyrae
Armed with hammers



Registered: 04/07/09
Posts: 5,561
Loc: Woody Creek
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I'll leave the light on for this thread.
-------------------- "Freedom is something that dies unless it's used." H.T.
I've come to believe that the heart is the filter of the enlightened mind. Epilson Lyrae
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the_gardener
Stranger


Registered: 05/14/09
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^^lol^^
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anonjon
Partially Right

Registered: 11/03/08
Posts: 6,322
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Quote:
the_gardener said: wow. melanin really. that is a shocker. so what your saying about the halogen is that the intensity or angle dont have to much affect on the mushies but the spectum does. even though i thought that most halogens where of the wrong spectrum. i too im really skeptical of the light so tell your cat im with him on that one. sounds like i need to do some more research
Well, my cat is using daylight spectrum florescents on the advice of those more experienced than himself. The halogen incident was separate. He happened to have a cake in a lone container by this lamp and the fruits went nuts growing towards it. They changed direction when he'd move it. The phototropism was obvious. Dunno if cause is spectrum or intensity.
Here's a pic. fruits all pinned off side towards light. Then cake was rotated and they started going the other way.
-------------------- The above post is fictional, hypothetical, or downright nonsensical.
Edited by anonjon (08/30/09 12:04 AM)
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the_gardener
Stranger


Registered: 05/14/09
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Last seen: 12 years, 13 days
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Re: the importance of light [Re: anonjon]
#10964159 - 08/30/09 12:07 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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wow thats intense. i think your cat just sparked an expiriment. i will see if my turtle can put the paramaters together to make it work.
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Doc_T
Random Dude




Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 42,395
Loc: Colorado
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Re: the importance of light [Re: anonjon]
#10965001 - 08/30/09 07:49 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
anonjon said: Light doesn't seem to be the pinning trigger people used to claim it was. Seems the ebb and flow of humidity and air exchange are the real triggers.
Light is also, but the other two are also important. You need all three. Our understanding of the role that light plays is evolving, you'll see new info, and refutation of old info, as you search it out.
-------------------- You make it all possible. Doesn't it feel good?
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the_gardener
Stranger


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Re: the importance of light [Re: Doc_T]
#10965024 - 08/30/09 07:58 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Well I don't mean to disagree with you doc t but can you elaborate. The reson I ask is that when my turtle incubates his cakes he does not keep them in complete darkness. As per your theory they would all pin invetro. To the best of my knowladge this has never happened
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Brennus
Student of Life



Registered: 05/31/08
Posts: 3,297
Loc: SE United States
Last seen: 6 years, 10 months
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Light in the 6500-6800k spectrum is necessary for healthy fruit formation. Without proper lighting, yields will suffer.
If you want wall to wall flushes in a monotub, you'll need to invest $20 or so in a decent light.
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Doc_T
Random Dude




Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 42,395
Loc: Colorado
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Quote:
the_gardener said: Well I don't mean to disagree with you doc t but can you elaborate. The reson I ask is that when my turtle incubates his cakes he does not keep them in complete darkness. As per your theory they would all pin invetro. To the best of my knowladge this has never happened
Light is one trigger, along with fresh air and complete colonization. Just like I said. (It's possible to grow cubes in darkness, but they won't like it very much.)
In vitro pinning also has a genetic component- once I grew out several generations of prints from one strain, and along the way, I accidentally selected for that.
-------------------- You make it all possible. Doesn't it feel good?
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anonjon
Partially Right

Registered: 11/03/08
Posts: 6,322
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Re: the importance of light [Re: Doc_T]
#10965106 - 08/30/09 08:24 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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My cat lets them pin invitro and birth. Altho he doesn't rinse the cakes or dunk on the first flush like many do. This is probably not optimal, but he likes skipping steps when he can. There's definitely more mutants doing this tho. I'm not sure if it's the light making them pin, or the shrinking of the cake or combo thereof. Flipping the jar really seems to encourage it.
My cat only recently switched to this recommended lighting. His jars sit in the light the whole time they colonizing. He hasn't really noticed much of a change in pinning. He was surprised because he used to think light was a big trigger.
...here's some mutants caused by invitro pinning 
2nd head growing off head:
 superfreak:
 veiled back:
-------------------- The above post is fictional, hypothetical, or downright nonsensical.
Edited by anonjon (08/30/09 08:59 AM)
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the_gardener
Stranger


