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upupup
guardian

Registered: 08/25/01
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Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA
#1088785 - 11/26/02 08:27 PM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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In a future life I am having a hard time getting Rhizomorphic growth to happen out of my Multi Spore Innoculations onto MEA from Myco Supply. My psycic tells me that I am only seeing that Intermediate linear type. The crystal ball says I tried it with spores from a syringe and from print scrapings.
I think at some point I may wonder if the strain has anything to do with it? Psilo. Cambo's. Being new to the whole clarivoyant idea and to a future of MEA I wonder what I might do to encourage rhyzo growth?
How many transfers might I have to do to get to the point of that pic on the cover of TMC? Should I use peroxided MEA or just straight MEA in the future?
-------------------- Support bacteria - they're the only culture some people have.
Edited by upupup (11/26/02 09:03 PM)
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Joshua
Holoman


Registered: 10/27/98
Posts: 5,398
Loc: The Matrix
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: upupup]
#1088881 - 11/26/02 08:56 PM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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After one to two transfers you should start seeing rhizomorphic growth. I am using MEA, I have some strains that grew rhizos on the first isolation, others took two isolations.
Joshua
-------------------- The Shroomery Bookstore Great books for inquiring minds! "Life After Death is Saprophytic!"
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On_the_Down-Low
Polyfil-ophile-Say it 3 timesfast.

Registered: 10/15/02
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: Joshua]
#1089215 - 11/26/02 10:21 PM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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Dumb question #116: Is there a connection between the agar and the lack of rhizomorphic growth? I thought it would be like the jars, some good rhizome growth and some not as good. No?
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upupup
guardian

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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: On_the_Down-Low]
#1090578 - 11/27/02 09:08 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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Wondering that same question especially after reading in TMC where they talk about the different agar recipies and them having favorites, the one out of the three they mentioned as NOT being a favorite was MEA. THey also mentioned that rye flour added to the agar helped with rhizo growth.
Anybody try this?
-------------------- Support bacteria - they're the only culture some people have.
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Champion des Champignons
long standing member;)

Registered: 07/26/00
Posts: 2,680
Loc: Alba
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: upupup]
#1091868 - 11/27/02 06:36 PM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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I find that the addition of a bit of yeast helps produce more rhizomorphic mycelium. But if transferring a linear isolation to MYA makes it more rhizomorphic it won't change the fruiting characteristics of the isolation....
-------------------- --------------------------------------------------- hmmm........
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upupup
guardian

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I really want to be smart...really, but what the hell did you say?
If I got that right your saying I might fidget with the "conditions" but it won't matter if the stuff dosen't have the umph to begin with?
-------------------- Support bacteria - they're the only culture some people have.
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Champion des Champignons
long standing member;)

Registered: 07/26/00
Posts: 2,680
Loc: Alba
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: upupup]
#1092924 - 11/28/02 12:41 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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what I was getting at is.... well, I mostly deal with clones on agar, rather than mutispores y'see. In my experience a cloned culture produces more rhizomorphic mycelium on MYA than MEA. If you were to isolate a pure linear culture from a multispore inoc. which didn't produce rhizomorphic mycelium on MEA and then transferred it to MYA where it suddenly did, this wouldn't indicate any change in the genetics of the isolation, ie it would fruit the same whether or not it was growing rhizomorphically on agar or not...kinda thing
>If I got that right your saying I might fidget with the "conditions" but it won't matter if the stuff dosen't have the umph to begin with? yes, if you change the agar formulation to improve the growth pattern of a PURE isolation, it won't make any difference in the final outcome, assuming all other conditions remain the same.
-------------------- --------------------------------------------------- hmmm........
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stonErollEr1
The Psilocybinsolution
Registered: 05/23/01
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But he was talking about multispore right? In my experience MEA does not produce rhizo?s untill the 2:nd or 3:rd transfer..but if i put it on PDYA[yeast] it actually produces rhizo?s right away on multispore innoculation.. So my conclution is that yeast do stimulate rhizo growth and PDYA is my favorite agar recipe..since i usually can do an pretty clean isolation in 2-3 transfers.[without sectoring.]
that?s my 2cents..
peace...
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zeta
Stranger

Registered: 05/24/02
Posts: 3,972
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: stonErollEr1]
#1092955 - 11/28/02 12:58 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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How much yeast are you people using?
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Anno
Experimenter



