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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > Mushroom Cultivation
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spawning rye to bulk coir * 1
    #10791083 -

this is going to be my first spawn to bulk experiment as well as my first time using rye. im using a 3 lb rye grain bag and pes hawaiian spores. the plan is to spawn to coir and then case with 50/50  at 100%. i was wondering if my plan sounded good tho.

i was thinking of spawning the 3lb of rye into 3 seperate trays each consisting of an extra 2 lbs of pasteurized coco coir (per tray). so a 1:2 spawn ratio.  so 3 trays each consisting of 1 lb of spawn and 2 lbs of coir.

then ill let those colonize to 100% and case with pasteurized 50/50.

does this sound solid? i really dont wanna hear the OH USE POO COIR SUZXXXXXX and all that bullshit because if u search through the threads on here with spawning to bulk coir the fruits are just as magical and abundant.

does this whole deal seem on point? also ive seen people pasteurizing by boiling water and then dumping into a bucket with the bulk sub in it. does this work jsut as well as doing it straight on the stove? it just seems like this would be easier for me to perform.

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Re: spawning rye to bulk coir [Re: nexiusus] * 1
    #10791106 -

:thumbup:

Sounds like a plan.  You have a good ratio too... 1:2 spawn to bulk should suit you well.  It will colonize relatively fast.  I used a 1:1 in my recent monotub, but I kinda wish I would have utilized more bulk.  Oh well.

Anyway, as far as pasteurization goes, I found it easiest to just dump all of my coir, worm castings, compost, verm, gypsum, and coffee grounds into a large sea food pot.  I then added enough water to reach field capacity.  I didn't have to add as much water as some people, because my coir was already loosened and at field capacity; I just had to add more water for the verm, castings, etc.

After putting everything into your pot turn the stove on and stir.  Keep stirring for a while.  Pop a meat thermometer into the substrate and test the temp.  It will work its way up to 160 F.  Once it does, take the pot off the stove and stir some more.  Put it back on and check the temp.  If it has gone down, leave it on for a bit until it reaches 160 F again.  Basically, keep stirring and heating until the substrate stabilizes at 160 F.  Once you do that, take the pot off the stove and store it somewhere clean for usage within the next 6-8 hours.  Substrates keep their heat very well.  It should stay within the 160 F range for at least an additional hour once you take it off the stove.

ETA:  Coir is a great substrate.  But I think you should consider adding some other amendments like coffee grounds, vermiculite, and gypsum.  You may even want to consider adding some compost if you have it or some worm castings.  These amendments will make your substrate that much more productive. A substrate full of diverse nutrients is favorable over substrates that only utilize one or two sources of nutrients.   

Edited by M11 (08/03/09 09:29 AM)

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Re: spawning rye to bulk coir [Re: M11] * 1
    #10791256 -

cool thanks for the help. how many 12 quart sweater boxes can i make from a 3lb rye bag with a 1:2 coir ratio. i would think i could easily make 4 of those but could i make more probably? say with like 4 inch thickness.

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Re: spawning rye to bulk coir [Re: nexiusus] * 1
    #10791289 -

Well, if you used 1 quart of rye to 2 quarts of substrate, you would fill the boxes 25%.  What are the dimensions of the boxes?  You want your substrate to be about 3-4" deep or so.

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Re: spawning rye to bulk coir [Re: M11] * 1
    #10794871 -

the boxes are 17"x11"x5". i want to spawn a quart per box to pasteurized coir like in oatmans spawning to coir tek. he states in the tek that a brick of coir fills 2 trays to about 3 to 4 inches thick. so whatever half of a coir brick at 3-4 inches of sub plus the quart of spawn.

im curious as to how many quarts would be made from a 3lb colonized rye spawn bag. ive read several answers that say about 2.5 quart jars 1/2 filled from a single pound of rye, and about 1.75 quart jars 3/4 full per single pound of rye. so figure that might be about 5 quarts total so 5 total trays.