Registered: 05/14/09
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Re: the importance of light [Re: Doc_T]
#10965112 - 08/30/09 08:26 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Doc_T said:
Quote:
the_gardener said: Well I don't mean to disagree with you doc t but can you elaborate. The reason I ask is that when my turtle incubates his cakes he does not keep them in complete darkness. As per your theory they would all pin invetro. To the best of my knowledge this has never happened
Light is one trigger, along with fresh air and complete colonization. Just like I said. (It's possible to grow cubes in darkness, but they won't like it very much.)
In vitro pinning also has a genetic component- once I grew out several generations of prints from one strain, and along the way, I accidentally selected for that. 
gotcha. so its not one or the other its all three. I'm sorry i misunderstood.
Can we go the other way with it then. is there a point where light becomes detrimental. like is there such a thing as too much light?
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Doc_T
Random Dude




Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 42,395
Loc: Colorado
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You aren't really grokking this in fullness, little egg.
Mushroom production is how the mycelium has sex. Ok? It's not 'like' sex, it IS sex. You want to seduce the mycelium, just like seducing a girl (or boy, I guess). Hold its hand, rub its feet. Nibble on the ears a bit. Hug it, pull it closer, tell it how you feel about it.
To get a ferocious and even pinset, you want to colonize in relative darkness, then introduce light while you drop RH (slightly) and increase FAE (a lot). Read Hyphae's Pinning Strategy if you can find a link.
-------------------- You make it all possible. Doesn't it feel good?
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the_gardener
Stranger


Registered: 05/14/09
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Re: the importance of light [Re: Doc_T]
#10965134 - 08/30/09 08:39 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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right on man. its been a while since the birds and the bees so some times i need a refresher. ill look up hypae's pinning stratagy. i think its in your sig. thanks for the info. looks like i have more reading to do. by the way i love your avatar. boxy right. shes hot as hell.
Edited by the_gardener (08/30/09 08:42 AM)
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Doc_T
Random Dude




Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 42,395
Loc: Colorado
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Quote:
the_gardener said: i have more reading to do.
Good, that's right where you should be!
-------------------- You make it all possible. Doesn't it feel good?
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PNW FunGuy
Psilocybian



Registered: 10/23/08
Posts: 1,165
Last seen: 2 years, 3 months
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Re: the importance of light [Re: Doc_T]
#10965157 - 08/30/09 08:47 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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A) light good
B) get your turtle some veggies
C) grab string for cat
D) don't turn domestic animals into illegal cultivators
sorry, I'm in a weird state of mind
Peace!
-------------------- "The edge, there is no honest way to explain it, because the only ones who know where it is are the ones who have gone over." Dr. HST, the true king of fun - RIP
 
Federal Bureau of Keeping Juice
Special Agent Fun Guy.
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prismism



Registered: 05/11/09
Posts: 5,570
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Re: the importance of light [Re: Doc_T]
#10965162 - 08/30/09 08:50 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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my cat doesnt grow mushrooms. but she likes to eat them.
-------------------- ephemeral anomalous
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PNW FunGuy
Psilocybian



Registered: 10/23/08
Posts: 1,165
Last seen: 2 years, 3 months
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Re: the importance of light [Re: prismism]
#10965187 - 08/30/09 09:02 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Lol, I needed that, thanks prism 
Peace!
-------------------- "The edge, there is no honest way to explain it, because the only ones who know where it is are the ones who have gone over." Dr. HST, the true king of fun - RIP
 
Federal Bureau of Keeping Juice
Special Agent Fun Guy.
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the_gardener
Stranger


Registered: 05/14/09
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Last seen: 12 years, 13 days
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Re: the importance of light [Re: PNW FunGuy]
#10965208 - 08/30/09 09:10 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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who said anything about illegal mushrooms.
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SpamTek
Spam Tek



Registered: 06/17/09
Posts: 124
Loc: Minnesota
Last seen: 12 years, 6 months
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: :
-------------------- Man Made Booze
God Made Booms
Who Do You Trust?
"Any society that will give up a little liberty to gain a little security will desirve neither and loose both." -Benjamin Franklin
-Supporter of the MRPP(Marijuana Re-Legalization Policy Project)-
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RogerRabbit
Bans for Pleasure



Registered: 03/26/03
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Loc: Seattle
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According to the latest brochure from Paul Stamets, he says that scientists don't yet know the exact mechanism that mushrooms use to turn light into energy, but they're all in agreement that they do. A normal day/night schedule works far better than 24/7.
Light becomes a pinning trigger when there is full colonization of the substrate, high humidity, and a loss of moisture from the substrate due to fresh air exchange. Provide all of the pinning triggers and you'll see stellar results. Use light in the 5,000 Kelvin to 7,000 Kelvin range for best results. Bright light has proved far superior to dim light. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms
semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat
"I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison
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anonjon
Partially Right