Registered: 06/17/99
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: stonErollEr1]
#1092957 - 11/28/02 12:59 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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>So my conclution is that yeast do stimulate rhizo growth and PDYA is my favorite agar recipe
Mine too.
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cujo7999
Space Monkey

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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: upupup]
#1092993 - 11/28/02 01:14 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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so what are all of the types of growth? i would just look for the biggest thickest quickest strands, right? but i understand that there are some names for the different types of growth, could i get a descriptions and names?
and if i were to do agar and powdered ...whatever theyed be growing on...Like dried and powdered grain, dung, or rice. then cook it with just agar. does this produce resonable growth and is it worth the effort to get substrate specific genetics isolated?
-------------------- *This is all Fiction by the Way*
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stonErollEr1
The Psilocybinsolution
Registered: 05/23/01
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: zeta]
#1093005 - 11/28/02 01:22 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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1g potato-powder [instant mashed potato-powder.Do you have that in the US?] 1g dextrose 2g Agar agar 0.2-0.4g dried yest
per 100ml H2o
Works great for me... But everybody got their own favourite recipe..
pecae...
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Roadkill
Retired Shroomery Mod


Registered: 12/11/01
Posts: 22,674
Loc: Montana
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: Anno]
#1093195 - 11/28/02 02:54 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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I like the PDYA the best too
5 grams instant potato's "Betty Crocker Potato Buds" 9 grams agar 7 grams of pure honey 1 gram of nutritional yeast mini flake 500 ml of purified water
-------------------- Laterz, Road Who the hell you callin crazy? You wouldn't know what crazy was if Charles Manson was eating froot loops on your front porch! Brainiac said: PM the names with on there names, that means they have mushrooms for sale.
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Skikid16
fungus fan

Registered: 06/27/02
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: Roadkill]
#1093245 - 11/28/02 03:45 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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In reply to:
7 grams of pure honey
This may sound stupid, but how does one go about measuring 7g of pure honey?
-------------------- Re-Defeat Bush in '04
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Anno
Experimenter



Registered: 06/17/99
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: Skikid16]
#1093260 - 11/28/02 04:27 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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Weighing?
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Skikid16
fungus fan

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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: Anno]
#1093262 - 11/28/02 04:31 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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So I just weigh it out? Damn I swear I'm retarded sometimes.
-------------------- Re-Defeat Bush in '04
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upupup
guardian

Registered: 08/25/01
Posts: 889
Loc: George "I love Hitler" Bu...
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: Skikid16]
#1093500 - 11/28/02 10:34 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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Wow, great posts kids...
This helps immeasurably....lovin ya'll....
-------------------- Support bacteria - they're the only culture some people have.
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On_the_Down-Low
Polyfil-ophile-Say it 3 timesfast.

Registered: 10/15/02
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: Anno]
#1095394 - 11/29/02 01:45 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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The armadillo was using the PDYA. But hasn't seen anything rhizomy in the first 7 days or so. There is some growth, but it can be hard to see it thru the 1/2 pint jars. He had noticed that some strains would pop out rhizomes that looked like a freaking forest of sea anemones on rye, but only produced cottony fluff on birdseed.
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Alkaloids
3,4,5-trimethoxyphenethylamine


Registered: 11/15/98
Posts: 743
Loc: pubis mons
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: Skikid16]
#1095412 - 11/29/02 02:01 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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don't worry.. the obvious can escape the best of us sometimes. *chuckle*
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On_the_Down-Low
Polyfil-ophile-Say it 3 timesfast.

Registered: 10/15/02
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: Skikid16]
#1095435 - 11/29/02 02:20 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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With water, 1 g = 1 ml.
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stonErollEr1
The Psilocybinsolution
Registered: 05/23/01
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: On_the_Down-Low]
#1095640 - 11/29/02 08:42 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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7days is a little to short time to see rhizo?s... Patience...!!!
peace...
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upupup
guardian

Registered: 08/25/01
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Loc: George "I love Hitler" Bu...
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: Roadkill]
#1095658 - 11/29/02 08:59 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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Those amounts are to pour how many dishes?
-------------------- Support bacteria - they're the only culture some people have.
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stonErollEr1
The Psilocybinsolution
Registered: 05/23/01
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: upupup]
#1095865 - 11/29/02 11:03 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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Depends on how much you pour in each petri..and the size of it. For standard size approx. ~25ml to each disk..
peace...
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upupup
guardian