so definitely pasteurize the coir. spawn the rye to each tray. should i mix the spawn in with bulk sub and then cover or should i mix it and then add another light layer of spawn over the top to protect against contaminants? cover it with foil and make a few hole with micropore over them. let colonize to 100% then case with pasteurized 50/50+.

i figure he got 350 grams dry from the first flush of 6 trays (8 were made but 2 were lost to contaminants) so I'm really hoping to blow every grow ive ever done out of the water with this one, as well as back up the whole spawning to coir thing.

i noticed oatman did his grow without pasteurizing the coir. he ended up with 2 trays out of 8. is there still a pretty good chance of me getting contams with coir even if i pasteurize both my coir and my 50/50+ when i case? im just worried because i have never had a casing contam prior to the first flush before and now that im planning on working with bulk subs i really realy am scared about that.

also how long do bulk substrates take to colonize with the 1:4 ratio suggested by oatmans tek? do using ratios like this instead of 1:1 or 1:2 for my first time that big a difference? i mean will i be gauranteed to screw it all up starting big with my first bulk?

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Re: spawning rye to bulk coir [Re: nexiusus] * 1
    #10794914 -

also what kind of ratios if i decide to add coffee grounds, worm castins, and gypsum to my coir? also where can one purchase worm castings? ive been able to find all my mycology products other than spores at plain old home depot so i was just making sure i could find that there. what kind of effect will adding those things to my coir bulk substrate add over that off just plain coir? what if any are the drawbacks of adding these things to my coir? will this increase/decrease my contamination chances or increase/decrease colonization, which in turn will decrease contamination chances?

thanks so much everyone im just really stoked about the bulk project and i wanna get everything right on paper. my materials should be here tomorrow or the next day so i can start the rye spawn and then during the down time waiting for colonization of spawn, can build everything i need for the rest of the grow. im going to need a different solution for fruiting since 5 12 quart trays wont fit in any FC i know of. i jsut need a way to keep the humidity up do a descent amount (not real real high just enough, since the casing layer should take care of alot in the way of microclimate) any ideas? can i just fruit these in open air instead?

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Re: spawning rye to bulk coir [Re: nexiusus] * 1
    #10798251 -

nexiusus said:
the boxes are 17"x11"x5". i want to spawn a quart per box to pasteurized coir like in oatmans spawning to coir tek. he states in the tek that a brick of coir fills 2 trays to about 3 to 4 inches thick. so whatever half of a coir brick at 3-4 inches of sub plus the quart of spawn.

im curious as to how many quarts would be made from a 3lb colonized rye spawn bag. ive read several answers that say about 2.5 quart jars 1/2 filled from a single pound of rye, and about 1.75 quart jars 3/4 full per single pound of rye. so figure that might be about 5 quarts total so 5 total trays.

so definitely pasteurize the coir. spawn the rye to each tray. should i mix the spawn in with bulk sub and then cover or should i mix it and then add another light layer of spawn over the top to protect against contaminants? cover it with foil and make a few hole with micropore over them. let colonize to 100% then case with pasteurized 50/50+.

i figure he got 350 grams dry from the first flush of 6 trays (8 were made but 2 were lost to contaminants) so I'm really hoping to blow every grow ive ever done out of the water with this one, as well as back up the whole spawning to coir thing.

i noticed oatman did his grow without pasteurizing the coir. he ended up with 2 trays out of 8. is there still a pretty good chance of me getting contams with coir even if i pasteurize both my coir and my 50/50+ when i case? im just worried because i have never had a casing contam prior to the first flush before and now that im planning on working with bulk subs i really realy am scared about that.

also how long do bulk substrates take to colonize with the 1:4 ratio suggested by oatmans tek? do using ratios like this instead of 1:1 or 1:2 for my first time that big a difference? i mean will i be gauranteed to screw it all up starting big with my first bulk?


Layer your substrate and spawn.  Put a layer of substrate and then a layer of spawn, and then a layer of substrate. 