Registered: 11/03/08
Posts: 6,322
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Re: the importance of light [Re: RogerRabbit]
#10965568 - 08/30/09 11:09 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
RogerRabbit said: A normal day/night schedule works far better than 24/7. RR
Works better specifically for pinning, fruitbody formation, sustaining vegetative growth, or all of the above? I suppose it's time my cat set up a timer, cuz he's too retarded to remember to switch the lights manually.
The mechanism by which they absorb light isn't known for certain, but there seems to be a lot of interest in melanin in this regard.
-------------------- The above post is fictional, hypothetical, or downright nonsensical.
Edited by anonjon (08/30/09 11:12 AM)
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anonjon
Partially Right

Registered: 11/03/08
Posts: 6,322
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Re: the importance of light [Re: Doc_T]
#10965593 - 08/30/09 11:16 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Doc_T said:Hold its hand, rub its feet. Nibble on the ears a bit. Hug it, pull it closer, tell it how you feel about it.
Some strains do better when you talk dirty to them.
-------------------- The above post is fictional, hypothetical, or downright nonsensical.
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OttoGenerated
Stranger

Registered: 02/23/09
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Re: the importance of light [Re: anonjon]
#10965596 - 08/30/09 11:17 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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So if I wanted to do an experiment, one monotub with light one without, all other variables controlled for. What effects should I expect on the tub that fruits in complete darkness?
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Doc_T
Random Dude




Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 42,395
Loc: Colorado
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Fewer fruits, uneven pinset. Uneven growth, sometimes in odd directions. Lower overall yield, and less spectacular individual shrooms. That's what I'd expect.
-------------------- You make it all possible. Doesn't it feel good?
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CJCollin37
Gentleman & Scholar


Registered: 08/10/09
Posts: 600
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
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Re: the importance of light [Re: Brennus]
#10965618 - 08/30/09 11:22 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Brennus said: Light in the 6500-6800k spectrum is necessary for healthy fruit formation. Without proper lighting, yields will suffer.
Really? 5500K won't cut it at all? I have a 5500K bulb, do you believe it wont be effective at all, or just less effective than the higher temp colors?
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RogerRabbit
Bans for Pleasure



Registered: 03/26/03
Posts: 42,214
Loc: Seattle
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Re: the importance of light [Re: CJCollin37]
#10965626 - 08/30/09 11:25 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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5,500 Kelvin will work fine. Once you get above 5,000K and below 7,500K, the difference is minimal. The important thing is not to use incandescent light bulbs, which at 3,000K are too 'red' to be of much use. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms
semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat
"I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison
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CJCollin37
Gentleman & Scholar


Registered: 08/10/09
Posts: 600
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
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Re: the importance of light [Re: RogerRabbit]
#10965676 - 08/30/09 11:36 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Sweeeet. Hey whats the deal with lights and lids and stuff. I mean, could one grow in a closet where the light is like 4 or 5 ft. above a container with a translucent, plastic lid? Plus, what if there's a translucent glass cover on the light? Would one lose color temp or important light waves in this situation, or anything like that?
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RogerRabbit
Bans for Pleasure



Registered: 03/26/03
Posts: 42,214
Loc: Seattle
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Re: the importance of light [Re: CJCollin37]
#10965858 - 08/30/09 12:15 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Here's a picture of the growing area in my underground mushroom farm, now complete. You're looking at ten shelves, each nearly 20 feet long and 3 feet wide. That's 400 watts of LED 6500K light rope stretched out over the 200 feet of shelving, for 2 watts of LED per linear foot of shelf. It's bright as daylight in there, although the picture really doesn't do it justice. There's room for 500 substrate blocks, and the temperature stays a steady 58F, even when it's 100F outside.
The rocks on the floor are for humidity, much as perlite serves that purpose in a terrarium. After spraying the rocks with water, humidity stays at near 99% for up to a week. I ran a water line to the farm and installed a faucet right in the growroom, so spraying the substrates and floor/walls will be easy. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms
semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat
"I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison
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Doc_T
Random Dude




Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 42,395
Loc: Colorado
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Re: the importance of light [Re: RogerRabbit]
#10965898 - 08/30/09 12:24 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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!!! That's quite a sight there.
So the LED's are working out for you, I take it? Do I remember that you are powering this off solar? Or wind, maybe?
-------------------- You make it all possible. Doesn't it feel good?
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Bugzy
Magician



Registered: 03/18/09
Posts: 436
Last seen: 11 years, 4 months
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Re: the importance of light [Re: RogerRabbit]
#10965994 - 08/30/09 12:41 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
RogerRabbit said: Here's a picture of the growing area in my underground mushroom farm, now complete. You're looking at ten shelves, each nearly 20 feet long and 3 feet wide. That's 400 watts of LED 6500K light rope stretched out over the 200 feet of shelving, for 2 watts of LED per linear foot of shelf. It's bright as daylight in there, although the picture really doesn't do it justice. There's room for 500 substrate blocks, and the temperature stays a steady 58F, even when it's 100F outside.
The rocks on the floor are for humidity, much as perlite serves that purpose in a terrarium. After spraying the rocks with water, humidity stays at near 99% for up to a week. I ran a water line to the farm and installed a faucet right in the growroom, so spraying the substrates and floor/walls will be easy. RR