Registered: 08/25/01
Posts: 889
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: stonErollEr1]
#1098113 - 11/30/02 09:56 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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Checked out some instant spuds the other day...Idahoan....they had a bunch of other stuff in them...preservatives and what not.....
Are those cool or do the contents need to be just 100% spuds...?
-------------------- Support bacteria - they're the only culture some people have.
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stonErollEr1
The Psilocybinsolution
Registered: 05/23/01
Posts: 666
Last seen: 13 years, 10 months
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: upupup]
#1100376 - 12/01/02 03:30 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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They?re probably allright..
Peace...
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On_the_Down-Low
Polyfil-ophile-Say it 3 timesfast.

Registered: 10/15/02
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: upupup]
#1101483 - 12/01/02 05:23 PM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
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Try to go organic if possible. Where did/would you get BRF?
What if the armadillo took a nice clump of rhizomes from a a jar of grain,and then grew it out on agar? If he didn't do it from grain, just from other agar, how would he chose the speciman for the 2nd stage grow out on agar?
Petris seem a lot better then 1/2pints at this point.
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stonErollEr1
The Psilocybinsolution
Registered: 05/23/01
Posts: 666
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: On_the_Down-Low]
#1103772 - 12/02/02 11:36 AM (21 years, 1 month ago) |
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Petris is the way to go..?pints is way to clumpsy to work with. Specimen? Do you plan on fruiting straight from the agar and then clone the first shroom that appears? or do you mean, what part of the mycelium to choose? If the later..take the healthiest looking part..or if you spot rhizo?s..its just selective growing..so goahead and select what part you want..[it all depends on what charisteristics[sp?] you are looking for.] And then isloate it so you get an "isloated" pure culture..[without sectoring]
peace...
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On_the_Down-Low
Polyfil-ophile-Say it 3 timesfast.

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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: stonErollEr1]
#1104194 - 12/02/02 02:07 PM (21 years, 1 month ago) |
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Is there any difference if the first mycelium comes from grain or from agar,when you do the second transfer to agar?
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Alkaloids
3,4,5-trimethoxyphenethylamine


Registered: 11/15/98
Posts: 743
Loc: pubis mons
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: On_the_Down-Low]
#1105778 - 12/02/02 10:39 PM (21 years, 1 month ago) |
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The source of the mycelium shouldn't matter in this case, but I would suggest using peroxidated agar to help keep your mycelium uncontaminated. and oh so pearly white. *ha ha* Actually if you get some nice rhizomorphic growth from the grain that might even give your selection process a head start.
--------------------
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upupup
guardian

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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: Alkaloids]
#1107612 - 12/03/02 03:39 PM (21 years, 1 month ago) |
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I wondered about that and thought someone asked that question already somewhere but I have been doing way too much research....
How bout it? Is that Kosher? Taking rhyzo growth out of a grain jar and transfering it to the agar and going off of that?
-------------------- Support bacteria - they're the only culture some people have.
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On_the_Down-Low
Polyfil-ophile-Say it 3 timesfast.

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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: upupup]
#1110312 - 12/04/02 02:58 PM (21 years, 1 month ago) |
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I hope so. The dillo said some of the rye grain jars were very rhizomorphic,but the agar is no where near as nice looking. So what's the advantage of agar again? Was the difference due to that strains preference forrye?or some other reason?
Edited by On_the_Down-Low (12/04/02 09:35 PM)
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upupup
guardian

Registered: 08/25/01
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: On_the_Down-Low]
#1111158 - 12/04/02 07:09 PM (21 years, 1 month ago) |
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Supposedly because you get a strain that is ryhzomorphic thus more prone to fruiting as ryhzomorphic growth is related to pinning, but is also seems that you have to test the new strain out becuase it may not have the same charecteristics as the original parents ie the shroom you took the print from....if i got that right....
-------------------- Support bacteria - they're the only culture some people have.
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stonErollEr1
The Psilocybinsolution
Registered: 05/23/01
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Re: Problems getting Rhizo growth from MEA [Re: upupup]
#1112819 - 12/05/02 06:44 AM (21 years, 1 month ago) |
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Exactly...since there is somewhat diffent geneticts due to the multispore innoc.. A clone has the same genetics as the cloned mushroom though.
peace...
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