Pasteurize both your coir and your 50/50.  Your risk for contaminants will be greatly reduced. 

Colonization times vary a lot.  I spawned my 1:1 mix 3 days ago. I just took a peek to see if there was any progress from yesterday.  I noticed significant growth.  I can already see many white spots breaking through the surface.  It takes as long as it takes.  A good estimate would be 10-14 days.

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Re: spawning rye to bulk coir [Re: nexiusus] * 1
    #10798279 -

nexiusus said:
also what kind of ratios if i decide to add coffee grounds, worm castins, and gypsum to my coir? also where can one purchase worm castings? ive been able to find all my mycology products other than spores at plain old home depot so i was just making sure i could find that there. what kind of effect will adding those things to my coir bulk substrate add over that off just plain coir? what if any are the drawbacks of adding these things to my coir? will this increase/decrease my contamination chances or increase/decrease colonization, which in turn will decrease contamination chances?

thanks so much everyone im just really stoked about the bulk project and i wanna get everything right on paper. my materials should be here tomorrow or the next day so i can start the rye spawn and then during the down time waiting for colonization of spawn, can build everything i need for the rest of the grow. im going to need a different solution for fruiting since 5 12 quart trays wont fit in any FC i know of. i jsut need a way to keep the humidity up do a descent amount (not real real high just enough, since the casing layer should take care of alot in the way of microclimate) any ideas? can i just fruit these in open air instead?


I used approximately the following ratios for my bulk substrate.

6 cups coir
2 cups compost
3 cups vermiculite
1.5 cups coffee grounds
1.5 cups worm castings
0.75 cups gypsum (~5-10% by volume)

Bulk substrates aren't really an exact science.  You could easily take the cup measurements I took and use handfuls.  In the end, it really doesn't need to be perfect.  Adding extra amendments to your bulk substrate will increase the productivity of your tub system.  The myc will have more  nutrients to feed on.  Adding amendments like compost and worm castings adds nitrogen, which is very beneficial for mycelium. Adding amendments won't increase your risk for contaminants.  If anything, the extra beneficial microbes in castings and compost will prevent contamination.

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Re: spawning rye to bulk coir [Re: M11] * 1
    #10799730 -

Sounds good let us know how it goes,good luck :thumbup:

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Re: spawning rye to bulk coir [Re: Blutjager] * 1
    #10805020 -

im super stoked about this bulk project. my last casing project went very well. i pulled 17.5 grams dry from my first flush and 11 grams dry from my second flush using a pound of pf tek sub cased with MCMG. The damn thing worked terrific. Not to mention this casing was fruited outdoors (thank god for south florida weather!) I didn't have to do anything but mist my casing and thats it. No adjusting temps and humidity and all that bullshit. I kinda want to do that with my new bulk grow as well since the outdoor growing conditions here are perfect for that but I don't know if I want to do an outdoor bulk grow using coir as a bulk substrate I think it would be safer contam wise to use hpoo or cpoo. So I suppose I'll fruit these guys indoors. Anyways I think I'm going to make 3 trays total this grow each with a lb of rye spawned to 3 lbs of coir and other goodies. I'll keep you guys updated on how it goes. Thanks alot.

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Re: spawning rye to bulk coir [Re: nexiusus] * 1
    #10805486 -

nexiusus said:
Anyways I think I'm going to make 3 trays total this grow each with a lb of rye spawned to 3 lbs of coir and other goodies. I'll keep you guys updated on how it goes. Thanks alot.

Always try as many things as possible if for no other reason than the learning experience you will gain  :yesnod:

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Re: spawning rye to bulk coir [Re: Blutjager] * 1
    #10869079 -

Well I started a 3 lb rye bag injected with 2.5cc of pes hawaiian spores and 2 of agar's microwaved wbs jars for an experimental portion of this bulk grow. All three are showing 1-2% mycelial growth after being inoculated monday. Terrific news indeed. One of the wbs jars seems to be way to moist and has what look to be wet spots but mycelium is growing on them so hopefully it won't be a problem, but we shall see. If it is a problem I'll know which way to adjust the moisture next time using that particular tek.