Badass!!
-------------------- American by Nature.... unamerican by Law
"Out of all the things I've lost, I miss my mind the most."
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the_gardener
Stranger


Registered: 05/14/09
Posts: 25
Last seen: 12 years, 13 days
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Re: the importance of light [Re: RogerRabbit]
#10966278 - 08/30/09 01:35 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
RogerRabbit said: Here's a picture of the growing area in my underground mushroom farm, now complete. You're looking at ten shelves, each nearly 20 feet long and 3 feet wide. That's 400 watts of LED 6500K light rope stretched out over the 200 feet of shelving, for 2 watts of LED per linear foot of shelf. It's bright as daylight in there, although the picture really doesn't do it justice. There's room for 500 substrate blocks, and the temperature stays a steady 58F, even when it's 100F outside.
The rocks on the floor are for humidity, much as perlite serves that purpose in a terrarium. After spraying the rocks with water, humidity stays at near 99% for up to a week. I ran a water line to the farm and installed a faucet right in the growroom, so spraying the substrates and floor/walls will be easy. RR

WOW. that's just bad ass! you said that the mushies absorb light energy is there a limit to how much they can absorb? is there a point where it starts to become detrimental to the mushies?
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cloudsaregathering
pasturbater



Registered: 08/08/09
Posts: 1,283
Loc: ZZ9 Plural Z Alpha
Last seen: 10 months, 22 days
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is the 58F like mid ground temp for all the mushrooms I'm taking it there is more then 1 kind growing in there...
--------------------
"the root of the problem has been isolated"
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JBags31
Stranger


Registered: 08/19/09
Posts: 19
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
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How about the LED grow light panels? They are in the 460-470 nm Blue spectrum, is that ok to use with tubs?
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RogerRabbit
Bans for Pleasure



Registered: 03/26/03
Posts: 42,214
Loc: Seattle
Last seen: 1 year, 10 months
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Re: the importance of light [Re: JBags31]
#10969210 - 08/30/09 08:42 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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58F is the ground temperature in this area(and most areas) year 'round. With all that steel in ground contact, it keeps the air at that temp, which just happens to be best for shiitake, maitake and oysters, my three main cash crops.
More light is better than less light, provided it doesn't heat up and/or dry out your substrates. I found a few years ago that a few minutes of direct sunlight each day works wonders for stimulating massive pinsets and have been recommending such since then. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms
semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat
"I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison
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Cloneufc
Master Exploder!



Registered: 11/15/07
Posts: 1,237
Loc: Las Vegas
Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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Re: the importance of light [Re: RogerRabbit]
#10982451 - 09/01/09 08:32 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Thats a really nice setup! I just hope your LED lights dont discolor and change the light spectrum. They are known to discolor over time.
I have seen some really neat solar powered LED light rope that lasts over 9 hours per day. Would be of great use to someone who doesnt have a power supply nearby.
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RogerRabbit
Bans for Pleasure



Registered: 03/26/03
Posts: 42,214
Loc: Seattle
Last seen: 1 year, 10 months
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Re: the importance of light [Re: Cloneufc]
#10983231 - 09/01/09 10:35 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Up until this summer, all I had was solar panels. The co-op finally ran power lines up here as part of the economic stimulus package so I actually have utility power now. I originally ordered all LED so I could run them on solar. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms
semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat
"I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison
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anonjon
Partially Right

Registered: 11/03/08
Posts: 6,322
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Re: the importance of light [Re: RogerRabbit]
#10986084 - 09/02/09 11:53 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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On the subject of light, will adding an additional light in the yellow spectrum to help w/ photography have any kind of negative interference on the daylight spectrum bulbs? I don't like how blue the photos turn out in the growing area and want to add a bulb in the 3500 range.
-------------------- The above post is fictional, hypothetical, or downright nonsensical.
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Cloneufc
Master Exploder!



Registered: 11/15/07
Posts: 1,237
Loc: Las Vegas
Last seen: 1 year, 5 months
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Re: the importance of light [Re: anonjon]
#10986689 - 09/02/09 01:39 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Just add a growlight in addition to the blue light. It uses all colors of the spectrum, just like the sun. I figure since mushrooms have been using the sun forever, why not imitate it?
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Doc_T
Random Dude




Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 42,395
Loc: Colorado
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Re: the importance of light [Re: anonjon]
#10986737 - 09/02/09 01:47 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
anonjon said: On the subject of light, will adding an additional light in the yellow spectrum to help w/ photography have any kind of negative interference on the daylight spectrum bulbs? I don't like how blue the photos turn out in the growing area and want to add a bulb in the 3500 range.
The mushrooms will pretty much ignore light that isn't in their range.
-------------------- You make it all possible. Doesn't it feel good?
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Newpala21
1st time farmer



Registered: 10/16/08
Posts: 371
Last seen: 15 years, 3 months
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Re: the importance of light [Re: RogerRabbit]
#10992806 - 09/03/09 02:16 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
RogerRabbit said: Here's a picture of the growing area in my underground mushroom farm, now complete. You're looking at ten shelves, each nearly 20 feet long and 3 feet wide. That's 400 watts of LED 6500K light rope stretched out over the 200 feet of shelving, for 2 watts of LED per linear foot of shelf. It's bright as daylight in there, although the picture really doesn't do it justice. There's room for 500 substrate blocks, and the temperature stays a steady 58F, even when it's 100F outside.
The rocks on the floor are for humidity, much as perlite serves that purpose in a terrarium. After spraying the rocks with water, humidity stays at near 99% for up to a week. I ran a water line to the farm and installed a faucet right in the growroom, so spraying the substrates and floor/walls will be easy. RR

HOLY SHIT MY MAN!!!!!!! U R MY FUCKIN HERO RR. now that is fuckin impressive, is that in ur basement or a old school bomb shelter or did u dig tht bad boy urself? how ever u did it u just gave me some inspiration
--------------------
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RogerRabbit
Bans for Pleasure



Registered: 03/26/03
Posts: 42,214
Loc: Seattle
Last seen: 1 year, 10 months
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Re: the importance of light [Re: Newpala21]
#10998075 - 09/04/09 10:27 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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It started life as a shipping container. I hired an excavation contractor to deliver it and dig the hole as you'll see in the pictures below. After that, the Mrs and I have done all the work to get it to that point. I'll post more pics as time goes on. We're finishing up the colonization area and new lab now. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms
semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat
"I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison
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telekid
very gnar

Registered: 01/24/09
Posts: 342
Last seen: 11 years, 10 months
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Re: the importance of light [Re: RogerRabbit]
#10998103 - 09/04/09 10:33 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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now that's a dream come true. makes a feller wanna go buy some land.
--------------------
my easy lids
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anonjon
Partially Right

Registered: 11/03/08
Posts: 6,322
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Re: the importance of light [Re: telekid]
#10998188 - 09/04/09 10:54 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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That is truly wonderful. Congrats!
I hear one can get those used shipping containers fairly cheap due to the trade imbalance with china. How much was it if you don't mind my asking?
-------------------- The above post is fictional, hypothetical, or downright nonsensical.
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BrandNewbie
Captain



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Re: the importance of light [Re: anonjon]
#10998292 - 09/04/09 11:19 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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-------------------- Question: Why do women wear make-up and perfume?
Answer: Because they're ugly and they stink.
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Newpala21
1st time farmer



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Re: the importance of light [Re: RogerRabbit]
#10998300 - 09/04/09 11:21 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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gotta say that just makes me wanna get into the mushroom biz even more. boy ole boy u could definitely supply a small county with that bad boy right there. So u gonna use that for happy or sappy mushies?
Also i see two tubes from what it looks like in the back of the container in the fourth pic, ones white the other is blk. was wondering if thats your ventilation system? If not how do u regulate your air movement / flow, ya know, the fae?
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RogerRabbit
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Re: the importance of light [Re: Newpala21]
#10998558 - 09/04/09 12:10 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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The pipes you see are the air vents. Each was extended 10 feet(3 meters) upwards and out of the soil above.
It's for edibles only. I paid $1500 for the shipping container, and have spent a bit over $30,000 since then to get it buried, supported, shelved, and lit so far. I'm almost done. I suspect the whole operation is going to cost somewhere around $40K by the time I've finished. However, it should grow twice that much in mushrooms per year, for a six month payoff, which is a darn fast return on the investment. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms
semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat
"I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison
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Newpala21
1st time farmer



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Re: the importance of light [Re: RogerRabbit]
#10999034 - 09/04/09 01:40 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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wow did not know that there was that much profit to b made in edibles. So then u supply local grocers or food chains, i mean thats gonna b alot of mushies in that bad boy u must b moving them quick...
Seriously i like the hole cultivating aspect of mushies and other fungi, its my favorite hobby and im curious as to how one goes about getting into ur field of business. I only ask cuz i could so do this for a job, i enjoy it. anyways sorry if im getting to personal in ur bizz but u really got a way of making me want to learn more.
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SubGen1us