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Re: spawning rye to bulk coir [Re: nexiusus] * 1
    #10869083 -

next time use more spore solution - or better yet, use a liquid culture.
also, when measuring bulk ratios, you need to measure by volume, not weight (ie. talking about splitting that 3lb grain bag into 3 trays with 2lb of coir each.)

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Re: spawning rye to bulk coir [Re: Optx] * 1
    #10869597 -

why would u want to use more than 2 or 3cc for a 3lb rye bag of multispore? that seems plenty sufficient i would think anything larger might disturb the moisture of the bag.

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Re: spawning rye to bulk coir [Re: M11] * 1
    #10870074 -

ETA:  Coir is a great substrate.  But I think you should consider adding some other amendments like coffee grounds, vermiculite, and gypsum.  You may even want to consider adding some compost if you have it or some worm castings.  These amendments will make your substrate that much more productive. A substrate full of diverse nutrients is favorable over substrates that only utilize one or two sources of nutrients.   

:thumbup:


--------------------
"Freedom is something that dies unless it's used." H.T.
I've come to believe that the heart is the filter of the enlightened mind. Epilson Lyrae

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Re: spawning rye to bulk coir [Re: Epilson Lyrae] * 1
    #10874593 -

im definitely going to add some type of amendments. i have yet to decide which ones. im not sure what i can get in my neighborhood really. the only place i have near my neighborhood that sells things like that i could put to use is home depot. does home depot sell worm castings or compost that could be pasteurized for bulk subs?

oh and update one of the wbs jars has taken off and is looking terrific while the other one actually has zero mycelial growth and looks to be contaminated. i will keep an eye on it for exactly one week and if it is contam'd toss it. the other one even tho it looks similar to the one with no growth has plenty of growth. almost 5% today. even has mycelial growth in the spots where there is high moisture which usually seem to take longer. the rye bag is up to about 3% today and is definitely growing much much faster than all of my old brf grows which is totally cool

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Re: spawning rye to bulk coir [Re: nexiusus] * 1
    #10890595 -

any ideas? additions to coir that i can obtain at home depot

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Re: spawning rye to bulk coir [Re: nexiusus] * 1
    #11125980 -

Instead of spawning I used the 100% colonized 3lb rye spawn bag to case a gigantic tub. It's a double sided casing around 3.5 inches deep in a tub that is 24 inches by 16.5 inches. I'm letting it fill in then patching and fruiting outdoors again like last grow. I'll show the results.

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Re: spawning rye to bulk coir [Re: nexiusus] * 1
    #13321666 -

Recently started spawning Rye to straight coir and have seen improved results. Sorry about to late post, new member and need to get my first 10.


--------------------
live for everything, die for nothing. BWS

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Re: spawning rye to bulk coir [Re: crooked 9s] * 1
    #13321852 -

Crooked, your going about this in the wrong way. Sure you don't think your doing any harm (Prolly), rules are in place for a reason...

Whoring post-count frivolously isn't the way...


--------------------
AMU

Terence McKenna Said:
"We have to create culture, don't watch TV, don't read magazines, don't even listen to NPR. Create your own roadshow. The nexus of space and time where you are now is the most immediate sector of your universe, and if you're worrying about Michael Jackson or Bill Clinton or somebody else, then you are disempowered, you're giving it all away to icons, icons which are maintained by an electronic media so that you want to dress like X or have lips like Y. This is shit-brained, this kind of thinking. That is all cultural diversion, and what is real is you and your friends and your associations, your highs, your orgasms, your hopes, your plans, your fears. And we are told 'no', we're unimportant, we're peripheral. 'Get a degree, get a job, get a this, get a that.' And then you're a player, you don't want to even play in that game. You want to reclaim your mind and get it out of the hands of the cultural engineers who want to turn you into a half-baked moron consuming all this trash that's being manufactured out of the bones of a dying world."

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