Registered: 11/26/02
Posts: 3,427
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Re: the importance of light *DELETED* [Re: anonjon]
#10999652 - 09/04/09 03:48 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Post deleted by SubGen1us
Reason for deletion: .
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RogerRabbit
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Re: the importance of light [Re: Newpala21]
#10999679 - 09/04/09 03:54 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Wholesale prices of edibles are about half what they cost in the grocery store. In Seattle, shiitake run about $17/lb so I'll be getting $8/lb. The fruiting room is laid out to hold 500 substrate blocks, each one producing 1 to 3 lbs over a three week cropping period. The colonization room is designed to hold 1500 substrate blocks, since they need three times as long in there. The end result should be anywhere from 100 to 300 lbs per week going to market, which is not bad for a total of 320 square feet of area. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms
semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat
"I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison
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ferrel_human
stone eater



Registered: 06/26/09
Posts: 17,211
Loc: South texas
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Re: the importance of light [Re: RogerRabbit]
#10999704 - 09/04/09 04:01 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
RogerRabbit said: It started life as a shipping container. I hired an excavation contractor to deliver it and dig the hole as you'll see in the pictures below. After that, the Mrs and I have done all the work to get it to that point. I'll post more pics as time goes on. We're finishing up the colonization area and new lab now. RR

well you my friend are definately a fungi fun guy. no pun intended but well taken. +5 for you RR.
-------------------- Nature is my church and walking through it is gospel. It tells no lies and reveals all to those who look, and listen, closely.
-Karode
 
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anonjon
Partially Right

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Re: the importance of light [Re: SubGen1us]
#10999772 - 09/04/09 04:20 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
SubGen1us said: I'd like to see a reference to the melanin statement you posted. I have no idea how that would work but it would be cool to read about.
Honestly, I have no idea if this even relates to cubes or whatever. I just thought I would share.

It relates if you're growing outdoors i suppose. But generally no. Photosynthesis has nothing to do with it.
Here's some melanin links: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radiotrophic_fungus http://www.technologyreview.com/blog/duncan/17611/
eh..just google it actually http://www.google.com/search?source=ig&hl=en&rlz=1G1GGLQ_ENUS259&=&q=fungi+melanin+light+energy&aq=f&oq=&aqi=
-------------------- The above post is fictional, hypothetical, or downright nonsensical.
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Newpala21
1st time farmer



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Re: the importance of light [Re: RogerRabbit]
#10999780 - 09/04/09 04:22 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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So what are your plans for the winter, as i can see u live in the mountains and you get quite a bit of snow up there and im sure it gets cold as hell some nights. Whats ur plan for the bad boy( u should name it that,lol)on keeping the temp suitable for growing conditions, curious to see what genius idea u got for this... im so digging a whole in my yard and doing something like that, then i can b more discreet.
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RogerRabbit
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Re: the importance of light [Re: Newpala21]
#11001168 - 09/04/09 08:28 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Newpala21 said: So what are your plans for the winter, as i can see u live in the mountains and you get quite a bit of snow up there and im sure it gets cold as hell some nights.
The temperature in the growing area stays a constant 58F, regardless of outdoor temp. On the few 25F nights we've had so far, the growroom remained at 58F, and on the few 100F days we had during the summer, it stayed at 58F. The colonization room is insulated to R40, not counting the dirt it's buried in, so with the heat from the substrates, I'm sure I won't even need to provide supplemental heat. In fact, I'll probably have the window cracked a bit all winter to keep it from getting too warm with 1500 substrate blocks inside. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms
semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat
"I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison
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Doc_T
Random Dude




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Re: the importance of light [Re: RogerRabbit]
#11001217 - 09/04/09 08:36 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
RogerRabbit said: In fact, I'll probably have the window cracked a bit all winter to keep it from getting too warm with 1500 substrate blocks inside. RR
You need to harness that for heating your house. Maybe not this year, but... soon.
-------------------- You make it all possible. Doesn't it feel good?
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RogerRabbit
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Re: the importance of light [Re: Doc_T]
#11001254 - 09/04/09 08:42 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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It's too far away. Besides, we have a wood stove and all the free firewood we can use right here, so we get free heat. I like to keep it nice and cozy inside, and there's nothing like sitting in front of a warm fire and watching it snow. After all the hard work this summer, I can't wait. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms
semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat
"I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison
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danielx
whatup!


Registered: 10/13/08
Posts: 6,500
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Re: the importance of light [Re: RogerRabbit]
#11002432 - 09/05/09 01:04 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
RogerRabbit said:

So for fae in the container, do you just have one vent sucking in and one vent sucking out? Or do you use passive venting?
How high is that rock layer on the ground?
You don't have problems with mold growing everywhere with that kind of humidity in there?
very nice setup.
-------------------- Long live kratom
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Cloneufc
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Re: the importance of light [Re: danielx]
#11002856 - 09/05/09 03:51 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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A shipping company a few years ago in my area went out of business and they were selling cargo containers for $500 each. Makes me wish I would have bought one.
When I saw those pics it gave me flashbacks of a bunch of crazy,cul,nudiest people that live in the mountains. They bury cargo containers and small trailers in the sides of mountains and live in them.
For growing mushrooms that looks like the way to go. I didnt realize how expensive it is. Labor is pricey. I thought for the price you could build a concrete style World War II bunker.
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RogerRabbit
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Re: the importance of light [Re: danielx]
#11003541 - 09/05/09 09:59 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
danielx said:
Quote:
RogerRabbit said:

So for fae in the container, do you just have one vent sucking in and one vent sucking out? Or do you use passive venting?
How high is that rock layer on the ground?
You don't have problems with mold growing everywhere with that kind of humidity in there?
very nice setup. 
The black pipe heats up in the sun and creates a lower pressure area which draws air up and out. The white pipe creates a higher pressure area and feeds the container with fresh air.
The rocks are 3" to 4" thick, with a sloped concrete floor with drains at the low spot below the rocks.
No mold at all. There's nothing for it to grow on.
Below is a shot just before it was covered up. The tarps and plastic are moisture barriers, and the black and white passive ventilation pipes are visible at the far end. After burial, they were each extended up another 10feet, to place them six feet above finished grade. The back end of the unit is now under almost 10 feet of soil. That's why the temperature stays a steady 58F, which is perfect for fall fruiting cold weather edibles and medicinals. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms
semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat
"I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison
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Newpala21
1st time farmer



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Re: the importance of light [Re: RogerRabbit]
#11003774 - 09/05/09 11:06 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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so u got no fans or any blower/sucker, it gets Fae due to the pressure of heat rising and cold air sinking,is what ur sayin, just so we all understand how thats workin. well u certainly thought this out very well, what sparked that idea for ya? I got a quick question for ya RR, have u ever heard of skinning the top layer off after u pic a flush. this is pertaining to a 18gal mono using wbs,h-poo, and straw. my guy grows aswell but he said that he skins off the top layer so that the mycelium can recharge/regrow and produce more pins. i never read or heard that anywere before and i figured u should know since you are the Yoda of this great hobby. Sorry off topic just wondering what ur opinion was.
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Shroom Queen
ProNoob


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I heard that mushrooms don't need any light is this true?
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Newpala21
1st time farmer



Registered: 10/16/08
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Quote:
Shroom Queen said: I heard that mushrooms don't need any light is this true?
not so much that they dont need any light but they need alittle light with fae to get a good pin set goin. ive read that the light is what gets the pins goin but then other ppl say its the fae itself that does it. id say 2hr min of sun and they should do just fine. I turn my light on at 7am and off about 7pm, so its a matter of what works for u thats all.
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RogerRabbit
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Re: the importance of light [Re: Newpala21]
#11004204 - 09/05/09 12:56 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Correct, no fans or blowers. The FAE is natural and based on the fact that if there is a temperature or pressure differential between two air masses, there will be flow between them. This also happens to be the exact same engineering principal that makes the shotgun terrarium perform so well.
The large surface area in contact with the earth also negates the need for any heat or AC. So far, I've observed the grow room over a 80F temperature swing(It's been as hot as 105F outside and as cool so far as 25F) and the internal temp has not even varied by 1 degree. It stays at 58F. I have no reason to suspect that this winter when it's -30, it will change from that same 58F, which is ground temperature at that depth.
Don't cut the top layer of substrate off after a flush.
Light is required not only for pinning, but for proper mushroom development as well. Mushroom mycelium derives energy from light. Mushrooms grown without sufficient lighting are weak, thin and have little weight compared to mushrooms grown with proper lighting. That's why I have over 400 watts of 6500 Kelvin LED lighting in my grow room. It's as bright as daylight in there, and the walls are painted bright white to reflect the light around the room. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms
semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat
"I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison
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Newpala21
1st time farmer



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Re: the importance of light [Re: RogerRabbit]
#11004351 - 09/05/09 01:35 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
RogerRabbit said: Correct, no fans or blowers. The FAE is natural and based on the fact that if there is a temperature or pressure differential between two air masses, there will be flow between them. This also happens to be the exact same engineering principal that makes the shotgun terrarium perform so well.
The large surface area in contact with the earth also negates the need for any heat or AC. So far, I've observed the grow room over a 80F temperature swing(It's been as hot as 105F outside and as cool so far as 25F) and the internal temp has not even varied by 1 degree. It stays at 58F. I have no reason to suspect that this winter when it's -30, it will change from that same 58F, which is ground temperature at that depth.
Don't cut the top layer of substrate off after a flush.
Light is required not only for pinning, but for proper mushroom development as well. Mushroom mycelium derives energy from light. Mushrooms grown without sufficient lighting are weak, thin and have little weight compared to mushrooms grown with proper lighting. That's why I have over 400 watts of 6500 Kelvin LED lighting in my grow room. It's as bright as daylight in there, and the walls are painted bright white to reflect the light around the room. RR
ok so dont cut the top layer off, can i ask why i shouldnt do this, could it get inffected if so? ive noticed that my mycelium turns slightly grey,its not contamination, im not sure if this is due to spores falling or is it possible for the mycelium to die/stall? if so what can b done to prevent this? Has anyone ever had condensation build up on top of their mycelium to were u can see beads of water allover the top. I think this is causing my fruits to grow hollow and thin, but im just not sure.. RR, you said that ur using 6500 kelvin led lighting. my question, ive been using this light bulb, its a n:vision mini spiral lamp fluorescent bulb 120v-19watt 5500k and it says daylight on it for kind of light produced, is this one ok or is there another one i should b using. only askin cuz u said that improper lighting can cause thin and hollow fruits and im wondering if this could b the reason.
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RogerRabbit
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Re: the importance of light [Re: Newpala21]
#11005212 - 09/05/09 04:45 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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5500 K is fine. If you buy another one in the future, 6500 K is a bit better, but don't toss out your 5.5K CFL.
Condensation on top of a bulk substrate is normal. It doesn't cause hollow stems. The most likely cause of that is growing at high temperature. Hollow stems are a sign of very rapid growth, and higher temps can stimulate rapid growth. Fruit quality is better if you'll grow at normal room temp.
It's best not to disturb your bulk substrate. There's nothing to be gained by cutting away part of it. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms
semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat
"I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison
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Newpala21
1st time farmer



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Re: the importance of light [Re: RogerRabbit]
#11005849 - 09/05/09 07:58 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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ok thanks for ur info and responses.. my grow room is normally around 76-80f, it varies cause of the summer heat. although i did notice that my mushies grew alot nicer in the winter by me, was alot easier to regulate my room temp, my house is an older one and i dont think its insulated very well cause its always hotter up stairs by like 10degrees, even when i got the ac going its frezzeing down stairs and much warmer up stairs so i cant wait till winter to c how they grow. If thats the case i think i gotta work on insulating my attic better,and hopefully that works for next summer.
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Newpala21
1st time farmer



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Re: the importance of light [Re: Newpala21]
#11017274 - 09/07/09 09:27 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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So is it necessary to have the light on top of the mono or could u place it on the side if u didnt want to put the plexiglass in. I got two bins stacked and i have a 20 inch bulb just propped up/standing up on the side of them, think this should b fine or should i spend the cash and get the plexiglass.
Also is there another way to install the plexiglass on the lid without using gorilla tape. i have been noticing that some times there is green mold growing around the edges of the tape and on the lid were the two meet on the inside and i have to go and strip it off and clean it real good and re-tape it but i find i gotta do this after about 2 uses (full cycles)and that damn tape aint cheap. Anybody got a different way or use something different to secure the p-glass?
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RogerRabbit
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Re: the importance of light [Re: Newpala21]
#11017466 - 09/07/09 10:03 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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You don't need to tape or otherwise secure the plexiglass. Just lay it up there. Light from the sides is fine. It doesn't need to come from the top. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms
semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat
"I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison
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datdude2k9
Stranger
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Re: the importance of light [Re: RogerRabbit]
#11017771 - 09/07/09 10:48 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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i got a standard cfl that says 60 on it would that be sufficient light? or would putting it in sunlight be a better option?
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RogerRabbit
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Re: the importance of light [Re: datdude2k9]
#11018136 - 09/07/09 11:57 PM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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It's probably a 15 watt CFL. More important than that is the color temperature. If it's a 'warm white' it won't do much good. Look for a CFL that says 'cool white' or 'daylight'. If it has a K rating, look for around 6500 Kelvin. Put the light as close to the terrarium as you can get it without causing heat buildup.
Sunlight is always better, but avoid more than a few minutes per day of direct sunlight. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms
semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat
"I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
Thomas Edison
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Grizzdude
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Re: the importance of light [Re: RogerRabbit]
#11018241 - 09/08/09 12:12 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
RogerRabbit said:
Sunlight is always better, but avoid more than a few minutes per day of direct sunlight. RR
So do you advise a couple minutes of direct sunlight a day? I was going to use indirect sunlight for my terrarium.
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GhettoChild
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Re: the importance of light [Re: Grizzdude]
#11018634 - 09/08/09 01:16 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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Are grow lights fine?
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datdude2k9
Stranger
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Re: the importance of light [Re: RogerRabbit]
#11018725 - 09/08/09 01:32 AM (15 years, 4 months ago) |
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what about indirect sunlight?
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